sixteen-bit
Member
Maybe you'd have a case if the X1's original plans had been successful, but we've seen with PS4 it's primarily a games console with secondary multimedia features.
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The death of the Game Console
- Thread starter jeff_rigby
- Start date
Maybe you'd have a case if the X1's original plans had been successful, but we've seen with PS4 it's primarily a games console with secondary multimedia features.
Boombox On
Member
Why do you assume that the term 'service' excludes gaming?
Regardless, Sony and Microsoft make far more money off of their services than they do the hardware itself.
dragonfart28
Banned
Consoles already have their sales, but I agree that in terms of a value proposition, I have no use for a PS4 or Xbone this generation.
Ironically, the Wii U is a competent secondary console to PC.
Ironically, the Wii U is a competent secondary console to PC.
jeff_rigby
Banned
Please read: Game Consoles to replace Cable boxes and the connected home starts in
PCs are evolving to fill this role and now require Trusted boot and embedded DRM as well as power modes. Embedded DRM and trusted boot allow Playready DRM and until recently only Game consoles and CE platforms like blu-ray players supported this.http://www.accton.com/Newspage.asp?sno=82 said:
Will you change that too 2016 next?
Fattony12000
Member
GaaS. Games as a service.
jeff_rigby
Banned
Tivo suit April 2014 moved the FCC mandate to June 2015 not me. Are you asking if someone will Sue to delay it more and the FCC will comply? Don't think so as letters to the FCC are pretty sure the industry is ready for this.
Niteandgrey
Neo Member
The only thing that's dead is the willingness of console manufacturers to take an enormous up front loss on the hardware. The items on the OP's comment simply confirm that the hardware and software needed to produce low-power, low tdp hardware that still has plenty of horsepower is going to be even more available than ever in the next couple of years.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
WiiU has been getting lap in terms of the games. This narrative it somehow it's a better platform than the other two platforms get the fuck out of me because of missing so many good game putting upcoming big heavy hitters that the WiiU will never see.
That's nothing changes if my phone doesn't have some redeeming qualities but it's absolutely getting destroyed when it comes again and if you tell your friend or I cancel consumer which platform to buy I would recommend that as a good thing 3rd because it's missing so many quality games and the average person doesn't even give a damn about multi platform on PC when it comes to the passageway mainstream gamer. This kind of narrative might be something of a discussion. On here but when I'm recommending a platform with the most names of high quality then I would go with the ps4 as the first choice and Xbox as the second.
You can take that rationally or think I hate. believe me I don't mean and as a matter of fact if I'm ever going to get a second console before I get a ps4 again then it would be the WiiU.
So what you are saying is that I am supposed too start using my PS4 as a Cable box this year? Yes or no will do as an answer.
More_Badass
Member
What "the industry is ready for" and what people will actually buy and prefer to use are two very different things
LordBaztion
Member
Agree with OP. At least MS will move to W10 PCs by the end of this gen. It makes sense with the device agnostic path the Company is following. I expect MS to partner and sponsor some living room PCs suporting W10 and MS peripherals like the gamepad and kinect.
However, I expect Sony to make a PS5, they seem to handle well the hardwarr business.
However, I expect Sony to make a PS5, they seem to handle well the hardwarr business.
martino
Member
Isn't Sony launching their own subscription service for TV channels named Playstation Vue or something like that?
If so, makes me believe Sony thinks gaming only consoles are a thing of the past as well or they wouldn't be diversifying their business.
dragonfart28
Banned
That's a fair point.
For my tastes, the exclusives currently on the 'next gen' consoles aren't compelling enough for me to make the investment and those gameplay types are covered on PC with better fidelity and performance. And the value proposition of Steam is incredible, IMO.
Many of the exclusives on Wii U are truly unique to that platform and are a much better draw as an alternative to the high production games found elsewhere.
Well...Sony has been thinking this since the PS 1 launched...Every company that had a console that could playback music CD's, movies have been thinking this. Dont need to say any more about the PS3 and the Blu Ray player. Some just took it a lil further recently. (Xbox One) Which makes Nintendo's stance on music, movie media playback seem kinda odd. Then again no it doesnt.....their stance falls in line with Nintendo's thinking almost to a tee.
Difference is Sony isnt putting gaming on the back burner behind the TV features. Not really back burner.....just that MS went all in on TV TV TV TV with the XBO.
jeff_rigby
Banned
Yes, this year if you have a Cable TV DVR. Yes if you don't have a DVR and you buy something like Sony's Nasne or a HD Homerun Prime for cable or Over the Air TV.
In addition, with a PS4 you also get XTV (browser called from programming), 1080P and S3D (due to the use of the Blu-ray codec) for OTA and Cable
Pokemaniac
Member
jeff_rigby, correct me if I'm wrong, but a lot of your argument seems to hinge around the assumption that because the tech can evolve in a particular direction which looks appealing to you, an enthusiast, that direction also looks appealing to general users, and, as such, the tech will likely evolve in that direction. This is a generally poor assumption. While there is some overlap between what general consumers and enthusiasts find appealing, whether or not enthusiasts find a particular evolution of tech appealing is often not a great predictor of whether general consumers will find something appealing.
AtomicShroom
Member
Man I am so sick of these "PC gamer inferiority complex" threads. You want consoles to die so that all your favorite games will make it onto PC so that you can play them in a higher resolution and, in a lot of cases, pirate them and get them for free. We get it already! It's not going to happen! Move on!
More_Badass
Member
Yes that's definitely why people would want their favorite games on PC. Makes perfect sense /s
dragonyeuw
Member
*Better* being completely subjective of course, it has less overlap for a PC gamer since it's basically a Nintendo box. For me neither the xbone or PS4 have built up enough of an exclusive library to make them worthwhile, and all the worthwhile third party titles are available on PC in ( usually) superior form.
Memorabilia
Member
This (Re: GaaS).
If games are ever primarily offered only as a streaming service & no longer offer local (whether optical or digital) based content any longer...that is the exact moment I walk away from gaming.
Every company on the planet wants to squeeze gamers like they are human ATMs & one of the ways is by roping people into monthly subscription style services. While I'm happy to pay for an inexpensive service like Netflix to watch disposable/one viewing shows & movies, I'll never be comfortable with a sub model for streamed games. Gaming is qualitatively different to me. I dont view games in the same way as I view most movies/TV shows. To me, games themselves are collectables. In this sense, I'm definitely not the target demo for some of the current services that various companies are trying out. To my tastes, Playstation Now is a train-wreck with that pricing model. Services like EAs vault are slightly more tolerable since the pricing is more reasonable & we at least have content stored on a local machine. But ultimately the purpose is the same: To tie gamers to a monthly payment system in perpetuity rather & break away from the traditional one & done purchase model.
The trends are obviously there as some % of gamers obviously dont mind or even like this sort of service. But count me out.
As to the OP, I think there's a lot of merit to his points in the long run. Microsoft does seem to be moving towards a model where games you purchase can be played on several different devices (an idea I do actually like). We can also gather from rumors that Nintendo is headed this general direction. But I'm still not convinced we are close to the traditional console being phased out anytime soon. As much as Steam has helped streamline PC gaming, its still too complicated & fraught with technical problems for the average person. Soccer moms, Joe Sixpack & dude-bros still have trouble figuring out how to set the clock on the proverbial "VCR". If a product is not dead simple & reliable 99.99% of the time most peoples' eyes glaze over & they'll tune out & never consider buying it. Consoles bridge the gap between technically oriented PC gamers & casuals who consider downloading & playing Candy Crush to push the limits of their patience/understanding of such technical wizardry. Can PCs get to the point they fill that gap themselves & make consoles redundant? Well, Win10 certainly seems partly aimed at doing just that. But, so was Win 8.1 & we all saw how that went. Win 10 is still Windows. And PCs still have literally thousands of different combinations of hardware that by its very nature means it cannot be as easy/simple/reliable as a console with a single, tightly controlled hardware/software platform. There's also the challenge of promoting a market of various branded Steam machines, for example. This is inherently different & more decentralized than marketing a console with one brand that people can easily grasp. This doesn't mean its impossible. After all, people have adapted to there being multiple brands of Android tablets. Not everyone needs the absolute simplicity of Apple's walled garden. So, maybe "PCs as console killers" could happen in the long run. But ease of use, even with MS trying hard on the tile OS, is still a major hurdle. It also seems to me that over the past 18 months, Sony's hardware oriented console approach to get people into their ecosystem is one of the only things they've been able to make money off of (other than insurance). Would they be able to accomplish the same thing if there were essentially several brands of PS4s running the Sony OS? Sony does seem to understand the trend of GaaS by trying things like PSNow. And producing Powers is obviously their attempt to value add to PS+ & bring in cord-cutters a la Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, etc.... But I'm not convinced PSNow can succeed without major changes to its pricing model &, more importantly, major improvements to the internet infrastructure in the US...which isn't going to be happening for at least several years. Streaming a non-interactive TV show in HD is one thing. Reliably streaming 30-50gb interactive games to a similar sized audience is another. Its a whole different set of technical challenges.
TLDR: For at least the next few years, there are several technical & marketing reasons why I cant see Sony or MS being able to keep consumers focused on XBLA/PS+/PSNow/etc... if there are, say, 5-10 different brands of Xbox or Sony OS PCs out there pushing non-localized, subscription based entertainment as their only revenue streams. PCs are still too complicated & unreliable for mass, casual adoption & I don't see Win10 changing that significantly. And US internet infrastructure is ridiculously too slow for millions of US consumers to make this a reality (& there are political dysfunction & corporate monopoly realities standing in the way of changing this anytime soon). As such I still see traditional consoles with local hardware/games as the best option for many/most consumers for at least one more generation.
I don't believe MS went all in on TV, not when they have funded so many exclusives, timed or otherwise, that have already released in less than 2 years of the One's life. It's more like they wanted the multi-media aspects to share an equal part of the stage with games to reinforce their original value proposition of an all-in-one console. It seemed so silly considering you still had to have a cable box and subscription to enjoy its multi-media features, so it didn't really consolidate anything.
The difference with Sony now compared to its previous efforts is that they're actually forming partnerships with TV program providers to create their own TV package offering, not just using the Playstation as a Trojan horse for a media technology largely invested in by its larger organization. Sony's value prop (smarter than Microsoft's IMO) is that you actually could replace your cable box with a Playstation, and I assume this service will extend to their other tech like TVs and Blu-ray players in short time.
The Mad Draklor
Member
It's certainly a dominant factor in my console-only lifestyle.
More_Badass
Member
Uncharted, Bloodborne, Infamous, Everyone's Gone To Rapture, Rime, Quantum Break, Inside
Why would anyone get PlayStation vue when it's actually more expensive and has less content than cable or satellite? Dish is making sure they are playing in this space with Sling TV, Comcast, time warner, dtv, etc., will soon follow suit and they will make it work w/ rokus and such. Sony won't be able to compete in the space.
kiunchbb
www.dictionary.com
A PC isn't easy to build at all, it might be easy for gaffers, but most people that grew up with iPhone and tablet won't have a clue.
Less and less people are buying desktop, and high end gaming laptops are too expensive and confusing for typical consumer to buy. Even as pc gamer I still have problem telling which graphic card is stronger without doing research.
This is why steam pushing so hard for steamOS, the ease of use is still a huge advantage for console.
Less and less people are buying desktop, and high end gaming laptops are too expensive and confusing for typical consumer to buy. Even as pc gamer I still have problem telling which graphic card is stronger without doing research.
This is why steam pushing so hard for steamOS, the ease of use is still a huge advantage for console.
Yeah, that's pretty terrible.
Steam machines.
Maybe you should make a thread about it.
pixelation
Member
Why do people always forget about the rest of the globe?, internet speeds aren't ready yet in the US, and even if they were... what about the rest of the world?, i don't think that MS, Sony or Nintendo would be willing to concentrate in the US alone.
dragonfart28
Banned
I disagree with the assumption that one needs to upgrade every two years.
You can already buy a PC that has better technical capabilities than consoles, and enjoy that for the life cycle of the consoles.
The real question is whether or not you think the investment is worthwhile for the exclusives currently on those systems.
Certainly, Bloodborne has done filled that role for some gamers.
More_Badass
Member
Aren't those Linux-only or something like that?
Boombox On
Member
No contract requirement for one.
Kind of nullified the whole "more expensive" claim, which is unfortunate, because it was actually wrong to begin with.
dragonfart28
Banned
Yes, this seems to be a huge drawback to SteamOS, imo.
You can get a very competent machine in the Alienware Alpha and not be stuck with the Steam platform.
Steam OS is Linux based, but you could run windows. See the alienware alpha for example, which can regularly be had for $399. It has it's own alienware interface that runs on top of windows. There's also steam big picture mode, that basically turns a PC into a console. A PC is very simple to use for gaming if you stay within the steam environment.
There is a no contract option with both DirecTV and comcast, $10 more per month. I'm sure others have similar options.
It's the intent of it I'm highlighting. I'm suggesting even Sony doesn't believe their PlayStation business can be grown on a gaming-only platform. And they're just getting started, give them some time to figure it out.
I agree with the OP in so far to say the gaming-only console is on its way out. I don't think Sony, Microsoft, Google, Apple, or Amazon have found the exact answer, but they're all working on it as part of their platform and will continue to do so.
The most important reason consoles are great is that they offer a single, unchanging hardware target that developers can optimize for. This is something you will never get in the PC space, unless you want to see games that only work on "authorized setups" from NVIDIA or AMD, which would basically just mean another console.
Having 2-3 set configurations to optimize for allows for developers to get a lot more out of less hardware. Most of the frustrations I have had in the PC space have to do with it being impossible for your particular setup to be tested. Sometimes a game just won't work. And most people who buy games aren't interested in being a part time computer engineer just to make their games work.
Having 2-3 set configurations to optimize for allows for developers to get a lot more out of less hardware. Most of the frustrations I have had in the PC space have to do with it being impossible for your particular setup to be tested. Sometimes a game just won't work. And most people who buy games aren't interested in being a part time computer engineer just to make their games work.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
When has Sony ever released a gaming only console? These have been multimedia boxes for years.
More_Badass
Member
Oh I know. I tend to play a lot of PC games that aren't on Steam
What I have never understood is the mentality that PC needs to replace consoles or is the better choice rather than simply enjoying their co-existence. I have my laptop for indies and stuff that you'd never see on consoles and consoles for AAA games. It's that simple