- We get no prophecies at the House of the Undying? That's the entire point of the adventure! If Xaro/Pyat Pree really wanted to capture Daenarys, couldn't he/they have done so without all of the sneaking and lying? He slaughtered half of her entourage without her even knowing it. Where is Xaro's house guard at the end? How could Danaery get away with assaulting the manse of the richest man in Qarth?
- Where the fuck is Ghost?
As someone mentioned above, House of Undying shows King's Landing with snowfall and an empty Iron Throne, destroyed Hall. Maybe...that is the prophecy for the TV series?
I haven't read the books, but keep reading about the missing prophecies in this scene, I am sure they didn't show that without any meaning to it.
20% Tyrion planning and Tyrion/Varys delicious conversations
30% Arya's great adventure
20% Jon Snow & Qhorin's adventure
10% Stannis/Davos/Mel
10% Cat/Briene/Renly
10% Theon
Blackwater
House of the Undying
Let's see how that went?
-Tyrion planning almost entirely cut. Most Tyrion/Varis scenes cut
-Arya's entire adventure cut out
-Jon Snow's adventure mainly cut. No Ghost visions of giants and mammoths digging the lake. Entire Q story removed basically.
-Stannis...no Storm's End, No peach, otherwise handled ok
-Cat/Brienne handled ok despite some changes
-Theon story was handled ok. A lot worse for sure, lack of Bastard tricking him takes the sucker punch of out of the climax of his book 2 story. But serviceable.
-Blackwater was fantastic
-House of the Undying was missing
My god they have fucking WRECKED the Jon storyline. How hard would it have been to have the wildlings settle camp and have Jon/Qhorin have a 1-minute hushed discussion like
Qhorin: You're going to have to kill me
Jon: Wuh huh how why?
Q: Its the only way you are going to convince them to spare you
Jon: I can't I won't blah blah blah
Q: You MUST. Eat with them, sleep with them, laugh with them, learn all you can...
Instead we get Jon killing Q of his own volition, all because he said bad words about Mommy and Daddy? smh
I'm seeing this complaint a lot, but if the point is that it wasn't clear what was happening, I thought it was pretty obvious what the intent was. Don't think it's really something they had to spell out in such a ham-handed fashion.
One thing I really think is worth highlighting this episode is the music. I saw some critcism of the music in the other thread, and I tend to agree. But tonight had some nice ones. I liked the song that played during the montage of Dany and her crew raiding the mansion (I think it was a remix of the shows theme). That Whitewalker theme is also going to stick with my for awhile (Probably because I keep watching the scene on youtube).
Snow on the iron throne, then she walks north of the wall.
Otherwise it's showing the future, that she wont arrive at the iron throne until the others have pillaged the south, and even when she has it in arms reach she'll go off for something else.
Snow on the iron throne, then she walks north of the wall.
Otherwise it's showing the future, that she wont arrive at the iron throne until the others have pillaged the south, and even when she has it in arms reach she'll go off for something else.
One thing I really think is worth highlighting this episode is the music. I saw some critcism of the music in the other thread, and I tend to agree. But tonight had some nice ones. I liked the song that played during the montage of Dany and her crew raiding the mansion (I think it was a remix of the shows theme). That Whitewalker theme is also going to stick with my for awhile (Probably because I keep watching the scene on youtube).
- Wight power! Seriously, the Other actually creeped me the fuck out - very very well done. Not exactly what the book made them sound like, but a huge improvement over Season 1. I did wonder if we were going to see Sam the(SOS)
Slayer
this episode, since Grenn and Edd running off into the whiteout was very reminiscient of that SOS scene.
- Theon's story. I thought Theon's story was a bit more emotional on screen than in the book. In the book he acts like a mustache twirling villain once he gains Winterfell, then goes out like a bitch. In the show he was more realistic and had his ups and downs.
- Tyrion's two scenes. Varys. Smug Pycelle. TV Shae who's 10x more interesting, nay, 100x more interesting than bored little "can we fuck now?" girl Shae from the books. Big SOS spoiler:
I honestly believe she wanted to go across the sea with him; I wonder if the bedroom scene will be done differently in Storm...either he doesn't "off" her or if she shows some true regret
.
- Faceless Jaqen. Too bad we only got a very short scene with Arya this episode, but ninja Jaqen was worth it. Liked the scene quite a bit, was begging the HBO gods that we'd see him change and we did.
- Robb and Talisa, sitting under a tree. W E D D I N G. I wonder if this means Talisa is truly her real name - I assumed we'd find out if she was lying BEFORE she was married.
- Brienne the Badass. Loved this fucking scene. All of it. The little ruse between B and J. The sudden coy trick the Stark guy does, totally something I would do to try and make sure they're lying. I swear that Stark soldier was like "eh, I've seen enough crime capers to know when someone's lying about who they are...let's pull this outta context a bit and make them say his name at the same time". However, see "decent".
- Dany. The after the House scene was fucking great. The raiding, etc. I'm still not 100% sure if she was justified in leaving both Xaros and Doreah to die in that vault. Maybe Xaros, sure, he lied to her and ended up getting her people killed. But how do you know how deep Doreah was in this? I'm not white knighting it, because let's be honest and say that Doreah is fucking hot, but Dany considers her handmaidens her sisters. So it was weird that she would kill her sister in this way without talking to her about it. We're seeing a stronger, more aggressive Dany and I love it. I loved her in this, more than any other episode this season. These scenes reminded me of why I love Dany...watching her walking across a snowy, destroyed Red Keep to the Iron Throne reminded me what she has at stake. But I'm not sure if she's that ruthless yet...even though she watched her brother die a horrible death.
What was pretty decent:
- The House of The Undying. Yeah, I actually liked it. I understand why they couldn't do twenty different scenes from all over the world for one scene - Jackson had 10x the budget for LOTR but he couldn't do the prophecy scene with Galadriel at the end of Fellowship that was in the book. I would have liked at least the Rhaegar moment, though. That said, I like Drogo/Rhaego - you wonder if it's truly them, "undying", waiting for her to come for them once she dies.
- The court scene. It was pretty much exactly like in the book. It's here because it's fun to see them all fucking lying to make this marriage happen, but also because I really like Natalie Dormer's chest.
- Littlefinger. Book readers know what I'm talking about. SOS
So maybe LF's involvement in Sansa's "rescue" isn't going to be so secret, last minute? Maybe she'll know LF is behind Boros' saving her? Or maybe Boros doesn't even appear again, maybe it's LF meeting her in the Godswood.
- Stannis. Liked: seeing how Mel treated him like an old lover, seeing how much she cared about him and was at ease around him which brings me to what I didn't like and that was the bizarre psycho choking scene. Stannis was definitely treated like the villain of this season, almost as much as Joffrey himself. Between his careless drive in Blackwater and this scene, this Stannis is less justified than the book version.
- Brienne the Baddest Ass. Um, that's a bit morbid of Brienne. She was never one to take pleasure in killing, she resisted it as much as possible. Sure, the slow death was justisfied, but her psychotic pleasure in it was very un-like the character. Dude did, again, deserve it.
What I didn't like:
- Jon and Quorin. Yeah, despite what Halfhand whispered to him last episode, I would have liked a clearer "You have to pretend to be one of them, even if it means you need to kill me". I would have liked that message more delivered. Because if someone looks away a second or isn't paying attention, they're going to see Jon murder Halfhand in cold blood. I know I'm going to have to explain this to my wife after he does it. Also, after disarming Quorin, there's a split second, then Jon ruthlessly and angrily runs him through in a very painful looking way. It looks very real, so I can see even the Lord of Bones accepting his Wildling orientation as the Real McCoy, but too real...Jon really seemed to have wanted to murder Quorin for calling his mother a whore. Maybe Ros is your mom, Jon, and it's a justifiable fact.....
- Luwin's death wasn't as emotional as I was expecting. The actor played it as if he could stand up any moment now. Not that he was mortally wounded to the point that he needed Osha to end his pain. The book death was much sadder, the character himself was better in the book I think (especially the scene after Ned's death in Book 1).
- Dany's armpit flame throwers. Don't get me wrong, I liked this much better than how it was done in the book, but her look of ecstasy as fire comes from under her arms was really comical.
OH AND:
Weiss: “We need more guy junk on the show. Fair and balanced.”
20% Tyrion planning and Tyrion/Varys delicious conversations
30% Arya's great adventure
20% Jon Snow & Qhorin's adventure
10% Stannis/Davos/Mel
10% Cat/Briene/Renly
10% Theon
Blackwater
House of the Undying
Let's see how that went?
-Tyrion planning almost entirely cut. Most Tyrion/Varis scenes cut
-Arya's entire adventure cut out
-Jon Snow's adventure mainly cut. No Ghost visions of giants and mammoths digging the lake. Entire Q story removed basically.
-Stannis...no Storm's End, No peach, otherwise handled ok
-Cat/Brienne handled ok despite some changes
-Theon story was handled ok. A lot worse for sure, lack of Bastard tricking him takes the sucker punch of out of the climax of his book 2 story. But serviceable.
-Blackwater was fantastic
-House of the Undying was missing
As someone mentioned above, House of Undying shows King's Landing with snowfall and an empty Iron Throne, destroyed Hall. Maybe...that is the prophecy for the TV series?
I haven't read the books, but keep reading about the missing prophecies in this scene, I am sure they didn't show that without any meaning to it.
They've completely dropped the ball with everything Rhaegar related.
No mention of Lyanna's rescue by Ned in season 1, neutered Jaime's speech to Catelyn earlier this season, no appearance in Dany's vision in the HotU.
Obviously, they can make up for it by letting Qaith (the masked woman) give her vague advice again, but it's really kind of disappointing to have such a major part of the backstory almost completely glossed over. And that's completely ignoring the other prophecies. Considering one of them acts as Dany's big motivation for a lot of her actions going forward, I think viewers are being robbed by them being omitted.
At this point, just read the books. They only covered maybe 60% of the actual content in the book and for the most part the content they replaced it with is just TnA and Ros. Ros is fucking stupid and boring.
Brienne the Baddest Ass. Um, that's a bit morbid of Brienne. She was never one to take pleasure in killing, she resisted it as much as possible. Sure, the slow death was justisfied, but her psychotic pleasure in it was very un-like the character. Dude did, again, deserve it.
I dunno, it felt to me that she just considered it to be proper retribution. There was clearly an element of anger in it, but I didn't get the feeling that she took any real pleasure from it - just what she felt was justice being served.
They've completely dropped the ball with everything Rhaegar related.
No mention of Lyanna's rescue by Ned in season 1, neutered Jaime's speech to Catelyn earlier this season, no appearance in Dany's vision in the HotU.
Obviously, they can make up for it by letting Qaith (the masked woman) give her vague advice again, but it's really kind of disappointing to have such a major part of the backstory almost completely glossed over. And that's completely ignoring the other prophecies. Considering one of them acts as Dany's big motivation for a lot of her actions going forward, I think viewers are being robbed by them being omitted.
Again, all of those act as parts of her internal monologue, she never talks about them openly. It would have been extremely difficult to use them as motivation for her going forward, without her stupidly talking to herself
Brienne the Baddest Ass. Um, that's a bit morbid of Brienne. She was never one to take pleasure in killing, she resisted it as much as possible. Sure, the slow death was justisfied, but her psychotic pleasure in it was very un-like the character. Dude did, again, deserve it.
I much prefer this efficient bad ass Brienne to the clumsy "“have you seen a maid of three-and-ten with blue eyes and auburn hair" Brienne who is too "girly" to kill. Was really an eye roll worthy plot line
Again, all of those act as parts of her internal monologue, she never talks about them openly. It would have been extremely difficult to use them as motivation for her going forward, without her stupidly talking to herself
Beautiful episode but fuck them for this Jon Snow storyline. I want to know who got more minutes, Ros or Qhorin Halfhand? Please fire whoever wrote this shitty Jon storyline. Even Maester Luwin got the shaft in terms of minutes, at least give him a longer death. Daenerys was getting her Legend of Zelda on, I loved it. That scene with the Iron Throne was fucking epic stuff. Though the this whole King of Qarth stuff was some pointless bullshit. Who said they blew the budget on episode 9?
She gets invited by the warlock to go to the house of the undying as a pleasantry. She goes and it's a weird magical haunted house that she gets lost in and sees some interesting flashbacks and prophecies about the world as she makes her way through.
Eventually she gets to the undying. From what I gathered, they were like ghosts that still had a physical attachment in the world and refused to die. They had physical hearts, but the rest of their bodies were like ghosts. They had lived for 1000s of years and waited to meet Dany.
She meets them and they tell her some prophecy stuff. They all want to touch her because she is the mother of dragons they have waited for. When they touch her she freaks out on instinct and her dragon takes that as a cue to start breathing fire and roast all of the undying's physical hearts and they all actually die. This causes the house of the undying to set on fire and collapse or something.
Dany escapes and the Warlock guy who brought her there as a nice gesture sees his entire home and elders and religion burned to the ground in front of him and snaps and runs at her screaming with a knife or something and gets stopped.
It was funny, because basically these immortal people invite Dany to their place to say hi and she accidently burns them all to the ground and destroys their entire culture. Whoops. The prophecies were also all very interesting world building.
IRRC,
She gets invited by the warlock to go to the house of the undying as a pleasantry. She goes and it's a weird magical haunted house that she gets lost in and sees some interesting flashbacks and prophecies about the world as she makes her way through.
Eventually she gets to the undying. From what I gathered, they were like ghosts that still had a physical attachment in the world and refused to die. They had physical hearts, but the rest of their bodies were like ghosts. They had lived for 1000s of years and waited to meet Dany.
She meets them and they tell her some prophecy stuff. They all want to touch her because she is the mother of dragons they have waited for. When they touch her she freaks out on instinct and her dragon takes that as a cue to start breathing fire and roast all of the undying's physical hearts and they all actually die. This causes the house of the undying to set on fire and collapse or something.
Dany escapes and the Warlock guy who brought her there as a nice gesture sees his entire home and elders and religion burned to the ground in front of him and snaps and runs at her screaming with a knife or something and gets stopped.
It was funny, because basically these immortal people invite Dany to their place to say hi and she accidently burns them all to the ground and destroys their entire culture. Whoops. The prophecies were also all very interesting world building.
- Jon and Quorin. Yeah, despite what Halfhand whispered to him last episode, I would have liked a clearer "You have to pretend to be one of them, even if it means you need to kill me". I would have liked that message more delivered. Because if someone looks away a second or isn't paying attention, they're going to see Jon murder Halfhand in cold blood. I know I'm going to have to explain this to my wife after he does it. Also, after disarming Quorin, there's a split second, then Jon ruthlessly and angrily runs him through in a very painful looking way. It looks very real, so I can see even the Lord of Bones accepting his Wildling orientation as the Real McCoy, but too real...Jon really seemed to have wanted to murder Quorin for calling his mother a whore. Maybe Ros is your mom, Jon, and it's a justifiable fact.....
I read it as Jon being unable to do what was necessary, so Halfhand took things into his own hands and really needled at Jon's psyche, forcing him to get angry and kill him. It could have used a tad more setup, but it wasn't very confusing.
Read them all in order, trust me. It'll be like a directors cut for season one, and youll get so much more out of book 2 what with all the stuff that got changed for season 2.
In the book was the Robb wedding a New Gods (The Seven) ceremony instead of some Old Gods one? I'm not even sure they discussed it, since Robb isn't a viewpoint character.
Considering that Robb is a northerner and Talisa isn't even from Westeros it struck me as odd, though I don't recall if maybe Robb was raised both religions since his Mother follows the New Gods being from the Riverlands.
I guess another explanation would be that they're so far south that there is no Old Gods wedding ceremony practitioners around.
This is extreme nitpicking. I don't actually care about these sort of deviations at all. Just something I noticed.
You can start with book 2. You CANNOT start with book 3 or it won't make any sense since book 2 was so different than TV season 2.
You could read book 1 if you want. It's about 95% similar and the changes won't confuse you in later books. They were minimal. I started with Book 1 after watching TV S1 and it was still nice to go through it again and get a proper grasp on all the characters.
