slightconfuse
Banned
Thanks I'll check it out later
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hearthstone |OT7/7| _ Give Tyrande | _ Blizzard: Give Amazon Money
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
- Status
Thanks I'll check it out later
SonicXtreme
Member
fun wild deck i've been laddering with to enjoy both yogg and the nerfo shaman cards before it's too late this week. it's not OP or anything but it's good enough for ladder, and super fun to hit on yogg. while still causing some shamanesque rage quits here and there lol. any suggestions? if i was worried about win rate i'd def add a secret eater but yogg is more fun with the extreme slant towards spells (same reason no boom or shredder/sludge)
More lava burst or rockbiter would be nice but man, you can't survive to yogg in wild without double malestrom and lightning storms, you just can't; plus the spell damage makes those much stronger than they normally are
healing wave can do some work, it was better when i had an arcane giant in here, but in the end 4 mana 7/7 that works with the overload synergy seem to be more critical than a late game giant
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, good example of how popping the block at 1 was a mistake when it would save him an entire lava burst to settle for popping it at 2. Very few situations where that 1 extra health would matter compared to holding a lava burst in hand.
The second lava burst on the second block isn't even worth discussing though. I guess it feels smart to play arround ice barrier, even though it's pretty dumb when you would have lethal either way.
A lot of people do play like idiots against freeze mage just because it's not a matchup you get a lot of practice playing, but yeah, there's not that much to learn about it. Especially for the basic math arround ice block and barrier.
So after surviving all of Mage's random bullshit spells I still lost because he used Yogg...twice. Such an amazing "competitive" game. Sadly, the patch wouldn't change a thing about this match. Yogg isn't going anywhere.
I thought that patch just announced the nerfs first...but it turns out those are the only balance changes they're going to do. Are they serious? Where are the buffs to some of the unplayable cards? Especially the class standard cards. It doesn't take a genius to recognize the common denominator between Shaman and Warrior and what allows them to have so many viable tier 1/2 decks.
Looking forward to seeing the outrage when Midrange Shaman approaches 30%+ usage while maintaining a ridiculous win rate after the nerf patch (lol).
The rare game where I'm not playing against Shaman or Hunter always comes down to a Yogg by Druid or Mage.
[
I thought that patch just announced the nerfs first...but it turns out those are the only balance changes they're going to do. Are they serious? Where are the buffs to some of the unplayable cards? Especially the class standard cards. It doesn't take a genius to recognize the common denominator between Shaman and Warrior and what allows them to have so many viable tier 1/2 decks.
Looking forward to seeing the outrage when Midrange Shaman approaches 30%+ usage while maintaining a ridiculous win rate after the nerf patch (lol).
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Interesting that crackle is your only wild card when it's arguable that something like Storm Crack or Lightning Bolt is better. It can be hard to make use of that high roll unless you're going to YOLO and risk it all on the high roll.
At the end of LOE, you kinda only saw crackle in face decks where you could easily just point it at face and see if you have lethal this turn or just push him closer to lethal in the following turn, and because you can only run 2 copies of Lightning Bolt and Lava Shock.
Midrange shaman decks weren't running it at all to my knowledge, but did have things like Zombie Chow, Piloted Shredder, Dr. Boom, and occasionally Haunted Creeper which became wild exclusive.
For a Yogg spell damage deck, maybe crackle would make more sense if you also included the other crackle like spells?
We already went through this "why does Blizzard not buff cards" phase already. They haven't buffed a card since Slithid Swarmer and that felt less like a buff and more like something they forgot to do last minute.
I personally think it's bull crap just like their "once a year" balance patch.
I do understand that in theory over buffing can lead to inherent power creep. But I also think that re-printing same cards but "better" in a DIGITAL CARD GAME is just inherently dumb. Seems Blizzard is slowly realizing that what works in TCGs is not optimal for a digital card game.
The other way to buff cards is to print more synergy cards. But some cards are just inherently bad and the only way to make them good is to print broken synergy cards. Like you could make a minion that gives charge and +2 damage to your 1 HP minions to make Magma Rager good... but then you are just inviting other broken non sense to happen like Mysterious Challenger. Then people will be complaining about broken Magma Rager OTK decks and Blizzard will have to rotate out cards or nerf something.
And I am talking about buff to terrible cards, not really cards that are on the mediocre side. I don't want them to be buffing stuff like Mind Games from Priest just because Priest sucks. That would be an awful mistake.
I personally think it's bull crap just like their "once a year" balance patch.
I do understand that in theory over buffing can lead to inherent power creep. But I also think that re-printing same cards but "better" in a DIGITAL CARD GAME is just inherently dumb. Seems Blizzard is slowly realizing that what works in TCGs is not optimal for a digital card game.
The other way to buff cards is to print more synergy cards. But some cards are just inherently bad and the only way to make them good is to print broken synergy cards. Like you could make a minion that gives charge and +2 damage to your 1 HP minions to make Magma Rager good... but then you are just inviting other broken non sense to happen like Mysterious Challenger. Then people will be complaining about broken Magma Rager OTK decks and Blizzard will have to rotate out cards or nerf something.
And I am talking about buff to terrible cards, not really cards that are on the mediocre side. I don't want them to be buffing stuff like Mind Games from Priest just because Priest sucks. That would be an awful mistake.
SonicXtreme
Member
hm, you do bring up a good point i didn't even think of; crackle is the only wild card LOL. But, it's a dual edged sword; i do find crackle very very good in this deck; it needs the extension, and i have 3 cards to negate overload, and with trogg, and it really helps with things like deathlords, it's almost essential to fight through cheated out early high health minions like that.
so theoretically i could drop crackles, pick up lava burst and a hex, and go standard
BUT that comes with the caveat; i'm winning in wild, wild has very diverse decks you face, so people are playing lots of homebrew decks. making those drops and going standard, might not make the deck much weaker, but will sort of filter out my opponents to more refined meta decks that might actually be harder to beat despite the deck arguably just moving sideways and not losing much between formats
a very interesting dilemma i don't think i've ever really run into yet despite maining wild since the split.
shredder would be an 'upgrade' but i'm trying to be as lean on minions as i can to fight to drop yogg and have more madness occur lol. the synergy with the ones i have is pretty damn good, boom for a faceless could arguably be better but honestly i find more often throwing faceless down early and/or getting overload for trogg is more valuable, or just as valuable as BBs (plus man i play boom in enough decks lol)
edit: altho legit crackle is one of the most powerful 2 mana burn spells this game has ever seen IMO, immensely moreso in a deck that includes massive amounts of spell power opportunities and troggs.
You should go with Ancestor's Call + Malygos if you want to cast a lot of spells in Wild.
Brode streaming: https://www.twitch.tv/bbrode
Brode streaming: https://www.twitch.tv/bbrode
SonicXtreme
Member
nah i'm celebrating the 'death' of yogg, rockbiter, tuskar, etc trying to make a fun deck that makes big yoggs as well as abuses shaman in general. this deck will be dead in a couple of days. but it'll get me to single digits in wild while having a blast.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I call it more of a 3 mana burn spell with a bonus of some overload synergies, but whatever.
And yeah, you can play kinda whatever you want in wild, up until you start facing legit N'Zoth decks, and then above that, Secret Paladins. Up to you if that's the deck you wanna go through the easy ranks with.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
But it's just weird that they nerf some shit into oblivion and then never try to somewhat fix it later. Does it not bother them that pretty much no one (or at least no one I've seen) is going to use Starving Buzzard? They destroyed the card to the point of it being fucking useless unless you want to drop it on turn 8 or some shit.
I mean I know there's a lot of cards that never see the light of day, and I don't expect them to buff those cards, but I just want them to take a second and look at some of the nerfs that they may have gone too far on. Blade Flurry pissed me off a ton since Rogue's have so many removal options, but I didn't think that shit was right. I just wanted 3 mana and for it to not hit the face.
Just concede then, mayne.
irfaanator
Banned
.
oh no, you're still going to lose to me. But I'm not gonna be happy at wasting fifteen minutes because you want to pilot trash for a skin. We're both gonna suffer at this point.
if it's casual then yes concede rather than suffer probably
Why you gotta be like that, mayne. Some of us main Priests. ; ))))))))))
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
It's not just yogg stopping his spell casts when he is either silenced, destroyed, transformed, or returned to hand, it's also that he'll have overload from overload spells.
At least one thing stands to reason, if yogg is still good, then at least shaman will be easier to contest with it.
Well, I endured a 27 minute match against a BMing Priest player who liked to rope every turn, so I think I'm entitled to a little gloating. (That's different from bragging
)As far as evaluating Fool's Bane, it's the rank 20 players who are running that card! I was evaluating that card in its natural environment. (Or maybe that was the first time it was ever used against me, since it's a bad card few people run)
Well, I endured a 27 minute match against a BMing Priest player who liked to rope every turn, so I think I'm entitled to a little gloating. (That's different from bragging
As far as evaluating Fool's Bane, it's the rank 20 players who are running that card! I was evaluating that card in its natural environment. (Or maybe that was the first time it was ever used against me, since it's a bad card few people run)
Zalae use Bane instead Gorehowl in his CW anti-shaman build, seem very content with it
90% of the time he never plays it and ends up changing it to a random legendary with monkey.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Stuck at 12 with Shaman a whole day even falling back down to 13, less than 1 hour with Malygos Rogue to get to 11...
Why the hell player with his caliber do that lmao
its a weapon, its better play to just equip it than just slam revenge for nothing to play card in mirror
control warrior certainly don't want harrison that in mirror
I watch his stream he certainly not doing that lmao
He does equip it before going Golden Monkey.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Ouch, just when I was thinking maybe brann isn't good enough for c'thun rogue... it goes uncontested for 3 turns against paladin and proc'd off 3 cards including 2 azure drakes. I just won off the momentum of that single card. Barely was a cthun deck at that point, just midrange rogue.
I'll probably cut it anyway though. I don't have thalnos and I kind of want dark iron skulker as well. But then again, brann + disciple of c'thun is probably one of the few ways I ever hit 10 cthun attack early on. Might be worth keeping.
I'll probably cut it anyway though. I don't have thalnos and I kind of want dark iron skulker as well. But then again, brann + disciple of c'thun is probably one of the few ways I ever hit 10 cthun attack early on. Might be worth keeping.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Not nearly as bad as yogg saron as far as I am concerned.
Or tunnel trogg x2, feral spirits... and like 100 other things.
CelticKnight
Member
They're up there, but personally anyone running a deck with Yogg-Saron in is a Grade A, 24 carat cunt and by the looks of everyone and their uncle is shoe-horning it into their decks due to it's "bouncebackability".
At least a mill deck involves some degree of skill, whereas anyone can play Yogg and snatch victory from the jaws of certain defeat through nothing more than pure luck. It's got to the point now where I expect it the moment my opponent gets to 10 mana and is losing... it's nailed on like a Warrior having Fiery War Axe on 2 and a Hunter using Call of the Wild on 8.
bangbang i'm a timpani
Banned
all these gimmick decks still lose to double cotw on turn 9/10
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
This druid got a turn 6 arcane giant for 2 mana, got 4 swipes (2 off raven idol), and still got spanked. https://hsreplay.net/replay/gcc722ij4S5MJ4YW9pVsCH
What gimmick decks?
What gimmick decks?
This game is seriously obtuse. I just found out wild mode is a thing. You all and people in tutorials use so many short hand terms, I assumed "wild" was a deck archetype or something lmao. I don't have any wild format cards, so the game hasn't given me the option to try it out yet. Will it be obvious when it happens?
Getting into this genre for the first time has been fun, but I've been amazed at my obliviousness. At least I'm having fun, lol.
Getting into this genre for the first time has been fun, but I've been amazed at my obliviousness. At least I'm having fun, lol.
The cards restricted to Wild have been phased out (happened back in April). It's a "legacy" mode of sorts for people with nostalgia. New players will not be offered any cards restricted to that format. You will have access to them however if you draft an Arena deck or during certain Tavern Brawl - you can also craft them with dust, but that's a poor investment for a new player. I advise you to stick to the Standard format for now so you don't handicap yourself more than necessary.
You won't unlock Wild unless you craft a Wild card, or after the next rotation. I don't recommend crafting Wild cards,
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Whew, what a fun game against tempo mage! Was a pretty even match for the first 9 turn, but I somehow assembled a strong swing turn with tempo mage running low on cards. I've finally turned the corner to where I'm ahead.
Oh, here's yogg to disregard the rest of the game to clear the board, do 8 damage to my face, draw her 4 cards, and give her shadowform to make sure I'll die before i can assemble another strong board.
https://hsreplay.net/replay/qo4ZYDmXMLZcMY48CUnqTY
fun...
Oh, here's yogg to disregard the rest of the game to clear the board, do 8 damage to my face, draw her 4 cards, and give her shadowform to make sure I'll die before i can assemble another strong board.
https://hsreplay.net/replay/qo4ZYDmXMLZcMY48CUnqTY
fun...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxsFH_oFybI
Simplified but 61-69% is straight out broken. I'm excited for what tomorrow brings.
Simplified but 61-69% is straight out broken. I'm excited for what tomorrow brings.
Echoing what the previous poster said, if you are a new player, Wild is NOT the format for you. Wild is a format that is very interesting for long time players of the game because there are no restrictions on the cards that are available. The rotated out cards are ins some ways the most powerful cards ever printed and they are a staple in nearly every Wild deck. A new player would need to craft these cards in order to be competitive in that format. Which might be something you'd want to pursue down the road, but isn't a good use of your limited resources when starting out. If you're planning to spend (probably lots) of money in the game, then you'll eventually get interested in Wild naturally as more and more cards that you have collected as part of Standard eventually move into Wild.
LyleLanley
Banned
It's kind of odd that there's a restriction at all but why would a player who doesn't have a single wild card want to go play that format? I imagine it would just be a shitty experience.
No it is.
You can't make a wild only deck maybe, but if you don't have any wild cards you couldn't do that anyway.
But you can definitely play Wild even with no wild cards.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
They wanted the mode to be hidden to new players because they feel new players are best served by playing standard. It's definitely a bit obtuse. I don't think it's necessarily a bad decision though. For the typical new player, perhaps less gamer savvy than a gaffer, 2 formats could be really confusing and extra overwhelming when you're just trying out a card game for the first time.
If you want to put up with all the shitty decks from the past, sure. I'd rather play shamans and yoggsaron than deal with some of the shit from the past. Can't even play oil rogue... so no thanks
It is quite a bit more balanced at least.
The most popular deck is extremely beatable.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
No, it's not. And how do you beat secret paladin now that they have n'zoth?
- Status