FoxMcChief
Gold Member
Sounds like how Elden Ring launched and people preferred to play on PS4.
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[Digital Foundry] Star Wars Jedi Survivor PS5 Pro: Severe Image Quality Problems... But RT in Performance Mode Is Nice
- Thread starter Lunatic_Gamer
- Start date
- News Analysis Review
Senua
Member
Isn't that still the only way to play Elden Ring without stutters?
Shake Your Rump
Banned
Are there any third party games with a "pro patch" that do not look worse?
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Steam Deck too
proandrad
Member
PS4 version of the game on the PS5.
Pedro Motta
Member
I mean, I was just testing this one on the Pro and it's night day the difference from the original PS5 performance mode. So much sharper and smoother. It's WAY better than FSR in motion. They are exagerating the issues here, I didn't notice them at all.
Stellar Blade, Final Fantasy VII Rebirth, F124… most of them look better tbh
Par for the course
Vick
Gold Member
Every Patched Capcom game looks and runs better.
One, Dead Rising Deluxe, is even looking a generation above the PC version at the moment, as for some bizarre reason like with DMC5 they haven't bothered porting their RT features on PC yet, despite Steam version also receiving an update the same day.
And not just the officially supported ones, all their native current gen games like RE Remakes and DMC5 benefited immensely from Pro as they now run maxed out at extremely solid 60fps instead of the 45-50fps they are on base Consoles.
you realize just said it sucks NOW too just using lots of words
Except you assume something that sucks now will, in some way, be great in the future
So going by no evidence you expect PSSR will go from worse than FSR now to being industry leading like DLSS in the future?
Pedro Motta
Member
But they make it sound like it's worse than before? I really don't understand their take here.
Bojji
Member
Watch the video.
Shake Your Rump
Banned
Bojji
Member
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Kacho
Gold Member
Yes PSSR is going to improve in the future the more they train the model.. We already have examples of it beating the pants off of FSR and outperforming even 3.7 DLSS in some ways. You shouldn’t take a botched, likely earlier version, of PSSR and extrapolate it to be the norm.
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Senua
Member
Bojji
Member
Yes PSSR is going to improve in the future the more they train the model.. We already have examples of it beating the pants off of FSR and outperforming even DLSS in some ways. You shouldn’t take a botched, likely earlier version, of PSSR and extrapolate it to be the norm.
Outperforming DLSS...
You can disagree that PSSR beats DLSS in some aspects but you’d be wrong.Outperforming DLSS...
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Vick
Gold Member
That's the price of the latest Nvidia revolutions: Ray Tracing and AI upscaling algorithms.
In the hands of questionable devs, that's what you get.
Guess it makes for some funny jokes, but there's also 8K 60fps current gen games running on this Console.
Senua
Member
GT7 is cross gen, but yes 8k 60fps is impressive, but they need to let it downscale to 4k otherwise basically no one will see the benefit.
DanielG165
Member
The Crew Motorfest is a big one that looks noticeably better via its Pro patch.
Tchu-Espresso
likes mayo on everthing and can't dance
I’m not sure how we can get results like those seen in ratchet & clank and Spider-Man, and then get what was produced in this game.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
DanielG165
Member
Jedi Survivor is really just an unoptimized beast on console overall. Even in quality mode, with what is supposed to be a locked 30fps, the game chugs when there’s enough water and RT reflections around, for instance.
Juxtapose this with something like Metro Exodus: Enhanced, a version of the game that was built around RT, yet the consoles run it at 60fps with RTGI. Survivor is a great game, but it’ll always be known for its mediocre performance.
Juxtapose this with something like Metro Exodus: Enhanced, a version of the game that was built around RT, yet the consoles run it at 60fps with RTGI. Survivor is a great game, but it’ll always be known for its mediocre performance.
brenobnfm
Member
Where is it optimized?
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
The quality mode already had all the RT effects on PS5.
It just runs at a slightly higher resolution now compared to the base PS5.
I cant work the exact performance gain since i dont know what the horizontal resolutions are but if PSSR is scaling like FSR and DLSS then its 10% on shot 2 and 48% on shot 3. Not the 2-4x RT performance boost suggested by the leaked docs.
Apparently it averages 1440p most of the time while the base ps5 averaged around 1152p so a roughly 40% gain in pixels over the base ps5 on average.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
This also shows that the console is not powerful enough. The cost of PSSR is high and there's nothing left over for other improvements. I knew something wasn't right when the previews first started dropping and we learned that many games were using Performance mode profiles instead of Fidelity Pro to hit 60 fps. I got mocked for complaining about it by Neogaf.
Then there's what I find truly unbelievable which is Sony's absolutely terrible support for their own console. There are 8 major Sony published PS5 exclusives without a mention of having any kind of support, now and in the future. There are tons of important 3rd party games not getting patches and then there are an increasing number of games that have been patched but the patches suck, like Silent Hill 2 and Rise of the Ronin and Dragon Age.
Notice also that the most demanding games, the ones most in need of the Pro, are still suffering from major issues- jedi survivor, Silent Hill 2, and Alan Wake 2! Finally, what is up with games like Callisto Protocol which was listed for weeks as having a patch but has now been removed from the list entirely with no update from anyone as to whether it will ever get upgraded? GT7 not having its Pro patch still. Monster Hunter Wilds removed from listing etc....i wouldn't mind so much if there was communication from Sony as to just what the hell is going on.
Silent Hill 2 sucks on the PS5 Pro, Konami is silent about it
Silent Hill HD Collection 2?
www.destructoid.com
$800 console we deserve better
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Dragon Age, SH2, Star Wars Outlaws, Dragons Dogma 2, and now Jedi Survivor. They need to understand that RT in 60 fps is not possible on this console. On paper, yes it couldve been, but the console isnt performing up to specs. Just do some basic testing. Have a non-blind QA guy review whichever intern was incharge of switching the API calls from FSR to PSSR and you wont have this issue.
AW2 intern was smart enough to keep RT out of it but in his infinite wisdom decided to max out settings in performance mode and ended up with the same internal resolutions with worse framerates. Incompetent buffoons. All of them.
Even the RT mode in AW2 shimmers like this on every single wooden wall and reflective object. Clearly PSSR is not handling this well right now but devs should also be held responsible for not doing basic testing. They clearly didnt have people play the entire game.
SportsFan581
Member
I guess we'll have to wait for new releases to see what the devs do with the Pro. Clearly most of the post launch patches are going to be low effort.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
One thing to this games credit on Pro- Fidelity mode looks WAY better than base PS5. One of the most impressive games I've seen actually with all that RT and better iq than base.
Topher
Identifies as young
Agree. It isn't like these devs are finding this out when DF tells them. They see quality of the work being done before anyone. Hopefully some early lessons being learned here, but really shouldn't be the case.
intbal
Member
I bet Sony didn't decide on that price until the beginning of this year when Microsoft announced they were essentially giving up on Xbox.
Cuz, like, why not? If there's no competition, why not charge whatever they fucking feel like?
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
We should be thanking them then as the idea is devs will be more likely to actually fix these games getting called out by a major tech channel like DF!
I swear you guys have your priorities in ALL the wrong places. You're more concerned about the Pro being made to LOOK bad then you are for Sony and 3rd parties to get their shit together and do a better job for our $700!
I've made many posts criticizing the lack of effort I'm seeing for this console for one reason- because I've been planning on buying it and have bought it now and simply want a great experience! I've been met with mostly attacks and mocking from fanboys who don't like hearing "negativity" about the Pro.
We've waited 4 years and $800 later on a console that's twice the amount of CU's as PS5 that's supposedly 45% faster and has machine learning. It's time we finally got something worthwhile from our money not to have patches that do jack shit or even make games worse in some cases! Sony has 8 games they've just ignored so far...Lego Horizon came out after the Pro- no patch ...any media article bashing Sony or Konami for Silent Hill 2 etc should be applauded!
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Yup
DanielG165
Member
Nowhere I assume, but I’ve heard that one can brute force it on PC with enough grunt.
bundylove
Gold Member
Honestly.
Scrubs is my top 3 favorite comedy tv show.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
There is GPU power left over for other improvements or you would not be seeing RT reflections and RTAO here. However, there is that much more so all that extra GPU (45% if cerny is to be believed or 30% if you go by other benchmarks) is going into rendering the RT effects which not much room left to improve the resolution.
PSSR and FSR should have roughly the same cost so in this particular game the cost should be negligible. You are thinking of TLOU games and Demon Souls which did not use any FSR, TSR or Checkerboard scaling so in these particular games, most of that extra GPU did go into PSSR.
I just ran some tests in TLOU2 where old 1440p performance mode was 115 fps, the pssr 1440p internal mode was 80 fps while the base ps5 performance mode was 90 fps. the cost of reconstruction there is roughly 45%. in the other test, the base ps5 is 85 fps, pssr is 78 fps and pro is 110 fps. thats 41%.
so yes, in tlou2's case the entire gpu is going into reconstruction, but alan wake 2, jedi survivor, star wars outlaws, dragon age and other games already use FSR which typically has a similar cost to dlss. Now there is a good chance the PSSR is bandwidth and vram hungry like DLSS so in that sense it could be more expensive than fsr, but i cant test that.
FoxMcChief
Gold Member
It’s great. As long as you pretend that last season school thing doesn’t exist.
Fbh
Member
I don't get respawn. With how bad the IQ is on base console why the fuck would you choose to re-enable RT in performance mode on the pro instead of actually improving the resolution? Leave the performance killing stuff to the 30fps mode
Also, once again we see PSSR isn't a magic solution for good IQ. Like all other upscaling tech it struggles when the internal resolution is super low.
For the pro to actually deliver the promise of fidelity visuals at 60fps, the performance mode actually has to render at a decent resolution for PSSR to be effective.
That's probably why Rebirth has been one of the biggest upgrades. Square somehow got the IQ to look like shit on base console but it's actually not running at a bad resolution in performance mode ( averages at 1152p). That's high enough that even on the base console it would probably look much better with FSR.
Also, once again we see PSSR isn't a magic solution for good IQ. Like all other upscaling tech it struggles when the internal resolution is super low.
For the pro to actually deliver the promise of fidelity visuals at 60fps, the performance mode actually has to render at a decent resolution for PSSR to be effective.
That's probably why Rebirth has been one of the biggest upgrades. Square somehow got the IQ to look like shit on base console but it's actually not running at a bad resolution in performance mode ( averages at 1152p). That's high enough that even on the base console it would probably look much better with FSR.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
one day it will be.PSSR is a game-changer though according to some people here. It will turn crap into gold.
this is me running cyberpunk PT at 720p internally. it took a while to get here. in beta PT was a ghosting mess like PSSR in jedi, but they eventually fixed the ghosting issues when PT was officially released.
There is no shimmering, or ghosting or graining visuals here. The AI cores in the PS5 Pro are roughly as powerful as 3000 series nvidia cards so eventually it will be fine. especially if it can run and look this well at 720p internal resolution. What's inexcusable is that sony let it get shipped in this state. tech is still clearly in beta and while some devs like GG, F1 and Lords of the Fallen devs were smart enough to skip PSSR for now, other devs didnt bother testing and exposed all of PSSR's issues with RT games and lower resolutions.
PSSR is virtually indistinguishable from native 4k in demon souls and tlou games because its upscaling from a higher resolution of 1440p.
PixelatedBeast
Member
Nobody is paying $1000 for the pro? Where are you getting that from? Trade in your ps5 and the price drops to $350.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
The thing with FF7 is that its not running any RT effects. The RT effects are the problem here. PSSR cannot handle them right now. AW2 runs at a similar resolution (even a little bit higher in fact) to Rebirth and has really bad issues with resolving reflections. Even the star wars jedi survivor's quality mode runs at a much higher resolution averaging 1440p and yet PSSR here struggles far more than ff7 rebirth.
But yes, they shouldve just increased the resolution of the performance mode and allowed it to run around 1152p like Rebirth.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
In Canada it cost close to $1000 and even I was graphic whore enough that I was willing get one, you can’t find fucking disc drive and without that I can’t play none of my games I already own.