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//: StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty |OT2| GL HF GG

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Y

YakiSOBA

Member
Should i decide my build AFTER i scout?

Tell me what I did wrong / what can be corrected:

TvP, went 1/1/1 fast banshee + cloak.. scouted after supply was complete and saw 1 pylon, 1 gateway, 1 gas...

Turns out he went 4gate and I lost around the time my first banshee came out. He came in with a few stalkers and a sentry + zealots :(
 
S

Slavik81

Member
YakiSOBA said:
Should i decide my build AFTER i scout?

Tell me what I did wrong / what can be corrected:

TvP, went 1/1/1 fast banshee + cloak.. scouted after supply was complete and saw 1 pylon, 1 gateway, 1 gas...

Turns out he went 4gate and I lost around the time my first banshee came out. He came in with a few stalkers and a sentry + zealots :(
Click to expand...
That doesn't sound like a scouting failure. The main purpose of scouting is to check if he's doing something weird. Instead, he was doing the most normal, straight-forward thing he ever could do.

If the build can't handle an opponent building a few basic unit-producing structures and attacking you, then you really need to re-examine either your planning or execution of it.

Post a replay, and maybe we can help you out.

ProudClod said:
Thanks! Where can I upload the replay?
Click to expand...
I tend to just use MediaFire. They're a good place to keep any files.
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
YakiSOBA said:
Should i decide my build AFTER i scout?

Tell me what I did wrong / what can be corrected:

TvP, went 1/1/1 fast banshee + cloak.. scouted after supply was complete and saw 1 pylon, 1 gateway, 1 gas...

Turns out he went 4gate and I lost around the time my first banshee came out. He came in with a few stalkers and a sentry + zealots :(
Click to expand...

Rushing into cloaked banshees is also a bit cheesy. It's not cheese per se, but it's something that will only work if you don't get scouted/face early pressure. That's too big of a gamble IMO. With Protoss, turtling without making a single unit is simple (although I would argue stupid), for terran, the best thing you can do is block off your ramp. If the enemy has any sort of ranged units, you're fucked.

Like Slavik said, the problem is with your build. If the first offensive unit that comes out is a banshee, you have a problem. You need to modify your build order. Is there any way for you to pump out racks units before you get your banshee? It'll sacrifice a little bit of the banshee timing, but you won't die to a tiny push. Block off your ramp, pump marines out and position them behind the supply depots so they can defend anyone trying to walk up the ramp.
 
T

TheRagnCajun

Member
ProudClod said:
Rushing into cloaked banshees is also a bit cheesy. It's not cheese per se, but it's something that will only work if you don't get scouted/face early pressure. That's too big of a gamble IMO. With Protoss, turtling without making a single unit is simple (although I would argue stupid), for terran, the best thing you can do is block off your ramp. If the enemy has any sort of ranged units, you're fucked.

Like Slavik said, the problem is with your build. If the first offensive unit that comes out is a banshee, you have a problem. You need to modify your build order. Is there any way for you to pump out racks units before you get your banshee? It'll sacrifice a little bit of the banshee timing, but you won't die to a tiny push. Block off your ramp, pump marines out and position them behind the supply depots so they can defend anyone trying to walk up the ramp.
Click to expand...

If you constantly pump out marines with your one rax you should be able get to 2 cloakd banshees by the 7 minute mark still.
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
TheRagnCajun said:
If you constantly pump out marines with your one rax you should be able get to 2 cloakd banshees by the 7 minute mark still.
Click to expand...

And there you go. I don't play Terran, so I don't really know their timings too well -- but that's obviously quite a bit better than rushing to banshees and not having any racks units.
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
Slavik81 said:
That doesn't sound like a scouting failure. The main purpose of scouting is to check if he's doing something weird. Instead, he was doing the most normal, straight-forward thing he ever could do.

If the build can't handle an opponent building a few basic unit-producing structures and attacking you, then you really need to re-examine either your planning or execution of it.

Post a replay, and maybe we can help you out.


I tend to just use MediaFire. They're a good place to keep any files.
Click to expand...


MediaFire doesn't work for me. It tells me to clear my cache, which I've done, and the uploader still won't open. Any other sites? I want to upload a replay against a Diamond protoss where I do exactly what I was talking about last page. He sees my roaches approaching, builds a sentry. Force Fields his ramp, and sees my roaches leaving. Goes back to focusing on his base, not realizing that a few seconds later, my roaches walked up the ramp and target fired his sentry. By the time he realized this, the sentry was dead, his zealots were dead, and he tried to warp in a sentry -- but it was too late. I rushed 12 zerglings in, along with the roaches that were in his base, I killed every probe/stalker/etc that he had.
 
M

Meeru

Banned
Pandaman said:
alot of people just want to get diamond then go afk because they're worried they'll be demoted if they kept at it. cheesers and the like, you know.

dont really pay them any mind, most of them are gold leaguers at best >_>
like valenti! 600 points, lol what a scrub.
♥
Click to expand...
1v1 lets go tonight

The reason why I don't find any satisfaction with the current laddering..is because no one can see how highly ranked u are..until chat rooms show up :p
 
H

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
ProudClod said:
MediaFire doesn't work for me. It tells me to clear my cache, which I've done, and the uploader still won't open. Any other sites? I want to upload a replay against a Diamond protoss where I do exactly what I was talking about last page. He sees my roaches approaching, builds a sentry. Force Fields his ramp, and sees my roaches leaving. Goes back to focusing on his base, not realizing that a few seconds later, my roaches walked up the ramp and target fired his sentry. By the time he realized this, the sentry was dead, his zealots were dead, and he tried to warp in a sentry -- but it was too late. I rushed 12 zerglings in, along with the roaches that were in his base, I killed every probe/stalker/etc that he had.
Click to expand...
Any upload site then?
http://depositfiles.com
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
Hazaro said:
Want to put up that other game with 20 mutas?

*depostfiles was not the one I meant, maybe it was http://www.filesonic.com/ ?
One of these sites has a 0-15 sec wait time unlike most others. Can't remember the name.
Click to expand...

Here :)
http://www.filesonic.com/file/36051889/mutastotherescue.SC2Replay

Also: I made a looooot of mistakes in this game. I realized I was so high on money because I was just so onfocused and sure that I would lose. Regardless, though, somehow, I pulled through.
 
S

Sblargh

Banned
Sweet baybee Jesus, I was diamond, why am I sucking so much? I'm having trouble against bronze people. What happened? How my magic gone away?
Last game I actually didn't notice that I put my probes and my army on the same command group.
There I am fighting next to his base and all my probes appear. :lol
I expand without making more gateways, money skyrocketed. Argh. All kinds of horrible.
I won by a mixture of miracle and his suckness. But he sucked for being a noob, I'm sucking for being a suckage person.
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
Sblargh said:
Sweet baybee Jesus, I was diamond, why am I sucking so much? I'm having trouble against bronze people. What happened? How my magic gone away?
Last game I actually didn't notice that I put my probes and my army on the same command group.
There I am fighting next to his base and all my probes appear. :lol
I expand without making more gateways, money skyrocketed. Argh. All kinds of horrible.
I won by a mixture of miracle and his suckness. But he sucked for being a noob, I'm sucking for being a suckage person.
Click to expand...

How long since you played?
 
M

mescalineeyes

Banned
Aylinato said:
so, i got promoted to diamond 3v3 random with 1 game...yet im still in gold random 4v4 =(
Click to expand...

stop playing that shit.

also, can anyone give me some good arguments why mutas aren't OP against toss? I am running out of them and my friend is a dickwad who keeps insisting they are.
 
W

Won

Member
mescalineeyes said:
also, can anyone give me some good arguments why mutas aren't OP against toss? I am running out of them and my friend is a dickwad who keeps insisting they are.
Click to expand...

Your friend is right. It's that simple.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
mescalineeyes said:
also, can anyone give me some good arguments why mutas aren't OP against toss? I am running out of them and my friend is a dickwad who keeps insisting they are.
Click to expand...
they die easily to phoenixes, rushing them has you die to about 6 different protoss builds and even when you get them versus robo tech it takes a long time and careful control to not die to some hurrrrrr stalker ball.

people who freak out about mutas are bad. no exceptions.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Corran Horn said:
We should have gaf showmatches to show who is top dawg!
Ill canon rush the fuck out of everyone.
Click to expand...
and have someone with a good computer record them this time. ill cocast!
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
and i still have the NA guest pass we were going to us for na ve eu, so euers could get in on some showmatches. >_>
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
mescalineeyes said:
what, you are EU? <:
Click to expand...
no, way back me and fanboi were throwing around the idea for a gaf na vs eu showmatch, but it never worked out/we never got around to doing it.

i still have the passes though, so all EUers would have to do is download the NA client and share the account for the games they need to play.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
mescalineeyes said:
Do you have to be first in your league to get promoted?
Click to expand...
no.
there is no relationship at all between promotions and any information you have access to from your account.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
fanboi said:
You are always first in my league!
Click to expand...
&#9829;
you are your own league to me.

--

i love how day9 is uploading all the dreamhack stuff, it makes it so easy to download and watch them at home. ^^

also waaaaaaaaaaaaaat at the clide match in gsl a few days ago.
 
C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
Pandaman said:
&#9829;
you are your own league to me.

--

i love how day9 is uploading all the dreamhack stuff, it makes it so easy to download and watch them at home. ^^

also waaaaaaaaaaaaaat at the clide match in gsl a few days ago.
Click to expand...
That clide series was insane.


I need to figure out how to stream on something besides livestream. Adobe FME wont recognize my 5.1(maybe 7.1...) audio card as a output device for streaming :( Only fix I can figure out is to headset jack into my microphone jack but then I cant hear. Or use my mobo sound card....which always glitches out after a few hours.
 
A

Aylinato

Member
so I went away from my laptop after this one game, and then when I come back it promoted me to plat in 4v4 random (it may have been a delay with the game)
 
H

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
I was teaching a friend how to cope with Terran as P.
Just to dip into the mindset of someone who knows how the game works, but doesn't fully use what is available to them.

I poke in with 3 marauders with shells at about 7:00. Nothing big, just seeing what he is up to, going to pick off a zealot or stalker, maybe a sentry.
I kite his 2 zealots + stalker and he types 'gg'.
I tell him to quit being a pansy and pull his probes. A chrono'd stalker pops and cleans me up.

We go back to the replay and what do we see?

1) He started hallucination ("I need it for scouting" - 'You don't have any sentries and it's much to early to invest in that')
2) He had warpgate finished and a robo sitting. He opted to chrono boost 2 stalkers instead of making them from warpgates. He also had a robo which a chrono'd immortal should have come out of (He had enough money and supply). (Instead he focused on trying to micro his units against marauders)
3) He felt defeated after pulling his probes to defend (But he was actually up 4 workers since I expanded behind it)

A good counter push with his early immortal and 6 stalkers would have been nice to see. No need to kill anything, just poke and check, poke and check.

Then of course I beat him since I had 3 ravens, a few banshees, tanks, ghosts, and 1-1 marines and marauders :lol
I played a real nice PvP after too.
 
I

Ikuu

Had his dog run over by Blizzard's CEO
Oh god I'm so bad at ZvZ, I can cope with T and P just fine (Gold League) but against Z I just have no idea what I'm doing, lost quite a few games to 10pools :(
 
C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
These last few days, every protoss just canon rushes. So annoying. :(

Now they all start on lower ground, luckly you can catch quick enough but if you dont your fucked.
 
H

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
Corran Horn said:
These last few days, every protoss just canon rushes. So annoying. :(

Now they all start on lower ground, luckly you can catch quick enough but if you dont your fucked.
Click to expand...
Just get your own cannons and wall your ramp yourself! :lol
 
P

ProudClod

Non-existent Member
mescalineeyes said:
go fast roach. it changed my life.
Click to expand...

I used to fast roach against Zerg, but 13gas12pool speedling build is godly against zerg, even when they fast roach. You get your speedlings out a bit quicker. It's incredibly easy to contain your enemy if you have map control. You see roaches approaching? build some spines in the base, and run into his base with a bunch of speedling. Worst case scenario, if you have to engage, make sure you're in an open space, and you should be good. Plus, not going early roaches makes it a lot easier to tech quickly to mutas, which is almost an instant-win against a player who went quick roaches.

Still, regardless of all of that shit I just said, I feel like everyone needs to pick one strong build order against each race, and perfect it. Obviously, leave room open to react to cheese/early pressure/FE, but as far as regular games go, at plat+ leagues, it's almost never a question of who had the better build. It's a question of who executed it better, and who made the right decisions.
 
T

twofold

Member
Ikuu said:
Oh god I'm so bad at ZvZ, I can cope with T and P just fine (Gold League) but against Z I just have no idea what I'm doing, lost quite a few games to 10pools :(
Click to expand...

Click this link - http://www.livestream.com/mrbitter/...a0c5&utm_source=lslibrary&utm_medium=ui-thumb

Go to the 1 hour 8 minute mark. Enjoy two hours of ZvZ coaching with one of the best Zerg players in North America.

Three builds covered -

Roach expand + timing push
Speedling/baneling
15 hatch FE

There's loads of other great tips about scouting and Overlord placement, too.
 
H

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
T

twofold

Member
Hazaro said:
That is super slick!

Anything for the other races?
Click to expand...

Do you mean ZvX? Or PvX and TvX?

If it's the first, there's two recorded coaching sessions for ZvP and ZvT in the livestream account. ZvP deals exclusively with two base burrowed roach into hydras with a late spire while ZvT is two base spire with roach support.

If you meant the latter, there's nothing that I know of unfortunately.
 
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