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Spring Anime 2012 III | AITAKATTA YES!

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duckroll

Member
CG movies are closer to film in this regard because you can easily move the virtual camera around, although you still have to artificially construct everything on the set.

Not really true, because this applies to a lot of modern animation as well. CG movies, or the really good ones, are made just like traditional animation is. Script -> storyboard -> layouts -> key animation.

I don't think "experimenting on set" is a very good way to describe film making either. Because that just sounds like poor planning. Good directors generally know what they want to shoot before they get on set.

The difference with live action shooting is that you are actually filming actors who need to perform physically. So the script is important to instruct and guide them as the primary subjects being filmed. For animation (CG, 2D, whatever) storyboards are what instructs the animators, who are the ones creating the primary subjects being filmed - the animation.
 

Makoto

Member
Hyouka 8

iSrtZrgzNXJIC.png

No, you screw you, Ibara. Are you even trying? Oreki is like
6-0
when it comes to mysteries. WTF have you done? Huh? You tried to solve a mystery once. Once!
At Chitanda's house when you were freeloading and getting fed and even then you had nothing.
Get off Oreki's back you stupid children. I thought this show was going to involve everyone solving a mystery themselves. Why are these people still relying on Oreki?
If anything, I enjoyed this episode simply because Oreki's seething apathy of it all was so apparent. More so than usual. Who needs the Harrison Ford gif when Oreki already describes how many shits we give? I also enjoyed the final shot of the club room where we see everyone but Oreki stand up.

 
Saint Seiya Omega 10

Well this gold saint is definitely a step up from the old guy, but he's still a far cry from the awesome displayed by the other Leo saints. I hope we actually get a good gold saint in this that isn't Seiya.

Ah well, at least stuff is happening. That last minute...
 

Branduil

Member
Not really true, because this applies to a lot of modern animation as well. CG movies, or the really good ones, are made just like traditional animation is. Script -> storyboard -> layouts -> key animation.

I don't think "experimenting on set" is a very good way to describe film making either. Because that just sounds like poor planning. Good directors generally know what they want to shoot before they get on set.

The difference with live action shooting is that you are actually filming actors who need to perform physically. So the script is important to instruct and guide them as the primary subjects being filmed. For animation (CG, 2D, whatever) storyboards are what instructs the animators, who are the ones creating the primary subjects being filmed - the animation.

Well, I thought I made it clear that planning is still important. It's just that in animation, the screenplay(and layouts) are a direct representation of how you want things shot, so they need to be exact. Film is different because even though you plan things out, once you're on set things can change, either because the director has a moment of inspiration, or they realize that a certain shot isn't working as planned. In addition, nearly every scene is shot from multiple angles, which means that some films can change massively depending on how they're edited.
 

qcf x2

Member
Mawaru Penguindrum, a show that aired last year created by the main creator of Utena (if you've not heard of that, it's basically the best shoujo anime of the 90s). It was pretty uneven, but when it was good it was particularly excellent.

Alas, firehawk and darkside didn't like it at all. Lots of people disagreed with them. Hence - CONFLICT! DORAMA! etc.

Oh, haha. That one. I watched the first three episodes or so...it's on my to-do list.
 

duckroll

Member
Well, I thought I made it clear that planning is still important. It's just that in animation, the screenplay(and layouts) are a direct representation of how you want things shot, so they need to be exact. Film is different because even though you plan things out, once you're on set things can change, either because the director has a moment of inspiration, or they realize that a certain shot isn't working as planned. In addition, nearly every scene is shot from multiple angles, which means that some films can change massively depending on how they're edited.

I'm just saying, most CG animation is nothing like film making. Uncharted is more like film making because of motion capture. Pixar and Dreamworks stuff are all hand animated. The camera doesn't make any difference between the importance of script or storyboards in that case. CG animation is much closer to traditional animation than it is to live action.
 

Risette

A Good Citizen
Right. I think the most fundamental difference between animation and live-action is that animation is entirely artificial, visually. I guess that's an obvious statement, but what it means is you need to do a great job in the pre-production phases, because that's where everything onscreen is going to come from. It's not like film where you can experiment on-set and come up with great stuff organically. Not to say planning isn't important in film, obviously, just that in film storyboards are much more like loose guidelines rather than being the primary foundation for the film's visuals.

CG movies are closer to film in this regard because you can easily move the virtual camera around, although you still have to artificially construct everything on the set.
Animation isn't entirely artificial -- it's entirely symbolic.
 
Tales of the Abyss 21
b7age.jpg

Let's go do cute girl things off screen so they don't have to animate us for a while.
Worst animated episode by far. Either they wasted their budget on the last episode or are trying to save up some for a more worthy episode. And the next one looks like it is. This episode is basically a set up for the next episode. Asch meets his parents for the first time in 7 years, and Jade explains you'd have to commit mass suicide in order to get rid of all the miasma. And since apparently Asch has a death wish, he plans on doing that with a bunch of replicas. Next episode should be neat, going by the preview.
dsUGK.jpg

Tear, this is Luke we're talking about here...
 

qcf x2

Member
Honestly, I feel that part of the problem with Fate/Zero 1 is the voice acting.


I disagree, but I must say it took me the better part of 6 episodes before I could tell the difference between all the dark haired guys. It made me almost appreciate the cotton candy palette that's common in anime.
 

Branduil

Member
I'm just saying, most CG animation is nothing like film making. Uncharted is more like film making because of motion capture. Pixar and Dreamworks stuff are all hand animated. The camera doesn't make any difference between the importance of script or storyboards in that case. CG animation is much closer to traditional animation than it is to live action.

Yes, I realize most CG animation is hand-animated. But it is true that you have more freedom to move around the camera in CG films. I mean, that's one of the main draws of utilizing CGI. In the animatic phase of a CG film you'll have an easier time changing camera angles and blocking if you need to because those things are by nature easily altered in CGI.

Animation isn't entirely artificial -- it's entirely symbolic.

I don't disagree, but I don't think symbolism and artifice are mutually exclusive.
 

Risette

A Good Citizen
I disagree, but I must say it took me the better part of 6 episodes before I could tell the difference between all the dark haired guys. It made me almost appreciate the cotton candy palette that's common in anime.
That's what I said to duckroll!

It really is confusing. They look and sound the same!
 

Narag

Member
I disagree, but I must say it took me the better part of 6 episodes before I could tell the difference between all the dark haired guys. It made me almost appreciate the cotton candy palette that's common in anime.

That's what I said to duckroll!

It really is confusing. They look and sound the same!

I still wonder if that was intentional with the whole duality thing going on and them diverging on their paths.

It took me forever too.
 
Midori Days 09
pMnoo.gif

Midori's here to sell you whatever she wants.
Decent episode. Focus is on the otaku guy was is kinda meh. I was amused by the whole convention bit and Midori basically selling puppets of herself to other otakus. The second half with the Midori lookalike wasn't that great nor was the twist at the end. Easily the most throwaway episode of the series yet.
 

duckroll

Member
Yes, I realize most CG animation is hand-animated. But it is true that you have more freedom to move around the camera in CG films. I mean, that's one of the main draws of utilizing CGI. In the animatic phase of a CG film you'll have an easier time changing camera angles and blocking if you need to because those things are by nature easily altered in CGI.

And I'm saying that has nothing to do with the comparison between the importance of scripts in filming live action and in animation. The camera has nothing to do with anything. The camera operators in film don't really need to know what is in the script. They only need to know what the director tells them for a given scene. The script is important because it instructs the cast, and the cast are the ones being filmed.

For animation, what is being filmed is the animation of the characters or the environment. That is the "performance" so to speak. And what instructs the animators are the storyboards. Animators don't read the script and decide what to draw. They base their animation and layouts on what is storyboarded.
 

duckroll

Member
Isn't the storyboard based on the script? It's not a direct connection, but it's there.

It is. This discussion started because we were debating about whether the specific choice of cutting between the race and the audience in Redline and how the race was paced is something that is directly from the script, or something defined in the storyboards. I feel it is obvious that such specific details would be from the storyboarding, and not the script itself.
 

Branduil

Member
And I'm saying that has nothing to do with the comparison between the importance of scripts in filming live action and in animation. The camera has nothing to do with anything. The camera operators in film don't really need to know what is in the script. They only need to know what the director tells them for a given scene. The script is important because it instructs the cast, and the cast are the ones being filmed.

For animation, what is being filmed is the animation of the characters or the environment. That is the "performance" so to speak. And what instructs the animators are the storyboards. Animators don't read the script and decide what to draw. They base their animation and layouts on what is storyboarded.

I was talking about the differences in storyboarding between mediums, not scripts. Sorry if I didn't make that clear. I agree, the script is just as important in both cases.
 
Looks like quality anime.
The premise is dripping with quality.
Kaga Ryosuke, a helplessly romantic teenager, was walking in the rain when he sees a beautiful girl with red eyes drenched in the rain. Everyone was avoiding her, but Ryosuke was taught to treasure women so he offered his help by letting her dry off at his home. Ryosuke can't imagine that this mysterious girl would stab him in the chest and leave him to die… Or did she? Who is this pretty girl and what does she want with him?
 

Dresden

Member
I disagree, but I must say it took me the better part of 6 episodes before I could tell the difference between all the dark haired guys. It made me almost appreciate the cotton candy palette that's common in anime.

I don't know, one's Goku, the other looks like a child molester. I think they're pretty distinctive for the most part.
 

Uchip

Banned
I disagree, I mean only two to three episodes were good while the rest was just subpar to dull, too slice of lifey. ep 3, then that episode that involved
alternate universe of sorts
. I ended up getting friends just to see the first three episodes just to see their response at it.

Ignore the guy with Naruto Yaoi in his avatar, I loved watching madoka too
 

Branduil

Member
These comments do not pay due respect to how subtly powerful the construction of the scenes in the episode are. Can you get the same information from reading a summary? Sure. But that's true of anything. Some esteemed members of this very community are known for using Wikipedia as a replacement for actually watching shows (won't name any names!). But that sells the visuals short.

The opening scene is a good example of something that cannot be conveyed in just a summary. The combination of the camera framing, the music build up, and the eventual zoom out leading to the white-out with the show logo is definitely a complete audio-visual experience. The scene where Waver learns about the Grail War in the library is another great scene which is much more compelling than any text summary can provide. As he learns more and gets more excited about it, there are faster cuts and more a more kinetic feel in both the direction and his monologue. As this happens the weather outside also gets increasingly stormy. There is a lot of atmosphere which uses the medium of film extremely well.

Those two scenes are fine. The problem is all of the Kirei/Kiritsugu scenes. Especially the infamous circle-walking scene which nearly kills all interest in the show before it even really begins.

Honestly, I feel that part of the problem with Fate/Zero 1 is the voice acting. Kiritsugu, Kirei, and you can throw in Tokiomi as well, all have a relatively flat, emotionless, deliberately paced way of speaking that makes it easy to lose attention when they're just talking at each other for an extended length of time, especially when they start throwing around Grail War terminology that no one not already invested in the franchise cares about. Everything can blend together, and the characterization the episode attempts doesn't have as much of an impact as it should. I don't feel that Irisviel serves as enough of a humanizing force for Kiritsugu, and certainly Kirei is a cipher. I'm sure that's intentional, since we're supposed to see each of them through the lens of the other, and neither of them understand the motivations of the other, but it makes it difficult to get invested in their conflict. Once they start showing who they are through their actions and in how they play off of other Masters and Servants with different personalities, then they become more interesting to watch and listen to.

That is a very big problem. It also doesn't ever feel like the double-length for the episode is justified, given how little actually happens until the end.
 

jbug617

Banned
I think i'm done with Kids on the Slope. The music was great and I expected more of that.

Really enjoying the progression of Kuroko no Basket and at the beginning of Nyaruko I wasn't a fan but the show has grown on me.
 

1stStrike

Banned
Phew, so I finished watching the last season of Major. Overall, it was a great series, but my opinions of the individual seasons vary.

My ranking of seasons (from best to worst) is as follows: 1 2 5 3 6 4

I could definitely see myself going back and watching seasons 1 and 2 again. So many fantastic moments in them and they really captured the "burning youth" spirit there. Season 5 was also excellent with a lot of very tense situations. While I liked season 3, I was starting to get tired of the whole "Goro finds shitty players, makes them awesome" thing. At least in later seasons the players were already good/competitive and he just influenced them instead.

Season 6 wasn't bad, but I felt they should've stopped at 5. The whole yips thing and such was mostly irritating/boring and I don't feel like the story really went anywhere for the first half of the season. Also, some of Goro's reactions to things were badly done - he'd still get angry or down over the smallest things, things that he'd already tackled in the series and should've been able to handle without any problems due to his experience and personality. They irritated me a bit here in that regard.

Of course, season 4 was bleh overall. I didn't really care about
the Bats or the whole pretending that people spoke English and that Goro couldn't understand them thing. The manager of the team being some little girl in bat cosplay was pretty dumb too.

I watched the epilogue episode where
14 years had passed and Goro couldn't pitch anymore. It was really depressing seeing him throw a ball with his left arm in the beginning and having it drop lifelessly to the ground.
It was a good way to end things and I'm glad an anime gave us a proper ending instead of just cutting off midway and leaving the story incomplete (which seems to happen far too often for my liking).

There were some great supporting characters in this series (pretty much all the Japanese ones - I wasn't fond of most of the American characters) and the series left its mark for sure. I don't think there's any other sports anime out there that can compare to the character relationships that have developed in this series. It was really top notch in that regard.
 

Makoto

Member
A Certain Magical Index 24 (FINAL)

Disclaimer: This post is nothing but bitching about how awful Index and the first episode of Index II are.

A Certain Magical Index sought to blow my mind and boy, was it successful. It blew my mind as to how illogical a show could be over the course of 24-episodes. Between the show’s constant use of religious and scientific jargon and its inability to maintain any sense of consistency through its various arcs, I’m amazed that I was able to sit through it. Imaginary Number Sector, English Purist Church, Index Librorum Prohibitorum. There is so much terminology thrown around, it’s to the point where I don’t know if I should even bother remembering it all. It’s unnecessary padding masquerading as world-building. It’s as if the author had a bunch of old theology, latin and physics notebooks lying around and decided to work in as many concepts as possible. Like a monkey throwing fecal matter at a wall, it’s as if lecture notes were flung in a similar fashion and a story was connected from there. The overarching plot is nowhere to be found.
One arc focuses on a guy who can manipulate vectors and create dust explosions. Then it’s about an Aztec magician who uses the light of Venus to make matter explode from his rod weapon thing. Then someone wants to start a war between the two schools of magic or whatever because she lost her friend.
Now that I think about it, why did the first episode begin with a grand introduction of Academy City when we see almost nothing but characters from the religious sector immediately thereafter? 24 episodes and I know more about the magicians than I do about the citizens where the story takes place.

All the while the audience has no choice but to be led by the hand of Touma, a main character so awful that I think I’ve been given a greater appreciation for Mahiro from Nyaruko as a result. Equipped with a bullshit power that leaves the writers fabricating suspense at all times (because writing him in a logical way would make the average episode last about 2 minutes) and a demeanor that always perceives himself in the moral high ground when confronted by opponents, Touma reaches an unheard of level of terrible. He’s so grossly one-dimensional in his desire to protect people. No matter how easily he can win a fight, he always has to do something stupid and let the villain take off somewhere. Then we he actually confronts the villain, he needs 5 minutes to deliver a long winded speech about how he’s gonna win because he’s fighting for good intentions. Because he has to protect his friends. Because he believes in a world where no one fights. In his journey to avoid any character development whatsoever, I think his one character flaw is that there aren’t enough people around him in dire need of rescuing. While I don’t root against him, I certainly don’t root for him and it’s doubly aggravating that Misaka gets
dere around him simply because of his stupid, overpowered ability and his tiresome diatribes of virtue.

The villains almost get as obnoxious as Touma but since A Certain Magical Index has ADD up the wazoo, we don’t have to endure these crap villains for more than 4 episodes max. This show is so transparent about Japan’s obsession over misunderstood villains it’s revolting. In almost every arc, there has to be a villain who isn’t truly villainous but rather, a character who is just trying to protect who they love and is just in desperate need of a perception change.

I’m blown away that a character like Accelerator so deep seeded in being a cocky asshole, received such a corny story arc like that of
Last Order. He just has to remind the audience every five minutes that he’s a bad guy and that these are some crazy times we live simply because he’s doing something noble for a change. Yes, we get it, you’re an asshole and it’s unusual for you to help others. But nope, he has to keep reminding us, “You sure you want the bad guy to be helping you out? Hurr hurr, cause I’m a badass but I also have a heart. I’m the villain, but really, my morals are just misplaced.”
No, writers of Index, that’s not how you write sympathetic characters.

Goodness, this show is terrible. No plot structure, no character development and no sense of danger. Just the same awful main character and his useless sidekick Index who does jack aside from being the damsel in distress.

As long as Mikoto Misaka is in this show however, I will not abandon ship. I will keep sailing forward. I will endure what Index II has to offer and then I wash away its awful after taste with the spring valley dew of our glorious Railgun. Index offends me, it offends me so. 1/5

A Certain Magical Index II 1
-Just a seemingly normal day of Index annoying Touma? Check.
-Villain appears? Check.
-Bonus points: He’s a magician? Check.
-Instead of easily defeating the villain with his hand, Touma lets the villain escape with a momentary victory that takes up waaay too much of the episode? Check.
-Someone also needs rescuing? Check.
-Touma defeats the villain only after delivering a long winded speech about protecting his friends? Check.
-Writers try to make the villain sympathetic? Check.
Same formula. smh. And of course, Misaka asks Touma the last thing I ever wanted to see her ask him.
Touma does not deserve Misaka.
This guy is worse than harem leads. As least those characters are stupid in an oblivious sort of manner. Touma is just dumb.
 
Toriko 58


Awww yeah! Zebra time! They may have cut out some of his introduction (I can't really remember), but I don't even care because this was still good.

And I completely forgot about the other 2 gourmet prisons. I wonder if they'll ever show those.
 

LogicStep

Member
Damn guys... I just realized... I'm loving Toradora so much, I don't think I can explain how much I'm loving it. It's exactly the type of anime I like and this one is doing it so good... I just hate to think I will get to the end of it and it fucking sucks :( Up to ep 11 now so almost halfway through. Damn it! :'(
 

Dresden

Member
Damn guys... I just realized... I'm loving Toradora so much, I don't think I can explain how much I'm loving it. It's exactly the type of anime I like and this one is doing it so good... I just hate to think I will get to the end of it and it fucking sucks :( Up to ep 11 now so almost halfway through. Damn it! :'(

jman's alt account confirmed
 

cajunator

Banned
Damn guys... I just realized... I'm loving Toradora so much, I don't think I can explain how much I'm loving it. It's exactly the type of anime I like and this one is doing it so good... I just hate to think I will get to the end of it and it fucking sucks :( Up to ep 11 now so almost halfway through. Damn it! :'(

It really is quite enjoyable.
I say that as someone who is not a fan of Rie Kugimiya too so the show had to be exceptional not to annoy the fuck out of me.
It certainly is.
 

madp

The Light of El Cantare
Getter Robo Armageddon 01:


I'm pretty weak when it comes to my history with mecha, and my only previous experience with Getter Robo is buying some vintage 70s toys at a thrift store and selling them on ebay for huge cash. Although this 13-episode OVA series is from 1998, it retains the decidedly earlier aesthetic of its mecha and character design, and after my recent experiences with Abashiri Ikka and Delinquent in Drag, I am pleased to say that I have finally watched a Go Nagai work that hasn't made me want to murder the man.

For a franchise that I have zero acquaintance with and (I assume) has a large quantity of plot material preceding this entry, the first few minutes of the episode did a pretty good job of explaining the basics of the Getter Robo story. Mankind discovers an infinite energy source, it backfires somehow and evil monsters infest the moon, the UN creates mechas to vanquish the threat, the enemies are destroyed, and somehow after all of this
one of the scientists involved in the discovery of the infinite energy source known as "Getter Rays" was murdered by the pilot of Getter Robo and somehow comes back from the dead to avenge his own death with an evil robot army
. Okay. The rub to this turn of events is that
Ryoma, Dr. Saotome's murderer, is given a temporary reprieve from prison to pilot Getter Robo with the mission of killing Dr. Saotome again
.

I feel like this word has somewhat fallen out of fashion, but Ryoma is a pretty GAR dude although he's a bit different than your standard Kamina-esque GAR mecha pilot because he also exhibits a lot of anger on top of the usual outpouring of manly spirit that comes from kicking ass in a giant robot. I imagine that this is due to his current circumstances, but it's at least more interesting than if he was merely smug and cocky one hundred percent of the time. The other named characters don't exactly bear mentioning yet.

What's most notable about this series is how strikingly beautiful it is in art and animation. The mecha move fluidly and have a sense of weight to them, monsters are wonderfully grotesque, colors are fantastically rich, shading is often bold. Lovers of 2D mechanical objects, ink/cel art, and just good animation in general will all find something to love in this series. My concerns about lack of prior familiarity with the characters and plot immediately evaporated away and I was caught in the visual spectacle.


I'm watching this series as part of a trade with Grzi, and he picked a fine choice for me. The plot is nothing amazing so far, so expect future episode impressions to be much shorter and more readable than this!
 

Defuser

Member
Damn guys... I just realized... I'm loving Toradora so much, I don't think I can explain how much I'm loving it. It's exactly the type of anime I like and this one is doing it so good... I just hate to think I will get to the end of it and it fucking sucks :( Up to ep 11 now so almost halfway through. Damn it! :'(

They don't make shows like this any more with exception of Ano Natsu this year. I can't believe I expect J.C.Staff of all studios to keep romance genre alive.
 

Andrew J.

Member
Honestly, some of the characters in the Fate canon are miscast in my opinion. I look at the character and hear a certain type of voice in my head, only to actually hear their voice in the show and think "What the fuck?" (Kirei being by far the biggest offender, Tokiomi as a runner up).

We live in a post-Bleach world now; you can't cast Show Hayami unless his character is super evil.
 
A Certain Magical Index 24 (FINAL)

Disclaimer: This post is nothing but bitching about how awful Index and the first episode of Index II are.

I know there's a lot of competition, but the Index/Railgun franchise has got to be one of the worst in anime, Index in particular. It's got absolutely no redeeming values, and so many awful anime cliches it's somewhat unbelievable. Is there anything good about the franchise at all
apart from maybe Uiharu in Railgun
? I can't think of anything.
 

Articalys

Member
Dusk Maiden of Amnesia 10

Well, I'd say they were more than adequately able to portray the required emotions during this week's episode.

The scene where the candles were extinguishing one by one, with the music...

It would probably have been even more effective if
she had died with her eyes still open instead of the cliche "eyes close and head falls to one side" thing
though.
 
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