Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Shaman... first tuskar gets totem golem... second totem is mana tide totem... draws him only 4-5 cards... rag can't even remove his 1 real threat... nice rng there...
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T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Mukla and pagle still wont show up in your mulligan.
And it really is rare to have most of the 5 legendaries be low cost. Low quality, sure, but not low cost.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Malchezaar's Imp does seem like a substantial buff to Zoolock.
Even if you don't run any, you can still dark peddler if the situation works for it.
Even if you don't run any, you can still dark peddler if the situation works for it.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
It's dumb... because why does zoo need buffs? It's like they never want the deck to leave the meta ever...
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
What snowflake deck is he playing?
35 Legendary deck.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Damn, Blizzard shouldn't let people bully. I mean, rank 24s need to be protected. Save the kripps.
even Amaz is going ham on Blizzard, is there anyone that's not complaining these days. things are bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1532gfXzD8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1532gfXzD8
I feel like the complaint about Fandral + Innervate + PotW is a completely separate issue from "accidental victories" caused by RNG cards.
The Fandral issue is almost entirely related to how powerful Innervate is as a card (you can do similar stuff with Violet Teacher, Innervate, PotW). The other cards are massive swing RNG cards that dictate the game and cannot really be played around, which leads to feelings of being robbed.
The main thing to take away is that whenever RNG is in play... one player feels good and the other player feels very bad. This extends far beyond just competitive play, it's relevant at the lowest levels of the game even.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
The RNG really has gotten... out of hand. Even the new rogue cards, stealing random cards from an entire class... is just much wider than thoughtsteal. It's one thing to have to play around your own cards, another if you have to play around an entire classes' cards. For example, tonight I finally stabilized against some aggro rogue with ancient of lore. Then he gets mulch and I die.
Rag was always problematic in this regard. I still had several matches tonight decided by the RNG on him.
At least one game decided by tuskar totemic summoning the golem and then the next one got a mana tide totem.
Let alone yogg... barnes... brawl... definitely had a game determined by a 50/50 brawl...
edit:
oh yeah... good old animal companion... seriously fuck that card... dunno how many losses I've had just because of a turn 3 huffer.
He's right about Tuskarr Totemic, but it's not going to get changed before it rotates. Flamewaker is fucked too, but a lot of my annoyances with cards like that come from the coin counting as a spell.
The rest of them are a bit swing and miss. Don't agree so much with Animal Companion and Fandral is only problematic because Innervate lets you cheat. Without it a combo is pretty reasonable, and it's a Legendary so it'll happen less in general.
Look at Ben Brode's top five cards and Karazhan, it's obvious that RNG cards are something they like and I have no expectations for it to change.
Tuskarr is the fucking worst of all.. With Shaman early gamè is made you hectiç with high priority kill this card made situation completely unrecoverable.
I rather see barnes pull out ysharj and not even mad but tusķarr made my blood bòil
Fanďral complaint ìs just weird tho
I rather see barnes pull out ysharj and not even mad but tusķarr made my blood bòil
Fanďral complaint ìs just weird tho
That's actually a decent rant. I actually agree what he said regarding the RNG and poor design of the most popular cards in this meta. All those cards make the other player's blood boil. If anyone wants to build a winning deck, he/she needs to include Tuskarr Totemic, Animal Companion (+ Call of the Wild), Flamewaker, or Fandral. Yogg is the cherry on top of what's blatantly wrong unless Blizzard decides later to add spells that are not directly playable by any hero and hurt the owner. Add something like Darkstrike, a flamestrike that kills Yogg's board.
The only thing that makes Fandral a little bit less OP is that it's a legendary, so you only see that minion on the board once in the game unless your opponent teched a panda in there for some bizarre reason. The chances of having a three card combo are usually low, too.
The only thing that makes Fandral a little bit less OP is that it's a legendary, so you only see that minion on the board once in the game unless your opponent teched a panda in there for some bizarre reason. The chances of having a three card combo are usually low, too.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Some RNG cards are okay, but they've definitely gone in a direction where it's become worse and worse.
Also, I think I understand why he thinks fandral is a problem. And I personally feel the same. His text is just incredibly powerful for a 4 drop and because it exists in a class with innervate it really is too much imo. And he is saying that if you don't remove this 4 drop after a single turn, the druid has probably won the game. It's pretty disgusting but true. 4 drops determining the entire game on turn 4 is incredibly problematic. Darkshire councilman is a 3 drop that if you can't deal with... probably wins the game.
Also, I think I understand why he thinks fandral is a problem. And I personally feel the same. His text is just incredibly powerful for a 4 drop and because it exists in a class with innervate it really is too much imo. And he is saying that if you don't remove this 4 drop after a single turn, the druid has probably won the game. It's pretty disgusting but true. 4 drops determining the entire game on turn 4 is incredibly problematic. Darkshire councilman is a 3 drop that if you can't deal with... probably wins the game.
Sure those cards are strong but that's a separate issue.
4 mana 7/7 can win your game outright if it sticks and hits face once but that's a completely separate issue from Tuskar Totemic. That is more getting into balance territory than RNG complaints.
In other news been trying out Dragon Paladin and it feels really nice now. Maybe a bit too "fair" though but it feels complete with that new 2 and 6 drop. Very high chance to get Dragon's Consort from the discover.
4 mana 7/7 can win your game outright if it sticks and hits face once but that's a completely separate issue from Tuskar Totemic. That is more getting into balance territory than RNG complaints.
In other news been trying out Dragon Paladin and it feels really nice now. Maybe a bit too "fair" though but it feels complete with that new 2 and 6 drop. Very high chance to get Dragon's Consort from the discover.
Yeah, I tend to agree with some of his points, even as somebody who loves the concept of Yogg Saron as a card but has been convinced he's out of hand.
The thing is, RNG can be both a positive and a negative impact on games and a measure of players skill if implemented well. Turkar Totemic and Yogg are examples of it being bad. Discover minions like Ivory Knight are examples of it being good, part of the skill in the game is being able to pick cards (even if there are lackluster choices) that can give you an advantage.
Every class has cards that give you early advantage (except priest...). I think that should remain in the game. But cards that compound that advantage too much aren't good for the game as a whole, especially if that element is random.
Shaman should not, for example, have storm that does 2-3 damage. It should do 2, and cost 3, or 3 and cost 4. In that way I think malestrom portal is more fair for shaman, since even though it has a random element, it's a lot less punishing of an effect if it whiffs. And it it doesn't, then the worst you have to deal with is a 2/4, and that usually isn't the end of the world in a game where most 3 drops are 3/2.
The thing is, RNG can be both a positive and a negative impact on games and a measure of players skill if implemented well. Turkar Totemic and Yogg are examples of it being bad. Discover minions like Ivory Knight are examples of it being good, part of the skill in the game is being able to pick cards (even if there are lackluster choices) that can give you an advantage.
Every class has cards that give you early advantage (except priest...). I think that should remain in the game. But cards that compound that advantage too much aren't good for the game as a whole, especially if that element is random.
Shaman should not, for example, have storm that does 2-3 damage. It should do 2, and cost 3, or 3 and cost 4. In that way I think malestrom portal is more fair for shaman, since even though it has a random element, it's a lot less punishing of an effect if it whiffs. And it it doesn't, then the worst you have to deal with is a 2/4, and that usually isn't the end of the world in a game where most 3 drops are 3/2.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I tend to play decks that simply don't have much if any RNG in them. Oil rogue is probably my favorite deck of all time, preserved only in memory, and it doesn't have a SINGLE rng card in the list (I 95% of the time did not even run dr. boom). Okay, I guess sword oil technically has RNG, but it is not even close to the same level of some of the bad ones like animal companion. You always get the attack buff, you just don't know which minion gets it. The variance is just not the same.
Now... even my malygos rogue has BARNES. I'm sure if I played Miracle rogue I would run him too, because he is too good to pass up. And he is interesting.
Blizzard hath ruined me.
Now... even my malygos rogue has BARNES. I'm sure if I played Miracle rogue I would run him too, because he is too good to pass up. And he is interesting.
Blizzard hath ruined me.
I appreciate randomness for what it is, but it can ruin the competitiveness in some games. For example, I do think that rogues having a class identity of using somebody's own cards against them is fun, and could potentially be good design. But, it has to be implemented well.
Speaking of which, burgle rogue is doing work tonight. It's pretty satisfying to turn around and use somebody's own minions and spells against them. Works best, admittedly, when those spells tend to be things like "do 5 damage" or "Give a minion +2/+2" though.
not trying to break up the salt fest that's going down but I'm actually doing good with my Control Shaman now. It's a lot of fun and finally got my win rate with this deck up from 47% to 63%. just took a crapton of practice and patience. Starting to love these long, drawn out matches that go past 5 mins (at least when I'm in Control lol)
Practiced a bit in Wild and climbed back to 20 (well i was way above that rank alst season but whatevs good enough for one night) and went right back to standard
Practiced a bit in Wild and climbed back to 20 (well i was way above that rank alst season but whatevs good enough for one night) and went right back to standard
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lol. The one red is Dragon Warrior. Oh, and Aggro Shaman is almost at a 55% win rate.
http://www.vicioussyndicate.com/vs-data-reaper-report-16/
I wanted to try out more Rogue (Barnes + Questing is really strong), Dragon Priest/Paladin, and Reno Mage but I just don't want to deal with Aggro Shaman with any of those decks.
There's a ton of different Dragon Paladin builds out there. StrifeCro's deck looks interesting. Brann + Netherspite Historian is the cheapest combo at only 5 mana and happens to be one of the better targets? So good.
Looks like a solid deck. I need to test it out later today.
Dragon Warrior would never have been that popular if it weren't for the fact that it had the best match up against Aggro Shaman. The entire deck was created mainly to counter Shamans.
Zoolock used to have good match up against Aggro Shaman but a lot of pro players have started to believe that it's in favor of Aggro Shaman if they have Maelstroms.
I actually don't remember any deck in the history of HS having that skewered of a match up chart. Usually top decks have like 2-3 bad match ups at the minimum.
This is where Blizzard usually comes in after a month and nerfs something. Their MO usually is that if a deck is still the best after two expansion releases then it means that the answers were not provided to the deck and the meta did not self correct. It's why they took so long to nerf the Patron deck.
Zoolock used to have good match up against Aggro Shaman but a lot of pro players have started to believe that it's in favor of Aggro Shaman if they have Maelstroms.
I actually don't remember any deck in the history of HS having that skewered of a match up chart. Usually top decks have like 2-3 bad match ups at the minimum.
This is where Blizzard usually comes in after a month and nerfs something. Their MO usually is that if a deck is still the best after two expansion releases then it means that the answers were not provided to the deck and the meta did not self correct. It's why they took so long to nerf the Patron deck.
There are match-ups and opening hands where the only way to win is to coin out a totem. Won me a lot of games doing that even before WotOG.
I used it to facilitate trades using flametongue, abusive, or just so I will have something to buff Draenai Totem Shaman/Thing From Below
Mage can do all 3 just fine.
You know what Malygos is very underrated in this meta, by that I mean not just to facilitate OTK
But its does stick on the board, these aggros/tempo deck not use hard removal or even if they does they often use it for tempo swing, so when maly came down its usually stick, and if its stick, you had full mana count to utilize and its gg
But of course its very big if to survive to turn 9 even if you ramping hard
But its does stick on the board, these aggros/tempo deck not use hard removal or even if they does they often use it for tempo swing, so when maly came down its usually stick, and if its stick, you had full mana count to utilize and its gg
But of course its very big if to survive to turn 9 even if you ramping hard
I replaced one templar with Brann. Its a fun deck and I might use it for couple of days for now.
Im struggling really hard with the game right now. Even getting to rank15 seems like a desperate grind and I dont want to play fast rush decks just for getting ranks. Im still looking for that 1 deck that would really click. Im switching waaay too often when I get frustrated and right now the frustration kicks in easily. Maybe Ill need a break from this game hah
Some notable moments from my Ancestral Shaman
I played Ragnaros and then cloned him
I still don't have Sylvannas yet. But luckily my opponent played her for me. So I used faceless manipulator to acquire her, hexed his sylvannas, put ancestral on my sylvannas, and then cloned her again for good measure. Overkill
huh will give this a try. Will have to replace ysera with someone else tho. I have other dragon legendaries I can use tho
Yeah other day I deleted my Malygos mage that was running Barnes & curator. But then while going through my stats in HDT tool I noticed it had a high win rate. Revived.
getting much use out of totemic might?
I played Ragnaros and then cloned him
I still don't have Sylvannas yet. But luckily my opponent played her for me. So I used faceless manipulator to acquire her, hexed his sylvannas, put ancestral on my sylvannas, and then cloned her again for good measure. Overkill
lol. The one red is Dragon Warrior. Oh, and Aggro Shaman is almost at a 55% win rate.
http://www.vicioussyndicate.com/vs-data-reaper-report-16/
I wanted to try out more Rogue (Barnes + Questing is really strong), Dragon Priest/Paladin, and Reno Mage but I just don't want to deal with Aggro Shaman with any of those decks.
There's a ton of different Dragon Paladin builds out there. StrifeCro's deck looks interesting. Brann + Netherspite Historian is the cheapest combo at only 5 mana and happens to be one of the better targets? So good.
Looks like a solid deck. I need to test it out later today.
huh will give this a try. Will have to replace ysera with someone else tho. I have other dragon legendaries I can use tho
Yeah other day I deleted my Malygos mage that was running Barnes & curator. But then while going through my stats in HDT tool I noticed it had a high win rate. Revived.
You run Feral Spirits in Totem Shaman?
getting much use out of totemic might?
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