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[AbortedWalrusFetus]

I'm not going to defend their decision and say it was a good one, but I can almost guarantee you that the reason is that too many people with machines that they think are high spec (or are in fact high spec) will run with high res textures, experience poor performance, and then publicly bash the game.

What exactly do they think people are doing right now? The visuals aren't even on par with some inferior MMOs on the market.

 

[bloodforge]

massive swtor meltdown over the texture issue. lol

i do agree it's bullshit though. the dressing room preview looks like complete ass.

Their explanation is complete crap, "well some people may have issues running the high resolution textures so we just removed them for everybody and "medium" in the textures option was a bug". Riiight.

It's clear the engine they are using is just garbage.

 

[Lain]

So we won't get high-res textures? The game will keep looking sort of a mess, with blurry, shitty textures? Disappointing.

 

[RaySpencer]

But the guild list is broken 90% of the time so I can't really see

Use ctrl+U, it reloads the UI, its stupid that you have to do this, but at least it works. If your ever having a problem with quest icons on the map, or guild list being wrong, just use ctrl+U!

 

[The English Conquistador]

So we won't get high-res textures? The game will keep looking sort of a mess, with blurry, shitty textures? Disappointing.

Wow, that's pretty shocking if true. :/

 

[cpp_is_king]

So we won't get high-res textures? The game will keep looking sort of a mess, with blurry, shitty textures? Disappointing.

Replacing all the textures with high res textures isn't the only solution. They can implement a complicated LoD scheme for example. But the point is that any solution (which they've already said they're still looking into) will be more complicated and hence take time.

 

[Giolon]

How can a choice being implemented into the game be a bug? The code didn't write itself one of the programmers put it there. Stephen Reid lies a lot....

Come on, lying? Really? Here's an entirely plausible explanation based solely on his post:

Devs implement Low, Med, High textures. Testing shows that running High all the time runs like ass. One or more Devs gets a task to make High textures only available to cutscenes, remove High as an option, and rename Medium to High. This should have happened all behind the scenes before launch without any of the players noticing.

But hey look! Someone forgot to do the remove/rename step! Or it was merged wrong into the release code. Or there was a minor reason they couldn't remove it until something else was fixed.

There are myriad ways a bug like this ends up in a game. None of them should be attributed to malice. I take Stephen at his word. Perhaps this is because I am a Software Engineer who spends 8+ hours a day doing exactly this kind of stuff.

You can argue that they should be able to get the performance out of their engine to handle the high res textures and that they suck if they can't, but calling them liars is childish.

 

[RaySpencer]

It sounds like the high res textures are coming, it just wont be an easy fix, so we might have to wait a little bit.

 

[Darklord]

So he's saying the high res textures were too much for the client AND a high-end PC? Then how the hell do games like Conan and Eve work? Because they have fantastic, high res, high end graphics. The only way to get TOR running ok was slop textures? That sounds like a huge screw up rather than a issue they "fixed".

 

[daoster]

I'll try again. He died a lot for me. He also throws guys all over the place.

I just got her. I tried her on recommendation from someone in the GAF guild. She doesn't really work for me. I end up getting a lot of threat and taking a lot of damage. Sure fights go faster but I get hit for a lot. Normal fights are okay but anything with like 2 strongs or an elite, I'm dead.

I just started the planet when you start Act 2. I can't remember what's it's called. I'm fighting these green bug things that keep knocking me out of cover or freezing me in stone.

I don't watch the chat log that often. I should keep an eye on people looking for group I guess. I don't think anyone has been on the same planet as me during my play time. But the guild list is broken 90% of the time so I can't really see.

I rarely visit the fleet. I guess I should take some time to stop what I'm doing and sit around a bit. I do that a lot on other MMOs. I'm not sure why I keep going forward in this one. I think the story pulls me forward. I don't know what level people are or what FP is my level. Broken guild list and all that. But it seems most people in our guild who ask for FP are usually lower than me or are the 50's

Okay. I did some at lower levels but once I heard the complaining in GAF, I just felt wrong. But maybe I'll suck it up and go ruin some 50's day.

If Bowdarr is batting guys around, turn off that ability. Risha may have trouble with two elites, but those fights don't happen as often, and when they do, call out the tanks. You'll be getting a new melee DPS on the planet you're on (Balmorra), and she should be pretty strong and act as a mini tank (though she's not a tank).

Make it a habit to visit the fleet every time you finish a planet...or every time you're bored with your current planet. Buy the fleet passes so you can quick travel to the fleet.

And NeoGAF is synonymous with complaining, so you shouldn't let it get to you. While there are things definitely wrong with PVP, and there are certainly idiots on PVP, it's gotten a lot better (at least in my experience).

 

[HBroward]

Reposted from the last page, because it explains why the textures may not be there:

If you want to put on a tin foil hat and go deep into the rabbit hole, I found this thread linked on reddit, it could certainly explain why this isn't an easy fix for them, if it turns out to be true. Note, none of this has been confirmed, but it is certainly plausible.

 

[BattleMonkey]

So he's saying the high res textures were too much for the client AND a high-end PC? Then how the hell do games like Conan and Eve work? Because they have fantastic, high res, high end graphics. The only way to get TOR running ok was slop textures? That sounds like a huge screw up rather than a issue they "fixed".

They used a 3rd party engine they bought instead of making the game ground up.

 

[cpp_is_king]

They used a 3rd party engine they bought instead of making the game ground up.

To be fair, using a 3rd party engine is pretty normal and in fact you'd be stupid not to. The problem is which engine they used.

 

[BattleMonkey]

To be fair, using a 3rd party engine is pretty normal and in fact you'd be stupid not to. The problem is which engine they used.

Lot of MMOs are done from the ground up, the one they used for TOR was not really battle tested yet and it's obvious that they are having to do massive work on it to do what they want.

 

[cpp_is_king]

Lot of MMOs are done from the ground up, the one they used for TOR was not really battle tested yet and it's obvious that they are having to do massive work on it to do what they want.

Lot of MMOs also fail because the amount they cost to make was more than the amount they could ever hope to bring in. Of course, using Hero Engine might as well have been the same as using no engine here, because now they have the same problem. Using the right engine can save a massive amount of money though and still produce a technically awesome game.

TBH I'm amazed they even shipped on Hero Engine. This is an example of mindblowingly good technical ability, but a breakdown at the leadership level.

 

[chickdigger802]

The funny thing is that all the in game cinematic tend to perform like shit (~10 fps).

And I'm still getting huge fps dips. First make the game perform solid everywhere before 'high texture' stuff ;P

And keep on dreaming kids, higher res graphics won't make JK pvp champion gear look any less shitty =P

And I finally hit 30! (Jieeff in gaf guild, don't recall ever mentioning it lol)

Spec full vig guardian so I just got overhead strike. Now this game plays like kotor

They really should give you a free teleport out of a story/group zone after you finish it. No reason to run all the way back...

 

[BattleMonkey]

They really should give you a free teleport out of a story/group zone after you finish it. No reason to run all the way back...

Flashpoints do if you haven't seen it. Ontop the minimap you get an exit button that teleports you out the flashpoints. Course your probably talking more about the class quest instance areas.

 

[chickdigger802]

Flashpoints do if you haven't seen it. Ontop the minimap you get an exit button that teleports you out the flashpoints. Course your probably talking more about the class quest instance areas.

yeah. wish quest instances had those as well, or a shortcut at the end that wraps to the front like in skyrim.

 

[Trouble]

Okay, we're starting to get more 50s every day in the Republic guild. Here are some small tips for those hoping to join some of us that are starting to run Hard Mode Flashpoints.

Start doing your Ilum/Belsavis dailies. Once you hit 50, the Ilum storyline opens up to you, it's relatively simple, and short, despite being a little annoying. Complete it. It shouldn't take you too long, it will go a lot faster if you team up though, and make it a lot more enjoyable. Ilum storyline feels very rushed/dull. The real reason you're here though, is not for the story, it's for the rewards. Besides the main storyline questline of Ilum, there will be a handful other quests that you will be able to do daily. These quests will reward you with Daily Commendations. While the amount seems small, these come in very, very handy, and will play a role in preparing you to run some of these HM FPs. You can trade in these for either level 23 (Purple) Armoring/Barrels/Hilts. This is where you're going to get your Armoring and either Hilt/Barrel for you items. Belsavis also has bonus series quest, you pick up the bonus series in the Fleet, I believe. Get it done, as it opens up the Heroics, which is going to be your main source of purple mods/enhancements/etc.

Okay, now that I've slightly brushed up on the daily quests, it's time to talk about the daily Heroics. There will be a Heroic 2 in Ilum, Darkness on Ilum. This will award you with the option to pick one of 4 enhancements. These will be class specific, I believe, so pick the one that is right for your build. These are the options I get to pick from as a Commando.

• Advanced Battle Enhancement 22
• Advanced Vigilant Enhancement 22
• Advanced Initiative Enhancement 22
• Advanced Quick Savant Enhancement 22

Pick the one that best suits your class.

Next we will travel to Belsavis, there are 3 Heroics there. 1 [Heroic 2] and 3 [Heroic 4]. Similar to the Ilum Heroics, these will award you with level 22 Purple enhancements/mods/armoring, that are Class specific. One of the Heroics will give your companion a nice weapon also. The armoring that you will get from "The Stasis Generator" Heroic, is not the level 23 Armoring you can buy with your Daily Commendations on Ilum, but it should do well enough until you can buy the 23 armorings from the Daily Comms vendor on Ilum. Best case, you want to end up with each armor you have to be:

• Armoring (51)
• Mod (50)
• Enhancement (50)

All purple, of course.


Now another thing you want to use to supplement this is Ilum Weekly/Daily PVP missions. While these are going to change once 1.1 hits, right now you'll want to take advantage of how easy they are to do. Basically you will go to the Ilum Open World PVP area, and destroy the enemy tanks to build up your Daily/Weekly. Shouldn't take too long and there will be usually Imperial players there too doing it, don't be so rash and attack though, most are there to do their Daily/Weekly also. Try find one a spot where Rep/Imps are going back and forth destroying tanks in order to build up your Daily/Weekly count. The weekly will reward you with 2 champion bags and a choice of one champion bag or one Battlemaster gear bag. (Pick the champion, unless you're Valor 60.. but if you're Valor 60 you probably won't be reading this lol) The daily also rewards you with 1 Champion bag. These champion bags randomly give you something, it could either be a piece of Champion level armor/etc that you can go exchange to the PVP Vendor, or Centurion Commendations. The armor/weapon/implant you can get from the bag is not an actual piece of armor, rather it's more of a commendation which let's you choose one piece of gear from different Champion sets. For example, if you get a chest piece, you can then go exchange that chest piece for one of the 4 different chest pieces available. Choose the one that is better suited to your build of course. Don't want to go into too much detail here but if you have more questions about how Champion bags/Ilum PVP Dailies work feel free to ask me in game. Anyways, the main thing I was trying to convey, is that these pieces of Champion armor will also be very helpful to get you started in end game Hard Modes, at least until you can pick up better PVE armor. You can also get more bags by buying them for 200 Warzone & 200 Mercenary Commendations and doing your Win Warzones PVP Daily/Weekly.


If there's enough interest from the 50s we have in the Republic side right now, me and Aran will be running two groups to do the Heroics tomorrow so you can get a handle on what to do/where to go/etc. If there's not enough people, but you would still like to learn what to do, feel free to send me a whisper or let me know in clan chat, and I'll be more than glad to guide you.

If I missed anything, I apologize, it's 3 AM and I'm really sleepy. If you don't understand something, again feel free to ask. Might not be the clearest post, but I hope some of the information can help you.

Fantastic write up. I've just been focusing on end-game PVP, didn't even know about the heroics having good rewards until you brought it up last night.

Can we get a link to this post from the OP?

 

[XiaNaphryz]

How can a choice being implemented into the game be a bug? The code didn't write itself one of the programmers put it there. Stephen Reid lies a lot....

Quite easily - if there was a Low/Medium/High selection choice elsewhere in the code, someone could easily have copy/pasted it to an option it wasn't supposed to be on.

That said, that sort of bug should have been caught by internal QA long before. Whether the devs chose to address it in time is another thing.

 

[BattleMonkey]

yeah. wish quest instances had those as well, or a shortcut at the end that wraps to the front like in skyrim.

Yea I usually save my fast travel for the class quests because they often involve going into a deep multi level instance. Side quests for the most part have you just run in and out and can often get out before respawns, so I keep my fast travels saved for them as much as possible.

 

[sangreal]

They used a 3rd party engine they bought instead of making the game ground up.

To be more precise, they bought a 3rd party engine from a company that only makes text-based games.

(I'm actually a pretty big fan of Simutronics' games)

 

[Hari Seldon]

Honestly I don't see why this texture thing is a big deal. Game looks pretty good as it is. It is no Age of Conan, but I was kind of expecting that being bioware and all. Bioware used the NWN engine for like 150 years.

 

[sangreal]

Honestly I don't see why this texture thing is a big deal. Game looks pretty good as it is. It is no Age of Conan, but I was kind of expecting that being bioware and all. Bioware used the NWN engine for like 150 years.

My PC likely can't handle any better so it doesn't bother me per se, but the armor textures really do look like shit. Especially the preview window (but not for companions)

 

[BattleMonkey]

Honestly I don't see why this texture thing is a big deal. Game looks pretty good as it is. It is no Age of Conan, but I was kind of expecting that being bioware and all. Bioware used the NWN engine for like 150 years.

I think the game looks great, but really they should give us the options to crank it up if we want. Game runs great for me and it's all maxed out, only a few indoor areas drop in frame rate. I would like to have the option of at least trying to run the game with higher textures if my machine can handle it.

 

[gatti-man]

lmao for real? I'm sorry but ff14 ran like complete ass.. especially in towns with lots of people.



Anyways on another note. It really pisses me off that you can't add people to friends list if they aren't currently online.

Yes it did run like ass but on my high end pc it didnt run poorly when you didnt take into account how well it should be running. I avg 40-50fps. Reid says decent textures would cause the game to slow down bc user pc's cant handle it is flat wrong. The engine is so shit that its even worse than ff14s is what this means to me. Those movie textures arent even that great to begin with. This just really pisses in my cool aid bc i love this game but the textures are just so bad. Whats the point in getting cool gear when it all looks like different shades of mud?

 

[JWong]

I really don't give a shit about performance as long as the game is good, which FF14 is not.

 

[XANDER CAGE]

:lol at the medium setting being "a bug"

 

[nataku]

lol @ their response to the texture resolution. Making people with high end PCs suffer because those with low end PCs don't understand they can't run high resolution textures? Come on, Bioware. You're MMO has some of the worst looking textures of the major MMOs out there.

 

[Mareg]

I was wondering if I could copy the game directory ?
My friend bought the game online but he doesn't have the necessary bandwight to download the whole thing before the end of is montly download cap (he would have to wait until the 24th wich is very unfortunate). I plan to put my game directory on a portable drive so he doesn't have to.
I know this worked with WoW. I was wondering if you had to install SWTOR proper or you could just drop the game directory and be good to go ?

 

[daebo]

LOL.. you know, reading all this stuff... I swear, I feel like I'm playing the game wrong... I haven't done any flashpoints. I've only done like 3 heroics... I've done some PVP but not lighting up the world. Granted I'm only level 23 but still...

 

[gatti-man]

I really don't give a shit about performance as long as the game is good, which FF14 is not.

Woosh

The point is ff14 had a TERRIBLE engine and even that was able to output incredible textures. The player textures in this game can be as bad as ps2 era.

 

[Hari Seldon]

Someone else said it, but I am pretty much convinced they don't want the perception that this game needs a high end PC. At least not for a little while. Then they will enable the High Textures as Ultra Textures.

 

[cpp_is_king]

Woosh

The point is ff14 had a TERRIBLE engine and even that was able to output incredible textures. The player textures in this game can be as bad as ps2 era.

FF14 didn't have a terrible engine, it had terrible design and production values. It didn't have a great engine, but I assure you Hero is basically the worst you can find anywhere. You couldn't even invent an engine in your head worse than HE

 

[nataku]

FF14 didn't have a terrible engine, it had terrible design and production values.

No, FF14 had a terrible engine. It didn't even have proper, if any, environment shadows. Probably because of performance issues. It has great textures though.

Either way, I'm reading through the post in the SWTOR forums and someone shows a comparison with FFXI PC showing better character textures. FF11.

Hell, FF11 had better character shadows too.

 

[Repgnar]

LOL.. you know, reading all this stuff... I swear, I feel like I'm playing the game wrong... I haven't done any flashpoints. I've only done like 3 heroics... I've done some PVP but not lighting up the world. Granted I'm only level 23 but still...

I'm level 43 and that's how I played for the most part. Gave up on doing heroics around 25 and have only done like one or two since then. Once I hit 40 I did pvp for a full level then finished up Hoth. Only completed two flashpoints too but plan on going back and soloing the lower level ones once I hit 50.

 

[BattleMonkey]

No, FF14 had a terrible engine. It didn't even have proper, if any, environment shadows. Probably because of performance issues. It has great textures though.

Either way, I'm reading through the post in the SWTOR forums and someone shows a comparison with FFXI PC showing better character textures. FF11.

Hell, FF11 had better character shadows too.

Textures are an issue, but TOR does lot of other visuals lot better than FF11 did which brings things down. FF11 has better textures than alot of "next gen" console titles who are many years older, but still is lacking in many areas in comparison.

 

[chickdigger802]

No, FF14 had a terrible engine. It didn't even have proper, if any, environment shadows. Probably because of performance issues. It has great textures though.

Either way, I'm reading through the post in the SWTOR forums and someone shows a comparison with FFXI PC showing better character textures. FF11.

Hell, FF11 had better character shadows too.

To be fair ff11 did have pretty good textures. Like the only thing square enix excels at these days.

 

[gatti-man]

FF14 didn't have a terrible engine, it had terrible design and production values. It didn't have a great engine, but I assure you Hero is basically the worst you can find anywhere. You couldn't even invent an engine in your head worse than HE

That is exactly what i gathered Reid was saying between the lines. Our engine is shit dealwithit.gif

 

[frequency]

If Bowdarr is batting guys around, turn off that ability. Risha may have trouble with two elites, but those fights don't happen as often, and when they do, call out the tanks. You'll be getting a new melee DPS on the planet you're on (Balmorra), and she should be pretty strong and act as a mini tank (though she's not a tank).

Make it a habit to visit the fleet every time you finish a planet...or every time you're bored with your current planet. Buy the fleet passes so you can quick travel to the fleet.

And NeoGAF is synonymous with complaining, so you shouldn't let it get to you. While there are things definitely wrong with PVP, and there are certainly idiots on PVP, it's gotten a lot better (at least in my experience).

I didn't know it was an ability.

The thing with keeping Risha around and switching to tanks when I need to is gear. How do I keep 2 companions adequately geared?
I'll look forward to the new melee companion. I just got Risha though. Seems really soon to get another?

I'm often bored of my planet. I really need to slow myself down and go sit around and hang out for a while. I spend a lot of time just "hanging out" in MMOs. I'm really not sure why I don't in this one. Maybe because it feels like such a single player game or something. I'll look up fleet passes and buy some. I only know of the long cooldown one in my abilities.
I think a part of the issue is that the fleet is just so ugly and brown

Thanks for the tips and stuff.


About the textures:
My computer isn't the best. My SO built it like a year and a half ago for ~$900. So it was relatively budget.
I don't know what settings I run FF14 at but it looks really nice and is really smooth. This game looks way worse. I don't have any performance issues though. So I think I can probably run it with better textures. I would like to at least be given the option. My settings in this game are at High or whatever and it still looks really outdated.

 

[Mammoth Jones]

I'm not so much concerned about graphical quality. The game looks fine. Once AA is patched in, it should be great. But performance is my gripe.

The game runs like hogshit. Just feels very unoptomized for a game they wanted to scale well on a variety of configurations.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

I am still having fun but I really don't think I will re-sub after my 30 day trail. The game just doesn't run that well on my computer and I can't figure out why. Its fun but I have been there and done that.

I was pretty hyped for this game too.

oh well I hope everyone that keeps playing it has a blast though.

 

[Hawk269]

I think the game looks great, but really they should give us the options to crank it up if we want. Game runs great for me and it's all maxed out, only a few indoor areas drop in frame rate. I would like to have the option of at least trying to run the game with higher textures if my machine can handle it.

At minimum they should give us options to tweak graphics settings:

* Plant density slider
* Draw distance slider
* Terrain radious cluttler level
* Terrain draw distance
* Effects graphic level
* Shadow settings that dont look like shit
* AA settings (Yes this is finally coming in the next patch)

Basically, graphics tweaks that have existed in most PC games for over 2-3 years.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

At minimum they should give us options to tweak graphics settings:

* Plant density slider
* Draw distance slider
* Terrain radious cluttler level
* Terrain draw distance
* Effects graphic level
* Shadow settings that dont look like shit
* AA settings (Yes this is finally coming in the next patch)

Basically, graphics tweaks that have existed in most PC games for over 2-3 years.

Bingo! the pathetic graphic options is a real joke.

 

[TriniTrin]

At minimum they should give us options to tweak graphics settings:

* Plant density slider
* Draw distance slider
* Terrain radious cluttler level
* Terrain draw distance
* Effects graphic level
* Shadow settings that dont look like shit
* AA settings (Yes this is finally coming in the next patch)

Basically, graphics tweaks that have existed in most PC games for over 2-3 years.

Agreed, I really REAALLY hate the growing plants because the draw distance for them isnt adjustable

 

[Lain]

Honestly I don't see why this texture thing is a big deal. Game looks pretty good as it is. It is no Age of Conan, but I was kind of expecting that being bioware and all. Bioware used the NWN engine for like 150 years.

The game looks like a mixed bag to me. Just taking a stroll through Kaas' forest, I see blurry, low res textures on trees on the ground.
A look at the armor I wear, and I see a blurry mess with lost details.
Playing Agent, I almost laughed at how bad the texture on the mask of the Darth looked.
There is also the shadows problem, which look bad and tend to behave strangely.
Since it is what it is for the textures, I hope they'll be able to do something for the shadows.

 

[XANDER CAGE]

The game looks like a mixed bag to me. Just taking a stroll through Kaas' forest, I see blurry, low res textures on trees on the ground.
A look at the armor I wear, and I see a blurry mess with lost details.
Playing Agent, I almost laughed at how bad the texture on the mask of the Darth looked.
There is also the shadows problem, which look bad and tend to behave strangely.
Since it is what it is for the textures, I hope they'll be able to do something for the shadows.

This is the one that really made me notice it too, haha.

 

[Dunlop]

If they can fix my insane load times when I go on a planet, I will be happy with leaving the graphics at the current level

It's at the point that I had given up on PVP while questing on a planet because it will take me like 5 minutes to get back once the match is over

 

[Blitzzz]

At minimum they should give us options to tweak graphics settings:

* Plant density slider
* Draw distance slider
* Terrain radious cluttler level
* Terrain draw distance
* Effects graphic level
* Shadow settings that dont look like shit
* AA settings (Yes this is finally coming in the next patch)

Basically, graphics tweaks that have existed in most PC games for over 2-3 years.

I think you can set density in the ini file... maybe a few more. It's weird that all those settings were in beta and all got removed

I do like their implementation of tree draw distance though....the tree blobs from far away at least fill out the scenery without putting too much strain on system


on another note, is there a complete list of titles and where to get them somewhere? I think the codex lists 60 something total and breaks some down by planets

 

[Effect]

Do the social aspects (not just in terms of grouping but simple interaction with other players) improve in the game at all (naturally or having to go out of your way to create any interaction) or is still largely a single player game the higher in level you go and the farther you get from the starting planet?