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[Bowser]

So, a little update – I’ve been cutting for 6 weeks - started a keto diet with a 15% deficit and ICF cut. Ran keto for 4 weeks, then spent the last 11 days running Lyle McDonald’s Rapid Fat Loss protocol (Lyle recommends no more than 10-12 days for a “category 1 dieter” which is up to 15% BF for males) - no reason for RFL; I’m a masochist and just wanted to see if I had the willpower to actually do it.

Macros on the RFL diet were 180g-200g protein and less than 20g each of fat and carbs, ~1,000 cal (roughly a 50% deficit to maintenance) per day. I subsisted on egg whites, fat free cheese, jerky, chicken, turkey, veggies (broccoli, asparagus, spinach, mushrooms, etc.), protein powder, and cottage cheese for 11 days. Only condiment used was salsa/Sriracha/hot sauces and only liquids consumed were water (at least a gallon/day), black coffee or tea, sugar free Red Bull pre-lifting, and a Coke Zero (or two) a day.

Kept my same workout schedule (3x per week of ICF cut) and ate on a 16/8 IF (8am (post-workout) to 4pm feeding window) so I was lifting 16 hours fasted (these past 11 days, not during the 4 weeks of keto). Despite the ~6 weeks of cutting, I have been able to progress the main lifts as prescribed for ICF cut (3x5, add 5lbs every other workout, although the last two sessions this week were rough, especially OHP):

• Squats: 135 -> 175
• Bench: 140 -> 160
• Deadlift: 185 -> 205 (speaking of - form check: http://youtu.be/VSE0llQbjOs; think I fixed the hip/butt issue Cooter spoke of, but think my back is too rounded?)
• Barbell Row: 115 -> 140
• OHP: 70 -> 100

Weight went from 145 lbs (at the start of keto) to 130.5 lbs (as of this morning post-bathroom, pre-lifting) – at least 7 lbs of that was water weight after about a week on keto. Pretty pleased with the results, but now I’m looking forward to this weekend’s high-calorie, high-carb re-feed. Lyle’s recommendation (for category 1) is 5-6g of carbs per pound on the first day of the re-feed, I don’t think I can even hit that without downing tons of fruit, rice and bread (would be 650-780g of carbs for me). Think I’m going to shoot for roughly 400g today, 275g tomorrow, and 150g on Sunday (will probably pack on 8-10 pounds of water weight after the weekend haha). Gonna treat myself to chicken cheesesteak, onion rings, and beer tonight, food coma incoming Already had a giant bowl of oatmeal with an apple and protein powder post-lift, I felt slightly drunk on carbs after haha.

I’ll post pics later this weekend of pre-keto, pre-refeed, and post-refeed.

Now, a week of relaxed eating/diet break/maintenance for my vacation trip, then I’ll see whether I wanna keep cutting or try a (very) modest bulk…

 

[Pete Rock]

[*]Deadlift: 185 -> 205 (speaking of - form check: http://youtu.be/VSE0llQbjOs; think I fixed the hip/butt issue Cooter spoke of, but think my back is too rounded?

To me it looks too close to a stiff-legged or RDL. I think if instead of shoving your hips back and up and taking your shins away from the bar, if at that point you took the slack out and leaned back, it would be more in line with traditional DL mechanics.

Looking back at your 200 form check video I would say you are in a better position there when you begin the lift, but your ass comes up first, out of proportion with the chest drive. They should both move vertically in a synchronized manner. If your chest came up without your ass moving, the load would be entirely in your low/mid back. If your ass moved up without your chest the load would be entirely in your upper hamstrings/glutes, so the goal is to balance the two.

Also it could just be me or the angle of the videos and honestly it's been a while since I did traditional stance, but your feet are about as wide as the outside extents of your hips instead of being a little closer together (one foot width each direction) placing them more directly underneath the socket. It's probably a little different for everybody though and if it feels good then don't change them for me by any means. Also your grip width seems to be a little too wide, from what I understand your arms should be straight up and down for the entire lift, instead of flared out or in. But obviously you have to get them around your legs, so these could be interrelated.

 

[Matugi]

Back at school, all settled in. Gonna swim a little bit this afternoon and weekend and then hit the ground running on Monday.

 

[Imm0rt4l]

Fuck failed 170lbs on bench 3x5 twice this week on SS. That's never happen before. Just keep eating, right? I feel like a failure

I never did SS, but maybe you need to deload.

 

[Bowser]

To me it looks too close to a stiff-legged or RDL. I think if instead of shoving your hips back and up and taking your shins away from the bar, if at that point you took the slack out and leaned back, it would be more in line with traditional DL mechanics.

Looking back at your 200 form check video I would say you are in a better position there when you begin the lift, but your ass comes up first, out of proportion with the chest drive. They should both move vertically in a synchronized manner. If your chest came up without your ass moving, the load would be entirely in your low/mid back. If your ass moved up without your chest the load would be entirely in your upper hamstrings/glutes, so the goal is to balance the two.

Also it could just be me or the angle of the videos and honestly it's been a while since I did traditional stance, but your feet are about as wide as the outside extents of your hips instead of being a little closer together (one foot width each direction) placing them more directly underneath the socket. It's probably a little different for everybody though and if it feels good then don't change them for me by any means. Also your grip width seems to be a little too wide, from what I understand your arms should be straight up and down for the entire lift, instead of flared out or in. But obviously you have to get them around your legs, so these could be interrelated.

Yep, I definitely see what you mean by it looking more like a stiff-legged DL. Probably because I was so focused on keeping my hips higher that I ended up over-correcting. Will keep watching more videos and thanks for all the tips.

 

[Petrie]

I definitely like his way of thinking in quite many different levels.

Spoiler

Also I am madly in love with him. He is so adorable! <3

He is a beautiful male specimen.

 

[MrMuscle]

Daaaamn dunno how I missed this the first time around, do you ever get your BF% tested? I am really curious, that looks like 8% or less ... insane brah. If you keep your diet that dialed in I can only imagine your body very incrementally adds muscle mass. I do strict IF and it has taken me about a year to gain 6 lbs. I agree with you though, as I would rather look nasty all the time. My much larger old lifting buddy (in frame and weight) has suggested I do the dream/FE bulk over the winter but I don't think I could manage and it just doesn't seem very appealing to me

Thanks man. I do a 7 point skinfold test every friday to check my progress. I dont bother with the BF% but mainly just check the different measurments. But the test today told me i was at 6% but im probably more around 8%. Id love to do a DEXA scan someday, but i dont really need it. The mirror is good enough.

As to muscle gain. Ive been lifting for 20 years, so I think im getting very close to my natural potential (http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/whats-my-genetic-muscular-potential.html) so I dont think it matters how i do it as long as the diet is on point and im getting enoough nutrients.

I did a competition in 2006 and all the "experts" told me to do a heavy bulk because then i would gain a lot of muscle. BUT looking back i call BS on that. Im sure i built some muscle, but a leangain would probably have given me the same results. A heavy bulk is in my mind something being used my people on steroids to cover up the waterweigth etc. Naturals really dont need all those extra calories either.

Also, I used 1 year to go from 84kg to 120kg, and then another year to drop back down to 90kgs. And i really didnt feel good at all on that heavy weight. I can show some pictures so you get what im talking about. Picture 1 is contest day (thats why im black), pic 2 is at 120kg and pic 3 is around 90kg.

So yeah, ill never bulk like that again. I usually do a 200-300 calories surplus if i feel like i need more food. That way i can easily gauge when i gain more fat than i need.

BUT it is important to remember that being this low bodyfat MIGHT not be the most healthiest thing in the world. And if your body cant handle it you might be constantly tired and your workouts will feel like shit. So make sure to find something YOU enjoy. Having abs is NOT the most important thing in the world... But it sure is cool

SORRY ABOUT THE PICTURE SPAM!

 

[sphinx]

Also, I used 1 year to go from 84kg to 120kg, and then another year to drop back down to 90kgs. And i really didnt feel good at all on that heavy weight. I can show some pictures so you get what im talking about. Picture 1 is contest day (thats why im black), pic 2 is at 120kg and pic 3 is around 90kg.

hats off.

the discipline it takes to go up or down in your weight however you want is WAAAAY harder than bringing yourself to the gym and lift weight.

this is some serious discipline right there.

inspiring, thanks for sharing.

 

[ohhthegore]

Great pics mr muscle

 

[MrMuscle]

I've killed 13 lbs in 5 weeks and am happy with the momentum I have going to cut my weight down from 200 to 150 (I am now at 187).

Thats kick ass progress, great job!

hats off.

the discipline it takes to go up or down in your weight however you want is WAAAAY harder than bringing yourself to the gym and lift weight.

this is some serious discipline right there.

inspiring, thanks for sharing.

Thanks my friend. I just really love to work out, eat right and push my body to where i want it to be. And if i can inspire just 1 person with my hard work then its definitely worth every second of sweat, tears and pain.

Great pics mr muscle

Thank you very much.

 

[ILoveBish]

Mrmuscle, great work. Im also not a fan of dirty bulks unless you are really skinny.

 

[CherryWoodFuton]

I'm going to try to not get shitfaced for my birthday tonight. I want to try and get some 1s on squats tomorrow. It probably would be a better idea to postpone it until Monday?

 

[FallingEdge]

Ty all very much for your comments! It is always an ongoing goal for me to see where I can take my body next. I'm currently sticking with a traditional BB split to work on the weak spots from a visual perspective. I know I look a bit fluffy, especially in the midregion. I need to do more core work. Making that a top priority this fall/winter. If there is one thing I learned this year is how important carbs are to me. I look and feel better at eating 150g+ as opposed to under 100. Even looking at pics a few weeks ago where I wasn't eating as much and I see a huge difference.

mrmuscle, you look great. Your middle pic reminds me of kinda where I am/was. That third pic is where I would like to look like on a daily basis. If I can walk around 10-12%, I be good to go. Worry about that next year. I think I will just hire a coach or something. I don't want to think, I just want to follow directions.

 

[SeanR1221]

I think the best part of Mr Muscles post is he's been lifting for 20(!) years. Puts it in perspective for you.

Although I think I'd like to look like his middle pic the most

 

[CherryWoodFuton]

Mrmuscles you are fucking awesome

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Mr Muscles you are a fucking beast. Very motivating see your changes.

____________________________________________________________

Under what circumstances would you guys suggest undergoing a cycle of creatine?

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Mr Muscles you are a fucking beast. Very motivating see your changes.

____________________________________________________________

Under what circumstances would you guys suggest undergoing a cycle of creatine?

No cycle. Take it daily. Enjoy benefits.

 

[Cudder]

Mr Muscles you are a fucking beast. Very motivating see your changes.

____________________________________________________________

Under what circumstances would you guys suggest undergoing a cycle of creatine?

Under any circumstance. Don't even cycle it, just take it.

Off to the gym I go. 5x5 treating me pretty well so far.

 

[Ashodin]

Did my High Back Squats 3x5, Bench press 3x5 yesterday in addition to some cardio, then I loaded up on about 123g of protein (wow) my highest ever. Feels good man

Also did 3x5 Free weights of 30 lbs each hand. Highest I've ever lifted free weights.

 

[God Dayumm]

I take one teaspoon of creatine before lifting and one after, so that's not daily, should I take it daily?

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

No cycle. Take it daily. Enjoy benefits.

Under any circumstance. Don't even cycle it, just take it.

Off to the gym I go. 5x5 treating me pretty well so far.

sweet cheers!

also there's two variety's i can see.

Monohydrate and Ester Ethel. Which one is recommended.

Oh and do you guys take pill or powder?

 

[Joey Fox]

I'm back on SS for the past month after 3 months of laziness. Current stats:

Bench - 190 x 5 x 3
Press - 120 x 5 x 3
Squat - 215 x 5 x 3
Deadlift - 225 x 5 x 3
Power Clean - 135 x 3 x 5

All of these lifts were solid last time with a lot left in my tank, and I'm happy to be almost lifting respectable weight. I still look like a tub of lard at 5'9" 202 lbs, but that'll work itself out as I keep going.

 

[Cudder]

sweet cheers!

also there's two variety's i can see.

Monohydrate and Ester Ethel. Which one is recommended.

Oh and do you guys take pill or powder?

Take a micronized creatine monohydrate. Creapure if you can find it.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

sweet cheers!

also there's two variety's i can see.

Monohydrate and Ester Ethel. Which one is recommended.

Oh and do you guys take pill or powder?

pill, doesn't really matter. I use monohydrate and havent looked twice

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Take a micronized creatine monohydrate. Creapure if you can find it.

cheers - found it!

http://www.myprotein.com/sports-nutrition/creatine-monohydrate-creapure/10529740.html

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Take a micronized creatine monohydrate. Creapure if you can find it.

woops noticed that one is "creapure" but not "micronized"

what are the perceived benefits of the micronized variety? a google search is giving me mixed responses.

cheers

 

[FallingEdge]

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002DYIZEO/?tag=neogaf0e-20

there you go

 

[RumblingRosco]

Creatine rule of thumb: If it has no sugar/fat/protein and dissolves easily, you're good to go. Doesn't matter beyond that.

 

[MrMuscle]

mrmuscle, you look great. Your middle pic reminds me of kinda where I am/was. That third pic is where I would like to look like on a daily basis. If I can walk around 10-12%, I be good to go. Worry about that next year. I think I will just hire a coach or something. I don't want to think, I just want to follow directions.

Thanks man. Using a coach is not a bad ide. I got plenty of knowledge but i also have a coach i can bounce ideas an thoughts off. It really comes in handy.

Mrmuscle, great work. Im also not a fan of dirty bulks unless you are really skinny.

Thanks pal. For some hardgainers a dirty bulk might be necessary yeah.

I think the best part of Mr Muscles post is he's been lifting for 20(!) years. Puts it in perspective for you.

Although I think I'd like to look like his middle pic the most

Now I sound like an old man

Hehe thats the beauty! We all have different goals, but work just as hard to reach them.

Mrmuscles you are fucking awesome

Thanks alot, i appriciate it!

Mr Muscles you are a fucking beast. Very motivating see your changes.

____________________________________________________________

Under what circumstances would you guys suggest undergoing a cycle of creatine?

Thanks bro, and as for creatine do like the other guys said 5g Creapure Creatine Monohydrate a day and you are set.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002DYIZEO/?tag=neogaf0e-20

there you go

cheers bro, much appreciated

 

[PartlyCloudlike]

Eat more, read the ss chapter on the press, remember to squeeze your glutes and abs hard as you press with lats locked down, get enough rest, micro load and you will eventually have to stagger your workload. Maybe a 5x5 one day then a 3x3 heavier later that week. Do it first.

I'll keep your advice in mind, especially regarding the glutes and abs, thanks! I'm 5'7" and weigh 152.8, but suffered a lot of strength loss to get to this weight; intentionally lost 18 pounds about 2 months ago by dieting and playing basketball.

Hey Grumble I just wanted to thank you for your advice! Today I made sure to squeeze my glutes and be conscious of keeping the lats locked down and it REALLY helped me feel more rigid during the lift. The power seemed to come more from my entire body. On previous lifts the strength didn't feel as evenly distributed. I was finally able to complete 3x5 at 75lbs for OHP. Small weight for most, but a big victory for me. Thanks!

 

[sphinx]

fitgaf I have to ask you:

what is the highest BF% you allow yourself to have when on a bulk?

what number makes you say "no fucking way, weight is going down, starting this very second"

do you go over 20% or is that way too off limits??

 

[Cudder]

fitgaf I have to ask you:

what is the highest BF% you allow yourself to have when on a bulk?

what number makes you say "no fucking way, weight is going down, starting this very second"

do you go over 20% or is that way too off limits??

I don't even care. It's not like you'd get super fat anyway since you're working out, and hopefully not doing one of those stupid eat everything I see bulks. People seem to forget a proper bulk is just a 500 calorie or less bump in your maintenance. Anyway I'm pretty sure I've been at like 25% for a long time, didn't even really phase me. It's real easy to get the fat off so I don't even mind it.

 

[BakedYams]

god damn, ive never been so full on greens and protein. I just met my requirement for the day, still lacking carbs so ill probably get hungry later but i checked my weight this morning and its 196, down from 200 last night. I redid it on a harder floor and its still 196. I don't get how weight fluctuates so much, after I ate, I literally gained 4 pounds on proteins and veggies.

 

[Sadetar]

Well then I will just have to rest easy with the knowledge that my silkies excuse form deficiencies! I find that the beard doesn't help nearly as much in comparison.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I loved the facial hair as well!

Ok, after your story I am just happy I haven't got a smoking hot lad at the gym to constantly tell me that look at that other chick who is ridiculously sexy and doing the thing right. You were really nice about the whole situation though.

Something I feel is always worth mentioning in regards to body shape is relativity. No body part exists or is perceived in isolation of the rest. Oddly enough I made this same point to a male friend of mine who is into cross-dressing and was considering buying some corsets. I questioned his motivations for wanting to incorporate this type of restrictive garment and he stated that he just wants that more tapered waist appearance. So I asked him - do you know what the best way to make your waist look smaller is? He shook his head. The answer is to make your ass enormous! Muahahaha

He didn't appreciate it as much as I thought he would, but the point still stands in my mind regardless of gender or current body composition.

Hahah, you are absolutely right and I am sadly aware of this. I also need to make my tummy smaller so my ass will look bigger in that comparison. I have also been trying to work that butt. Lol, ok, so I already recognize your butt cheeks, so we might as well start to work on it the other way around. I never thought I would actually post my ass comparison pics online, but hey, there is always the first time...

The ones on the right are from I think mid June and the ones on the left are mid August. Even though it is still small, I think I have managed to gain a bit more shape to it while cutting.

If I were you I would consider Starting Strength/barbell training to be the next evolutionary step in your body recomposition. But I am biased as that was my methodology. Keep your diet in check and keep doing your yoga and physical therapy then begin to add the strength programming without taking anything away from the rest of your pre/re-habilitation programming. Squats and Deadlifts are the long windy roads to the holy grail which you seek.

Oh, I haven't done yoga, since I haven't yet got permission to that, but I have been doing pilates that also works nicely with core muscles. I don't think I will change my program before consulting my doc, but I am seeing him next week's Wednesday so we will see what he has to say.

What comes to deadlift I am not going to try those before my back is fully healed, but squats I have been doing with an empty bar (light one, not Olympic). But hey, I appreciate your input and I might hopefully soon ask about it with more depth depending what that dear doctor will tell me.

Oh, oh! And on June I couldn't get even my fingertips to the floor when I tried to touch it with somewhat straight legs and today I managed to get nearly my whole palm! (Ok, I had a feeling of a pressure on my lower back after that, but I can do it now!) I remember I used to be overly flexible like two years ago before all this, so I hope I can at some point go back to that. ^_^

He is a beautiful male specimen.

He is indeed.

SORRY ABOUT THE PICTURE SPAM!

No need to apology the amount of pictures - I really appreciate them!

Hahah, even though I will never start to like that fake tan that people take to competitions to show off their muscles.

You are ridiculously ripped though. That is just insane.

god damn, ive never been so full on greens and protein. I just met my requirement for the day, still lacking carbs so ill probably get hungry later but i checked my weight this morning and its 196, down from 200 last night. I redid it on a harder floor and its still 196. I don't get how weight fluctuates so much, after I ate, I literally gained 4 pounds on proteins and veggies.

Oh, it varies a whole lot. You should start to weight yourself perhaps like once a week always at the same time of a day. I would suggest a morning after you have visited the bathroom so it would be easier to compare where you are going.

Also since it looks like I have been spamming a whole lot of photos lately, I will add one more to the collection. Hahah, for once actually in my normal everyday clothing that I went to work with! Considering where I started and that I have been going to gym and working out only five months, I am actually quite satisfied where I am now. Still working on it. So without a further ado, me today.

 

[Bowser]

oh man. Just gorged on chicken cheesesteak, onion rings, fries, and a beer. I feel like this:

 

[CherryWoodFuton]

Welp Fit Gaf took an interesting turn with Sadetar's booty pics.....

Spoiler

DAT ASS

 

[Cooter]

Well my peeps..... Success! 525 deadlift at 175 on the dot today. I failed my first attempt. Got it just below my knees. Went down to 510 and barley got that. Then went down to 455 and did 2 sets of one. After that I went back up to 525 for another attempt. It looks like I'm having a seizure but I got it up!! Boy was it tough. So year long goal accomplished 1 day before I turn thirty-five! Feeling pretty damn ecstatic at the moment!

Here it is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5wlbLW8fTA&feature=youtu.be

 

[Faiz]

Damn nice Cooter. The Superman getup is perfect.

 

[MrToughPants]

Awesome job Coot!!

Hahah, you are absolutely right and I am sadly aware of this. I also need to make my tummy smaller so my ass will look bigger in that comparison. I have also been trying to work that butt. Lol, ok, so I already recognize your butt cheeks, so we might as well start to work on it the other way around. I never thought I would actually post my ass comparison pics online, but hey, there is always the first time...

The ones on the right are from I think mid June and the ones on the left are mid August. Even though it is still small, I think I have managed to gain a bit more shape to it while cutting.

Looks like I have some competition

 

[Pegosaurus]

so the way I understand it is this

you 'bulk' to build muscle mass and you 'cut' to lower body fat % and gain muscle definition

so this means that when you first start lifting you should always be in a bulking phase right? How do you know when you should start a cut?

 

[sphinx]

hot-ass GAF

you do not want to start this fight lol

 

[Xildenafil]

Great work Cooter! 525 lbs at 175 lbs body weight is damn impressive...

I'm resolving to post more in this thread and will post some form check vids over the next week.

Mixed results for today - new PR on deadlift (1x5 @ 275 lbs) but had to deload to 225 lbs squat 3x5 and stalled at 155 lbs bench 3x5.

Happy lifting weekend everyone

 

[Xildenafil]

so the way I understand it is this

you 'bulk' to build muscle mass and you 'cut' to lower body fat % and gain muscle definition

so this means that when you first start lifting you should always be in a bulking phase right? How do you know when you should start a cut?

I would say you should start cutting either a) when you feel uncomfortable with your weight (e.g. 40 lbs over your starting weight) or b) once you stall and deload on 3x on all lifts on a beginner program like SL or SS. But really you should be able to deadlift at least 315 lbs and squat 225 lbs before you even think about a cut.

Just remember that a bulk doesn't mean eat everything in sight - it means eat 200-500 calories above maintenance per day.

 

[Cudder]

so the way I understand it is this

you 'bulk' to build muscle mass and you 'cut' to lower body fat % and gain muscle definition

so this means that when you first start lifting you should always be in a bulking phase right? How do you know when you should start a cut?

It all depends on where you're starting from.

 

[J. Bravo]

375 squat 1rm today heck yeah

 

[Pegosaurus]

I would say you should start cutting either a) when you feel uncomfortable with your weight (e.g. 40 lbs over your starting weight) or b) once you stall and deload on 3x on all lifts on a beginner program like SL or SS. But really you should be able to deadlift at least 315 lbs and squat 225 lbs before you even think about a cut.

Just remember that a bulk doesn't mean eat everything in sight - it means eat 200-500 calories above maintenance per day.

thanks. I don't plan on cutting anytime soon after I start lifting but I just wanted to get an idea of when it should be considered.

thanks for the info on the bulk too, wasn't sure how much I should be eating

just wondering though, what exactly do you mean in the bolded?

 

[Leeness]

My coworkers are generally always so nice!

And that is good - rest until you feel better and then get back to it with more energy and motivation!

What comes to shirts like that you have quite much similar built to me, but you are just in a very good way smaller and lighter than I am. So cutie, don't think that you can't wear something since it is all in your head! If you want to wear something fitting that is embrasing your body - just do it and feel happy about it! With all honesty you are your worst critic, other people don't seek flaws in you the same way you do.

I'm gonna do strength yoga tonight. I can walk again

I definitely can't wear things like that haha. Baggy sweaters are the only thing I should be wearing. I'm too nice--wouldn't want people getting sick around me.

Omg, your butt pictures! Get it! I do squats all the time, and nothing. My ass is flat as a pancake and will always be. Sigh.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

MTP is literally Mister Tough Pants because they gotta work hard to keep the pumpkin inside

 

[Deleted member 47027]

y'all been watching Gym Rescue? Friend Heel provided this:
http://www.spike.com/episodes/3ctwde/gym-rescue-when-push-comes-to-shove-season-1-ep-101