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Breaking: Israel launches Operation Protective Edge against Hamas in Gaza

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How does me drawing on a map demonstrate whether i am for one-state or two-state. Sure there are a fair few settlements that a roughly in the middle of the west bank, those would need to evacuated, but the much larger ones are around E. Jerusalem would probably stay.
Because we can be on the same page on what a two state solution looks like. I want you to tell me what a Palestinian state's borders look like without 67 borders and E Jerusalem.
I should clarify and make it clear, I am not saying all Israeli settlements in the West Bank must stay, like in Gaza, there are going to be those that need to be withdrawn from so the borders make sense and the Palestinians have a contiguous state.

Also, if you know already what the negotiators want, then please enlighten the rest of us.
Maybe some other time. I am interested more in what you think an ideal Palestinian state looks like.
 

nib95

Banned
Israel dismantled the Gaza settlements didn't they? Also, I already know what Israeli and Palestinian negotiators want. I want you to show me how the future Palestine state looks like. I gave you the link. Draw the map.

If you cannot, then you are for one-state.

This is what I want to know. To all the supporters of Israel, please draw out the map as you see it fair. I want to know what land you think is actually fair for Palestinian's to be granted based on all factors after you've considered them.

For me personally, it's the 1967 borders, which is still more than Israel is internationally accredited to, by law.
 

Pilgor

Member
Absolutely fucking disgusting that they're capitalising on the downed plane.

It's common knowledge the soldiers and tanks have been prep'ed for weeks. You think it's a coincidence they pull the trigger a couple hours after the plane goes down? The news is already getting buried in the Ukraine stuff and isn't there a gag order on Israeli press?

This might be completely crazy, but would the Mossad be capable of crashing the Malaysian airline?

I'm pretty confident in assuming Israel thought it was an opportune time to invade Gaza while the entire world's attention was on the downed passenger jet.

The timing is far too perfect.

When I read about the terrible plane crash earlier, I joked to myself that people in this thread would somehow find a way to vilify Israel. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
 

ramuh

Member
This is what I want to know. To all the supporters of Israel, please draw out the map as you see it fair. I want to know what land you think is actually fair for Palestinian's to be granted based on all factors after you've considered them.

For me personally, it's the 1967 borders, which is still more than Israel is internationally accredited to by law.

Maybe return Gaza to Egypt and make them Egyptian citizens and the West Bank to Jordan and make them Jordanian citizens like pre 1967?
 

FlyinJ

Douchebag. Yes, me.
When I read about the terrible plane crash earlier, I joked to myself that people in this thread would somehow find a way to vilify Israel. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

Yeah, Israel is crushing Gaza under it's boot as we speak! We're just irrationally vilifying left and right LOL!
 

LNBL

Member
When I read about the terrible plane crash earlier, I joked to myself that people in this thread would somehow find a way to vilify Israel. I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

Have you forgotten your own behavior in this thread yesterday?
 

Menaged

Member
This is what I want to know. To all the supporters of Israel, please draw out the map as you see it fair. I want to know what land you think is actually fair for Palestinian's to be granted based on all factors after you've considered them.

For me personally, it's the 1967 borders, which is still more than Israel is internationally accredited to, by law.

Maybe because I don't live in these lands, but to be honest, I don't care too much.
Just give them something they'll be pleased with and end this stupid fighting.

But yeah, I guess 1967 makes sense.
 

Pilgor

Member
Yeah, Israel is crushing Gaza under it's boot as we speak! We're just irrationally vilifying left and right LOL!

What does that have to do with the plane crash?

Have you forgotten your own behavior in this thread yesterday?

You are unbelievable. Someone posts fake pictures from twitter/Facebook and I call them out. Someone posts another video from Facebook, and I don't trust its authenticity? Oh yes, terrible behavior!
 

nib95

Banned
Maybe return Gaza to Egypt and make them Egyptian citizens and the West Bank to Jordan and make them Jordanian citizens like pre 1967?

What the hell are you talking about? Pre 1967 it was the 47 borders (UN drawn and internationally recognised), and before that it was all Historical Palestine, also officially known as Mandated Palestine or the British Mandate for Palestine, due to the land being under British rule and administration (not Jordanian or Egyptian).

744px-Mandate_for_Palestine_%28legal_instrument%29.svg.png
 

Quotient

Member
Because we can be on the same page on what a two state solution looks like. I want you to tell me what a Palestinian state's borders look like without 67 borders and E Jerusalem.

Do you realistically believe that the Israeli's will ever hand over E. Jerusalem to the Palestinians? What from this 60+ years of conflict has given you the idea that it will happen?

Maybe some other time. I am interested more in what you think an ideal Palestinian state looks like.

If i knew, i would have the Nobel Peace prize and my own island. In reality, i hope for anything that would give them contiguous borders and provide them the freedom and liberties to have their own country. I don't doubt some of the Israeli settlements are going to be dismantled, and that the Palestinians may get less land, but that really has to better than what they have now.
 
Do realistically believe that the Israeli's will ever hand over E. Jerusalem to the Palestinians? What from this 60+ years of conflict has given you the idea that it will happen?
So what is the "realistic" option for a Palestinian state. What are it's boundaries. Do we revert to 48 borders like someone suggested?
 

LNBL

Member
What does that have to do with the plane crash?



You are unbelievable. Someone posts fake pictures from twitter/Facebook and I call them out. Someone posts another video from Facebook, and I don't trust its authenticity? Oh yes, terrible behavior!

You brought the pictures into that discussion again, after you disregarded that video as "Pallywood". Perhaps you should think about what you are writing before you hit the submit button and as you can read back in this thread, the majority thought you were an ass for posting that.
 
You are unbelievable. Someone posts fake pictures from twitter/Facebook and I call them out. Someone posts another video from Facebook, and I don't trust its authenticity? Oh yes, terrible behavior!
Such a revisionist, and so soon. Someone posted a video of a mother crying over her dead children. You responded with "PALLYWOOD", suggesting that the mom is faking it. Have some shame.
 

Quotient

Member
So what is the "realistic" option for a Palestinian state. What are it's boundaries. Do we revert to 48 borders like someone suggested?

Following this age-long conflict has shown me that the Palestinians won't get right of return to Israel and they won't get E. Jerusalem. Barak's proposal for the West Bank was 73% initially with an eventual total of 86%. I personally would prefer Israel just hand over the whole West Bank, but like i said, i really don't think 100% would happen.
 

nib95

Banned
Such a revisionist, and so soon. Someone posted a video of a mother crying over her dead children. You responded with "PALLYWOOD", suggesting that the mom is faking it. Have some shame.

I'm sorry but what the fuck. That's just deplorable. Shocking to see that kind of immaturity and sentiment on GAF full stop tbh.
 

Terra

Member
I find it awkward that in 2014 we cannot settle these kind of disputes. I mean...come on.
We need more love & care.
 

Pilgor

Member
Such a revisionist, and so soon. Someone posted a video of a mother crying over her dead children. You responded with "PALLYWOOD", suggesting that the mom is faking it. Have some shame.

You must be having trouble reading my posts, so I will do you a favor and quote myself.

Someone posts fake pictures from twitter/Facebook and I call them out. Someone posts another video from Facebook, and I don't trust its authenticity

I responded PALLYWOOD because I suspected that the unsourced Facebook video was likely used out of context, something the Palestinians have been known to do.

I have no duty to explain myself to you. I stand by what I said. Call it Pallywood, call it fraud, I don't really care. Yes, the video ended up being accurate, and I admitted that. But that was only after a proper source was cited.
 
Fucking hell.

Can't believe they're invading.

Just hope they show more regard for human life than they have so far, far too many dead and only more will die because of this. Horrifying news :(
 
Following this age-long conflict has shown me that the Palestinians won't get right of return to Israel and they won't get E. Jerusalem. Barak's proposal for the West Bank was 73% initially with an eventual total of 86%. I personally would prefer Israel just hand over the whole West Bank, but like i said, i really don't think 100% would happen.
So you agree West Bank and Gaza should be returned to Palestinians for a future Palestinian state?
 

Joni

Member
How long before we hear the hospital was secretly manufacturing weapons?
No, but they were clearly warned. If they didn't want to act as human shields for Hamas, these paralysed and/or comatose patients could have walked out before the bombs hit them!
 
Okay, then we are on the same page. Status of E Jerusalem I will be satisfied if it's declared as an international city under control of UN with the Temple Mount still under the Waqf Board, even though the 67 borders say it belongs to the Palestinian state.
 

Quotient

Member
Okay, then we are on the same page. Status of E Jerusalem I will be satisfied if it's declared as an international city under control of UN with the Temple Mount still under the Waqf Board, even though the 67 borders say it belongs to the Palestinian state.

I have no problems with that, but you don't have to convince me, the Israeli's need to agree to that.

I am neither Israeli, Palestinian, Jewish or Muslim. East Jerusalem doesn't have the any significance for me, like it does for those groups.
 

werks

Banned
Actually, on Israeli TV right now - IDF says long range rockets were hidden in this hospital.
Where's the proof? Palestinian casualties have to be witnessed by international journalists before they are considered legitimate. No burden of proof on the IDF?
 

Quotient

Member
Where's the proof? Palestinian casualties have to be witnessed by international journalists before they are considered legitimate. No burden of proof on the IDF?

Yeah this does need to happen. If you are going to attack a Hospital, you better be able to prove your claims of weapons storage, etc.
 
NBC pulls Ayman Mohyeldin from Gaza "for security concerns" and replaces him with Richard Engel.
Ayman Mohyeldin, the NBC News correspondent who personally witnessed yesterday’s killing by Israel of four Palestinian boys on a Gazan beach and who has received widespread praise for his brave and innovative coverage of the conflict, has been told by NBC executives to leave Gaza immediately. According to an NBC source upset at his treatment, the executives claimed the decision was motivated by “security concerns” as Israel prepares a ground invasion, a claim repeated to me by an NBC executive. But late yesterday, NBC sent another correspondent, Richard Engel, along with an American producer who has never been to Gaza and speaks no Arabic, into Gaza to cover the ongoing Israeli assault (both Mohyeldin and Engel speak Arabic).

Mohyeldin is an Egyptian-American with extensive experience reporting on that region. He has covered dozens of major Middle East events in the last decade for CNN, NBC and Al Jazeera English, where his reporting on the 2008 Israeli assault on Gaza made him a star of the network. NBC aggressively pursued him to leave Al Jazeera, paying him far more than the standard salary for its on-air correspondents.

Yesterday, Mohyeldin witnessed and then reported on the brutal killing by Israeli gunboats of four young boys as they played soccer on a beach in Gaza City. He was instrumental, both in social media and on the air, in conveying to the world the visceral horror of the attack.
 

DERF

Member
Someone please enlighten me why it is ok for Hamas or another group to shoot into Israel and kill people, but not the other way around?
 
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