Support NeoGAF

[killatopak]

Might be feasible with PSSR. It could have subpar gpu but a beefed up cpu.

My issue is how will this work post PS5. Now that I think about it, I guess it is fine. Cross-gen games are still being released after all.

In a vacuum it's a bad idea but looking at the current landscape of gaming where we're still operating at sub HD resolutions, I think this gives them brrathing room to actually reach 4k60 regularly. Emphasis on regularly especially with non-crossgen games.

 

[IDKFA]

Maybe in 15 years.

15 years? Probably nowhere near that long. 5 years top is my guess.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

I’d expect in terms of performance…

Switch 2 = PS4 Pro (2025 release)

PS5 Portable = PS5 slim (2028 release)

 

[deriks]

It will be a PS4 Pro level and people will buy since we're still getting PS4 Pro level of games

Nintendo predicted that

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Someone posted this in another topic, but this is what makes me change my earlier take on a potential dedicated handheld from Sony.
I completely overlooked such a feature:

Can the portal cast to a TV? Like is it a way to completely remove the need for a ps5, is it handheld only?

That would be pretty neat, unless Sony somehow manages to make this a possibility with Portal.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

It will be a PS4 Pro level and people will buy since we're still getting PS4 Pro level of games

Nintendo predicted that

Would it be popular if the bulk of its library was existing PS4 games?

 

[Radical_3d]

The Vita was a great little system. Sony just didn't give it the proper support and poorly positioned it against mobile phones.

It’s the last handheld. The rest have been easily transportable devices.

Edit: also not gonna happen. The technology to play native PS5 games on the go is ages away.

 

[Astray]

Sure, but they may as well not even exist for the large, mainstream market.
And unlike the Steam Deck, this new PlayStation handheld will actually have a retail presence.

I was watching Retro Game Corps yesterday, and he had a garage sale where he sold his old Steam Deck and Switch accessories.. And he was shocked that the Switch stuff was getting all the interest and most people coming to the garage sale had no idea what a Steam Deck even was.

People here really gave the Steam Deck far more notice than it's actually getting. It's not giving Nintendo any real issues rn.

Here's the video, go to 0:43

 

[SaintALia]

So a new handheld that will play gen old games? People will likely put up with that on Switch2 because of all the Nintendo first party efforts. It won't be the same for this handheld. It also doesn't help that Steamdeck exists as well and a lot of Sony's games are on PC now.

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Vita in 2024 is still a baller system. That screen still holds up, so does the size and ergonomics. Emulators work well.

Would love a PS5 handheld.

 

[pachura]

A PS4 handheld would be perfectly enough

 

[Little Mac]

How excited I am for a Sony handheld depends on how good or bad the physical ergonomics of the Switch 2 are.

 

[Kdad]

If it doesn't rival Steamdeck 2 at launch it'll be dead in the water.

 

[ZehDon]

... None of those examples are running the PS5 version of the game. Its running the PC version. Why do you think a port is needed to different hardware? Its not something that simply runs on a completely different architecture. Which is what the handheld would need to be as the bandwidth and GPU capabilities of the PS5 are simply not something that can be done in a handheld any time soon. Its going to need severe cutbacks of some sort and that would need to be done via software.

Yeah, that's not really how any of this works. There's no such thing as other devices running the "PS5 version". The architecture of the PS5 is just standard x86 with a custom AMD APU. The "PS5 Version" is just the game's code compiled to target the PS5's bespoke API, which is swapped out for a different APIs, such as DX or Vulcan, to create the different platform targets. The days of entirely re-writing games for specific hardware ended after the PS360 era when everything standardised. So, yeah, the ROG Ally is running the PS5 version, just using different API's to target the different hardware. The PC's scalability options are simply disabled when the game's compiled for the PS5. In any case, Sony's next handheld will just be an x86 handheld so Sony can just use their PC versions without any additional work. They'll likely "console" it, meaning the games will be loaded with pre-set configs so player's don't have to tinker with settings.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

If it doesn't rival Steamdeck 2 at launch it'll be dead in the water.

Steamdeck sells like shit as well, so it's not exactly offering competition.

What did Steamdeck sell so far? A mere 3M?

 

[jm89]

If it doesn't rival Steamdeck 2 at launch it'll be dead in the water.

My guess in terms of hardware power i think steamdeck 2, xbox handheld, this sony held will be similar in power. Valve said they are waiting for a generation leap for a steamdeck 2 and i think ms and sony are doing the same.

Sony might have the advantage with PSSR being a matured ai upscaler by the time the handheld could come out. Although i'd imagine AMD might have something by then aswell.

 

[Schmendrick]

please no...

We can do without another weak ass platform that either holds back everything else or stretches resources even thinner.

 

[ProtoByte]

Now they know the smart way to do things make games that will run on the handheld & home console.

Delete this evil, now.
That would be disastrous.

 

[Zathalus]

Yeah, that's not really how any of this works. There's no such thing as other devices running the "PS5 version". The architecture of the PS5 is just standard x86 with a custom AMD APU. The "PS5 Version" is just the game's code compiled to target the PS5's bespoke API, which is swapped out for a different APIs, such as DX or Vulcan, to create the different platform targets. The days of entirely re-writing games for specific hardware ended after the PS360 era when everything standardised. So, yeah, the ROG Ally is running the PS5 version, just using different API's to target the different hardware. The PC's scalability options are simply disabled when the game's compiled for the PS5. In any case, Sony's next handheld will just be an x86 handheld so Sony can just use their PC versions without any additional work. They'll likely "console" it, meaning the games will be loaded with pre-set configs so player's don't have to tinker with settings.

Of course that is how it works, otherwise it wouldn't take months of porting to make a PC version. Entire segments of code have to be rewritten just so that the game can work on a split memory architecture for example. The handheld needs to run all PS5 and PS4 games without any changes being made to the base code. You can't force different setting or scalability options like you can with PC games. Even the PS5 was not 100% perfectly capable of running all PS4 games without issues, AC Syndicate needed to be patched by Ubisoft in order to work. Now imagine all of that running on a handheld with massively cut down memory bandwidth? Sure, you can probably change the output resolution, but not everything scales linearly with resolution.

That's my point, making a console that can seamlessly play PS4/PS5 games without any changes to the code base of those games is pretty much impossible with current technology, but if the games need to be patched or ported to work on the handheld then yeah, that is perfectly possible.

 

[Astray]

So a new handheld that will play gen old games? People will likely put up with that on Switch2 because of all the Nintendo first party efforts. It won't be the same for this handheld. It also doesn't help that Steamdeck exists as well and a lot of Sony's games are on PC now.

You would have to buy those brand new on Switch 2 (assuming that you bought Switch 2). These same games are considered "old" on PS4/5 and would likely sell for far less.

 

[ZehDon]

Of course that is how it works, otherwise it wouldn't take months of porting to make a PC version. Entire segments of code have to be rewritten just so that the game can work on a split memory architecture for example. The handheld needs to run all PS5 and PS4 games without any changes being made to the base code. You can't force different setting or scalability options like you can with PC games. Even the PS5 was not 100% perfectly capable of running all PS4 games without issues, AC Syndicate needed to be patched by Ubisoft in order to work. Now imagine all of that running on a handheld with massively cut down memory bandwidth? Sure, you can probably change the output resolution, but not everything scales linearly with resolution.

That's my point, making a console that can seamlessly play PS4/PS5 games without any changes to the code base of those games is pretty much impossible with current technology, but if the games need to be patched or ported to work on the handheld then yeah, that is perfectly possible.

No ones talking about PS4 games and the PS5 game speculation revolves around an x86 handheld as I’ve explained, meaning it won’t be running Sony’s PS5 API, it’ll be running a PC API. You’re losing the forest for the trees.

 

[Zathalus]

No ones talking about PS4 games and the PS5 game speculation revolves around an x86 handheld as I’ve explained, meaning it won’t be running Sony’s PS5 API, it’ll be running a PC API. You’re losing the forest for the trees.

The article is literally about playing PS5 games. Which stands to reason that includes PS4 games. It’s not a PC type device.

 

[Darsxx82]

It seems to me a very interesting situation. There are many unknowns and aspects that Sony will have to resolve.

1- The release date. I suppose they will wait for the release of PS6?
A portable console that runs PS5 games is interesting for the masses today, in 4+ years the new games will be out.

2- Support. The fear of the situation experienced with PSVita comes back to mind.
It will need support from Sony's Studios First to receive new games or adaptations. When the time comes, 3rd party support will be linked to sales.
Compatibility with BC games from PS4/5. Sony is going to have to do a great job in that aspect. Much more than the current BC that is almost limited to working via brute force.

-The price. What kind of product do you have in mind? I doubt that Sony will launch a portable that does not have as a forecast to sell tens of millions. Among other things because it is necessary for the 3rd parties to give it specific support.

In that case, MS/XBOX would have an easier time designing a product of this type because it has Windows on its side and its ecosystem and catalog is connected (Playanywhere) and its software BC system is easily transferable to future devices.

Support for a Windows handheld is simpler and it would be a product that would have 3rd party support by default because it would basically run PC games like RogAlly, SteamDeck etc..

Is SONY thinking of a "steam/Windows" portable console compatible with PC ports of its games??

In 3-4 years we will also have SteamDeck 2, RogAlly2 etc (that play PS Games via Steam and Epic Stores) and, personally, those are more attractive and versatile types of products than those whose closed hardware viability will depend on first party sales and support. That is to say, I don't think Switch 2 is the only enemy to focus on as the author of the article does.

 

[Mayar]

I could be wrong but I hear this rumor all the time, plus if they do the same thing they did with Vita,then this idea of a portable console doesn't make sense. If they want to make a portable console for the market, it needs support with games and not just a few games at launch, otherwise it will all repeat the fate of Vita and just as happily die.

 

[Punished Miku]

It will, however, completely destroy Microsoft's chances at making a splash if Sony beats them to the market. It'd be almost cruel at this point to dominate them in yet another space.

MS isn't trying to outsell people in hardware anymore. They'll sell games on a PS handheld too. PS handheld would be the only expensive closed system handheld. Switch 2 cheaper. Everything else, open.

 

[Impotaku]

Welcome to the portable ps5, the most amazing 10 minutes of gaming you’ll ever see till the battery shits out. Backpack power supply and 50 foot power cord not included.

Going with the vita legacy they’ll gimp the internal storage so that you can barely put any games on then sell you a grossly overpriced propitiatory memory card I mean it worked for the super successful vita right.

 

[RoboFu]

No way they could get a pc tower ps5 pulling 220 watts is going to fit / work in a handheld.

I'd love them to make PS5 S like handheld though that would be funny

 

[Jesb]

Just improve on your cloud option with portal. We don’t need this.

 

[Sanepar]

>Releases PSP to rival the DS
>PSP is a great handheld and sells well
>Releases the Vita, barely supports it, lets it die
>Exit the handheld market
>Oh, shit, it's actually still profitable
>Come back after a decade after losing their entire market share.

The Vita was a great little system. Sony just didn't give it the proper support and poorly positioned it against mobile phones.

They do't have enough studios even for one console. The only way a handheld will work for them is a console that just receive ports from ps5.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Steamdeck sells like shit as well, so it's not exactly offering competition.

What did Steamdeck sell so far? A mere 3M?

It sold well enough to encourage many other manufacturers to start making their own PC handhelds.

 

[Robb]

I’d love that! Makes sense now that they have PSSR as well. I assume they’d be able to make it punch quite a bit above its weight, especially if the hardware is good from the get go.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I could be wrong but I hear this rumor all the time, plus if they do the same thing they did with Vita,then this idea of a portable console doesn't make sense. If they want to make a portable console for the market, it needs support with games and not just a few games at launch, otherwise it will all repeat the fate of Vita and just as happily die.

Iirc the biggest issue for Vita was UMD. The format was practically unsupported, turning Vita into a paperweight handheld.

If Sony would release a digital-only handheld, they would eliminate this issue.

 

[jm89]

>Releases PSP to rival the DS
>PSP is a great handheld and sells well
>Releases the Vita, barely supports it, lets it die
>Exit the handheld market
>Oh, shit, it's actually still profitable
>Come back after a decade after losing their entire market share.

The Vita was a great little system. Sony just didn't give it the proper support and poorly positioned it against mobile phones.

Whilst vita was a great system, having 2 seperate ecosystems is not easy.

Ask nintendo.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

It sold well enough to encourage many other manufacturers to start making their own PC handhelds.

That's not saying much.

SteamDeck sold 3M.

Vita sold 10-15M and was considered a massive flop.

 

[buenoblue]

I just picked up a Rog ally z1 extreme for £399. This thing is legit. Plays ALL games on pc, and with cross save to my desktop. Plus its an emulation beast. I gotta power bank to for £36 that more than doubles the battery life .

Black ops 6 normal settings, 720p( looks great on 7 inch screen),no upscaling, 60-70fps with 3 hour battery life with power bank ,

 

[OmegaSupreme]

That's not saying much.

SteamDeck sold 3M.

Vita sold 10-15M and was considered a massive flop.

Well for the longest time you could only get the deck on the steam store. The vita was everywhere. The vita almost certainly had way more money behind it.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Well for the longest time you could only get the deck on the steam store. The vita was everywhere. The vita almost certainly had way more money behind it.

Yes, and Vita was considered a flop with 3-5x as much sales as SteamDeck.

Although it's apples to oranges, I'm just saying with 3M sales, Steamdeck isn't even in the same ballpark as Playstation and is completely irrelevant.

 

[twilo99]

Series S version of their games??



Blasphemy.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Vita problem was that it was focused on console level gaming which also requires console level development & at that point the question becomes " Why are we developing for 2 different platforms"

Now they know the smart way to do things make games that will run on the handheld & home console.

Can’t wait to read the revisionist takes if this actually releases.
People have spent the better part of the last half decade saying that the Switch is kinda a failure because it failed to sell the same numbers as Wii+DS.

If Sony releases a handheld capable of playing their actual 1st party games on the go, it will have to be expensive, and this will bite into their home console market. Japan especially would probably 90% give up on Sony’s home consoles, bulky and made for living rooms many Japanese homes don’t even have. So PS home + PS handheld numbers will inevitably amount to previous PS home numbers, probably a bit more, but surely not twice as much. And I’m absolutely sure that, somehow, some people will find that absolutely obvious and not a failure at all.

Such a handheld may probably come when Sony is reasonably sure that their physical games market has become negligible. This thing will not be able to play physical media, that’s a given.

 

[LordOcidax]

Sony going back to develop for two systems again because the influence of Nintendo… Nahh, this can’t be true… But if true … Imagine being influenced by a company that is not your competition. Still, Sony is having problems to support the PSVR2, there’s no way they are going Series X and Series S route, but worse…

 

[ZehDon]

The article is literally about playing PS5 games. Which stands to reason that includes PS4 games. It’s not a PC type device.

It doesn’t stand to reason at all. And if Sony releases a handheld that only plays PC compiles of PS5 games, it’ll be DOA. That offers less than my Steam Deck.

 

[chilichote]

Stupid question: the PS5 Pro is probably on 4nm and consumes about as much power as the PS5/Slim on 7nm/6nm - how much would a PS5 on 4nm consume?

And how much with a reduced GPU that would use PSSR for 1080p?

 

[ArtHands]

I could be wrong but I hear this rumor all the time, plus if they do the same thing they did with Vita,then this idea of a portable console doesn't make sense. If they want to make a portable console for the market, it needs support with games and not just a few games at launch, otherwise it will all repeat the fate of Vita and just as happily die.

That's what happened with the PSVR2: they abandoned it shortly after launch.

 

[ArtHands]

Series S version of their games??



Blasphemy.

Imagine asking the developers to optimize their game across 4 different Playstation hardwares (portable, PS5, PS5 Pro and PS6)

 

[Kikorin]

They should first develop some PS5 games maybe.

Btw after the scam PS Vita has been I would never buy another portable from Sony.

 

[LordBritish]

So portal is essentially DOA… ill buy one for $99

 

[jm89]

Series S version of their games??



Blasphemy.

We literally have a device called the steamdeck that works without needing to run into a situation like the series s.

Sony don't need to make it mandatory to support, like the steamdeck games can be scaled down optionally, sony just need to make the process as easy as possible. If it really can run ps5 games day one then ps6 games would just need scaling down with a patch.

If a dev doesn't want to scale their games down, it could have remote play and cloud streaming to allow peopple to play their libraries.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Series S version of their games??



Blasphemy.

Wait the guy who said he has been evangelizing PC handhelds since 2016 is sowing doubts about a PS Handheld that would eat all PC handhelds lunch and we're surprised by this?

 

[Orbital2060]

They also say there that plans might change, and drop the idea. Theyre likely hedging their bets, with Xbox also building a handheld.

Thing is, with all of the games Xbox are making now, of which quite a few might release on Switch and PlayStation, and with Xbox devs already making games for S, a handheld Series S/budget level of performance makes a lot of sense.

 

[jm89]

So portal is essentially DOA… ill buy one for $99

Uhm how is it DOA? It's been selling well, topping the accessories charts many times.