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Final Fantasy XIV |OT6| Casino Royale
- Thread starter tiggerkiddo
- Start date
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Ive heard some game developers confess that not everybody who buys their videogame completes it. Reasons could be difficulty or time or whatever. But this somehow doesn't prevent them from making good endings to their games.
Anecdotally I see a lot of people with The Final Witness, DW weapons or even just gear in bog standard DF roulette runs on our data center, so much that my own achievements kinda seem inadequate to me to be honest. Maybe westetners do have to get good and stop fearing Titan which is usually a oneshot by the way.
The problem with letting people see content is that hard encounters ARE the content. Spoiler alert, the cutscenes in Coil aren't actually numerous. T12 is the only instance that gives a substantial story. This is what you want? Why play the game?
And I did suggest EX primals as a good starting point in difficulty for endgame content.
Vanity argument though oh man. Coil drops will be vanity come May. Doesn't stop anyone from raiding.
Anecdotally I see a lot of people with The Final Witness, DW weapons or even just gear in bog standard DF roulette runs on our data center, so much that my own achievements kinda seem inadequate to me to be honest. Maybe westetners do have to get good and stop fearing Titan which is usually a oneshot by the way.
The problem with letting people see content is that hard encounters ARE the content. Spoiler alert, the cutscenes in Coil aren't actually numerous. T12 is the only instance that gives a substantial story. This is what you want? Why play the game?
And I did suggest EX primals as a good starting point in difficulty for endgame content.
Vanity argument though oh man. Coil drops will be vanity come May. Doesn't stop anyone from raiding.
skLaFarebear
Member
Sweet, got into the GAF FC 
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
I wonder if any of this has to do with the introduction of group finders. I remember back in the WoW days where you had to cobble a group together on your own, people tended to communicate more in groups, because communication was necessary to get the group together in the first place.
Now, you can go through duty finder (other MMO's have group finders as well now) and not utter a single word for the entire instance while this was not possible before since you actually had to speak to get into a group.
I think this kind of system sets people up to fail on the harder content since easy clears with no issues are expected, and people in general are not incentivized to communicate and work together. It kind of treats the other players in your group as disposable instead of people you want to work together with and maybe do dungeons with again in the future (even if you do the cross-server match-making stops this).
It would be interesting to see how removing DF would affect people's willingness to communicate. For sure zone chat would be a lot busier.
Now, you can go through duty finder (other MMO's have group finders as well now) and not utter a single word for the entire instance while this was not possible before since you actually had to speak to get into a group.
I think this kind of system sets people up to fail on the harder content since easy clears with no issues are expected, and people in general are not incentivized to communicate and work together. It kind of treats the other players in your group as disposable instead of people you want to work together with and maybe do dungeons with again in the future (even if you do the cross-server match-making stops this).
It would be interesting to see how removing DF would affect people's willingness to communicate. For sure zone chat would be a lot busier.
skLaFarebear
Member
As someone who's playing an MMO for the first time in their life, I think Duty Finder kind of eases you into working with other people in groups in simpler dungeons that don't really require much communication. It gets you used to working with other people on missions without the extra need to communicate to find people. Even though you'll eventually have to when you get to the endgame dungeons that actually require it, but at that point you'll somewhat know how to work with other people in a team.
Plus, communicating on PS4 would kind of be a total bitch compared to PC.
Twice tonight I got hit with an error 90002 ("lost connection with server") which is unfortunate since I just signed up with a VPN to specifically avoid that error (it's been better since signing up, until tonight). While I can usually get right back in, both times I got error 3102 ("you are still logged in") for like, easily over ten minutes plus. Very strange. Hopping the maintenance tonight fixes that, but I don't see this issue reported anywhere else.
The staying logged in thing has been happening since launch, don't see it being fixed any time soon. Just be thankful it didn't last longer than ten minutes, I've seen people be stuck like that for 24 hours and more with the same thing.
One thing I've found that seems to fix it for me is restarting my PC.
RellyRell28
Banned
Looking at my gear right now and there's no reason why I should just finish second coil just to have it complete. Maybe I'll take a break from zodiac and do some of them.
So, despite the warnings [plural] from Angary...
Do not congratulate me, please. For I have entered hell.
So let me get this straight. First, before I do anything else, I need to grind out 75 [75!!] Alexandrite. Then affix Materia to it [I'll probably go 25/25/25 to help lessen the cost, since I've read the DPS difference between that and pure SSPD/DET is supposedly around 1-2%] before I begin the whole dungeon drop/light nonsense?
...I can see now why I was warned to stay away.
Do not congratulate me, please. For I have entered hell.
So let me get this straight. First, before I do anything else, I need to grind out 75 [75!!] Alexandrite. Then affix Materia to it [I'll probably go 25/25/25 to help lessen the cost, since I've read the DPS difference between that and pure SSPD/DET is supposedly around 1-2%] before I begin the whole dungeon drop/light nonsense?
...I can see now why I was warned to stay away.
I should have listened to Angary. ;_;
Hm, small solace I guess. Just odd I hadn't run into this in the months since I resubbed, but tonight I'm hit with it twice.
Nobody won.
Tourney rule stops it and its 30 wins, not 30 matches (just pointing that out as I initially missed it myself)
This reads like an amazingly rose tinted view of how things worked before group finders became a common thing. It was generally an absolute pain in the hole to put groups for even "casual" content together and a complete waste of time, people should be spending their time playing the game not wasting their time on stuff that could be better automated. In FFXIV case you have the best of both worlds really, PF replicates the old looking for group chat spam with a much more streamlined system and DF provides a fully "anonymous" alternative. That isnt even getting into how getting groups together in chat doesnt (and never did) guarantee any more competency or consistency than assembling them via a group finder does.
It seems disingenuous to suggest that the percentage of people who dont complete single player games is meaningfully comparable to the amount of people who dont see endgame raid stuff. Even if it was, what exactly would that prove?
How is that a problem? If people are offered a choice between an easy and a hard raid and choose to play the easier version to see the encounters/cutsceneces/areas/etc. who exactly is it a problem for? As for the last part I honestly dont follow, "Why play the game?" just feels like an odd non sequitur
I didn't even do anything!
Cheezeman3000
Member
So I finally paid to get Teamspeak on my phone so that I can communicate with people during T9. Ran through the first divebombs phase with a PF group but then things fell apart. My god... that fight is just too much sometimes. We even had a guy calling out the debuffs, but when there's so much going on it's tough to remember what needs to happen.
But I will be back.
But I will be back.
To all of my children in whom Life flows abundant
To all of my children to whom Death hath passed his judgement
The soul yearns for honor, and the flesh the hereafter
Look to those who walked before to lead those who walk after
A Realm Reborn - Main Theme
WTB Divebomb-free coil, PST. It's gotten to the point where I have literally no idea what I'm doing wrong--God knows I die constantly but I usually know why--I just know if I get the divebombs marker I'm going into the wall.
And so the sicknesss claims another. Remember Makoto as he was in the good times, not as the hunt-obsessed Alex fiend he is about to become.
BRB, name changing to Cassandra.
And so the sicknesss claims another. Remember Makoto as he was in the good times, not as the hunt-obsessed Alex fiend he is about to become.
BRB, name changing to Cassandra.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Most of the low level dungeons feel like tutorials (while Guildhests are bite sized ones) so you are right about that.
And yes, communicating on the PS4 is a pain, even with a keyboard since you need to put the controller down to type quickly.
Rose tinted? I think you're assuming a lot of things that I never actually said. I was only addressing the communication and expectation of results aspects of group finding. I didn't say anything about difficulty or competency.
Augemitbutter
Member
i think coil is fine at the moment. just eliminate divebombs next cycle. still hate those.
we just need a new mid tier level of content. i think odin is pretty well balanced for beginning-mid tier. you don't need to study walkthroughs to win at this fight. you will win with fundamentals alone, if you and your party mastered their classes and know how to dodge basic stuff.
this type of content should be the majority of this game actually. the begginers stuff we have now (basic dungeons/towers) should be reduced to 20%. hardcore raids could have a few more turns. fates/hunts/mining/botany should just be a footnote.
1. yes, people have to get good.
2. coil already is vanity if you grinded for zodiac.
we just need a new mid tier level of content. i think odin is pretty well balanced for beginning-mid tier. you don't need to study walkthroughs to win at this fight. you will win with fundamentals alone, if you and your party mastered their classes and know how to dodge basic stuff.
this type of content should be the majority of this game actually. the begginers stuff we have now (basic dungeons/towers) should be reduced to 20%. hardcore raids could have a few more turns. fates/hunts/mining/botany should just be a footnote.
1. yes, people have to get good.
2. coil already is vanity if you grinded for zodiac.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Reading T12 guides is making my head spin. I just hope I do a good job.
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
If you're playing a bard shout 'wipe' and run into the blackfires, everyone will love you for it.
It's really simpler than guides make it out to be, much like T8.
Just completed the Chrysalis for the first time and a funny thing happened. During the meteor phase one of the healers d/ced and we didn't manage to get down the tear fast enough. The moment the big meteor hits and we are about to wipe, a new healer connects but doesn't get hit by it. The result was that he could revive everyone and we had all the time of the world to destroy the tear and finish the fight
tiggerkiddo
Member
Luckily for the group I'm going as SMN so I get to beg Ryder for Ballad.
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
Bad news, I think Ryder removed every button but Blunt Arrow after the teasing.
For that you'd need a pro sch.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Oh I can be very persuasive.
Barring that, I kick Ryder out and make Pelli sing!
Barring that, I kick Ryder out and make Pelli sing!
Pyros_Eien
Member
It's really not very hard, especially if someone's calling bennus.
Phase 1 is just, stack in one spot, move out when the thing spawns on you, rinse repeat, bane your dots on the Bennus when they spawn under the boss. Might need to bane on the black fires too, depends on wether or not you have a BLM, so you might have to keep charges up and wait until you need to use them or the cooldown for aetherflow is almost back up.
Phase 2 as a non bard/non healer is stand wherever you want that's not on top of the healers, run to designated spot when you get blue marker then run out of the ground aoe that spawn and just kill the boss/bennus as they spawn.
Phase 3 is follow the group and kill things as they're called/numbered with priority on big bennus, don't constantly Bane stuff as you want stuff to die in a certain order, and probably virus a big bennu at some point.
Phase 4 is dodge things and kill the boss, and maybe you have to go in fountain at some point if you get a spot but it's basically a matter of following the order established before the start of the fight and if you're not in it, you just ignore everything but the aoes and burn the boss down.
There's a lot less mechanics to do when playing as DPS.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Trying to understand every mechanic I can because the next group will ask me to go as healer. Or something other than the last job I went as!
RellyRell28
Banned
I was aware that it was wins not matches. I was stating matches as for the fact I couldn't do any tourney matches after the 15 to possibly get the card now. Anyways you gave me my answer thanks
Pyros_Eien
Member
No guide will really prepare you to healing a fight anyway, especially T12, the damage comes in spikes and with weird timings until you know the rotation. You might as well focus on doing it as a DPS quickly, then after having seen the fight you can try to see what more you need to learn as a healer.
As a healer you generally want to watch out for Revelations which come at a preset place in the boss' rotation, brand passing in P2 (Stoneskin/Adlo whoever has the brand at the time and heal him upon passing, the works) then P3 is just dish AOEs out, tanks can get hit a lot but at the current gear probably shouldn't be an issue, in P4 don't make my mistake of standing on the edges of the arena, occupy a spot somewhere in the middle where you can reach everyone and visually track tethers.
The Last Wizard
Member
What should or can I do with all this fish I'm getting? I'm about to just sell it as it's taking up too much inventory space.
Demoskinos
Member
Sell them. If you have CUL to 30 you could always desynth them aswell
PhillipCostigan
Member
T12 as a DPS is pretty handy. Slightly more involved as a ranged since you can get Brand but honestly it's a /afk fight for DPS, especially if you have the gear to push 4 Bennus.
It's a fun fight though. Each phase has a lot of different mechanics so it's fun to learn step by step.
I agree completely; I'm another person who has never cleared T5. There are just too many different mechanics to master and unlike in solo content, you can't practice mastering them except in a live party with human players. "Just get better!" rings hollow when the only possible way to get better involves forcing your incompetence upon other players, who have to suffer while you learn.
A better "nerf" would have been to allow more time to react to mechanics, and to turn one-shots into near-one-shots. Simply raising stats by some percentage is, as you have said, not going to make things any easier, and, if anything, will only make the veterans more frustrated with the beginners.
This is my first MMO too, and there are so many concepts that would never occur to an offline-only RPG fan (but that the community seems to expect everyone to understand), so don't sweat it I myself lost the level 15 Marauder story fight during the beta at least a dozen times (maybe more) because it just never occurred to me that enemy enmity could be focused no a specific party member. Of course, enmity is mentioned, but all content up to that point is solo, so how would anyone conceive of individual-member enmity?
This made me wish for more communication early in the game. Guildhests do this, to some extent, and I highly recommend practicing on them over and over until you understand what each one is teaching you. The NPC guide does a great job of explaining things, once you get past his quirky and flavorful language.
Well if you don't have a pro SCH gg on T13.
RellyRell28
Banned
I never really found the Twin fight to be hard even with this being my first MMO also. Once I learned the mechanics it was smooth sailing.
Pyros_Eien
Member
You don't need a pro SCH on T13 though. If you have a monk and a smn, you don't even need a scholar at all. Soil on megaflare is nice but isn't really needed if you're geared in 120-130left side(and by now most people are) and that leaves using virus on giga, which is hardly pro level. Other stuff like weaving DPS cycles, it's nice, but if your DPS are on point, it's mostly not going to be needed. And considering SCH already doesn't need to be healing a whole lot which gives them time to DPS, it means that obviously the healing isn't particularily hard once you know the fight and know when to expect the spikes(and if the WHM knows, then it's enough).
Not that I think doing red fire is pro level either, if anything the pro healer is the WHM who's keeping the 2 tanks(when bennu is up) alive while the SCH is just prancing around running from blue to red and back to the other healer with sprint on.
What about anything I've posted in this short line of conversation made you think a 9000 word reply to troll posts was a good idea?
I just returned to the game yesterday to ramp up for Heavensward.
For someone returning to the game since just after ARR's launch (cleared Garuda, but Titan, so I still don't even have my base Relic, 0 Coil turns cleared), what should I be doing or focusing on? I'm not too worried about getting back into end-game content since it's going to be obsolete very soon, so I'm wondering more about added game functions or features I need to unlock, important things to collect/farm, or other things to prepare for the expansion.
Probably just going to level various DoW/H classes up in the meanwhile.
For someone returning to the game since just after ARR's launch (cleared Garuda, but Titan, so I still don't even have my base Relic, 0 Coil turns cleared), what should I be doing or focusing on? I'm not too worried about getting back into end-game content since it's going to be obsolete very soon, so I'm wondering more about added game functions or features I need to unlock, important things to collect/farm, or other things to prepare for the expansion.
Probably just going to level various DoW/H classes up in the meanwhile.
You should try getting in a GAF group for T5 these days--I remember grouping up with you one night months and months ago while I was still trying to get a clear, and the difference between then and now is pretty ridiculous. I think that group fell apart over Conflag and fireball indicators just flat-out not being seen, and somebody just raging over it because some people have short fuses, but subsequent overgearing has made it such that it's much less of an issue because it is possible to burn down the conflag in time even if half the party is stuck in there, and it is possible to two-soak a fireball if the marked person keeps running away. I think the only actual one-shot left in T5 is the wall, and a completely unsplit fireball and the latter will only kill 1 person which is, at this point, effectively nothing.
I still think they should introduce practice mode DF queues for trouble spots in the tougher fights, or 4-man Guildhests that emultate specific mechanics, or something. I would permanently relocate to T9 Divebomb practice because it's pissing me off.
Final Coil does seem to have been designed specifically with ease of future nerfs in mind, and less last-minute surprise mechanics (T11 tethers, T12 fountain are really the only things I can think of?) so they do seem to be learning.
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