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[Negotiator]

Im talking in regards of CUs versus high clocks not necessarily memory bus width

eg. having a 12TF vs 12TF gpus except one less CUs/higher clocks vs more CUs/low clock.

Wide and slow means a bigger die, so lower yields. Also, you need more PCB layers for the additional traces, which increases costs a bit.

Narrow and fast means a smaller die, so higher yields, but cooling becomes more challenging (so you'll have to invest more money there).

It's a trade-off.

We've seen 512-bit bus GPUs since the GDDR3 era:

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-hd-2900-xt.c192 (80nm GPU)

Launch Price 399 USD

And this one with GDDR5:

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-r9-390.c2664 (28nm GPU)

Launch Price 329 USD

From a technical perspective, it's not totally unrealistic to manufacture a 512-bit bus APU.

Keep in mind that 7nm (let alone with EUV) is far more dense than 28nm or 80nm in regards to memory controller die size.

 

[TeamGhobad]

Ps5 2020 infos - Pastebin.com

web.archive.org

This pastebin from 2018 is also looking like it might be accurate.

NO. third party dev would know about specs somewhat but not know about their sub models, price, BC, release date, ect ect. this is FAKE.

 

[onQ123]

Most rumors put PS5 between 12.9TF & 14.2TF with 18GB - 24GB of GDDR6 with a high memory bandwidth

 

[xPikYx]

I don't know why, might be a sensatiin, might be that godfall trailer despite hellblade2 but i believe Microsoft will win the battle of power this time around, they really want to push on power performance wise this gen and think they are in an advantage position in terms of deals with manufacturers to give power at a reasonable cost. My belief despite the majority of rumours stating the ps5 will be more powerful

 

[Dilusha117]

Do you guys know who was the first to say 12 TF for XSX? Was it the Youtuber Dealer gaming?

 

[MilkyJoe]

Most rumors put PS5 between 12.9TF & 14.2TF with 18GB - 24GB of GDDR6 with a high memory bandwidth

16 FP confirmed

 

[havok75]

NO. third party dev would know about specs somewhat but not know about their sub models, price, BC, release date, ect ect. this is FAKE.

Ah fair enough, he was right about E3 and it is looking like the spec is similar to what's being speculated.

 

[onQ123]

Do you guys know who was the first to say 12 TF for XSX? Was it the Youtuber Dealer gaming?

By: Anthony Garreffa from Jan 25, 2019 @ 0:01 CST

Read more: https://www.tweaktown.com/news/64616/next-xbox-8c-16t-zen-2-cpu-navi-gpu-16gb-ram-499/index.html

Next Xbox X - 8C/16T Zen 2 CPU, Navi GPU, 16GB RAM for $499

Microsoft's next-gen Xbox: custom Zen 2 CPU and Navi GPU from AMD, 16GB GDDR6, ray tracing technology, and more.

www.tweaktown.com

Next Xbox X - 8C/16T Zen 2 CPU, Navi GPU, 16GB RAM for $499 Microsoft's next-gen Xbox: custom Zen 2 CPU and Navi GPU from AMD, 16GB GDDR6, ray tracing technology, and more

We know that the next-gen Xbox and PlayStation consoles are both in development and both use AMD technololgy in the form of a Zen 2 processor and Navi GPU, but now a new leak on Reddit is teasing some monster specs for what the purported next-gen Microsoft consoles: Xbox Streaming and Xbox X. The rumors are coming from a Reddit post which teases the codename Lockhart as the Next Xbox Streaming console that will reportedly launch for $249, and it'll pack a custom 8C/16T Zen 2 processor from AMD. Microsoft is reportedly using a custom Navi GPU with 4 TFLOPs of performance, 12GB of GDDR6 (which will most likely be shared memory across the system and graphics side of things), and a huge and super-fast 1TB NVMe SSD with 1GB/sec of speed. Next Xbox X (codename Anaconda) - $499: CPU: AMD's custom Zen 2 CPU with 8C/16T (should be on 7nm) GPU: Custom Navi GPU (12 TFLOPs of performance, also should be 7nm)

 

[TeamGhobad]

These consoles are gonna last 10years

 

[onQ123]

These consoles are gonna last 10years

They might stay on the market for 10 years but they will get a upgraded model in like 3 or 4 years

 

[TeamGhobad]

They might stay on the market for 10 years but they will get a upgraded model in like 3 or 4 years

12 tflops of navi and RT there wont be a need for it.

 

[Bryank75]

These consoles are gonna last 10years

We'll still get a mid-gen upgrade. Probably focusing on Raytracing and GPU IMO.
Maybe we will get some cool unexpected tech upgrades too...

Edit: Probably a more compact or sexy design...

 

[onQ123]

12 tflops of navi and RT there wont be a need for it.

No need for it but a die shrink will enable them to make a upgraded console so they most likely will

 

[TeamGhobad]

We'll still get a mid-gen upgrade. Probably focusing on Raytracing and GPU IMO.
Maybe we will get some cool unexpected tech upgrades too...

Edit: Probably a more compact or sexy design...

redesign sure as we go to 5nm and the machine runs cooler but new tech no. i highly doubt it. this is why they're already launching 2 systems.

 

[Bryank75]

redesign sure as we go to 5nm and the machine runs cooler but new tech no. i highly doubt it. this is why they're already launching 2 systems.

How far away is a die shrink / 5nm do people think? I don't really know how long these things take...

 

[Von Hugh]

12 tflops of navi and RT there wont be a need for it.

Due to RT especially there needs to be an upgrade.

 

[TeamGhobad]

How far away is a die shrink / 5nm do people think? I don't really know how long these things take...

5nm should be fully available in 2022 then from there 3mm i assume.

Due to RT especially there needs to be an upgrade.

this is one of my concerns. that the RT it too weak to do anything substantial and it just takes up die space.

 

[Negotiator]

How far away is a die shrink / 5nm do people think? I don't really know how long these things take...

TSMC on Track to Deliver 3 nm in 2022

TSMC is delivering record results day after day, with a 5 nm manufacturing process starting High Volume Manufacturing (HVM) in Q2 next year, 7 nm process getting plenty of orders and the fact that TSMC just became the biggest company publicly trading in Asia. Continuing with the goal to match or...

www.techpowerup.com

Don't expect PS5 Pro until late 2023 at the earliest.

 

[Tommy Fisher]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

 

[nowhat]

5nm should be fully available in 2022 then from there 3mm i assume.

Wasn't there supposed to be a physical limit to how small the process can be? Like, that physics prevents the process from going beyond a certain size, even if it could be technologically possible. But a quick google gave me this: https://www.anandtech.com/show/15217/intels-manufacturing-roadmap-from-2019-to-2029

1.4nm??? WTF

 

[pawel86ck]

Few months ago Phil has said Scarlett will offer 4x more performance than xbox x. CPU will offer 4x more performance for sure but 12TF can also offer 4x boost in performance if we take into account architecture gains. 12TF RDNA should offer GCN Vega equivalent of around 15TF (maybe even more if RDNA2 will offer further gains), but VRS alone can boost performance by 75% as new 3dmark VRS tier2 test shows, so performance should be comparable to 25TF Vega then. So yes, I really think what Phil has said about 4x boost compared to xbox x is possible after all .

 

[TLZ]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

Alright. I'm going to bed now, and in 7 hours I want to see that Vetted tag under your name. You better not be banned mister.

 

[quest]

Few months ago Phil has said Scarlett will offer 4x more performance than xbox x. CPU will be for sure offer 4x more performance but 12TF can also offer 4x boost in performance if we take into account architecture gains. 12TF RDNA should offer GCN Vega equivalent of around 15TF (maybe even more if RDNA2 will offer further gains), but VRS alone can boost performance by 75% as new 3dmark VRS tier2 test shows, so performance should be comparable to 25TF Vega. So yes, I really think what Phil has said about 4x boost compared to xbox x is possible after all .

AMD will only be VRS level one we dont know yet if there is any extra hardware for Microsofts VRS implementation.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

Mod of War

 

[Negotiator]

AMD will only be VRS level one

Says who?

we dont know yet if there is any extra hardware for Microsofts VRS implementation.

Sounds like DX12 baked-in secret sauce BS to me.

 

[luca_29_bg]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

Hey Tommy, did you heard the same thing the other insider guy (if true) heard about a possible further increase for ps5 flops in these days ? He said he received a mail about this possible "upgrade" ? What do you think ?

 

[Agnostic2020]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

I feel all giddy and shit like a kid let's get you verified and let your secret info flow through the thread all over our faces haha

 

[TeamGhobad]

Wasn't there supposed to be a physical limit to how small the process can be? Like, that physics prevents the process from going beyond a certain size, even if it could be technologically possible. But a quick google gave me this: https://www.anandtech.com/show/15217/intels-manufacturing-roadmap-from-2019-to-2029

1.4nm??? WTF

more like barriers. that will get broken. ya we're not close to the limit.

 

[pawel86ck]

AMD will only be VRS level one we dont know yet if there is any extra hardware for Microsofts VRS implementation.

I believe MS implementation will be even further improved, otherwise I see no reason why they would patent it and talk about it. So yes guys, I'm telling you with 25TF Vega performance equivalent these consoles should be fast enough to render games at 4K 60fps, and not to mention checkerboard rendering. With checkerboard rendering I think they will be able to hit even 8K. The gap between XSX vs Xboner S will be insane, literally 25x.

 

[sonomamashine]

DJ12 an APU with Ryzen 3700 series and Rx5800 XT + controller + ram + ssd + blueray + (probably an hdd aswell) etc... and sell less than a separate GPU 5800xt wich is on the APU of the Ps5....
didnt know Sony & AMD where involved in charity business.

I'm sure there was a break down of fabbing costs a couple of hundred pages ago, but you are probably looking at 100 tops. (some reason I have $50~60 in my head per chip though)

lol if you alluding to this then... ⬇⬇⬇⬇

No probably cheaper.

ok the ps5 would have the 5800xt gpu and sell for less than 500$ and the same Gpu (5800xt) would sell for 599$, ok i'm glad that made sense to you.

 

[CyberPanda]

 

[Agnostic2020]

Ofcourse . If it's 4tf why make it big and pay more for transportation in distribution channel ?

 

[Gamernyc78]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

Ouuuuu Yeah Boiiii

 

[Gamernyc78]

Mod of War

OH SHIT!!! It's poppin now. release the kraken!!!

 

[-kb-]

Wasn't there supposed to be a physical limit to how small the process can be? Like, that physics prevents the process from going beyond a certain size, even if it could be technologically possible. But a quick google gave me this: https://www.anandtech.com/show/15217/intels-manufacturing-roadmap-from-2019-to-2029

1.4nm??? WTF

if i recall correctly, when shrinking to extreme levels (such that we are approaching) some quantum effects start to take place that one may not expect. I would not expect us to get anywhere near 1.4nm without some serious changes.

Quantum Effects At 7/5nm And Beyond

Quantum Effects At 7/5nm At future nodes there are some unexpected behaviors. What to do about them isn't always clear.

semiengineering.com

 

[Gamernyc78]

I believe MS implementation will be even further improved, otherwise I see no reason why they would patent it and talk about it. So yes guys, I'm telling you with 25TF Vega performance equivalent these consoles should be fast enough to render games at 4K 60fps, and not to mention checkerboard rendering. With checkerboard rendering I think they will be able to hit even 8K. The gap between XSX vs Xboner S will be insane.

I'm actually super excited to see how far thy can push the checkerboarding. Good times ahead.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Vapor chamber confirmation? = flatulence

 

[CyberPanda]

 

[Gamernyc78]

I think when Sony announces its specs the internet will explode. I'm really curious about the RT implementation though regardless how limited it is also the memory situation.

 

[Agnostic2020]

 

[DJ12]

DJ12 an APU with Ryzen 3700 series and Rx5800 XT + controller + ram + ssd + blueray + (probably an hdd aswell) etc... and sell less than a separate GPU 5800xt wich is on the APU of the Ps5....
didnt know Sony & AMD where involved in charity business.

lol if you alluding to this then... ⬇⬇⬇⬇

ok the ps5 would have the 5800xt gpu and sell for less than 500$ and the same Gpu (5800xt) would sell for 599$, ok i'm glad that made sense to you.

So despite admitting the chip will add 50~60 dollars to the overall cost of the console you still are comparing it to a retail GPU price which probably only cost half its retail price to make anyway as evidenced by the spreadaheet.

As you like to say, ok....

AMD got paid a big fat cheque before and will receive payments for the life of the console and you think they aren't going to give ms and sony the best they have.

 

[Fake]

I'm actually super excited to see how far thy can push the checkerboarding. Good times ahead.

People forget they could even create a new tech from the ground with better resource save than cb.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

What do we have here? What's important? I can see Van Ghog, what else?

 

[Negotiator]

AMD got paid a big fat cheque before and will receive payments for the life of the console and you think they aren't going to give ms and sony the best they have.

Pretty big indeed:

Xbox One deal worth more than $3 billion to AMD, claims former VP

AMD secured a deal to provide Microsoft with the silicon to power its new Xbox One console, and a former AMD VP claims that the deal is worth in excess of $3 billion.

www.zdnet.com

PCMR hardware price gouging != console tech economics (games, services, certified accessories)

 

[Ar¢tos]

I think when Sony announces its specs the internet will explode. I'm really curious about the RT implementation though regardless how limited it is also the memory situation.

When both announce the specs the internet will explode. We'll have full blown fanboy wars, astroturfing & FUD spreading neo accounts, meltdowns and account suicides.
I can't wait!
I'll savour every second of it!

 

[TBiddy]

. We'll have full blown fanboy wars, astroturfing & FUD spreading neo accounts, meltdowns and account suicides.

I like how you act as it hasn't already started. Have you noticed the influx of "insiders" lately?

 

[Ar¢tos]

I like how you act as it hasn't already started. Have you noticed the influx of "insiders" lately?

That's just a free sample of what's to come.

 

[TBiddy]

That's just a free sample of what's to come.

True. It's gonna be a marvel.

 

[sonomamashine]

despite admitting the chip will add 50~60 dollars to the overall cost of the console you still are comparing it to a retail GPU price which probably only cost half its retail price to make anyway as evidenced by the spreadaheet.

As you like to say, ok...

I will repeat again
If AMD GPU is half the price 600/2=300
And the other 300 goes to other expenses (middle men) etc..
Doesn't the Ps5 need those (middle men) aswell....
It just teleport from the factory thru a portal directly to your house.

AMD got paid a big fat cheque before and will receive payments for the life of the console and you think they aren't going to give ms and sony the best they have.

Everybody knows that, but still there are some expenses to pay other than AMD.
Can you post your expectations, ps5 specs, xbox specs and prices.

 

[44alltheway]

Hey guys, No one has disappeared. i'm ready to be verified.

Let's ACTUALLY go!