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PoliGAF 2015 |OT2| Pls print

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B

Brawndo Addict

Banned
pigeon said:
Because they can't. The motion to declare the chair vacant is a House motion like any other, and can't be voted on without being recognized by the chair. In other words, Boehner would have to actively allow them to hold a vote to remove him.

Boehner's not resigning because they could force a vote on the floor, he's resigning because they could force an internal caucus fight. But by its very nature that fight has no procedural power. All it can do is force Boehner to resign.
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Isn't the motion to vacate the chair a privileged motion, or did I incorrectly recall that? I know there was hubbub about it earlier this year with Meadows because they were questioning whether his non-privileged version was even a legitimate format that could be brought, thus implying that the actual version of the motion is privileged. Whether they have the votes to succeed on such a motion is unclear of course, but that's not to say they couldn't attempt it. And I'm not sure it would be a given that the Democrats would vote to keep Boehner in given the potential upsides for them if a coalition speaker becomes necessary afterwards.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Brawndo Addict said:
Isn't the motion to vacate the chair a privileged motion, or did I incorrectly recall that? I know there was hubbub about it earlier this year with Meadows because they were questioning whether his non-privileged version was even a legitimate format that could be brought, thus implying that the actual version of the motion is privileged. Whether they have the votes to succeed on such a motion is unclear of course, but that's not to say they couldn't attempt it. And I'm not sure it would be a given that the Democrats would vote to keep Boehner in given the potential upsides for them if a coalition speaker becomes necessary afterwards.
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Even privileged motions require the chair to recognize you before they can be brought. (And the chair is allowed to ask you what you're going to say before they decide whether or not to recognize you.) Once you're recognized people can't derail the motion with debate or try to bring up other business, but just getting recognized by the chair is the primary tool/obstacle that keeps control of the House in the hands of the Speaker.
 
B

BobTheFork

Member
A few friends have passed me a story from DailyNewsbin. Is that source know or credible at all? The story is that forcing the reveal of Clinton's emails brought out some old archived emails she inherited from Colin Powell that have some serious dirt on Bush.

Here's the link but I'm not putting much stock in it

http://www.dailynewsbin.com/news/hillary-clintons-emails-reveal-that-george-w-bush-committed-treason/22854/

edit: The contents are supposed to be 'trick America into Iraq WMD bullshit', which I think we are kind of over.
 
B

Brawndo Addict

Banned
pigeon said:
Even privileged motions require the chair to recognize you before they can be brought. (And the chair is allowed to ask you what you're going to say before they decide whether or not to recognize you.) Once you're recognized people can't derail the motion with debate or try to bring up other business, but just getting recognized by the chair is the primary tool/obstacle that keeps control of the House in the hands of the Speaker.
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I guess the fear would be that such a motion comes from someone unexpected or arises unexpectedly during necessary business. I'm not familiar with the Robert's Rules of Order, but I would imagine that there's plenty of arcane avenues for them to take in trying to sneak someone into getting recognized or trying to force recognition. And given the must-address issues whose deadlines are quickly approaching, that could provide the kind of chaotic environment that would be necessary to pull something like that off. If there was an opportune time for the FC to go completely crazy, it would increasingly seem like this is the ideal time to do it. But to your broader point I am clearly wrong as it relates to them being able to bring it up on demand without issue.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Brawndo Addict said:
I guess the fear would be that such a motion comes from someone unexpected or arises unexpectedly during necessary business. I'm not familiar with the Robert's Rules of Order, but I would imagine that there's plenty of arcane avenues for them to take in trying to sneak someone into getting recognized or trying to force recognition. And given the must-address issues whose deadlines are quickly approaching, that could provide the kind of chaotic environment that would be necessary to pull something like that off. But to your broader point I am clearly wrong as it relates to them being able to bring it up on demand.
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Yeah, I mean, something along those lines would have to happen. Like, if the entire GOP hated Boehner but he was still Speaker, they'd get rid of him by waiting for him to put somebody else in as chair while he went to the bathroom or whatever and then raising the motion then. But otherwise there's just a ton of power in the hands of the Speaker with the current rules.

It would be kind of amazing if Boehner ACCIDENTALLY recognized somebody from the Freedom Caucus and got deposed in the middle of passing a debt ceiling, though.

Also we'd all die.
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
Black Mamba said:
blog_uninsured_cdc_cbo_1.jpg


Stupid Obamacare failing!
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Needs a note like on those phone review benchmarks "Uninsured Americans vs CBO benchmark (Lower is Better)"
 
I

Incognito

Troll
Donald Trump and Ben Carson Gain Strength in Poll of Republicans
Trump - 25
Carson -22

Rubio - 13
Bush - 8

Trump increases support

http://www.wsj.com/articles/donald-...in-strength-in-poll-of-republicans-1445288400

Donald Trump and Ben Carson continue to broaden their appeal among Republican primary voters and have widened their lead over Florida Gov. Jeb. Bush and many other more-experienced candidates, a new Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll finds.

Mr. Bush, once considered the GOP’s likely nominee, is also lagging behind his onetime protege, Florida Sen. Marco Rubio, who is emerging as the leading contender to rally the party’s establishment wing against the rise of insurgent outsiders such as Messrs. Trump and Carson.

The new poll, conducted Oct. 15-18, underscores the durability—even the gathering strength—of anti-Washington candidates who had long been viewed as likely to be flash-in-the-pan political phenomena.

The poll also tested opinion on another aspect of the Republican Party’s internal struggles, the question of who will succeed Rep. John Boehner (R., Ohio) as House speaker. GOP primary voters in the survey said it was more important to find a successor who would stand up for principles rather than seek compromise, even if that meant less work would get done, by a 56% to 40% split.
Click to expand...
 
I

Incognito

Troll
Chelsea Budgen, a Carson fan who is an at-home caregiver for her veteran husband in upstate New York, said she could support Mr. Bush. But she said she worried that Mr. Bush’s family legacy, as a son and brother of presidents, would prove to be a liability that would prevent him from winning a general election.

“I have nothing against him or his policies,” she said. “I just know Americans wouldn’t vote in another Bush.”
Click to expand...

that hurts. wonder how prevalent that sentiment is and how its impacting Bush's #'s.
 
I

Incognito

Troll
stolen from Weigel but damn, cant believe i'm saying this but erick erickson has actually written something bordering on sanity.

http://www.erickontheradio.com/2015/10/what-if-jeb-bush-walked-away/

Still, I wonder what would happen if Bush walked away. The odds are he does not, but the odds are also that as long as Jeb Bush hangs on, he prevents a necessary shake up in the race for those who are anti-establishment to look again at the field. There is a psychological hold on a lot of the anti-establishment forces convinced that Bush, by virtue of his last name and perceived second coming of Romney, will walk away with the nomination if left unchecked.

If Jeb Bush goes away, so too do many of those psychological holds, barring a Bush endorsement for someone else.

While Bush is not my choice, I do like the guy. He is a very decent, good guy. But at this point, I do wonder about his campaign. I also think there is a lot more value in Bush walking away and helping remove some of the fever gripping those opposed to another coronation by those who lined up behind McCain and Romney.

What is most striking about 2016 is the inability of the Establishment to concede its need to compromise after years of telling conservatives that they need to compromise. The Establishment would rather see the whole ship sink than see an outsider win. And in doing so, an outsider is winning and probably will win.
Click to expand...
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Incognito said:
stolen from Weigel but damn, cant believe i'm saying this but erick erickson has actually written something bordering on sanity.

http://www.erickontheradio.com/2015/10/what-if-jeb-bush-walked-away/
Click to expand...

This is partially why I think Cruz can win. He has the money, and while the establishment hates him I'd expect they'd rather he get the nomination than Trump who would destroy the party, or Carson. Right now Cruz is basically just waiting for one of them to fall. He has the superior ground game to them, he has the respect of conservative activists, he has the true believers.

If this comes down to Rubio, Cruz, and an anti-establishment candidate I definitely think Cruz can win. Assuming he doesn't have any skeletons in his closet because lord knows there are people in the GOP who would love to blow his life up.
 
M

Mario

Sidhe / PikPok
Plinko said:
"He's absolutely right!" -- Average Joe Republican

This stuff means absolutely nothing, sadly.
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He seems to have a similar strategy to Trump when it comes to foreign diplomacy - "I'll just say some stuff, and then they'll do what I want"
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Mario said:
He seems to have a similar strategy to Trump when it comes to foreign diplomacy - "I'll just say some stuff, and then they'll do what I want"
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And his poll numbers have skyrocketed because of it. I feel like we're inching closer and closer to the nation portrayed in Idiocracy.
 
M

Mario

Sidhe / PikPok
Plinko said:
And his poll numbers have skyrocketed because of it. I feel like we're inching closer and closer to the nation portrayed in Idiocracy.
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The delusion of a lot of the population that the US automatically has that much leverage is astounding for sure. Unsurprising given the same demographic thinks the US is the best at everything and anything. The US isn't even objectively the most "free" nation, but try telling this crowd that.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Carson's Afghanistan comments really reveal the extent of his fuckery. He's talking without thinking, basically, looking for any avenue that makes him sound different. Everyone supported the Afghanistan war, for good reason. I understand wanting to withdraw now, but in the immediate aftermath of 911 it made sense to attack there for obvious reasons.

Carson seems like he has put zero thought into this and instead decided "all the politicians support this? Guess I'll go the opposite way!"
 
M

Manmademan

Member
PhoenixDark said:
This is partially why I think Cruz can win. He has the money, and while the establishment hates him I'd expect they'd rather he get the nomination than Trump who would destroy the party, or Carson. Right now Cruz is basically just waiting for one of them to fall. He has the superior ground game to them, he has the respect of conservative activists, he has the true believers.

If this comes down to Rubio, Cruz, and an anti-establishment candidate I definitely think Cruz can win. Assuming he doesn't have any skeletons in his closet because lord knows there are people in the GOP who would love to blow his life up.
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Yeah buddy get on that Cruz train.

Ted Cruz has actually been out fundraising both Bush AND Rubio...the latter by almost double. His poll numbers aren't anything spectacular, but there's been a steady climb here.

The guy is an absolute shitheel but he IS a very good, very capable politician- which you absolutely cannot say about Bush, and probably won't be able to say about Rubio for a few years yet.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Plus Cruz looks like the Reagan puppet from the Land of Confusion music video, so he has that going for him.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Cruz is harmless. If he ever came close to getting the nom, the turtle would find a way to wreck him again. Heck, even fuckabee wrecked him. He's the Trump that can't handle the heat.

Retromelon said:
Jeb: *spreads hands, shakes head dismissively*
Click to expand...

Can't find any legit source for that schiavo thang, btw.

melon, you've disappointed me.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Really important numbers that were overlooked in that latest poll:

When Republican voters are asked to name their second choice in the race, 22 percent name Carson, compared with 14 percent for Trump, 13 percent for Rubio and 10 percent for Fiorina.
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When you put first/second choices together, Carson has 44 and Trump has 39.
 
M

Manmademan

Member
Plinko said:
Really important numbers that were overlooked in that latest poll:



When you put first/second choices together, Carson has 44 and Trump has 39.
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not really a surprise, carson has the highest likeability scores of anyone on either side of the race.

Of course, it's also worth pointing out that virtually no one has attacked Carson yet. At all. The only wounds he's gotten have been self inflicted- and his audience doesn't really seem to care too much about those.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Rep. Brendan Boyle (D-Pa.) on Monday said he has been told by an unidentified source that Vice President Biden is running for president.

"I have a very good source close to Joe that tells me VP Biden will run for Prez," Boyle, a freshman lawmaker, tweeted shortly before noon on Monday.

Shortly before that tweet, Boyle sent another reminding followers that Bill Clinton launched his 1992 White House bid in October of that year.

Anticipation for Biden's decision has reached a fever pitch, with Democrats anxious to know his plans in the wake of the first Democratic debate last week.

Reports indicate an announcement from Biden could come soon. The vice president has been wrestling with the decision for months.

Sen. Chris Coons (D-Del.), a top supporter of Biden, said earlier Monday that Biden is expected to decide about entering the race soon.
Click to expand...
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/257312-pennsylvania-dem-joe-is-in
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Plinko said:
Really important numbers that were overlooked in that latest poll:



When you put first/second choices together, Carson has 44 and Trump has 39.
Click to expand...

Carson is this election's Michelle Bachmann. I'm positive he will fizzle out before the year ends. He is just floating to the top because there is no big issue to paint him negatively for the primary voters. Eventually they will get tired of him and move on. I predict that's when Rufio will start to steal disaffected Carson voters.
 
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