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Game of Thrones *NO BOOK DISCUSSION* |OT| Season 7 - [Read the OP]

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N

Nerokis

Member
Sanctuary said:
For the first five seasons, I would rewatch all of the previous seasons again right before the new one would start. Didn't do that for this season though.
Click to expand...

I stopped doing this after season 4. Oberyn vs. The Mountain broke me.

Man, some of you. Cinematography goes a long way to compensate for budgetary restrictions, and the first season had it in spades. Most of the time the show was gorgeous, even in the first season.
Click to expand...

Yep. S1 still looked fantastic.
 
T

The Artisan

Member
teh_pwn said:
I wouldn't say shit, just that the writing quality has dropped and for obvious reasons - it's mostly original. Logistics of character locations is getting a bit lazy, and wittiness and dialog complexity has been replaced by comic relief.

Basically the show has gone from a dark, medieval fantasy to a Summer blockbuster movie.
Click to expand...

The writing quality has dropped and we can blame than on the showrunners and the main thing would be certain characters - like the sandsnakes, this isn't new to season 7 I think it started before that, and then of course the huge speeds at which characters can travel, like Euron, traveling to 2 distant places in 1 episode. The dialogue can get pretty iffy too.

But so far there are a lot of highs, too. There will be lows but there are a lot of highs and the important thing is that shit is rolling, there's little no filler unlike the other most popular show on TV.

I'd just like to think that if the writing is bad it's because there's no basis for them but I'm hoping GRRM is still on board and had a hand in writing the script.
 
R

RDreamer

Member
DarkJediKnight said:
And you're perfectly ok with the following:

Teenager who can see and affect the past
Dead men walking
Saying a few words can bring someone back from the dead
Click to expand...

Can we seriously stop with the "This show has fantasy elements therefore literally nothing has to make sense" defense? It really shows a lack of critical understanding on how fantasy writing works. Writing doesn't get to run roughshod over everything just because they showed a dragon one time. Fantasy writing needs to establish where it fits in with the real world and where it doesn't. It needs to be grounded and believable, even if there are undead and other magical creatures. Especially this series, which got famous literally because it was a more grounded, realistic fantasy series.

Fantasy shouldn't be used as an excuse for poor writing in a series. Where your world breaks from reality should be foreshadowed, it should be hinted at. It should surprise sometimes, but it shouldn't break consistency or believability. It should at the very least stay consistent within the same scene.

The person you posted was having issues because the scene wasn't consistent. Dany's dragon is shown blowing fire to an absolutely devastating effect. Literally it turned people to ashes in seconds. It was able to roast a massive area, too. Well, then just a second later Bronn is able to jump and not get roasted despite that massive cone and despite the show not hinting at Bronn apparently having superhuman jumping abilities. Same thing with the stream. Streams aren't different in this world. Most streams don't get like 10 feet deep within the span of maybe a couple feet out. And the fiery inferno would have boiled that fucking water pretty quickly. These are things that can easily take someone out, because they're spectacle played up to be dramatic and not terribly realistic, unfortunately. It's also liable to get people antsy because, again, this was a series that got famous on being grounded, realistic, and brutal when it made sense to be.
 
Nameless

Nameless

Member
VeeP said:
Anyone have that gif of Arya training with Syrio and then training with Brienne?
Click to expand...

arya-brienne-syrio.gif
arya-brienne-syrio-smile.gif
 
Grinchy

Grinchy

Banned
Damn, what a great episode. I loved when Bronn's bag of gold spills in front of him and he has to contemplate his real priorities in life.
 
J

jviggy43

Member
jotun? said:
internal consistency

establishing that things like magic exist in a fictional world does not make it OK to abandon all logic
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My friend told me its a fantasy show so I shouldn't be looking for logicial explanations for events within the show, as if having magic and dragons somehow means that the writer's are free to ignore all logic in order to write cool sequences into the story (which they are cool never the less).
 
T

The Artisan

Member
Grinchy said:
Damn, what a great episode. I loved when Bronn's bag of gold spills in front of him and he has to contemplate his real priorities in life.
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I don't think there was any contemplation there; the Dothraki attacker was still after his blood, so he had absolutely no time to just pick all that money up. He had to run for his life, there were no choices to make there except to get the scorpion.
 
M

mnannola

Member
Was anyone else pissed off at the ending? Like why was Jamie just sinking down, not trying to get back to the surface? I didn't get that part.
 
V

VeeP

Member
mnannola said:
Was anyone else pissed off at the ending? Like why was Jamie just sinking down, not trying to get back to the surface? I didn't get that part.
Click to expand...

His armor was heavy, he only has one hand - hard to say swim, dude just got rocked and saw death flash before his eyes, all of his allies were burnt to a crisp. Dude is shook.
 
N

Nibel

Member
What a great episode.

Seeing Littlefinger, a man who has been operating from the shadows using lies and deceptions as his tools, suddenly getting shook when Bran mentions the "Chaos is a ladder" quote was outstanding. That look on Littlefinger's face was so goddamn delicious
KuGsj.gif


Pretty convinced that both Bran and Arya will team up to take him out at some point, but I expect him to do some foul shit before that

And yeah, that battle scene was bloody fantastic
 
E

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
The Artisan said:
I don't think there was any contemplation there; the Dothraki attacker was still after his blood, so he had absolutely no time to just pick all that money up. He had to run for his life, there were no choices to make there except to get the scorpion.
Click to expand...
I think he definitely had to decide if he was gonna try to get the bag or GTFO. There's a moment where he glances over at it but then starts running.
 
T

The Artisan

Member
jviggy43 said:
My friend told me its a fantasy show so I shouldn't be looking for logicial explanations for events within the show, as if having magic and dragons somehow means that the writer's are free to ignore all logic in order to write cool sequences into the story (which they are cool never the less).
Click to expand...

if someone is that passionate about the show and wants to free it from that criticism, they're free to do so; but no everyone is so easily satisfied. this show like many other great entertainment stuff made by geniuses, is not free from blemishes and imperfections.
 
T

The Artisan

Member
Einchy said:
I think he definitely had to decide if he was gonna try to get the bag or GTFO. There's a moment where he glances over at it but then starts running.
Click to expand...
Bronn is not an idiot. He knows by the time he's over there trying to collect his money the Dothraki will be back. I think he was thinking *fuck I lost my gold* - I don't think there was a moment he thought about trying to get it back, there was no time for that.

edit: sorry for double post
 
J

jviggy43

Member
The Artisan said:
if someone is that passionate about the show and wants to free it from that criticism, they're free to do so; but no everyone is so easily satisfied. this show like many other great entertainment stuff made by geniuses, is not free from blemishes and imperfections.
Click to expand...

I would never argue the contrary. In fact, it was he who picked the argument with me for just pointing it out. Its a two way street. He can enjoy it all he wants and ignore all these issues but to try and argue that they don't exist simply because you enjoyed the episode in spite of those problems, is a bit silly to me.
 
T

Tawpgun

Member
I mean, judging by the preview, they fish out Jamie, Bronn, and round up the lannisters and ask them to bend the knee or die.

I assume most of the troops will bend. Bronn will likely bend.

Jamie... will be interesting.
 
E

effzee

Member
Heshinsi said:
How would that logistically make any sense? First episode they mentioned that the ride from KL to Winterfell took a month or so. In order for LF (who was in KL at the time) to have plotted Bran's assassination, he would first have to get a raven sent to him in KL, and then send a Raven back with a dagger attached to it for the killing (because how else would his dagger show up in the North?). No if anything, him trying to blame Tyrion is where he enters the story, and it fucking gets what you posted at the end to happen lol. Cat kidnaps Tyrion based off of Littlefinger stating that he lost the dagger in a bet. BOOM!
Click to expand...

I don't know man. Maybe the assassin traveled at the same time? Faster? Euron?
 
S

SoRuffShoNuff

Member
RDreamer said:
Can we seriously stop with the "This show has fantasy elements therefore literally nothing has to make sense" defense? It really shows a lack of critical understanding on how fantasy writing works. Writing doesn't get to run roughshod over everything just because they showed a dragon one time. Fantasy writing needs to establish where it fits in with the real world and where it doesn't. It needs to be grounded and believable, even if there are undead and other magical creatures. Especially this series, which got famous literally because it was a more grounded, realistic fantasy series.

Fantasy shouldn't be used as an excuse for poor writing in a series. Where your world breaks from reality should be foreshadowed, it should be hinted at. It should surprise sometimes, but it shouldn't break consistency or believability. It should at the very least stay consistent within the same scene.

The person you posted was having issues because the scene wasn't consistent. Dany's dragon is shown blowing fire to an absolutely devastating effect. Literally it turned people to ashes in seconds. It was able to roast a massive area, too. Well, then just a second later Bronn is able to jump and not get roasted despite that massive cone and despite the show not hinting at Bronn apparently having superhuman jumping abilities. Same thing with the stream. Streams aren't different in this world. Most streams don't get like 10 feet deep within the span of maybe a couple feet out. And the fiery inferno would have boiled that fucking water pretty quickly. These are things that can easily take someone out, because they're spectacle played up to be dramatic and not terribly realistic, unfortunately. It's also liable to get people antsy because, again, this was a series that got famous on being grounded, realistic, and brutal when it made sense to be.
Click to expand...

I don't understand the whole Bron jumping problem. When the dragon first roasts a group of soldiers it's maybe 2 soldiers wide, just enough for a line of horses to run through. You telling me a person can't jump that? The spread of fire is not that large at all.

I'm still amazed that people are breaking out maps and trying to determine timetables based on the distance traveled. If that's what interests you then wait 10 years for the next two books to be released and you can read all about how people broke their fast for weeks between anything of significance happening.
 
H

Heshinsi

"playing" dumb? unpossible
effzee said:
I don't know man. Maybe the assassin traveled at the same time? Faster? Euron?
Click to expand...

The only way this works is for LF to have included the assassin into Robert's entourage, with the express orders to make an attempt on the life of a Stark. That is still an incredible stretch.
 
T

The Artisan

Member
jviggy43 said:
I would never argue the contrary. In fact, it was he who picked the argument with me for just pointing it out. Its a two way street. He can enjoy it all he wants and ignore all these issues but to try and argue that they don't exist simply because you enjoyed the episode in spite of those problems, is a bit silly to me.
Click to expand...
I agree. I'm a huge fan of this series an for would love to speak about why, there are others who probably love it more than I do and it's hard to talk about it with people who try to defend any and ALL criticisms that can be made about it and plenty definitely can be made
 
One Eyed Willy

One Eyed Willy

Member
RichiRamjag said:
Jaime is a terrible character. He was interesting at first, then they showed some growth, but he hasn't been of any value since his return to kings landing. He just stands around making annoyed looks at euron now. It's the fault of writing.
Click to expand...

IMO Jamie is the big reveal in the entire series. He will be the prince that was promised. His lack of writing is actually a clue, slight of hand etc.. etc.. There are many other hints, including Ed Sheeran's song about the gold hand man, a lover and other prophesies discussed on the show.

But you are to be distracted by the R+L=J reveal last season and that somehow either Dany or Jon being bigger characters means they'll be involved in the final twists near the end. GRR ain't this dumb, Dany and Jon being in the forefront of this season as war and winter arrives to Westeros is again, all part of the big diversion.

Look deeper, peal back the layers.
 
A

aBarreras

Member
Conkerkid11 said:
Uhhh... How?
Click to expand...

this is the original post

Ernest said:
So, I'm clearly in the minority here, but this was a rather weak episode for me. Exciting, sure, but there are so many complete lapses in logic and common sense that it is too hard to look past. Why would the Dothraki horde charge in? Why wouldn't Dany bring all three dragons? How does Bronn avoid direct dragonfire that burns so far and wide? How is it that Jaime gets knocked off his horse while charging, into water that is that deep? How is it that being under a few feet of water protects him and Bron from dragonfire?
Click to expand...

nothing here is a "plot hole"
 
N

Nyx

Member
Awesome EP.

While this show has it's lows, it's highs more than make up for them.

Could be due to me being a fan of dragons though. ;)
 
K

KHlover

Banned
mnannola said:
Was anyone else pissed off at the ending? Like why was Jamie just sinking down, not trying to get back to the surface? I didn't get that part.
Click to expand...

He was wearing full plate armor with chainmail and has a solid golden hand...what the hell do you expect him to do?
 
P

Plum

Member
mnannola said:
Was anyone else pissed off at the ending? Like why was Jamie just sinking down, not trying to get back to the surface? I didn't get that part.
Click to expand...

1) Being knocked off your horse at full speed as you were literally about to die isn't exactly something you can recover from immediately.
2) Even if he had recovered he's still wearing tens, if not hundreds of pounds of armour on top of a golden hand; he's not exactly light weight.

Tawpgun said:
Bronn will likely have to carry him up.
Click to expand...

Fully expecting Dany to bring him up herself so he can be captured. Jaime's too valuable a person to have to just let him die.
 
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