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[Schmendrick]

No, I was asking you to explain what different things I was throwing in "one bucket". PC didn't need consoles to utilize SSD in order to take advantage of SSD speeds. Load times increased on PCs with SSD regardless. The only optimization consoles brought to the table was removing the CPU bottleneck and IO compression. That's a bottleneck that still exists today on PC except for games that take advantage of Direct Storage, which are few.

This was about consoles holding the pc back because software is designed around console limitations as the lowest common denominator. All the limitations to game design Czerny mentioned in his road to ps5 talk were already gone for half a decade on pc at that point but we had to wait for the next console gen to catch up.
It simply didn't matter that pcs could already load stuff in seconds when games were designed around a minute or more level data buffering with very limited stream in possibilities f.e.

Honestly, the SSD was probably the most overhyped tech on consoles this gen.

I mean..it IS crucial for most modern features....

 

[lestar]

There is a reason nintendo went for the hibrid way. Sony just cannot support 2 platforms (3 is you count the PC ports)

 

[Topher]

No this was about consoles holding the pc back because software is designed around console limitations as the lowest common denominator. All the limitations Czerny mentioned in his road to ps5 talk were already gone for half a decade on pc at that point.

HDDs were still widely used in PCs when PS5 launched so it was the lowest common denominator across the board.

 

[Schmendrick]

HDDs were still widely used in PCs when PS5 launched so it was the lowest common denominator across the board.

Bullshit. We're not looking at office PCs here. The audience that was even remotely interested in new demanding games was already a few years on nvme at that point.

 

[Topher]

Bullshit. We're not looking at office PCs here. The audience that was even remotely interested in new demanding games was already a few years on nvme at that point.

Then the question is what was the adoption rate for PC gamers up to the start of this console generation. PC game devs typically throw a very wide net to meet the wide array of gamers out there on older systems. I don't know that if we have hard data either way that is specific to PC gaming. Steam doesn't include SSD usage in their hardware survey. So yeah....to your point, we can't look at general SSD usage as that would include those "office PCs" but I just don't think HDD was gone to the extent that game devs could just stop supporting them. When exactly that was is hard to tell.

 

[Ebrietas]

The percentage of PCs using the latest technology at any given time is minuscule. Not enough to support big budget game development around it.

The fantasy PCMR has of consoles dying and everyone playing on PC would result in devs having to account for an even lower common denominator since the typical gaming PC is garbage (and will likely remain that way given the absurd component prices). So no, consoles aren't "holding games back" any more than PC would on its own. They actually help raise the baseline standard when they sell well, as they currently do.

 

[ProtoByte]

And it works besides cases when memory configuration complicate things
I trust Cerny will do a better job

You're telling me that the Series S "works" in not holding shit back?

Cerny isn't going to bend the laws of physics. Weaker baseline = weaker games throughout the gen. His time and effort is better spent maximizing the PS6, not tinkering around with a little league portable.

 

[Felessan]

You're telling me that the Series S "works" in not holding shit back?

Cerny isn't going to bend the laws of physics. Weaker baseline = weaker games throughout the gen. His time and effort is better spent maximizing the PS6, not tinkering around with a little league portable.

It'll be okay if game run 400-700p30 upscaled in portable and like 2k on ps6
And it's quite straightforward cut as GPU scales linearly and you'll have adjust memory speed accordingly
CPU better be the same and memory size/storage speed depends whether "tools" (c) can alleviate difference

 

[asdasdasdbb]

You're telling me that the Series S "works" in not holding shit back?

Cerny isn't going to bend the laws of physics. Weaker baseline = weaker games throughout the gen. His time and effort is better spent maximizing the PS6, not tinkering around with a little league portable.

That ship has sailed.

 

[nial]

Thread '[Bloomberg] Sony Working on Handheld Console for PS5 Games to Rival Switch'

Nov 25, 2024

Sony Group Corp. is in the early stages of developing a portable console that would play its PlayStation 5 games on the move.

The product is aimed at expanding Sony's reach and contending with Nintendo Co. for the portable gaming market, according to people familiar with its development. It would also counter any potential mobile hardware from Xbox maker Microsoft Corp., which is working on prototypes in the category as well. Sony's portable device is likely years away from launch and the company could still decide against bringing it to market, the people said, asking not to be named...

• Topher
• Replies: 595
• Forum: Gaming Discussion

• 
• 
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because this was a topic last year

If Reddit can discuss another GAF leak, so can GAF.

 

[StereoVsn]

Yeah. It needs to be able to play PS5 and PS6 games without modification.

Don't see PS6 happening unless we are talking cross-gen which will be around for a few years anyways.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Don't see PS6 happening unless we are talking cross-gen which will be around for a few years anyways.

Your expectations are too high for the PS6, me thinks.

 

[StereoVsn]

Your expectations are too high for the PS6, me thinks.

My expectations are low for a mobile device that's going to be 15w max for under $700.

 

[manzo]

If it's a full 100% handheld on it's own, It's going to be pretty much Japan-only to go against the Switch 2. I don't see it having any kind of decent impact in the west, akin to PS Vita. Nintendo gets a free pass here as they don't have a high-end home console like Sony has, as Switch is their only product and handles both.

Knowing Sony that they'll fuck this up one way or another, this might give the Switch a true run for it money if the handheld would work something like this:

1) Have it's own games, not being tied for development for both systems (ala Series S and X). <- This could kill the 1st party software support and the system would probably go the way of Vita. Should this happen, we would be all-around be tied to the forever backwards compatible case, which personally I wouldn't mind, but technology-oriented people would go ballistics
2) Use the home system, PS6 (or maybe even PS5) as a dock giving extra power. Simple USB-C cable between the home console and give power in a lightweight dock, ala eGPU type setup. <- Would make the dock solution extremely expensive, but would help to save costs on the system not having to support 2 power profiles
3) For the previous point, either allow the home console to give the extra power or then just give a free license to the home console version, with save transfers between the systems. This point would be on game-basis, so not all games will support docking. <- This would suck but hey, it's Sony. Would bring a plethora of other issues from half-assed support per publisher as it would eat sales of the "other version" and gives out too much for free in the current price-gouging environment

This way you could have a VERY different power profile between docked and handheld. How Switch has been, I think for the system to have a running chance against Switch, it needs to have some sort of a dual-profile power system with a dock-type thing.

They would have to nail so many things right to have a snowball's chance in hell against the Switch... but still I'm happy that Nintendo would be challenged in the portable space as now they are back to their turbo-arrogant ways.

Edit: Things that Sony in my opinion fucked up hardcore with the Portal was not making it support the WiiU type direct connection. I could just lug only the PS5 somewhere, plug the power cord in and play using the Portal. No, it has to be in a WiFi network etc. Or skimp out on the screen, not making it HDR capable etc. But on Sony's defense, they didn't really seem to either believe in the Portal and just pushed it out thinking it'll be a niche device. But it seems to be moderately successful to Sony even attempt a new handheld device of some sorts.

 

[manzo]

The percentage of PCs using the latest technology at any given time is minuscule. Not enough to support big budget game development around it.

The fantasy PCMR has of consoles dying and everyone playing on PC would result in devs having to account for an even lower common denominator since the typical gaming PC is garbage (and will likely remain that way given the absurd component prices). So no, consoles aren't "holding games back" any more than PC would on its own. They actually help raise the baseline standard when they sell well, as they currently do.

This is an outright excellent point. The baseline would just change somewhere else, which would we what, school-level laptops or even those Chromebooks? There could be a possibility that the baseline would be even worse off and stifle the technology even further for all we know. At least the bar is raised ever 6-7 years now and also mandates changes on the PC side, like forced SSDs and memory configurations.

 

[nial]

Supported by K KeplerL2

The handheld is coming at the same time or slightly later than the PS6.

 

[ReasonBeing]

I don't see it. I would live to see a PS Handheld, but I don't see how this would be any different than a Series S situation, if they support the current (at the time) gen. Otherwise, you are only playing games of the past, and we have already have PC handhelds that play older PS PC ports.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I don't see it. I would live to see a PS Handheld, but I don't see how this would be any different than a Series S situation, if they support the current (at the time) gen. Otherwise, you are only playing games of the past, and we have already have PC handhelds that play older PS PC ports.

It'd only be an issue if it can't run PS5 (6) games without developer intervention.

 

[Gamerguy84]

I'm good with portal. The games don't cost any extra and it runs great.

The industry is to saturated. they'll lose on it unless they just want to pay someone to slap their name on an already complete system.

 

[midnightAI]

it is not a good thing, it holds games back, limits ambition, and we get nothing but the same old, all gen.. its terrible in every way except for more money for the publishers

Question: Does PlayStation Portal hold back PS5 development?

 

[nial]

I'm good with portal. The games don't cost any extra and it runs great.

The industry is to saturated. they'll lose on it unless they just want to pay someone to slap their name on an already complete system.

There is only one device on that market.

 

[Deerock71]

They will nail the design given their track record with devices like the Vita. It's ultimate success will depend heavily on dedicated software support though. Entirely different from the PS Portal's which is a remote play device.

You know...Monster Hunter was about the only game that made the PSP a decent success. If they don't shore up support before they jump into the handheld space again, it could get ugly. Vita means ugly.

 

[Danjin44]

My issue with that for my taste Sony no longer have studio to make interesting game for the system.

It has to heavily rely on 3rd party.

 

[ReasonBeing]

Question: Does PlayStation Portal hold back PS5 development?

No game has to run native on a PlayStation Portal. I believe that is the point of the user you are replying to. A handheld that runs PS6 games natively impacts game development.

Personally, I don't think Sony would go that route (handheld running PS6 games)

 

[midnightAI]

No game has to run native on a PlayStation Portal. I believe that is the point of the user you are replying to. A handheld that runs PS6 games natively impacts game development.

Personally, I don't think Sony would go that route (handheld running PS6 games)

And whats to stop Sony from releasing a handheld that can do native PS4 (PS5 maybe) and stream PS6? It wont be native PS6 games because it doesnt have to. It wont hold back development because it doesnt have to run them natively. The assumption this will run PS6 games is a bit silly if you ask me.

 

[ReasonBeing]

And whats to stop Sony from releasing a handheld that can do native PS4 (PS5 maybe) and stream PS6? It wont be native PS6 games because it doesnt have to. It wont hold back development because it doesnt have to run them natively. The assumption this will run PS6 games is a bit silly if you ask me.

Nothing is stopping them, but they would have to ask themselves what kind of market is there for such a device. They would have much success with enthusiast, but Sony has shown with the Vita, PSVR, and PSVR2, that they are not keen on supporting "niche" markets.

You have to keep in mind that such a device would be competing against PC handhelds that will be running PC ports of PS4/PS5 games, as well as the large Epic, Steam, MS catalogs. Maybe Sony takes a shot with it (I hope so for variety sake), but this handheld market will be very competitive in 2026.

I think they would do great by leveraging their brand behind a PC handheld, like Xbox in is doing. I think 8 out of 10 people walk into a store and see a PlayStation branded PC handheld next to a Xbox branded PC handheld, and are going to grab the PS one.

 

[Zacfoldor]

Bad idea. Stick to a streaming device fellas. Nobody is going to pay 1k for PS6 and then drop 700 bucks on this thing. Make a Portal 2 OLED and be done with it. It's a lot better than people think. You think you have Nintendo on their back foot but you are wrong wrong wrong. All this will do is create an unfathomable amount of extra work for every studio in existence except Nintendo. More likely is this somehow ends up helping Nintendo and hurting everything else(just like XSS).

Microsoft even knows this. They just waved their 1st party handheld off. Don't do this.

 

[jm89]

Bad idea. Stick to a streaming device fellas. Nobody is going to pay 1k for PS6 and then drop 700 bucks on this thing. Make a Portal 2 OLED and be done with it. It's a lot better than people think. You think you have Nintendo on their back foot but you are wrong wrong wrong.

I don't think they will be competing with nintendo.

That just wouldn't work for Sony, as they would need to go all in on the handheld.

This runored PS handheld might just be an option for those who want it, and it's sold at a profit.

 

[midnightAI]

Nothing is stopping them, but they would have to ask themselves what kind of market is there for such a device. They would have much success with enthusiast, but Sony has shown with the Vita, PSVR, and PSVR2, that they are not keen on supporting "niche" markets.

You have to keep in mind that such a device would be competing against PC handhelds that will be running PC ports of PS4/PS5 games, as well as the large Epic, Steam, MS catalogs. Maybe Sony takes a shot with it (I hope so for variety sake), but this handheld market will be very competitive in 2026.

I think they would do great by leveraging their brand behind a PC handheld, like Xbox in is doing. I think 8 out of 10 people walk into a store and see a PlayStation branded PC handheld next to a Xbox branded PC handheld, and are going to grab the PS one.

Well thats my point, they don't have to support it (with native games), just like they don't have to support Portal, in fact, one major thing that people wanted from Portal was PS4 support, supporting 1 gen behind natively while supporting current gen (and future gens) through streaming seems like the perfect solution. Portal should be able to stream PS6 games also, so they even have a very low cost solution (relatively) already for PS6 and beyond. These handheld PC's have pretty terrible battery life, they are big and quite heavy for a handheld, they aren't a very good full on the go solution, and that's fine, because most people use these things at home anyway.

 

[nial]

Bad idea. Stick to a streaming device fellas. Nobody is going to pay 1k for PS6 and then drop 700 bucks on this thing. Make a Portal 2 OLED and be done with it. It's a lot better than people think. You think you have Nintendo on their back foot but you are wrong wrong wrong. All this will do is create an unfathomable amount of extra work for every studio in existence except Nintendo. More likely is this somehow ends up helping Nintendo and hurting everything else(just like XSS).

Microsoft even knows this. They just waved their 1st party handheld off. Don't do this.

The home and handheld consoles are part of the same PS6 family of systems. You're not generally supposed to buy both at the same time.

 

[RoboFu]

What happens when the PS6 only a handheld?

 

[nial]

What happens when the PS6 only a handheld?

It's both a home console and a handheld console.

 

[RoboFu]

It's both a home console and a handheld console.

a homesole it is then!

 

[TrebleShot]

It's both a home console and a handheld console.

a homesole it is then!

At this point it would be disappointing for me if it wasn't done form off handheld that you dock like the switch that greets a major performance boost. Sort of like a sleek eGPU with usb 4 it should be possible.

Sadly I think it would mean a gpu and apu being developed along side a high end screen the console would be 1k easily.

 

[nial]

At this point it would be disappointing for me if it wasn't done form off handheld that you dock like the switch that greets a major performance boost. Sort of like a sleek eGPU with usb 4 it should be possible.

Sadly I think it would mean a gpu and apu being developed along side a high end screen the console would be 1k easily.

Yeah, doing that would just not be feasible for Sony.

 

[Jesb]

Sony is just way too late to the party with this.

 

[Ebrietas]

Sony is just way too late to the party with this.

Lol, what "party"?

 

[Jesb]

Double post.

 

[Jesb]

Lol, what "party"?

The one that when they arrived everybody left already.

 

[Coconutt]

Is the idea to make a handheld that will play ps6 games and under or will it be more like a psp/vita and have its own games?

 

[Astray]

Is the idea to make a handheld that will play ps6 games and under or will it be more like a psp/vita and have its own games?

Play ps4/ps5/ps6(?) I think.

The one that when they arrived everybody left already.

Except this market is still very viable and not at all a finished party.

 

[DonJimbo]

That's where I'll be playing Intergalactic: The Heretic Prophet.

What a shitty name for a game

 

[TGO]

The one that when they arrived everybody left already.

Nintendo does it and their fans celebrate it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

On topic, it's a waste of time and resources....Although everything Sony does these days are, it's not like they can produce less...

 

[Dorfdad]

Dont think it will be a full handheld. What I think would that it would be a more powerful Portal. Media player / Streaming Device / Online Cloud player but more improved. Or if they want to be Johnny Big Balls. An 8inch 1080p OLED / 120FPS with 4-6 hour battery life. 24 GB ram onboard shared OS and games, Nextgen AMD processor / gpu chip. And finally a DOCK that is the 8k/60 4k / 240hz capable. 799.99 sale price. nextgen Controller with Hall sticks and longer battery life.

Otherwise just let Nintendo keep dominating the space. Oh and PS please just release your cloud gaming for PS5 to PC and MACs please.

 

[Memati187]

What is it with these companies and handhelds. Xbox brand died, sony brand suffers from identity disorder and Nintendo is technically 1.5 generation behind with overpriced piece of shit. But at least nintendo does what it is known for, no matter how much I dislike switch 2, they stick to their brand.

 

[nial]

Nintendo does it and their fans celebrate it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

On topic, it's a waste of time and resources....

You'll surely explain that.

Although everything Sony does these days are, it's not like they can produce less...

Yeah, that's how they became a stronger publisher than ever, while arguably having the biggest announcement of the not-E3 week.

 

[SILKYSMOOTH30FPS]

After the 9th gen, i don't know what it would even take for me to be excited for the 10th gen. I am fine with a handheld when your main system is powerful and full of quality exclusives. But if we go by current gen, it's a ghost town, and nothing but shitty state of plays pop up every now and then. Sony's trust was erased, and i don't think they'll improve much unless they fuck off from Cali, and go back to Japan. When that's done, you send Hulst cleaning toilets, and give him a toilet brush that has a Horizon sticker on it, he'll love it.

 

[TGO]

You'll surely explain that.

PSvita, PSVR2...
It'll release and unlike the PS5 it won't have the 3rd Party support for long and then it will die because Sony and their strong publishing skills will release a handful of games and quit.

Yeah, that's how they became a stronger publisher than ever, while arguably having the biggest announcement of the not-E3 week.

Dude I love Playstation too, but I have to wash the fucking Playstation Hype Train every year to clear the dust off it and tell it "next year you'll ride again" ...and it pains me saying it because I don't believe it.
I want them to be better, and so should you.
And remind me, what was Playstations biggest announcement of a none E3 Week?
Nioh 3? or did I miss something?

 

[AGRacing]

Great idea. Launch 2 600 dollar consoles at the same time.

 

[Perrott]

And remind me, what was Playstations biggest announcement of a none E3 Week?
Nioh 3? or did I miss something?

Uhhh...