MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
This is factual.I am sure by now everyone knows none of these reviews matter, the only thing that matters isMiyazakiHatesKojima
shillseal of approval when it comes to a Kojima game.
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Death Stranding Review Thread
- Thread starter Mista
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Might as well be, the whole thread is full of fanatical mental gymnastics all the way down to subscribing to SJW rhetoric of “feelings equal facts”.
Ironic, eh?
SAF0001
Neo Member
I think we all need to try it ourselves, because a strong atmosphere, storytelling and music may change our filling about gameplay from negative to positive side.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Thank you.
Phase
Member
Good post. These things shape our experience tremendously. Music for me has always had the biggest impact on my experience. I'm especially looking forward to seeing how it mixes into the gameplay and the world's atmosphere.
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BlackTron
Member
A diamond-studded piece of shit is still a shit.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Goofie ass post.
FranXico
Member
I think a lot of the gameplay choices probably are there to "make the player go through the pains of the main character". It's like Sam Bridge's fatigue and relief when reaching a destination is supposed to translate to fatigue and relief of the player.
Back in the day, we had to bash triangle to survive torture in one part of the game.
Now, we have to hold the trigger buttons to keep balance while carrying the cargo throughout the entire game.
Kojima just went all the way out on this one, for better or for worse.
Back in the day, we had to bash triangle to survive torture in one part of the game.
Now, we have to hold the trigger buttons to keep balance while carrying the cargo throughout the entire game.
Kojima just went all the way out on this one, for better or for worse.
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ethomaz
Banned
ethomaz
Banned
That seems better than I expected... terrains should be variables and vehicles should be hard to pass over it.
ethomaz
Banned
Wow I don't see an interesting online components like that since the awesome World Tendencies of Demon's Souls.
Hype increasing.
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davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
Arguing AGAINST the statement/idea that 'games must always be fun' is a disingenuous way to try and shut down certain criticisms of certain games.
Very few people actually mean 'a game should always be fun!' What they mean is 'a game should always be engaging'. They know this (although they may not have thought about it enough to articulate it) and those pushing back on them probably know it as well.
Does a game need to be balls to the wall action at all (or any) times to be good? Of course not. Few would argue otherwise.
Unless the game is literally intended to bore the Player's brain for some sort of metaphorical goal (Death Stranding MAY very well fall into this category), no one makes a game with the intention of NOT engaging the brain of the Player. Just like no one makes a movie- even a slow burn art house film- with the goal of making the audience disengage.
TL;DR- I would love for people to stop acting as if 'Games don't always HAVE to be fun!' is some sort of battlecry for those who look at games as MORE than just shoot-em-ups and fast driving arcade experiences.
Most people- and I would argue everyone on this board- already agrees that fun doesn't always have to be the goal. But you want to make a game that isn't engaging? Ok, well THAT is an argument we can have
.
Jaffe
Very few people actually mean 'a game should always be fun!' What they mean is 'a game should always be engaging'. They know this (although they may not have thought about it enough to articulate it) and those pushing back on them probably know it as well.
Does a game need to be balls to the wall action at all (or any) times to be good? Of course not. Few would argue otherwise.
Unless the game is literally intended to bore the Player's brain for some sort of metaphorical goal (Death Stranding MAY very well fall into this category), no one makes a game with the intention of NOT engaging the brain of the Player. Just like no one makes a movie- even a slow burn art house film- with the goal of making the audience disengage.
TL;DR- I would love for people to stop acting as if 'Games don't always HAVE to be fun!' is some sort of battlecry for those who look at games as MORE than just shoot-em-ups and fast driving arcade experiences.
Most people- and I would argue everyone on this board- already agrees that fun doesn't always have to be the goal. But you want to make a game that isn't engaging? Ok, well THAT is an argument we can have
.Jaffe
FranXico
Member
I think I saw you mention in a stream that while you are sure this game won't be for everyone, you are interested in playing it.Arguing AGAINST the statement/idea that 'games must always be fun' is a disingenuous way to try and shut down certain criticisms of certain games.
Very few people actually mean 'a game should always be fun!' What they mean is 'a game should always be engaging'. They know this (although they may not have thought about it enough to articulate it) and those pushing back on them probably know it as well.
Does a game need to be balls to the wall action at all (or any) times to be good? Of course not. Few would argue otherwise.
Unless the game is literally intended to bore the Player's brain for some sort of metaphorical goal (Death Stranding MAY very well fall into this category), no one makes a game with the intention of NOT engaging the brain of the Player. Just like no one makes a movie- even a slow burn art house film- with the goal of making the audience disengage.
TL;DR- I would love for people to stop acting as if 'Games don't always HAVE to be fun!' is some sort of battlecry for those who look at games as MORE than just shoot-em-ups and fast driving arcade experiences.
Most people- and I would argue everyone on this board- already agrees that fun doesn't always have to be the goal. But you want to make a game that isn't engaging? Ok, well THAT is an argument we can have
Jaffe
What are you expecting to get out of this game?
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ethomaz
Banned
H
hollowcupra
thanks for all the insights even knowing you did not like it what you wrote made me get a better ideia of how the mechanics are really interesting and I have the feeling I will love it.
It looks like a game I dreamed to play.
It looks like a game I dreamed to play.
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Phase
Member
FranXico
Member
Yes, H hollowcupra thank you for sharing your thoughts. At least you let us know why exactly it didn't work for you.
Damn, this just reminded me of the tube sequence in MGS4, crawling snake forward with the most vile type of gameplay gaming has to offer, elongated button mashing. I was nearly in fucking tears during that scene and never felt more connected to a character in a game before that.
davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
After watching some videos of the game and reading some reviews (including the glowing ones) I have very little interest in this game and truth be told the ONLY reason I'm playing it will be because:
#1- It's Kojima and the guy has earned my curiosity. Even if it sucks, it'll be an interesting kind of suck (at least as long as I can handle playing it)
#2- Because I do a stream that usually focuses on video games, it seems like I wouldn't be doing my job if I wasn't up on the latest stuff the gaming world is chatting about.
But without those reasons I would NEVER pick this game up. It looks and sounds dreadfully dull. I literally saw footage (that was sped up) showing the guy walking/running along a freeway for what must have been 10 minutes of play time. Literally just PUSHING the stick forward and running in a straight line. For ten minutes. Man, I just can't think of why I would willingly want to partake in something like that. For a SEQUENCE? Sure. For a section where I am being asked to metaphorically experience life thru the eyes of the character? Sure. But doing that for a whole game?!? No thank you. Not for me
.Jaffe
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KOMANI
KOMANI
That would be cool but will never happen. If you’re looking for more Snatcher, I suggest the Suda51 written prequel, SDATCHER. It stars Hideo Kojima as Little John.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
In my experience when people call things "Pretentious" very often they are just practicing a sort of intellectual inverted-snobbery.
They feel like anyone who appreciates things that they don't, must see them as being culturally impoverished by comparison, and not wanting to feel inferior they lash out to try and take them down "a peg or two". Funnily enough there's a perfect example of this exact thing a page or so back!
Not "getting it" is fine. Some people don't get Jazz, some people don't get classical music or opera. Its *normal* not to be into every style and flavor because there's more than enough variety to go around.
Noone has a monopoly on the good stuff.
The giveaway though is that when these arguments crop up about what is "real" and "important" you never see people arguing this case for things they don't like. Be it haute cuisine or Marvel movies, it always boils down to what they personally happen to value, irrespective of its place on the historical totem-pole of art and culture.
hollowcupra
Member
I'm more than happy to give any info about the game and despite my personal opinion i would never say to someone buy it or not, i'm just adding some more info on the table and give a better idea of how the game works.
vpance
Member
Nice review. Went into detail of all the gameplay elements and flaws of the loop.
Too bad the world is always the same. If he spent another couple years in development I think it could've been a cool mashup of NMS and Tomorrow Children.
FranXico
Member
It does sound like he went too far this time, doesn't it?
I posted above why I think he made the gameplay loop boring on purpose, but he could shortened the "dull" part quite a bit.
In any case, creators should experiment with their notions of what a game should have or play like. Even if I might not like a game, all games have a right to exist (yes, including Gone Home or Dear Esther).
davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
I think it's in how it's communicated. Being told I 'don't get' Death Stranding (or Jazz) is elitist in and of itself. From what I know about Death Stranding, I get it. I just don't like it.
Like, I GET why people love Blade Runner and I respect it. But FOR ME it's a very boring, slow movie.
Jaffe
davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
Agree and by the way, I LOVE walking sims.
Gone Home, What Remains, 30 Flights of Loving, and Firewatch are all in my top 25 games of all time.
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
I legit loathe the term “walking sim.” I think it is far too often used as a generic cookie cutter critique.
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Phase
Member
Exactly. If we allow ourselves to be more open to varied experiences, tucking our preconceived notions to the side for a bit, we will only benefit by gaining a better understanding of said thing and ourselves.
I'm liking the shift in this thread atm lol.
davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
I dunno, it works for me. What else would you call it? Ideally you could say 'adventure game' but that term brings with it lots of baggage that isn't relevant to the genre we are talking about.
Experiences, perhaps?
But every game, including MS PAC MAN, is an experience. So that doesn't really work either :/...
FranXico
Member
vpance
Member
I wonder if that player actually had to walk 10 mins though. Maybe if he played/planned his mission better he could've gotten a truck or something?
I don't doubt this game is going to be boring in some parts, for anyone. In a game with a guy that delivers packages on foot for most of the journey there's little way around it apart from copious amounts of fast travel.
SAF0001
Neo Member
I think that people who put gameplay on the first place(and prefer MMO and coop games for example) and all other things on the second - they’ll be disappointed.
And I hope that people who like to be inside the atmospheric game, fill it and think about its story and characters, who ready/want to identify himself with hero on the screen, who agree that gameplay can be a part of picture, they’ll like it.
Anyway, I already ordered the stillbook and waiting the launch day
And I hope that people who like to be inside the atmospheric game, fill it and think about its story and characters, who ready/want to identify himself with hero on the screen, who agree that gameplay can be a part of picture, they’ll like it.
Anyway, I already ordered the stillbook and waiting the launch day
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Truer words were never spoken.
But to be fair to the game, at the very least anyone of you guys in here who happen to deliver for, Amazon, Fedex, UPS, hell even UberEats, would likely have a great experience playing this love letter for all that you do for the industry.
Bryank75
Banned
One of the guys here said the shooting bits were very short and were the best bits of the game.
As gamers are we tuned to be on that high all the time? Can you glorify the mundane?
Is gaming capable of going beyond ground it has already covered a million times?
I do wonder about these things...
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I take your point, but I'd argue that communication is a two-way street. Its all in how you interpret "getting it".
Does it have to be a slight? I mean taste is not entirely rational, and I mean taste in both the literal and figurative sense.
Delicious or disgusting, how do you rationalize that personal reaction to a certain flavor?
There's a big ego component to it in my view. We generally don't get into arguments about literal taste (coke vs pepsi), but figuratively and conceptually... whole other story.
We kinda rationalize ourselves into conflicts based on relativism. Yes, you can argue that Jazz and Classical are more advanced forms of music than rock because of complexity, codification of form, historical precedent etc. Which are fair points but not necessarily relevant or meaningful if you prefer attributes that a different form of music emphasizes and/or the culture surrounding that music (dance for example).
The point I'm getting at is we tend to invoke a hierarchy of value, and if we perceive the person with an opposing view to be assuming a position higher on that hierarchy the ego feels the need to assert itself. Trouble is that perception is not necessarily accurate.
Sorry, kinda late here, so not sure if I've articulated my point clearly.
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JareBear: Remastered
Banned
no, very well put
thelastword
Banned
Yes, IGN and Stevivor……...
Despite the review scores, every reviewer has been consistent in saying that the gameplay, which is the most important thing in ANY game, is not that good, and that the game is a tedious chore. You can have the most amazing story and graphics, but if the gameplay falls short, the game should be viewed as a mediocre game at best. Those high scores and what they have been saying are inconsistent, and to be honest, feels very unprofessional if they can't pull the trigger on giving the game a lower score. At least the metal gear solid series had exhilarating gameplay and nice CQC mechanics. I have never seen anyone praising this game for its gameplay. In fact, they mention that it is simplistic, and the boss battles are easy, so the real "challenge", is the walking back and forth being a delivery man, and that is very concerning. The game isn't fully out, but I am definitely not going to get it day 1. It's best to wait till it falls in price.
Javthusiast
Banned
I have heard plenty people saying they liked the gameplay. It was the same with RDR2. So how about we stop whining back and forth and play for ourselves on launch, later when the game is on sale or never if you have zero interest,
Phase
Member
But where will be take our frustrations of daily life out, if not here?!
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davidjaffe
The Fucking MAN.
Oh shit- I thought this was a discussion forum where we- you know- discuss video games. Ugh, apologies. Please send me the TOS that explain exactly the topics that have been approved to be discussed here.
Thank you- it's appreciated!
Jaffe
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MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
That's exactly what I thought as well!
IamOnline4Real
owns Galaxy Brain. Still shrink wrapped.
I agree, I love games that push the medium of gaming. Been gaming since the NES, I am 35. The more the game is realistic, the more i enjoy it and become immerse and invested in the character. good character animation is what i love the most. I never fast travel in any games because for me its part of the journey.
I have learned to be patience and try to understand what a game is all about. Not all games should be about gunning and running. diversity is always welcome and that's what gaming is missing these days.
Death Stranding will be successful. I have no doubt. People just need to have an open mind and try it first. We might not like it, but "people" ( I guess they are mostly 12 years old) should stop the nonsense bashing, we clearly see that they ( Kojima Team) put a lot of passion and hard work into that project.
I am tired of lazy cookie cutter games with glitches and so on. The best exemple this year is Ubisoft with Ghost Recon Breakpoint.
When I pay 60$ for a game, I pay to experience and play something that i havent seen before. that's how i value my hard earn money, I never support a company that lazy and only care about my money, like Ubisoft.
I don't personally care about Kojima, i respect him as a creator and a fellow human being. So please people respect the man and his team. they are part of our gaming community. They never put micro transactions everywhere into their games because so far they care about the gaming community, and respect what gaming is all about.
For those who havent played and are happy and want this particular game to fail, you are the Cancer of our gaming community.