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[Mibu no ookami]

They showed how her all-consuming need for revenge, even despite her own better judgement, made her an awful leader. Nothing like her brother. And it was probably meant to foreshadow the inevitable dance between Ellie and Abby.

Exactly.

Although, it is worth mentioning that her brother hadn't accomplished the goals of the group either.

I think it goes to the theme of the ability to "endure and survive" these past 20 years, that most if not everyone who has survived isn't good anymore. They've had to sacrifice their humanity in order to survive.

Which I think will go to the end of season 1 as well in terms of whether humanity is worth saving still. Everyone basically sucks at this point, and even Henry sold someone (and by that extent everyone) out to take care of his own.

There's a different pandemic happening aside from the cordyceps, for which they might not be a cure at all...

 

[Roni]

This is the kind of bad writing that led to the mess that was TLoU2. Instead of focusing on realistic actions and reactions everything had to be a juxtaposition or parallel or foreshadowing. Kathleen is just a badly written character. First, she could easily have exacted revenge instead of dilly dallying about and looking around for 5 minutes while the truck sinks down. She could also have saved herself if she wanted instead of running after Ellie (I think that’s who she was going after) when the main threat were clearly the zombies. And Joel headshoting a dozen zombies while they are running at speed about - it works in the game, not in a TV show trying to be grounded.

So now the parallel is there and it's no longer looking too deep into it? Now it's just bad?

Make up your mind already.

 

[Kyo]

Kathleen is just a badly written character. First, she could easily have (blah blah blah)

People really don't understand what "badly written character" means. Someone making bad decisions does not mean they're badly written if the goal of the writer was to show someone making bad decisions. I can't believe I have to spell this out.

 

[Toons]

People really don't understand what "badly written character" means. Someone making bad decisions does not mean they're badly written if the goal of the writer was to show someone making bad decisions. I can't believe I have to spell this out.

Yep you see a lot of this even with protagonists characters. A chatacter making poor decisions is not bad writing if we are given reasons why that character may make poor decisions. Its bad writing actually, for every character to do the most logical and correct thing at every moment, especially 9f they are supposed to be a flawed character.

 

[Ulysses 31]

Yep you see a lot of this even with protagonists characters. A chatacter making poor decisions is not bad writing if we are given reasons why that character may make poor decisions. Its bad writing actually, for every character to do the most logical and correct thing at every moment, especially 9f they are supposed to be a flawed character.

I think it's the combination of the setting and what the characters do, if in a post apocalypse, where resources are scarce, a leader continues to makes selfish decisions that's only costing the group, it starts to stretch the verisimilitude of that world/story if such a leader remains in power for long.

 

[GooseMan69]

What was up with that weird slow mo shot of Perry when the bloater shows up? That was super weird. It reminds me of that one scene in The Sopranos when it does a slow mo shot of Carmella before doing a swipe transition. Really jarring and out of place.

 

[Kyo]

I think it's the combination of the setting and what the characters do, if in a post apocalypse, where resources are scarce, a leader continues to makes selfish decisions that's only costing the group, it starts to stretch the verisimilitude of that world/story if such a leader remains in power for long.

Sure, but if I am not mistaken, the show implies she's been in power only for days, a few weeks at best. And within that timeframe, her group has managed to overthrow Fedra, something her predecessor had failed (or not even tried) to accomplish. So it's hard to see why the people whom she had led to such a major success should already be turning on her because of a questionable decision or two.

 

[Represent.]

“The Bloater was a huge undertaking for our department, to create a practical character to interact with the cast and performers and provide as much reference as possible for the the vfx team to take further in post production. A happy marriage of practical and digital effects.”
- BarrieGower (Prosthetic Makeup Designer)

 

[sinnergy]

Really well done show . Love it.

 

[DeepEnigma]

A friend of mine who didn't really know this was from a video game messaged me the other day saying she was watching this new show called 'The Last of Us' on HBO and that she is hooked.

Gave her a brief rundown about it's history but no spoilers. She is not a gamer.

 

[BadBurger]

Sure, but if I am not mistaken, the show implies she's been in power only for days, a few weeks at best. And within that timeframe, her group has managed to overthrow Fedra, something her predecessor had failed (or not even tried) to accomplish. So it's hard to see why the people whom she had led to such a major success should already be turning on her because of a questionable decision or two.

It was the respect the people of KC had for him that sparked the rebellion. She was just there as his sister and a symbol of an unwavering demand for revenge that they could rally behind. The people would have likely overthrown FEDRA without her. But if she wasn't leader, they definitely would not have fallen in days.

Let's say Perry was in charge, her right hand man, who tried to point out to her that she had numerous priorities that came ahead of hunting Henry - and even quietly attempted to remind her that her brother told her to practice forgiveness - which she spat back in his face before he even had a chance to suggest it out loud. They wouldn't have fallen. In fact, everyone involved would have went on to a happy ending.

 

[Bragr]

It is still rock solid, but Ellie is the weird part for me, even with some of the odd Kathleen stuff and nonsensical plots.

Ellie in the game developed over a long time and had timely story parts, in the show, Ellie is non-stop cracking jokes and feels like an empty shell, Bella Ramsey is a stoneface and has virtually no expression of feelings, she's just there. They are desperate to make Ellie likable and I don't feel any connection between her and Joel at all, and the weird forced jolly attitude of Ellie takes me out of the desperate situation they are in.

The sets are insane though, it looks so good, massive, and full of life, and I am surprised at how much from the game is in the show. It's really cool. But holy shit this is gonna get campy when Joel dies. This is gonna be like Stranger Things.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

What was up with that weird slow mo shot of Perry when the bloater shows up? That was super weird. It reminds me of that one scene in The Sopranos when it does a slow mo shot of Carmella before doing a swipe transition. Really jarring and out of place.

I know what you mean. They did it 90s style, where they didn't increase the framerate to compensate for stretching out the footage, so it's stuttery looking.

I think they did it that way because it'd be hard to notice it was in slow motion otherwise, due to how dark it was. It's like they wanted to draw attention to it.

 

[Kyo]

It was the respect the people of KC had for him that sparked the rebellion. She was just there as his sister and a symbol of an unwavering demand for revenge that they could rally behind. (...)

So you're saying they followed her for bad reasons and would've been better off with someone else? Well, yes. It's basically the core idea behind the character and right here it looks like that came across just fine.

And that doesn't strike me as a sign of bad writing. Rather the opposite, really.

 

[DForce]

People really don't understand what "badly written character" means. Someone making bad decisions does not mean they're badly written if the goal of the writer was to show someone making bad decisions. I can't believe I have to spell this out.

A lot of "writing experts" surfaced within the past 2 years. They can barely comprehend what's going on in the story and they're always complaining about something that doesn't make any sense.

 

[BadBurger]

And that doesn't strike me as a sign of bad writing.

Good, because Mazin wrote her masterfully.

 

[Moses85]

Episode 5 was so damn good.

Delaying the bloater til now was a good decision. Hopefully we see another one later on the show.


Interesting how they're actually showing the jackson town. nailed the look, it's exactly as it was in tlou2.
Though looks like they've dropped the whole seasonal thing in the show. Makes sense, cause it feels like it's only been a week since they left boston lol.

This detail when he tore the jaw in two.

 

[Randall365]

I'm liking the show but tbh I prefer the acting in the game much more, the characters have better emotion and lines delivery. I think people who haven't played the game will enjoy the show much better than us.

Spot on. I never thought I would say it, but the animation and voice acting in the first game trumps the actors' performances in this. The problem is that they are so good in the game, these two are poor imitations. If you haven't played the game, then this would not be an issue (although my wife isn't keen on the chinny one playing Ellie).

The sets and design are clearly fantastic.

 

[Woggleman]

The first two episodes I was not sure about Ellie but she won me over.

Pedro Pascal is killing it as Joel if you ask me. I recently replayed some encounters in TLOU1 and it actually felt weird seeing Joel look like that.

 

[Shakka43]

Pedro Pascal is killing it as Joel if you ask me. I recently replayed some encounters in TLOU1 and it actually felt weird seeing Joel look like that.

 

[Ulysses 31]

The first two episodes I was not sure about Ellie but she won me over.

Pedro Pascal is killing it as Joel if you ask me. I recently replayed some encounters in TLOU1 and it actually felt weird seeing Joel look like that.

 

[Mr Moose]

I'm a bit bored with it, there's not enough action going on. We're 5 episodes in and there's barely any action, probably 5 minutes in a total of 5+ hours.
Joel is great, as is Ellie but damn it's boring. Flesh out the story all you want but add action, Jesus.

 

[DeepEnigma]

The first two episodes I was not sure about Ellie but she won me over.

Pedro Pascal is killing it as Joel if you ask me. I recently replayed some encounters in TLOU1 and it actually felt weird seeing Joel look like that.

Thanks for sharing, Pedro.

 

[FunkMiller]

The first two episodes I was not sure about Ellie but she won me over.

Pedro Pascal is killing it as Joel if you ask me. I recently replayed some encounters in TLOU1 and it actually felt weird seeing Joel look like that.

 

[Woggleman]

Joel in the game is and always will be the definitive Joel but Pedro did such a good job of playing him that I thought of him as Joel for the past few weeks. That is all I am saying.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I'm a bit bored with it, there's not enough action going on. We're 5 episodes in and there's barely any action, probably 5 minutes in a total of 5+ hours.
Joel is great, as is Ellie but damn it's boring. Flesh out the story all you want but add action, Jesus.

pew pew pew

 

[Mr Moose]

pew pew pew

Hey, don't spoil episode 6.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Joel in the game is and always will be the definitive Joel but Pedro did such a good job of playing him that I thought of him as Joel for the past few weeks. That is all I am saying.

I was only being cheeky. I agree as well with that.

 

[Clear]

Its interesting how scoped down this very expensive show is compared to the game. Ep's 4-5 basically cover the entire "summer" section, but its striking how pared-back it all is; basically taking 3 large fully-realized areas and crunching them down to a couple of set-pieces and a handful of connective interiors.

I'm not pointing this out to criticize, but to stress the immense amount of work the games represent even compared to a TV show with a $100m production budget.

 

[TIGERCOOL]

It was ok. last action sequence was unengaging despite all the bombast. Disappointed with all the tropes and it had that unfortunate plot armour feeling that you want to avoid when you've been grounding the rest of the shows action in realism. It was too much. Mostly on the script, but the director failed to salvage it.

Some other unearned moments like the scene with Kathleen in her childhood bedroom. We didn't need that. We got all the context from Henry's story in the daycare. Also didn't believe Joel trusting or feeling like he needed Henry. Not enough meat on that bone.

Still, Pedro's best overall acting performance as Joel. Henry's actor gets a passing grade. Mostly just passing but he did well in the scene that mattered most. The younger brother was good, and I'll always support using any means necessary to avoid having child actors deliver meaningful lines.

 

[Fess]

It is still rock solid, but Ellie is the weird part for me, even with some of the odd Kathleen stuff and nonsensical plots.

Ellie in the game developed over a long time and had timely story parts, in the show, Ellie is non-stop cracking jokes and feels like an empty shell, Bella Ramsey is a stoneface and has virtually no expression of feelings, she's just there. They are desperate to make Ellie likable and I don't feel any connection between her and Joel at all, and the weird forced jolly attitude of Ellie takes me out of the desperate situation they are in.

The sets are insane though, it looks so good, massive, and full of life, and I am surprised at how much from the game is in the show. It's really cool. But holy shit this is gonna get campy when Joel dies. This is gonna be like Stranger Things.

Agree on everything. Ellie is literally the weakest part of the show at this point, everybody else show some emotions but Bella is just blank. Everything else is top notch though, absolutely loved last episode with Henry and Sam 10/10
And I’m so gonna hate on Druckmann once the golf club appears, if they go that far, worst idea ever for an amazing character and story.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

Agree on everything. Ellie is literally the weakest part of the show at this point, everybody else show some emotions but Bella is just blank. Everything else is top notch though, absolutely loved episode 4. 10/10
And I’m so gonna hate on Druckmann once the golf club appears, if they go that far, worst idea ever for an amazing character and story.

The Golf Club Incident was an intentional trauma inflicted by Druckman on the audience. It hurt and made me miss Joel in TLOUII. Therefore I'd call it effective. But also effective is training a dog not to get in the trash by violently beating a stuffed animal in front of it. Are the ends worth the means?

I think when people get heated about TLOUII they're arguing whether that amount of trauma was justified and worth what was given up (more adventures with Joel). And everyone has their own line in the sand on that point.

 

[SlimySnake]

Agree on everything. Ellie is literally the weakest part of the show at this point, everybody else show some emotions but Bella is just blank. Everything else is top notch though, absolutely loved last episode with Henry and Sam 10/10
And I’m so gonna hate on Druckmann once the golf club appears, if they go that far, worst idea ever for an amazing character and story.

I hope they are slightly changing the Pedro characterization because they want to retcon the sequel's opening and let Joel live. The second game is like MGS2 in that its main theme is meta... I.e, Can YOU the PLAYER forgive Abby for killing your favorite protagonist. The character switch and the Santa Barbara prologue fight are basically designed solely to put the player through the emotions. No idea how they can adapt that for tv where the audience is passive. Just kill that storyline and do something different.

That said, Im fully expecting Abby and her Dad to be revealed in the finale's intro like Sam and Henry were in the last episode. They pretty much have to do this to set up the next season.

 

[Fess]

The Golf Club Incident was an intentional trauma inflicted by Druckman on the audience. It hurt and made me miss Joel in TLOUII. Therefore I'd call it effective. But also effective is training a dog not to get in the trash by violently beating a stuffed animal in front of it. Are the ends worth the means?

I think when people get heated about TLOUII they're arguing whether that amount of trauma was justified and worth what was given up (more adventures with Joel). And everyone has their own line in the sand on that point.

I absolutely loved part 1 and haven’t played Part 2 yet and know lots of people that skipped it as well so I’d say it was a terrible idea. I have it on the shelf now though, found it cheap on Black Friday, if I play it I’ll do it for the gameplay, the story turned to poop as far as I’m concerned. The game got new fans though and lots of talk and a TV Show now as well, but I can’t see how they could keep me interested if they fast forward into that scenario for season 2.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

I absolutely loved part 1 and haven’t played Part 2 yet and know lots of people that skipped it as well so I’d say it was a terrible idea. I have it on the shelf now though, found it cheap on Black Friday, if I play it I’ll do it for the gameplay, the story turned to poop as far as I’m concerned. The game got new fans though and lots of talk and a TV Show now as well, but I can’t see how they could keep me interested if they fast forward into that scenario for season 2.

It's not what I wanted, either, but, man, TLOUII still made me feel things (i.e. cry multiple times at the end cuz I'm a biiiiiitch), and the gameplay is second-to-none. You should give it a shot!

Whatever the show ends up doing I'm sure will be entertaining. Either to watch people's reactions to Golf Club or to see how they change it up

 

[SlimySnake]

We got all the context from Henry's story in the daycare. Also didn't believe Joel trusting or feeling like he needed Henry. Not enough meat on that bone.

The funny thing is that in the game Joel doesnt trust Henry. Henry ditching him when the Fedra arrive in the game makes Joel even more pissed. He punches Henry even after Henry saves him from drowning. it's not until the very last scene do they start to connect over their shared love of bikes. Not kids or responsibility or whatever.

Whats here isnt bad. Just absolutely needless. The game did everything better so why change anything? Henry didnt need a lukemia story. Hes just a dude who loves his brother. We dont need anymore backstory than that for the tragic ending. We liked the characters in the game because they were memorable and fun to be around. The show skipped a lot of really cool setpieces in favor of one big finale and i dont think its as good as what we couldve gotten had they been introduced early in episode 4.

 

[Fess]

It's not what I wanted, either, but, man, TLOUII still made me feel things (i.e. cry multiple times at the end cuz I'm a biiiiiitch), and the gameplay is second-to-none. You should give it a shot!

Whatever the show ends up doing I'm sure will be entertaining. Either to watch people's reactions to Golf Club or to see how they change it up

I’m a Joel Edition gamer, I have zero interest in an Ellie revenge and love story, it’s like seeing a Superman movie with only Lois Lane, the main character isn’t there.
But I’ll give it a spin some day just to try out the gameplay, got it for $4, I guess it’s worth that at least.

 

[Roni]

I’m a Joel Edition gamer, I have zero interest in an Ellie revenge and love story, it’s like seeing a Superman movie with only Lois Lane, the main character isn’t there.
But I’ll give it a spin some day just to try out the gameplay, got it for $4, I guess it’s worth that at least.

The creators of the game have been clear Part I was as much about Ellie as Part II. Joel was like a supporting character to Ellie's journey throughout America and the hook to align Ellie and the players in a path for revenge.

 

[DForce]

The funny thing is that in the game Joel doesnt trust Henry. Henry ditching him when the Fedra arrive in the game makes Joel even more pissed. He punches Henry even after Henry saves him from drowning. it's not until the very last scene do they start to connect over their shared love of bikes. Not kids or responsibility or whatever.

Whats here isnt bad. Just absolutely needless. The game did everything better so why change anything? Henry didnt need a lukemia story. Hes just a dude who loves his brother. We dont need anymore backstory than that for the tragic ending. We liked the characters in the game because they were memorable and fun to be around. The show skipped a lot of really cool setpieces in favor of one big finale and i dont think its as good as what we couldve gotten had they been introduced early in episode 4.

It's never needless if you have an opportunity to give a character a backstory that doesn't sacrifice the character's story. The point of a backstory is to give the audience a reason to care about the character on screen. Henry and Sam's leukemia story made their story more relatable to Joel's as there willing to do anything to protect their own, even if it is seen as a bad decision by some people. The series is filled with people that cross the line between good and bad.

 

[Fess]

The creators of the game have been clear Part I was as much about Ellie as Part II. Joel was like a supporting character to Ellie's journey.

Nah, then it was badly written. It was a story about a father who lost his daughter and the slowly growing bonds between him and a girl he agreed to protect and deliver that could potentially save the human race. If it was equally a story about Ellie then it would’ve been as much playtime with Ellie and the story would’ve been told from her perspective, but it wasn’t. Left Behind was Ellie’s story though, I think it was made to help people care more about her so she could become a main character, but that wasn’t in the original story.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

I’m a Joel Edition gamer, I have zero interest in an Ellie revenge and love story, it’s like seeing a Superman movie with only Lois Lane, the main character isn’t there.
But I’ll give it a spin some day just to try out the gameplay, got it for $4, I guess it’s worth that at least.

I went in expecting to hate it, as I'd seen the leaks. Turns out they still told a decent story. Easily worth $4 and your time if you like video games.

Ah, I'm pestering you to play it at this point. I'll leave you alone now

 

[Roni]

Nah, then it was badly written. It was a story about a father who lost his daughter and the slowly growing bonds between him and a girl he agreed to protect and deliver that could potentially save the human race. If it was equally a story about Ellie then it would’ve been as much playtime with Ellie and the story would’ve been told from her perspective, but it wasn’t. Left Behind was Ellie’s story though, I think it was made to help people care more about her so she could become a main character, but that wasn’t in the original story.

Ok, guess you know more than the creators then.

 

[Stooky]

The funny thing is that in the game Joel doesnt trust Henry. Henry ditching him when the Fedra arrive in the game makes Joel even more pissed. He punches Henry even after Henry saves him from drowning. it's not until the very last scene do they start to connect over their shared love of bikes. Not kids or responsibility or whatever.

Whats here isnt bad. Just absolutely needless. The game did everything better so why change anything? Henry didnt need a lukemia story. Hes just a dude who loves his brother. We dont need anymore backstory than that for the tragic ending. We liked the characters in the game because they were memorable and fun to be around. The show skipped a lot of really cool setpieces in favor of one big finale and i dont think its as good as what we couldve gotten had they been introduced early in episode 4.

Not enough time to establish this in one episode. You’re suggesting fitting hours of gameplay in one hour. Not enough enough time to build those relationships. It wouldn’t work. They made the right decision.

 

[Stooky]

Spot on. I never thought I would say it, but the animation and voice acting in the first game trumps the actors' performances in this. The problem is that they are so good in the game, these two are poor imitations. If you haven't played the game, then this would not be an issue (although my wife isn't keen on the chinny one playing Ellie).

The sets and design are clearly fantastic.

The Mocap and dialogue takes for the game were edited down to the very best takes with 3 or for takes in one shot, then handed to an animator to perfect the motion. Live action is based on the shot, no edits in the middle of the shot/take, it’s just not the same. Comparing the too is a waste of time.

 

[SlimySnake]

Not enough time to establish this in one episode. You’re suggesting fitting hours of gameplay in one hour. Not enough enough time to build those relationships. It wouldn’t work. They made the right decision.

Nope. Read it again. I’m saying they shouldve been introduced an episode earlier.

 

[Woggleman]

I think the golf club scene will be better received by a TV audience. My coworker asked me to tell her the plot of PT2 and potentially spoil season 2 and she said it sounds very interesting. Gamers are a different breed sometimes when it comes to outrage.

 

[TIGERCOOL]

I think the golf club scene will be better received by a TV audience. My coworker asked me to tell her the plot of PT2 and potentially spoil season 2 and she said it sounds very interesting. Gamers are a different breed sometimes when it comes to outrage.

TV audiences saw the equivalent of the golf club scene like twice per season in Game of Thrones

 

[Represent.]

I think the golf club scene will be better received by a TV audience. My coworker asked me to tell her the plot of PT2 and potentially spoil season 2 and she said it sounds very interesting. Gamers are a different breed sometimes when it comes to outrage.

Indeed. TV audiences arent little bitches.

No one was sending death threats and boycotting TWD after the bat to Glenns skull

 

[Raonak]

TLOU2's opening will be equivalent to Red Wedding.

The real question will be whether audiences will forgive abby or not...

 

[Represent.]

TLOU2's opening will be equivalent to Red Wedding.

The real question will be whether audiences will forgive abby or not...

They forgave Negan.

Frieza and Goku teamed up.

Abby will be fine