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Formula 1 2017 Season |OT| Japanese Horror Story - Sundays on Sky
- Thread starter Ark
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Traffic is, barely moving cars loitering on the apex of the corner before speeding up at the last second isn't normal traffic.
This happens all the time in qualifying. Drivers are instructed to wait for a gap so they slow down, usually at the end of the track.
it wasnt intentional, quite clearly fathing about with all the millions of buttons these cars have on the wheel to prep for the hot lap, he realised just in time and didnt affect the lap time much
Apparently it doesn't count if it wasn't intentional. 🙄
theignoramus
Member
Grosjean got another stab at it the next lap. Just a minor quali incident. If that was a high speed corner I'd agree with a blocking penalty.
Yes, and when they do it when there's someone on a hot lap right behind them it's a penalty. While I'm not a fan of the stewards interfering too much, with this and the Vettel incident it's pretty clear that Vettel and Hamilton are being allowed to operate in a manner the rest of the field is not.
Raikkonen held up Magnussen or Palmer or someone from a smaller team earlier in the season and didn't receive a penalty so you can't exactly say this was unprecedented.
But surely the top drivers are given more leash. Some stewards have already admitted that they don't want to interfere with the championship, which is bullshit as it has the exact opposite effect. Someone could end up edging the championship by way of escaping more penalties.
Myoclonic Jerk
Member
It's sad what has happened to Grosjean, but let's look at things little differently shall we?
Hamilton is fighting for the WDC, and Gros clocked 10th at his best try, would GRO have had gained anything by punishing Lewis? I'm not saying Hamilton didn't deserve a penalty, but it will be a shame if he got one. So I'm happy that it turned out the way it did. Good call
Hamilton is fighting for the WDC, and Gros clocked 10th at his best try, would GRO have had gained anything by punishing Lewis? I'm not saying Hamilton didn't deserve a penalty, but it will be a shame if he got one. So I'm happy that it turned out the way it did. Good call
The bolded might have something to do with that.
Let's put aside for a moment whether or not this was a penalty-worthy offense; not giving people penalties because it would be a shame is silly. Just because they're fighting for the championship doesn't mean they play by different rules.
Positioning in the WDC shouldn't matter when stewards make a call, nor the current place for quali. If a driver makes a mistake that requires a penalty, then a penalty should be given.
No one should be exempt from that because they compete for the WDC, unless where does it end? What offense will deserve a penalty? Who exactly competes for the WDC? Is it only the top 3 or does RIC also counts? Just all those questions and debatable things are exactly the reason stuff like that shouldn't matter when stewards make the call.
DarkJediKnight
Member
I'm a HAM fan and I think he should have been given a penalty on it. Grosjean clearly had to break early to avoid collision.
Sure, that doesn't mean they're not loud enough though.
Business
Member
I would think the decision was based on clear evidence from GRO's telemetry and not how clearly it looked from TV.
I bet upward of 90% of people that attended in person before the V6 era began would disagree.
I understand what you're saying but as somebody that has gone to every Aussie GP since 1995, the cars are not beasts now, the level of sound is similar to our V8 Supercars series which while loud, is not the league above that they used to be.
Check out this older video I took and you may begin to understand what the sound difference used to be. The 2nd car is a V8 supercar which is probably slightly louder than today's F1 cars. The third is an older, louder F1.
https://youtu.be/H03jC3OWVkw
Edit: I should also mention that I'm not trying to put you down and I'm glad you enjoyed it. The cars are impressive, I'm speaking only of the level of sound they produce. It's actually nice that you can hold a conversation with these cars and don't need to worry about hearing loss.
All F1 stewarding seems to go through a lens of "What will this mean for the current race and/or championship". It's a farcical way to officiate a sport. They meddle constantly thinking it improves the spectacle, but ultimately it just makes the whole thing feel fake, with a touch of WWE about it.
This particular case is a bit weird. It's hard to tell whether Grosjean could have taken the corner at full tilt given that Hamilton does get going pretty quickly, but Grosjean would have been taking an almighty risk to actually do it. How could he know how quickly Hamilton was going to accelerate? Even if it's not technically impeding, it really ought to be. Hamilton is very lucky, though, practically I'm not sure Grosjean would have done better than 10th and Hamilton is so far ahead of 2nd it would seem harsh to drop him further.
I wonder if the drivers' could be given some kind of onboard information (rather than relying on their team) to indicate the proximity of drivers on hot laps - would reduce how often it happens and give drivers no excuse if they screwed up.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
I think that Formula 2 is supporting the GP this week. If you can you should check it out. They had F2 after quali in Monaco, what a difference.
Uh what? Contact? They're saying they examined the telemetry and it didn't affect Gro. They used telemetry to identify that Vettel was infact insane in Baku.
Presumably it's a question of physical space. You can affect someone's lap by merely running ahead of them. The effect made by a car through the air affects drivers that are several seconds back. So I'd think impeding is a question of whether they physically got in your way. I guess the question here is whether there would have been a collision if Grosjean didn't slow abnormally. It looks touch and go to me.
theignoramus
Member
Not if was Hamilton's first of two runs, as it was with Grosjean.
No, it says it potentially affected Grosjean. God knows where the difference between affecting and impeding is, though.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
I assume affecting is "I hope this person doesn't block me", and impeding is "This person just blocked me".
i.e. if you're affected psychologically by their presence that you prepare to be impeded but that never actually happens, that would still slow you down - but they haven't actually impeded you.
Not entirely sure I agree with that in the context of the video, though!
adamantypants
Member
Not only that, the cars are actually about the same loudness as the V8 Era.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/...-louder-but-you-will-struggle-to-know-676431/
Problem is that the current cars are a lower frequency of noise so it only seems much quieter when really they're about the same level
Fox Mulder
Member
Psychotext
Member
Looks like the stress is getting to Mr Wolf.
Frankfurter
Member
"Comes across" as an ass? I've seen a bit or assholery from Angry Toto.
Tomorrow I'll try and grab some unscientific recordings of F2 and F1.
And, i like this thread, you are reasonable people
Most of us. Most of the time. No promises.
Tomorrow I'll try and grab some unscientific recordings of F2 and F1.
And, i like this thread, you are reasonable people
ElectronicOldMen
Banned
Formula E at its best is a kinda fun mix of open-wheel racing and door-to-door touring car nonsense
I mean, it's easy to forget that at one point, people were calling for Grosjean to have multiple race bans and even removed from the sport because of his crashfest in.. 2012? I feel like that's what Toto's trying to say, unfortunately he underestimated the headline that would come out of it and the way people would see it.
The hyperbole about Grosjean was utter bullshit though.
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