First reviews for Trank's Fantastic Four hit.
- Thread starter SCULLIBUNDO
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donkey show
Member
Trank, is that you?!
There's been a lot of complaints about the script (check out the sample dialogue quoted in this thread), but then Trank helped co-write the script (albeit with two other people and no Max Landis this time)
Has Kevin Smith stopped bursting into floods of tears on Fatman on Batman yet? You could practically hear Kevin Conroy awkwardly leaning away.
I'm not one for religiously adhering to the comics but the tone that Trank seemingly was going for - i.e. a pretty similar one to the one that made me bored and repulsed by Chronicle - is just a total mismatch with the Fantastic Four concept.
Throw another hundred million at this, you're going to get the same movie with better special effects and post-converted 3D. This attempt just seems fundamentally misguided.
I'm not one for religiously adhering to the comics but the tone that Trank seemingly was going for - i.e. a pretty similar one to the one that made me bored and repulsed by Chronicle - is just a total mismatch with the Fantastic Four concept.
Throw another hundred million at this, you're going to get the same movie with better special effects and post-converted 3D. This attempt just seems fundamentally misguided.
captainnapalm
Member
Not surprised. The trailer I saw was awful. It didn't seem to have a clue what made Fantastic Four work as a concept and seemed to be trying desperately to be hip and dark and gritty.
Also this kind of thing needs to stop:
"It's clobbering time" is something Ben Grimm's abusive brother used to say before he slapped him about. Comic book fans will love that.
Victor (pre-transformation): I think the whole world should come to an end.
Susan (sarcastic): Listen to Dr. Doom here.
This winking at the camera, self-aware stuff. Like they have to maintain this sense of irony and distance. It sucks.
Also this kind of thing needs to stop:
"It's clobbering time" is something Ben Grimm's abusive brother used to say before he slapped him about. Comic book fans will love that.
Victor (pre-transformation): I think the whole world should come to an end.
Susan (sarcastic): Listen to Dr. Doom here.
This winking at the camera, self-aware stuff. Like they have to maintain this sense of irony and distance. It sucks.
Really? I thought they were pretty interesting. The most recent one does a pretty good job describing the making of this disaster of a film. I mean it's an interview, Smith wants him to talk as much as possible.
WTFWTFWTF
ScreenSplitter
Member
"If we can't protect the Earth, you can be damn sure we'll avenge it."
"Check out Dr. Doom over here!"
One of these lines is not like the other.
"Check out Dr. Doom over here!"
One of these lines is not like the other.
Discotheque
Banned
lol exactly. they're both wack. but they're excusable.
the clobbering time one is stupid tho. it makes no sense either. why would he repeat something his abusive brother says when he puts in work?
ScreenSplitter
Member
No no no you misunderstand me Sir. The Avengers one fits. The Doom one is embarrassing.
I'm going to guess that it's his way of getting over the abuse from his brother. In a "when I hear the phrase it's clobbering time I'll be reminded of us saving the world and not my brother hitting me." kind of way.
Not that it excuses that decision to begin with but that's probably their logic.
Triggerhappytel
Member
I think it would have to be a major bomb that Fox decide it's better to sell back or share with Marvel than keep for themselves. I hope that happens because I think they've done a terrible job with the characters so far, but Fox are apparently being such dicks with it that I suspect they'll try to bolt FF onto the X-Men to piggyback on that series' success.
I just want Doom and Galactus to be done properly. The MCU lacks really good villains and three of Marvel's best are with Fox - Galactus, Magneto and Doom. Galactus could work really well in the MCU as the next major threat after Thanos is dealt with, and Doom would be a really good recurring villain who's always three steps ahead, a la Loki.
*sharp intake of breath*
If I were Fox and had to relaunch Fantastic Four again I'd do it as a soft launch by having the X-Men face off against a powerful and menacing Dr Doom. The F4 would then be introduced (with their powers, no origins) as a government team that's been quietly fighting Doom for years.
If the audience like what they see the studio could spin off this 'formed' F4 team into their film much like Warners are planning to do with their Justice League characters.
..., as for how Sony inevitably reboots Spider Man in a couple of years I'm less sure of what to do.
What do you think Singer will be able to do with the F4 that a more talented director like Matthew Vaughn (who had a producing credit) couldn't do?
If I were Fox and had to relaunch Fantastic Four again I'd do it as a soft launch by having the X-Men face off against a powerful and menacing Dr Doom. The F4 would then be introduced (with their powers, no origins) as a government team that's been quietly fighting Doom for years.
If the audience like what they see the studio could spin off this 'formed' F4 team into their film much like Warners are planning to do with their Justice League characters.
..., as for how Sony inevitably reboots Spider Man in a couple of years I'm less sure of what to do.
What do you think Singer will be able to do with the F4 that a more talented director like Matthew Vaughn (who had a producing credit) couldn't do?
ScreenSplitter
Member
What makes you think that'll happen?
Discotheque
Banned
also i doubt vaughn had much input on this movie. anyways if this lame kinberg still insists on including the f4 in the xmen universe i hope he does it after singer is done with the franchise.
edit: you might know though. aren't you kinda informed about some of these productions?
WordAssassin
Member
I don't agree at all. (Well, except for the budget part, 'cause yeah FF is a franchise that requires tons of special effects) Look at Incredibles. You need a competent writer to make the family dynamic of the group work, sure, but then you just make it an adventure film with them.
Hell just fucking copy the Ultimate Fantastic Four to like, a T, up until the Marvel Zombie bullshit crossover ruined all the amazing world-building that was happening.
FF1: Everyone gets their powers. Just do the Ultimate FF origin story. Megalomaniac Doom is the villain, he retreats at the end to fight another day. Just straight disappears.
FF2: Team has solidified more now. Open with them fighting the Mole Man guy, show that they're becoming a cohesive group. Doom still nowhere to be seen, maybe they're searching for him. Silver Surfer appears, they assume he's a Doom Bot, they fight him at the climax and lose. Cliffhanger with the warning that Galactus approaches.
FF3: Doom returns, now the ruler of Lavatria or whatever it's called. Finally get a proper, comic-accurate Doom in a movie. End it with Doom defeated but not dead. He retreats again. Does Fox own Squirrel Girl? Throw her in there.
FF4: Smaller-scale story, more personal. Give us a breather. Reed and Sue get married. Get the Skrull involved. Maybe they're hiding on Earth because something destroyed their planet. End with the return of the Silver Surfer.
FF5+6: Galactus arrives. Shit is fucking crazy. Doom teams up with the FF and SS to save Earth because if he can't rule it what's the point. Maybe end it with Franklin being born.
That's six movies with two arcs that are intertwined, plus a wide-open way to continue it even further. The first trilogy is about them becoming a true team and focuses on Doom finally being done justice. The second trilogy is more cosmic and is about Galactus being done justice. From there they could have Reed become more overprotective of his family and do a movie or arc where he almost becomes a villain himself - didn't they do that in one of the comics?
I feel like a family of super heroes is a fun and unique concept that Fox just can't seem to wrap their heads around for some reason.
Also cast Dennis from Always Sunny as Reed.
For all the talk of Spider Man now being the in the MCU the new stand alone film is still 100% a Sony Pictures film with the studio 100% financing, producing and distributing themselves.
Considering that the original people who gave us ASM 1 & 2 (namely Amy Pascal) and the shitty Bret Ratner X-Men film (namely Tom Rothman) are going to be directly behind this new film I have zero confidence in them or this new film.
As always, we shall see.
I'm afraid that I wasn't 'in the loop' on F4 at all. It was shot in New Orleans and I didn't know anyone who worked on it and I'm not in with anyone at Fox.
Though I do remember hearing at the time that Fox had Trank under contract after he directed Chronicle for them so they wanted him to work on F4 when his preference was to do an adaptation of the Red Star comic at Warners.
Fox enforced his option and he had no choice but to go and do F4. It seems like WB might have dodged a bullet in more ways than one there.
LeeRoyBrown
Banned
As an outsider to this series.
Never read the comic.
First two films were shit.
That B grade release from 94 was shit.
New one is shit.
Never read the comic.
First two films were shit.
That B grade release from 94 was shit.
New one is shit.
ryutaro's mama
Member
You knew it was all bad when the reviews got embargoed.
ScreenSplitter
Member
Except that's not true, Kevin Feige is producing. Of course Sony has final say, but it's completely disingenuous to claim it's 100% a Sony Pictures film. The whole point of the reboot is that it's not. It's a collaborative effort by Marvel Studios and Sony.
It is 100% a Sony Pictures.
Kevin Fiege is co-producing with Pascal.
Please don't get caught up in all the studio PR and spin.
ScreenSplitter
Member
Y'all need to learn percentages. Why would they even bother with the studio PR if Sony were making it solo. They'd just have sold the Avengers/Civil War cameos (actually Marvel wouldn't have ever taken that deal).
There were rumors during production about clashes between the director and studio, erratic behavior by the director (according to the studio, so who knows), and reshoots - which aren't uncommon, but these were rumored to be massive and involve core plot/narrative.
darkhunger
Member
Come on... Be optimistic. Fox let both Daredevil and Elektra revert when they realized they had no clue what they were doing with those... IMO this has got to be their last shot.
Studio PR is that Sony is financing and producing it like you said. According to Kevin Feige it is more like a Marvel Studios production with Amy Pascal as an additional staff member. I'd rather listen to Feige than some stuff Sony wrote to help them save face.
ScreenSplitter
Member
There were 12 years between the last Daredevil film and the Marvel reboot though, and Fox had various plans for reboots that fell through.
darkhunger
Member
But in the end they still let it revert. All they needed was to start production on something to prevent that, and they didn't.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
I'm a big fan of origin stories but this movie sounds awful, I feel like it would just waste my time and money.
#1 defender
Member
You're reading the quote wrong, it's saying that this film tried to be a darker, more emotional alternative to the MCU films, not that the latter are that.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Iron Man created an omnicidal self-replicating AI out of his male Siri and a magical space rock that had been previously used by a shape-shifting alien God to mind control a team of government agents.
But yes, crowds are too sophisticated to deal with a guy who masters interdimensional travel, universal language translators, and a flying car.
Kim Jong Un doesn't exist?
The Mandarin swap was at least funny, and the real Mandarin still exists in the MCU.
How hard is it to write Doom as evil Iron Man? They've tried 3x now to give us some version of Ultimate Doom, and no one likes Ultimate Doom.
SonicMegaDrive
Member
Sound like the unreleased 1994 Corman film will remain the best FF movie.
You know Doom has evolved through the ages much as the Mandrin did...
Folks need to stop getting their comics from Turner D Century.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I figured the movie would be shit the moment I saw the poster showing Reed Richards. Seriously, who thought that was a good idea to show a guy who barely looks the part?
The difference now is that Kevin Feige is a producer for the film so even though Sony is going to force batshit stupid ideas like 4 villains per film Feige will be able to push Sony in a direction that makes their fuckery work for once.
Rollo Tomasi
Member
Fantastic but not Fant4stic?
It's going to be interesting to see just how much 'pushing' Fiege can do on a film that Sony is fully financing.
I believe that this will be the first film that Fiege will (co) produce where he isn't at the top of the totem pole. Let's see how well he plays with others and vice versa.
Escape Goat
Member
Fantastic Fourth Fail
ScreenSplitter
Member
Again, why even give Kevin Feige a role if they're going to completely ignore him?
Escape Goat
Member
Why indeed.
darkhunger
Member
This type of arrangement happens all the time in Hollywood, a big ten studio paying a smaller one to produce. Just because a major studio is financing doesn't mean they make all the creative decisions. It all depends on the terms of the deal.
And here's the quote that specifically addresses your question:
And again, Feige already explains everything else there is to know about Marvel's role in the movie, and it's linked in my previous post. There's no debate here that it's primarily a Marvel Studios production.
Oh, wow. And they played that helicopter scene out more than Peter Parker's chimney joke.
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