Support NeoGAF

[SlimySnake]

So on one hand, I get why people bitch and complain.

But why does the game have to look any better? Does it not look good enough? do you enjoy seeing developers lose control of their budgets and close down? do you enjoy 5-7 year development cycles? But where are the Sony first party games??

Stop chasing graphics.

If you want to bitch about replacing the main character or agendas, that makes more sense in this case.

I'm fine with these half step games like Ragnarok, Spider Man Miles/2. etc.

Why? Because you paid $500 for a new console. And you are paying $70 for a next gen game.

 

[Senua]

Why? Because you paid $500 for a new console. And you are paying $70 for a next gen game.

Please lower your expectations I guess, dno why we give them excuses

 

[The Mad Draklor]

So on one hand, I get why people bitch and complain.

But why does the game have to look any better? Does it not look good enough? do you enjoy seeing developers lose control of their budgets and close down? do you enjoy 5-7 year development cycles? But where are the Sony first party games??

Stop chasing graphics.

If you want to bitch about replacing the main character or agendas, that makes more sense in this case.

I'm fine with these half step games like Ragnarok, Spider Man Miles/2. etc.

For me, I don't like how there's barely any difference in the enemy AI between GoT and GoY, if at all.

I'm absolutely okay with the graphics being the same as long as the enemy AI improved since that will directly affect gameplay.

 

[simpatico]

Other than engine work, how is the scope much less than GoT? You do know that engine work is only a small(ish) part of the development once you have an engine don't you? (and is usually done concurrently with the other work being done on the game) Otherwise UE or Unity games shouldn't take long to make correct?

(If anything the engine devs for multiple Sony studios may have already moved on to PS6 upgrades to their engines, fact is the PS5 just isn't that great when it comes to Raytracing and other advanced systems, the PS6 should change that)

All they have to make is the map and enemy layouts. The first round they had to figure out menus and systems and inventory and HUDs and the whole damn game. Sequel you've already got all the infrastructure. All the systems. All you have to do is populate the map with enemies and plop down all the scripting gates. I don't think is a novel critique. People have been making it for over a decade about some the "sequels" that hit the market.

 

[VGA-Games]

Activists are cheaper to hire than talented and passionate Game Developers

 

[mckmas8808]

by the looks of it.... I could say that it even had a lower budget. and if they scraped a game before yotei... are we seeing a 3 year game or a troubled game fixed with duct tape?.... regardless, PlayStation should be very proud at how things have gone with this piece of propaganda.

Yeah surprised it didn't cost $2 million to make right?

 

[LakeOf9]

This is a great thing, it's the exact sort of sustainable development we should be asking for more of.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Yeah surprised it didn't cost $2 million to make right?

.. . surprised. it. didn't. cost. $2 million. to. make. ?...... I dunno what that supposed to mean.

But this budget basically validates the criticism and observations about the game: it feels like a stand-alone expansion, not a full-fledged sequel, and it probably should have been released 18 months earlier

 

[nial]

Activists are cheaper to hire than talented and passionate Game Developers

... do we get banned on GAF for ableism?

 

[vpance]

.. . surprised. it. didn't. cost. $2 million. to. make. ?...... I dunno what that supposed to mean.

But this budget basically validates the criticism and observations about the game: it feels like a stand-alone expansion, not a full-fledged sequel, and it probably should have been released 18 months earlier

24 months earlier and $20 less.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

24 months earlier and $20 less.

yep, basically a stand alone expansion like First Light, Miles morales or Lost legacy

 

[VGA-Games]

... do we get banned on GAF for ableism?

Sorry, I don't know

 

[Ozzie666]

Why? Because you paid $500 for a new console. And you are paying $70 for a next gen game.

Devil's advocate.

Is there a PS4 cross generation release of this game. Are you suggesting this game as is, could run fully well on PS4? It's content designed for your $500 purchase and not available on your old box.

No one is making you buy this to justify your purchase. Like Don Mattrick said 'we have another box for you'

 

[Gamer79]

It looks like DLC for the first game.

 

[dgrdsv]

WTF happened to Sucker Punch? The first game they had to actually invent the fucking game, engine and gameplay systems. This is just a new map a couple new weapons. WTF took so long and what did they spend that money on? The scope of work is much much much less than GoT.

A conscious decision to make a safe relatively low budget sequel with a 160 headcount team. The latter alone puts them into "AA" territory so they'd need to double their size probably to pull off something more ambitious.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

Same budget, same amount of devs, same assets, same animations, same nearly everything with a MC reskin + pointless dog and new weapons that the MC stores and retrieves from an unnamed body cavity.

Reused a bunch of stuff from the last game yet still managed to spend as much money as the last game.

 

[DenchDeckard]

As end users, we are facing a lot of harsh realities this gen.

AAA gaming is not sustainable
Hardware is no longer subsidised

Better to accept it now imo, ahead of next gen

 

[Ar¢tos]

As end users, we are facing a lot of harsh realities this gen.

AAA gaming is not sustainable
Hardware is no longer subsidised

Better to accept it now imo, ahead of next gen

There will be no next-gen for me. I'm basically done with gaming.
I haven't played since Toem was on sale a month ago and there are no upcoming games that seem interesting to me, everything seems to be an uninspired rehash of something else.

Creativity and originality are at the lowest level possible.

I'll play on my PS5 the few rare games that manage to grab my attention and then I'm done, I can't be bothered to invest on a pc to play unique indie games, since, if they are good enough, they will eventually be released on consoles.

 

[Three]

Devil's advocate.

Is there a PS4 cross generation release of this game. Are you suggesting this game as is, could run fully well on PS4?

People forget that Ghost of Tsushima was 30fps on a PS4 Pro.

 

[GymWolf]

So this is why it looks like a ps4 dlc?

 

[DenchDeckard]

People forget that Ghost of Tsushima was 30fps on a PS4 Pro.

Yeah, I think it could deffo run on PS4 at 30FPS with some minor cut backs. It looks basically identical apart from a few improvements that happens in sequels

 

[Three]

Yeah, I think it could deffo run on PS4 at 30FPS with some minor cut backs. It looks basically identical apart from a few improvements that happens in sequels

Most games probably could get a port with half the framerate. That means you get double the CPU power and need half the GPU power in simple terms.

 

[midnightAI]

All they have to make is the map and enemy layouts. The first round they had to figure out menus and systems and inventory and HUDs and the whole damn game. Sequel you've already got all the infrastructure. All the systems. All you have to do is populate the map with enemies and plop down all the scripting gates. I don't think is a novel critique. People have been making it for over a decade about some the "sequels" that hit the market.

You have different departments working on different things simultaneously, they aren't waiting around (much). A vast majority of time to make a game of this size is the creation of the map itself, it's larger than the first game, none of the new map exists from Ghost of Tsushima so they are starting from scratch in that regard. A 4 year dev time for a AAA game of this size is not unusual at all and yet, for Yotei, people are calling them out for it and the one thing being called out in the post I responded to was the game engine, even with Ghost of Tsushima the engine is just the Infamous engine modified, it's rare a studio will start an engine from scratch unless the original engine wasn't fit for task.

(edit: also remember, Sucker Punch is not a huge team like Naughty Dog and SSM)

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Creating an IP should be much more expensive than creating a sequel

You already have the concept, world, mechanics, combat, a lot already in place

Spider-Man 2 costing more than 3 times the amount of the first game is ridiculous, for example. How? Why?

DEI is an expensive grift business

 

[midnightAI]

As end users, we are facing a lot of harsh realities this gen.

AAA gaming is not sustainable
Hardware is no longer subsidised

Better to accept it now imo, ahead of next gen

You do know this is said pretty much every gen don't you?

The issue is people's expectations are way too high, they expect miracles from hardware yet still want it to be very affordable (I agree with the affordable part, consoles should always be affordable (for the base system, not the Pro, Pro's are made to make money on the hardware from the get-go))

 

[ThisIsMyDog]

So.. smaller? (Inflation)

 

[Madserb2023]

It looks like it does.