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[March Climber]

I don't understand this critique that Neil or Naughty Dog hated Joel as a character and decided to fuck him up for 2. After beating TLoU2 I liked him more than ever. The flashbacks throughout the game really fleshed out his character and that ending flashback scene was fantastic and heartbreaking.

I don’t think he hated Joel, like SlimySnake said, but I do think that far too many saw Joel as a ‘hero’ which is what Neil wanted to course correct narratively. And yes, he kind of failed at doing so and also kind of failed at having the player connect with Abby. Instead Joel became a Martyr for fans. Some will always say that this was planned but honestly I don’t think it was.

 

[Represent.]

Joel was and is not a hero. He is arguably the bad guy. In fact, he is straight up the bad guy.

If the show does anything different, I hope its making that fact a home run in the TV show.

 

[March Climber]

Joel was and is not a hero. He is arguably the bad guy. In fact, he is straight up the bad guy.

If the show does anything different, I hope its making that fact a home run in the TV show.

I hope they make him as morally gray as possible. So far that has been the case and I’ve been enjoying it.

 

[Interfectum]

Joel was and is not a hero. He is arguably the bad guy. In fact, he is straight up the bad guy.

If the show does anything different, I hope its making that fact a home run in the TV show.

He's neither bad nor good. He has his own motivations and goals in a new, shitty world for mankind.

 

[Represent.]

He's neither bad nor good. He has his own motivations and goals in a new, shitty world for mankind.

The man ruthlessly slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of people, including a few of the only qualified doctors left on the planet, made the decision to say fuck all of humanity, no cure for you, just to save his own non-daughter. He is selfish and careless and arguably evil. Abby had every right to cave his brains in.

 

[Interfectum]

The man ruthlessly slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of people, including a few of the only qualified doctors left on the planet, made the decision to say fuck all of humanity, no cure for you, just to save his own non-daughter. He is selfish and careless and arguably evil. Abby had every right to cave his brains in.

It's a little more gray than that. It was two people traveling across a dead United States. It's not as if they were looking for trouble more than it found them. Plus it's a video game so remove 99% of those kills for realism.

The killing of the doctors signifies the lingering PTSD Joel suffers from with the death of his daughter. It defines his character and motivations.

 

[Ulysses 31]

The man ruthlessly slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of people, including a few of the only qualified doctors left on the planet, made the decision to say fuck all of humanity, no cure for you, just to save his own non-daughter. He is selfish and careless and arguably evil. Abby had every right to cave his brains in.

Let's not go overboard here, we don't know how many people he ambushed while he was with the hunters. The Fireflies though heavily provoked him first which you seem to completely ignore here and they never gave Ellie a choice either.

 

[Mephisto40]

The man ruthlessly slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of people, including a few of the only qualified doctors left on the planet, made the decision to say fuck all of humanity, no cure for you, just to save his own non-daughter. He is selfish and careless and arguably evil. Abby had every right to cave his brains in.

I'm not sure I would have pity or compassion for anybody running after me with a knife or shotgun, which is basically the people Joel killed apart from the doctors

 

[SlimySnake]

Joel was and is not a hero. He is arguably the bad guy. In fact, he is straight up the bad guy.

If the show does anything different, I hope its making that fact a home run in the TV show.

But I liked that about Game Joel. He kills random gangsters for guns and ammo. He's a drug smuggler. He doesnt like or wants to get attached to Ellie. It takes him a good 5-6 hours to finally get along with Ellie.

Here, he's shown as a normal dude who gets PTSD and ends up killing someone after a flashback. His hands are shaking. He looks lost as if its his first kill and im like thats not my Joel. My Joel was a ruthless killer shooting people at point blank over some fucking guns.

I get why they are changing it. Mainstream audience wont connect with a guy who is killing people indiscriminately. But the fact that we did in the game speaks to the writing and his character arc in the game. I bet they are going to setup the torture scene in winter and the finale where he murders Marlene and the doctors as this big twist where he goes to the dark side. And TBH, i dont know if that is going to work. The game is perfect. Changing things, even little things like this is going to create logical inconsistencies. We saw this in Game of Thrones where they changed certain small things that ended up having a huge impact in the later seasons.

 

[saintjules]

Joel was and is not a hero. He is arguably the bad guy. In fact, he is straight up the bad guy.

Reminds me of the theory that Daniel LaRusso from Karate Kid 1 was the bad guy.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'm not sure I would have pity or compassion for anybody running after me with a knife or shotgun, which is basically the people Joel killed apart from the doctors

Nor would I have compassion for people who want to kidnap and manipulate a child into being murdered for a theoretical cure without all the proper logistics set up to run any sort of tests or models.

 

[Ulysses 31]

I'm not sure I would have pity or compassion for anybody running after me with a knife or shotgun, which is basically the people Joel killed apart from the doctors

I can imagine most people would feel hostility towards a group that:

• Knocks you out when clearly you're giving CPR to someone you care for
• Robs and kidnaps you while unconscious
• Separate you from the one you care for
• Threaten you with death after they tell you they're gonna murder the one you care for

 

[March Climber]

Here, he's shown as a normal dude who gets PTSD and ends up killing someone after a flashback. His hands are shaking. He looks lost as if its his first kill and im like thats not my Joel. My Joel was a ruthless killer shooting people at point blank over some fucking guns.

Context matters here. He had a clear history with that guy and they were on good terms. Suddenly one wrong moment turned them against each other and Joel started seeing red and killed him. That shook him up.

Also what you described would not make sense as to what happened earlier in the show, where Robert was extremely scared of Joel(because he was ready to kill them when Tess told him), Joel had an arsenal of weapons stashed away, and he had no issue dumping freshly dead bodies into fire for money.

Give the show some more time before making these judgment calls and saying “not my Joel”.

 

[SlimySnake]

I watched this again with the missus. She saw me play this game over 6 times almost 10 years ago, so she knows most of the story. She knew Sarah was going to die anyway and was like why waste so much time on her. Just like me, she preferred the game's opening. She was also bored in the middle and I was like yes, Boston was boring in the game too, but shouldnt they have made it more interesting considering they had 10 years to try and fix it? She liked Pedro as Joel but didnt care for Bella at all. I have asked some of my non gamer friends to watch it. They knew about it but werent planning on watching it.

I am quite frankly surprised by the overhwhelmingly positive reaction to the episode. I didnt care for the constant handheld camera and a very cheap looking feel to the boston scenes. The cinematography is great during the CG shots but most of the time it doesnt feel like a movie like most HBO shows do. For example, compare the cinematography in the PS3 cutscene where Sarah dies. There is moonlight giving the scene this really memorable lighting whereas the show is shot like it was shot in someone's backyard.

Then you have the acting which feels very CW'ey. Coming from House Of Dragon, Euphoria and Westworld, the acting here leaves a lot to be desired.

I dont like what they did to Tess either. She has a great first scene but then acts like shes never been in a gun fight covering her ears and then letting the Fedras capture her. Game Tess shows up and immediately has Joel come with her to bust a cap in some fools. She starts the very first gunfight in the game by shooting one of Robert's guys in the face. here she begs Joel not to hurt Robert.

The way Ellie tells them about her immunity is also very off and almost happens in the background while Joel struggles with having killed a man. Something he should be fucking used to by now.

Then you have the whole Tommy subplot. They are supposed to be estranged. it's why the confrontation between the two works so well in the game. Maybe they will pull it off in the show but i have no idea why they had to add the whole Joel must Rescue tommy subplot. In fact, Tommy says no to Joel pawning Ellie off to him precisely because they were estranged. Now im worried about that scene. the dynamic has changed. Joe; is now a nice caring older brother instead of an estranged guy who made his brother do fucked up shit to survive in the early days.

Neil is directing the next episode so it should be way better directed than the first, but if the cinematographer is the same then the look of the show is going to be an issue till the finale.

 

[Vick]

The man ruthlessly slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of people, including a few of the only qualified doctors left on the planet, made the decision to say fuck all of humanity, no cure for you, just to save his own non-daughter. He is selfish and careless and arguably evil.

Nah, just a single one pointing a scalpel to his face saying he won't let him pick his daughter.

The rest of the doctors were optionally killed by Neil Druckmann every single morning when he came to the office.
I wonder if it's because he really likes being a sadistic monster, or maybe that's just what every single parent in the world would do, as the man said verbatim multiple times.

But disingenuity is nothing new with Part II fanatics.

Abby had every right to cave his brains in.

And yet Joel didn't had any right to kill her father (which was only NPC #369 at the time) ready to crack open his daughter skull?

This is where you weirdos always fall and shamelessly show your incomprehensible nature, you are saying you failed to empathize with one of the best characters ever, motivated by real loss of the worst kind and avatar of the player for the entire first game, but at the same time you're super ready and eager to embrace a sadistic character, made to be a plain villan, who tortured and killed in front of his crying daughter the person who literally saved their lives minutes prior.

 

[Ulysses 31]

And yet Joel didn't had any right to kill her father (which was only NPC #369 at the time) ready to crack open his daughter skull?

It's also weird how they overlook that Jerry didn't feel it was necessary to have Joel informed about the operation and is fine with operating without informed consent. Doesn't matter how many Zebra's he saves, it still looks bad for him.

 

[ThatStupidLion]

aside from playing the game, I know nothing about the show going into it (other than the joel and ellie casting).

watched the first eps last night....

felt okay. maybe slightly on the better side of average? thankfully not terrible.

thought their casting was kinda rough. acting felt not great tbh.

was pretty drawn out, slow and boring. didnt love editing/pacing in some spots.

missed this music though

honestly it just makes me want to play the game again ( havent played 2 so maybe i should do that?)

I'll keep watching, hoping it gets better.

 

[MMaRsu]

I watched this again with the missus. She saw me play this game over 6 times almost 10 years ago, so she knows most of the story. She knew Sarah was going to die anyway and was like why waste so much time on her. Just like me, she preferred the game's opening. She was also bored in the middle and I was like yes, Boston was boring in the game too, but shouldnt they have made it more interesting considering they had 10 years to try and fix it? She liked Pedro as Joel but didnt care for Bella at all. I have asked some of my non gamer friends to watch it. They knew about it but werent planning on watching it.

I am quite frankly surprised by the overhwhelmingly positive reaction to the episode. I didnt care for the constant handheld camera and a very cheap looking feel to the boston scenes. The cinematography is great during the CG shots but most of the time it doesnt feel like a movie like most HBO shows do. For example, compare the cinematography in the PS3 cutscene where Sarah dies. There is moonlight giving the scene this really memorable lighting whereas the show is shot like it was shot in someone's backyard.

Then you have the acting which feels very CW'ey. Coming from House Of Dragon, Euphoria and Westworld, the acting here leaves a lot to be desired.

I dont like what they did to Tess either. She has a great first scene but then acts like shes never been in a gun fight covering her ears and then letting the Fedras capture her. Game Tess shows up and immediately has Joel come with her to bust a cap in some fools. She starts the very first gunfight in the game by shooting one of Robert's guys in the face. here she begs Joel not to hurt Robert.

The way Ellie tells them about her immunity is also very off and almost happens in the background while Joel struggles with having killed a man. Something he should be fucking used to by now.

Then you have the whole Tommy subplot. They are supposed to be estranged. it's why the confrontation between the two works so well in the game. Maybe they will pull it off in the show but i have no idea why they had to add the whole Joel must Rescue tommy subplot. In fact, Tommy says no to Joel pawning Ellie off to him precisely because they were estranged. Now im worried about that scene. the dynamic has changed. Joe; is now a nice caring older brother instead of an estranged guy who made his brother do fucked up shit to survive in the early days.

Neil is directing the next episode so it should be way better directed than the first, but if the cinematographer is the same then the look of the show is going to be an issue till the finale.

You've played the game over six times. Would have to say your a bit too invested to take seriously.

"Oh no the show isnt exactly like the game waah"

 

[Slothbeing1209]

 

[engstra]

Watched the first episode last night and it feels like a really promising start. As a fan of the games I thought all actor performances were really good and as some have already stated Tess really steals the show. I did think the episode has some pacing issues but some of the scenes were spectacular, the truck scene felt really intense. What I've heard from a few friends who don't have any relations to the game is that it was a bit boring and I think I would agree if I didn't know what will happen later. It felt like 80 minutes of exposition and getting things out of the way to set it up for real adventure. Feels like it's only going to get better though and can't wait to see more. I do think it would've maybe helped to reales say the first 3 episodes in a chunk to get newcomers properly invested.

I gotta say I'm disappointed to read in this thread that they're basically ditching the spores, and was something I reacted to in the show. The Chernobyl people were so good at making the invisible threat of radioactivity feel scary in the show and I was really looking forward to them doing the same with spores. Switching to tendril mouths make the infected just feel like standard zombies

 

[Chronicle]

I watched it with my wife. We both enjoyed it. It's definitely got a larger budget. I'm not a huge fan of the looks of Bella Ramsey but I'll give her credit - she seems to have the character down. Lool forward to more episodes.

 

[BadBurger]

Just to be clear here, my reason for disliking Part 2 is 99% due to how the story is told.

Other people’s reasoning for disliking part 2 is due to Abby, the people with her, and certain political/social ideologies.

We are not the same.

Forcing the player to empathize over time with someone who becomes an instant villain at the beginning simply doesn’t work from a narrative standpoint, especially when that character doesn’t have good enough charisma or narrative motivations beyond that intro scene to even remotely attempt to help you connect with them. And also because by the time you even remotely start to understand them, the story jumps you back into a character who hates them.

The Naruto-style constant flashback whiplash, mixed with constant character switching whiplash, and the Naruto-style ending of the game, all don’t work either. Some people call it a masterpiece, but if this were a shonen anime it would be seen as kind of lame but business as usual for a shonen anime(which isn’t necessarily a good thing as shonen anime all have bad parts of storytelling that anime fans have simply become used to and don’t ever question).

I will always be part of the camp who wanted this to be a 3 part series.

Part 1 with Joel and Ellie
Part 2 as Abby only, going on an adventure to hunt down her father’s killer
Part 3 as dual campaigns of the aftermath of part 2

If it had happened like this, they could have let you think that Joel and Ellie’s story is done when part 2 started. That way they have you grow along with Abby in part 2, give her more of a personality, let you empathize with her, and then, just like part 1, you see a twist happen near the end where it’s revealed to the viewer who killed her father and you as the player are torn about what she’s attempting to do.

Then part 3 would have dual selectable campaigns of the two protagonists, so that you can see how the story plays out for each and have time to empathize further with each character. You might even root for Abby to find her peace as much as you are rooting for Ellie to do the same, even though their versions of finding peace are completely at odds.

Great post. Mostly agree.

I liked TLoU 2, but also had problems with the core narrative. Druckmann wanted to basically use an anti-hero to kill an anti-hero - or even villain in his mind. The problem was that most people, IMO, never saw Joel as an anti-hero or villain, but merely a pragmatic guy who got dealt such bad cards in life he became kind of fatalist. And then we as an audience, through him, got to watch him grow and prove he was still that same great father we saw in the harrowing opening minutes of the first game.

It was jarring, it threw the tone off in weird ways, it made Abby instantly unlikable, and brought out the worst aspects of Ellie's character.

All of obvious intent by Druckmann, but I just wasn't feeling it. There's better ways to tell a tragedy IMO.

 

[Hawk269]

When do they release new episodes?

 

[saintjules]

 

[saintjules]

When do they release new episodes?

Every Sunday night at 9pm EST.

 

[Skifi28]

 

[DForce]

I really have to watch her reaction videos going forward. She goes over what the characters are most likely feeling/going through at the time.

 

[Fess]

Yeah this was great. Very promising. I just hate waiting for new episodes. Just put the whole season out there.

 

[ManaByte]

 

[DForce]

Possible season 2 casting.

Spoiler

 

[Roni]

The fact you felt the need to reply to that is astonishing.

I'm an astonishing kind of guy...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Yeah this was great. Very promising. I just hate waiting for new episodes. Just put the whole season out there.

I think if they put the whole season out there, especially with this probably having limited seasons, it would be a flash and a pop.

This show is going to be everything people are talking about for almost 3 months... and then we're going to go into Emmy award season and if this can win, people will be talking about this show for the rest of the year...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Great post. Mostly agree.

I liked TLoU 2, but also had problems with the core narrative. Druckmann wanted to basically use an anti-hero to kill an anti-hero - or even villain in his mind. The problem was that most people, IMO, never saw Joel as an anti-hero or villain, but merely a pragmatic guy who got dealt such bad cards in life he became kind of fatalist. And then we as an audience, through him, got to watch him grow and prove he was still that same great father we saw in the harrowing opening minutes of the first game.

It was jarring, it threw the tone off in weird ways, it made Abby instantly unlikable, and brought out the worst aspects of Ellie's character.

All of obvious intent by Druckmann, but I just wasn't feeling it. There's better ways to tell a tragedy IMO.

I wonder how people would feel if the game opened on her side of the story.

Imagine if you started the game with the ending of TLOU1 and then you immediately start in as Abby.

Ultimately, I think they misbalanced the game and I was someone who didn't forgive Abby at the end wanted to kill her. I thought the gameplay was great, the story was great, the balance and pacing was poor.

 

[Woggleman]

If Neil Druckman wins an Emmy for this he should walk out to Hate me Now by Nas. Yes I would be petty like that.

 

[ChiefDada]

also kind of failed at having the player connect with Abby.

Not with me he didn't. I will NEVER understand the hate for Abby from people who actually played the game. Between her, Joel, and Ellie, she was the one I felt for the most by far. She had every reason to hunt Joel down for killing her father and to add more evidence to her humanity, she made it clear that she was only out for Joel and passed on killing Ellie and Tommy. But like she said, "they wasted it".

 

[Woggleman]

I actually understood both sides which is amazing that ND was able to make me empathize with two opposing factions.

 

[Dorohedoro]

Possible season 2 casting.

Spoiler

That'd be a solid pick. She seems about the right height as well. The question is how much she'd be willing to bulk up. But I have a feeling they'll tone down this aspect of her character from the game which is unfortunate. Finding someone that can get as big while also being able to act worth a damn will be very difficult to cast.

 

[Slothbeing1209]

For fans who love the spores from the game, Mazin shrugged and said it’s not out of the question for them to be included in the show — just not this season. Should the series get renewed, which it very well might considering its sky-high success so far, spores may very well come back as another method of infection.

 

[Represent.]

For fans who love the spores from the game, Mazin shrugged and said it’s not out of the question for them to be included in the show — just not this season.

Which is exactly what I said would happen the second this no spores thing was announced, people just love to freak out lol

 

[March Climber]

Not with me he didn't. I will NEVER understand the hate for Abby from people who actually played the game. Between her, Joel, and Ellie, she was the one I felt for the most by far. She had every reason to hunt Joel down for killing her father and to add more evidence to her humanity, she made it clear that she was only out for Joel and passed on killing Ellie and Tommy. But like she said, "they wasted it".

For you that is true, but I'd argue that on average, the players did not connect as much with Abby as the creator wanted them to. And I'm talking about the actual majority of players and not the very passionate online fans who are constantly planting pro-Abby and against-Abby flags to one-up each other.

 

[Fess]

I think if they put the whole season out there, especially with this probably having limited seasons, it would be a flash and a pop.

This show is going to be everything people are talking about for almost 3 months... and then we're going to go into Emmy award season and if this can win, people will be talking about this show for the rest of the year...

The story is known so how much water cooler talks can it have? It’s not knowing what’ll happen that gets people talking and speculating. See was great, I had many great talk with coworkers on that one. But this seems extremely faithful to the game story besides some characters changes. I’m thinking gamers will talk about it, what they’ve done right and what they’ve changed, like here. The rest will probably google on it when hearing people talk and have the story spoiled from all the years of gamers talking.

Either way, for me personally it’s always annoying with one episode per week. I use TV shows for longer lazy evenings when I’m too lazy to do anything else. I’ll wait a couple weeks for more episodes.

 

[DForce]

I don't get the notion that Neil Duckmann "failed" to make Abby likable. If he wanted to make the character likable, then he wouldn't make her commit such a horrible act. He stated from the beginning that many people weren't going to be fans of the Last of Us Part II, and that's based on what he made her do. His intent was to make the game divisive, and you're not going to have a divisive game if everyone liked the character.

The character being liable is a matter of an opinion. The game being talked about almost 3 years later shows that what he intended to happen is actually working.. He made a divisive game that people are still debating about.

 

[Big Baller]

Possible season 2 casting.

Spoiler

Sees got the face alright. Titties too big tho.

 

[GymWolf]

I watched the opening scene with the tv show explaining how the fungus can fuck us up and i have to say, it was a masterfully directed and acted scene, hannah is one hell of an actor, it's gonna be hard for the rest of the episode to maintain this level.

Too bad it was only a small cameo for him.

 

[Vick]

Possible season 2 casting.

Spoiler

And there we go, the most perfect casting choice of course. Better looking than the game version obviously.

Can already see myself siding with her vs the TV show bootleg versions of Joel and especially Ellie.. checkmate Druckmann, you fucking milksop snollygoster.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Not with me he didn't. I will NEVER understand the hate for Abby from people who actually played the game. Between her, Joel, and Ellie, she was the one I felt for the most by far. She had every reason to hunt Joel down for killing her father and to add more evidence to her humanity, she made it clear that she was only out for Joel and passed on killing Ellie and Tommy. But like she said, "they wasted it".

I don't blame her for what she did, but I still hate her.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The story is known so how much water cooler talks can it have? It’s not knowing what’ll happen that gets people talking and speculating. See was great, I had many great talk with coworkers on that one. But this seems extremely faithful to the game story besides some characters changes. I’m thinking gamers will talk about it, what they’ve done right and what they’ve changed, like here. The rest will probably google on it when hearing people talk and have the story spoiled from all the years of gamers talking.

Either way, for me personally it’s always annoying with one episode per week. I use TV shows for longer lazy evenings when I’m too lazy to do anything else. I’ll wait a couple weeks for more episodes.

There are three types of people

Gamers who played the last of us/watched a playthrough
Gamers who didn't play the last of us/didnt watch a playthrough
people who aren't gamers

The third category is the biggest category here, though the 2nd is considerable as well.

This idea that "everyone knows" just isn't true. These games each sold about 10 million copies (original 7 million) remaster 10 (probably significant double dipping) TLOU2 10 million.


You have billions of people who didn't watch TLOU and don't know anything about it

These people especially will be talking about it, but guess what, so are people who played the game like us... it's taking neogaf by storm as well. You think we'd be talking about it in 3 months if it released all the episodes already?

Look at shows like Wednesday that we're cultural hits... you've already seen the hype die down.

 

[Ulysses 31]

Not with me he didn't. I will NEVER understand the hate for Abby from people who actually played the game. Between her, Joel, and Ellie, she was the one I felt for the most by far. She had every reason to hunt Joel down for killing her father and to add more evidence to her humanity, she made it clear that she was only out for Joel and passed on killing Ellie and Tommy. But like she said, "they wasted it".

Well, Joel saved her but she went on to brutally torture him anyway for who knows how long. If she had shown an ounce of gratitude and spared him the torture and just shot him in the head a couple times that would've been a lot better IMO. And killing someone's father figure in front of them while they're begging not to is not something I would expect them to let slide either, especially for someone like Abby who travelled cross states on vague info in a post apocalyptic so it's hypocritical of her to think no one would return the favor after they swore to kill you.

Oh yeah and Abby was willing to slit the throat of someone pregnant saying the pregnancy made that deed even better.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Not with me he didn't. I will NEVER understand the hate for Abby from people who actually played the game. Between her, Joel, and Ellie, she was the one I felt for the most by far. She had every reason to hunt Joel down for killing her father and to add more evidence to her humanity, she made it clear that she was only out for Joel and passed on killing Ellie and Tommy. But like she said, "they wasted it".

Ellie was a terrible person during TLOU 2. Abby was overall a good person, its just that her

Spoiler

revenge felt overdone. For the rest she never repeats an action like this. She repeatedly offers to bury the hatchet and doesn't actively seek to kill. She never wants to fight.

I think the scene

Spoiler

where she brutally kills Joel is done so that the player is supposed to hate her guts. But then playing as her slowly realizes she was actually rather peaceful. Also her friends, none of them wanted to continue the fight. They acted like ok characters otherwise. Ellie on the contrary was a terrible person and ND no doubt tried to shock the player into rooting for Abby despite what she had done to Joel.

All in all I think the revenge by Abby's gang was out of place considering the kind of characters they were.

.

 

[The ninja farmer]

I watched the opening scene with the tv show explaining how the fungus can fuck us up and i have to say, it was a masterfully directed and acted scene, hannah is one hell of an actor, it's gonna be hard for the rest of the episode to maintain this level.

Too bad it was only a small cameo for him.

It so worked as a cold opening

All that was missing was a lame joke from the host ‘About how you don’t get pandemics anymore’ to break the uneasy silence, cut to commercial