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- Thread starter ZealousD
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SilentRacoon
Member
Well my deck definition might be all over the place, but I was thinking something along the lines of an Astral Communion ramp Druid deck, in which category does that kind of deck falls into? Just a ramp deck?
Astral Communion Druid is a bonkers deck that really doesn't fit any standard definition. This is not good for Astral Druid anyway. Astral Druid wants big stuff. Random legendaries aren't necessarily big. You can get stuff like Finley or the Nat Pagles.
LyleLanley
Banned
Wouldn't 5 more cards just make it less likely that you'll get Astral Communion when you need it?
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I could see malch being used in a midrange-ish deck like miracle rogue that runs a lot of card draw. It does add an element of inconsistency, but not all miracle rogue versions build up to a singular combo as their strategy. You can rely on bombs like ragnaros, so maybe this adds a few more bombs than what your opponent can deal with and you win. Definitely worth a try.
Eh there were doubters, but most people were optimistic about Reno. The effect was that bonkers and everyone secretly wished the death of face decks (lul).
Nah, Miracle is a delicate deck. Probably one of the worst decks to play this card in.
I was mostly responding to the original poster's assertion that Creeper was run in a lot of non-Hunter decks and that this card would be too if it were a neutral card. But the reason Creeper was run in a lot of other decks like Zoo, Aggro Pally, Egg Druid, etc. was almost completely due to the tokens and their insane synergy with Juggler, PO, Abusive, Blessing of Might, etc. A 3/2 Beast is going to be a lot worse than the tokens in those decks.
As for Hunter, I'm still not even sure this card is better than Creeper, although it's at least close. The fact that both bodies are Beasts is nice, but how often are you going to be wanting to play KC on turn 3? Coin+Houndmaster on 3 is nice, but if you have to Houndmaster the front half and trade it in to a 3/2, you are going to be a bit sad. Creeper would be better in that scenario since it would survive with its Deathrattle still in tact.
Overall, I'd say this card is slightly worse than Haunted Creeper in Hunter decks. That being said, even a slightly worse Creeper is better than the other Standard options, so it will certainly see play.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
It depends on what version you're playing. Miracle has never really been a one trick pony. Which is why it has lasted so long, past so many nerfs.
I reached rank 15. I personally love Hearthstone's ranking system. it feels good to reach top 30% with only putting in a few hrs.
This won't be run in Zoo. Not better than getting 5 1/1s, and less buffs to Darkshire Councilamn.
It will definitely find a spot in Reno warlock though, IMO. That deck has room for weird stuff at most of the mana levels, and 5 mana for 3 bodies is probably good enough to make it in standard. I doubt it does anything for any deck in Wild though.
But you do rely on tempo cards to last you till Auctioneer and the eventual burst finish. 5 random cards and a Pit Fighter don't fit that plan. PM is a card for very turtly decks.
BananasWithGuns
Member
Is there any reason Malchezaar wouldn't be played in control Warrior moving forward? Seems like a logical fit. I'm not sure what other decks it would go in (Reno?) but the effect is pretty damn crazy.
Kara Khazam annoys me quite a bit. Looks like another good Zoo card and for whatever reason Blizzard can't stop making shit for Zoo. No other Warlock deck would play it.
Protect the King definitely seems like it sucks. With Bolster it's a 5 mana, two card combo that's completely reliant on your opponent's board state. Not much point to putting it in your deck I think.
Kara Khazam annoys me quite a bit. Looks like another good Zoo card and for whatever reason Blizzard can't stop making shit for Zoo. No other Warlock deck would play it.
Protect the King definitely seems like it sucks. With Bolster it's a 5 mana, two card combo that's completely reliant on your opponent's board state. Not much point to putting it in your deck I think.
Duster for battle
Hey sweet, a decent cho gall card for once
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Lemme see how many miracle rogue decks I can name:
The original (stealth van cleef/QA)
The post-original nerf (van cleef no longer has stealth/QA)
Leeroy jenkins shadowstep coldblood miracle
mana addict miracle
southsea+cb+faceless miracle
ragnaros/boom miracle*
minion/conceal based miracle*
once again leeroy jenkins/coldblood/faceless miracle, due to ET
miracle with ragnaros*
malygos rogue
Yogg rogue*
Each rogue deck has a different early and end game strategy (or no longer exist due to card changes/or set rotations etc.), but they revolve around heavy cycling of cards to get to those threats. I think it might work in the * decks.
I don't think the new warlock will get played unless floodlock makes a comeback somehow.
It's basically Silverhand knight,which is a dead card pretty long time now.
I suppose it works well with Cho'gall, but do you really want to play both cards in the same deck?
Probably not.
It's basically Silverhand knight,which is a dead card pretty long time now.
I suppose it works well with Cho'gall, but do you really want to play both cards in the same deck?
Probably not.
"heavy cycling" only works with a specific deck like Miracle, with specific cards. Didn't draw that backstab or prep because you got a Nozdormu instead?
PM only gains value to longer the matches last. Miracle doesn't want a long game, it will tempo the opponent out and refill with Auctioneer. Drawing those cycling cards and auctioneer both get harder with 6 added filler cards.
PM only gains value to longer the matches last. Miracle doesn't want a long game, it will tempo the opponent out and refill with Auctioneer. Drawing those cycling cards and auctioneer both get harder with 6 added filler cards.
Protect the King seems like a good anti-aggro card, especially with bolster. turn 5 cranking out 5 3/3's (or more given how aggro works nowadays) with taunt against zoo would be pretty great. Its the kind of card that might actually get you back in the game, which HS needs a lot more of.
As for Duster for Battle, I'd say the one big advantage it has over forbidden ritual is that you can still use mana afterwards. There have been so many times while playing zoo that I would have loved to get 4 minions on the board and play argus, or even gormok. Writing the card off completely seems misguided, but given the state of play right now it probably would be a 1 of in zoo decks at max.
As for Duster for Battle, I'd say the one big advantage it has over forbidden ritual is that you can still use mana afterwards. There have been so many times while playing zoo that I would have loved to get 4 minions on the board and play argus, or even gormok. Writing the card off completely seems misguided, but given the state of play right now it probably would be a 1 of in zoo decks at max.
A Sentient Keyboard
Member
What if Prince Malchezaar shuffled 5 legendaries into your opponent's deck? I bet that woud be an autoinclude in most aggro decks since you trade your 1 dead draw for their 5, and the game is likely decided before any of the good legendaries can come down anyway.
Super Nothing
Member
The thing about Protect the King is that it's only good with Bolster. Without Bolster, it's crap. It also has anti-synergy with Warrior's many Whirlwind effects. I'll try to make a Bolster deck work, but I'm not optimistic.
Uhhh.... no? It just throws more stuff onto the board that can get punished by brawl or equality or whatever. Why does a slow deck want a bunch of small vanilla bodies?
If anything, it has extra synergy with whirlwind attacks against zoo. 4 or 5 1/1's on turn three to kill some of the death rattles or divine shields, followed by ravaging ghoul will be a premium removal combo. It's not like any deck is actually playing whirlwind right now due to RG. Even without Bolster it is still an objectively good card. Paladins must for battle gave a weapon and 3 1/1's, this will often get more than 3 1/1's, possibly even 6 or 7 against zoo, 4 against hunter, 5 against paladin, etc. Add bolster to it and you are getting a better value than muster/quartermaster.
By itself the card is great, with the buffs its even better.
BananasWithGuns
Member
Would Malchezaar make any sense in Zoo? There was a point where Zoo was a little slower and ran stuff like Loatheb and Dr. Boom. Maybe this opens that type of playstyle back up? It's not like they don't have the draw engine anyway.
Perhaps it's a bit too ambitious though.
Perhaps it's a bit too ambitious though.
I think if its at the end of your turn its too reliable and completely replaces elise.
Super Nothing
Member
Loatheb served the specific purpose of blocking AOEs, Zoo's biggest weakness and Dr. Boom was just too good not to run in every deck. A 5/6 and 5 random legendaries doesn't do anything for Zoo.
God damn more Zoo cards....
Duster for battle
irfaanator
Banned
if pm added the 5 legendaries when you played it, it wouldve been good even if the legendaries were meh, but 5 at the start of the game just sounds like salt when you draw a legendary instead of the card you need.
For you guys saying Prince Malchazar won't be a big factor because Control isn't thing are on a different matchmaking system than I am. C'thun warrior and Control Warrior are super popular and god forbid you get into a mirror match with these control decks. Hell I had a control warrior fatigue me while I was playing Mid-range Hunter the other day. (Then I got face rolled by a Dragon Warrior next game).
People love their control warrior and you can expect to see it in one form or another. Will be interesting to see if it actually works in any other class, but Prince Malchazar and Elise is a pretty fun combo.
People love their control warrior and you can expect to see it in one form or another. Will be interesting to see if it actually works in any other class, but Prince Malchazar and Elise is a pretty fun combo.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
PM gains value in long matches, yes. But it also is a deck construction tool. You can build your deck with more card draw, essentially creating a faster deck without giving up much overall power. A deck with too much card draw without enough power can be very consistent in it's strategy but ultimately loses games where it doesn't snowball or OTK. A deck with malch may let you include more card draw, with much less of a sacrifice on the power end. And in a rogue deck, like miracle, where you can include a lot of card draw mechanics, malch could turn out to be great.
So yeah, PM could be good in matches that last long, because you draw all those legendary cards. But it's hasty to write off saying PM isn't good when you have a deck with high card velocity where you're pretty much guaranteed to draw several of those cards.
I would say that some miracle rogue decks actually do like longer games. Not like 15-20 turns but at least 9-10.
I'm not gonna call it good or bad until I get some grasp on how the RNG works out. This is also a card I feel you need to experience to rightly call it one way or another.
Yeah, I am arguing a very possibly fringe addition to miracle rogue. But it's easy to write off a card or narrowly define it. It's much harder to find the positives. Kibler is 100% right on this aspect every expansion there are naysayers. Often enough they turn out to be wrong.
irfaanator
Banned
at least its a mediocre legendary to get from elise. It's a vanilla 5 mana 5/6 you can play whenever during fatigue
Zoo rarely goes to fatigue and has no need to dilute their deck with legendaries they dont want or need. The effect is a liability in zoo. Pit Fighter would be better.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Maybe you just cut one, and the 5 randoms are better than 1 less. But I could also see you cutting more for more utility/draw. It's pretty interesting imo.
I could see it being at least a one off in zoo if warriors continue to be so popular. Having your refill die entirely to a ravaging ghoul is embarrassing.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
It's the new poor mans legendary. Pretend you have 6 legendary cards in your deck when you only have 1. In fact, when people cry about decks with tons of legendarys that just stomp them, be like... well this is 6 legendary cards in 1. Balance the scales. I'm a wallet warrior now!
FiveSix4Three
Member
I'm just excited for Prince in my wild randuin deck.
Karsticles
Member
A core principle in deck building is that fewer cards are better. You want your deck to run optimally, not sloppily. The only decks that might run PM are those that either want to combat fatigue or force their opponents into it.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
But yeah it's true. To go back to the yugioh comparison earlier, they run 40 card decks minimum but there's so many searches and draw cards that it ends up being less than that really, especially when there's nothing like a mana cost in that game.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Deck building will always be a balance between power and consistency. What makes this card interesting is that it lets you bend the rules a bit and if you can capitalize on that, you might have something interesting, and possibly special.
If the goal is always to make the thinnest deck possible, you'd just include every cantrip/deck thinner possible. It'd be shit and that is my point.
If the goal is always to make the thinnest deck possible, you'd just include every cantrip/deck thinner possible. It'd be shit and that is my point.
You make the thinnest deck possible when you are playing a combo deck while also having enough cards to control the board so that you don't die before you get your combo pieces/draws. That's how the Warrior OTK works, that's how Freeze Mage works. In under no situation will those decks WANT to put more cards in their deck.
YGO has different rules than HS and if you COULD make a deck full of cantrips then people would in fact do that and it would be the most broken deck ever because you would be able to draw your entire deck in one turn and get off Exodia. As you can imagine in that game good cantrips are very hard to come by (or banned) or have very strict restrictions to them (like you must have X type of card in hand to draw).
In Hearthstone, cantrips are still usually attached to minions and spells which mean you have to devote mana to them. You are spending resources on something with lower tempo.
If Hearthstone had a card like Pot of Greed, where you draw cards while expending nothing, every deck would run that card. Something like Novice Engineer is not like that.
Sure, Tacitus#2849
I wonder which decks if they had the option to run 20 cards would do so.
Obviously all the combo decks would do it because that means they don't have to run as much draw.
I think Astral Communion Druid would run it too. Being able to have a much higher chance of getting Innervate plus Astral on turn 1 is huge and would honestly push the deck into very scary territory.
Obviously all the combo decks would do it because that means they don't have to run as much draw.
I think Astral Communion Druid would run it too. Being able to have a much higher chance of getting Innervate plus Astral on turn 1 is huge and would honestly push the deck into very scary territory.
Loving the look of Book Wyrm a shadow word pain for your dragon decks in any class.
Duster for battle is too rigid at 5 mana I would much rather use forbidden tentacles over them.
The synergy with Chogall is nice but that is not enough to justify using them.
Also I did not know you could get a brawl quest on non brawl days. This is the first time it has happened to me so now I must wait.
Duster for battle is too rigid at 5 mana I would much rather use forbidden tentacles over them.
The synergy with Chogall is nice but that is not enough to justify using them.
Also I did not know you could get a brawl quest on non brawl days. This is the first time it has happened to me so now I must wait.
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