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PoliGAF 2015 |OT2| Pls print

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P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Incognito said:
exactly. anyone who thinks the utter disaster that was the ACA rollout didn't affect the election is smoking something serious. i mean, i love the ACA, my fiancee will be getting on a platinum plan when enrollment comes around, and i worked for the obama campaign in both 2008 and 12, and you are exactly right. it was demoralizing and worst of all, a totally unforced error that resulted in weeks, if not months, of negative coverage. it was to be honest, depressing. and yes, it completely shifted the spotlight off the government shutdown and the damage to the GOP and onto a government program that comically flopped therefore reinforcing the GOP argument in the first place: that government is too big, unwiedly, and cant be relied upon.

i still get pissed thinking about it especially because of how successful the ACA has functioned since then. it was an anchor on the entire democratic field, and frankly they deserved it.
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The ACA rollout disaster was one of those moments where you had to miss Bill Clinton. Clinton was the type of president who would be curious about whether his super important healthcare coverage website was working - not a week before launch, not a month before launch, but months in advance.

I understand and largely agree with Obama's view on the 24 hour news cycle not mattering in the historical long term...but how many fuck ups can you have because you simply can't be bothered to do the little things? How many unforced errors can one White House sustain?

Especially when the entire point of your presidency revolves around the idea that government can do various things, can improve, etc. Yet people look at the government and still see a giant fuck up. Whether it's the ACA rollout or the VA or just about anything else.

I've been saying this for years. You can't excite your base when they're constantly cringing over some fuck up. How could many congressman run on the ACA in 2014 while getting mail from constituents about plans being cancelled/disappearing, the website not working, etc etc etc? There simply wasn't anything to hang your hat on. This isn't an Obama specific problem BTW, Clinton had the same problem in 1994. Midterms are about the base, and the base of the party in the WH tends to be apathetic due to their "team" not getting anything done that can be celebrated.

To make matters worse, the ACA's largest benefits go to people who don't even vote. Poor people, lower working class, etc. Whereas if you're a middle class/uneducated voter you're looking at your premium going up and automatically assuming it must be because of Obamacare. No wonder the law is still unpopular.
 
R

Retromelon

Member
dehydratedbabies said:
But... Money! Money exists and it's important it does not grow on trees! Plus, the government can't do ANYTHING right! Ever drive on a road? Exactly!

In before the "Bernie can't win #QueenHillary2008" squad.

But seriously, thank you for an issue-based thread, OP.
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Lmfaooo is there anything i can do to get the thread title changed to the bolded
 
D

Diablos

Member
BertramCooper said:
Why are you guys talking about health care when there's that new Trump/Carson poll out? Get your priorities straight.

Trump is all like...

giphy.gif


...right now.
Click to expand...
What does that picture mean?
 
P

PantherLotus

Professional Schmuck
We should start a website: ThingsTrumpSaysThatLiberalsSupport:

-- protecting social security
-- protecting medicare
-- taxing the wealthy more

Hey, pretty good start!
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
PantherLotus said:
We should start a website: ThingsTrumpSaysThatLiberalsSupport:

-- protecting social security
-- protecting medicare
-- taxing the wealthy more

Hey, pretty good start!
Click to expand...

I've been saying this for a while, Trump's wrecking ball effect on the current GOP setup is more interesting and complicated then "he just says what they're saying". I fucking love that his attack on Walker was for wrecking Wisconsin's infrastructure, Rubio or Cruz would never dare attack Walker that way because they'd do the same thing
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Incognito said:
a government program that comically flopped therefore reinforcing the GOP argument in the first place: that government is too big, unwiedly, and cant be relied upon.
Click to expand...
Obamacare never failed. The shit about ACA website disaster played into fears of people, not GOP talking points. It was a godsend to the RNC for the elections because frankly, no one imagined a technical glitchfest nightmare. GOP told us Obamacare would fail for different reasons (jobkiller, premium hikes, illegal, etc), but the interface to Obamacare failed. GOP and media just conflated the two and played to the fears of people that Obamacare was a failure. To PD's point, the White House could have handled the PR better. Obama could have done a few primetime addresses to the nation saying there is nothing to fear, and that this "problem" allowed everyone to see how much people wanted affordable health care so much so that they logjammed the website. Dispatch Sebellius and sponsors to sunday shows, late night talk shows, etc.

Own it, and shoot every fuckhead that says it's a disaster, count the names, note the backstabbers, move on.
 
P

PantherLotus

Professional Schmuck
The Technomancer said:
I've been saying this for a while, Trump's wrecking ball effect on the current GOP setup is more interesting and complicated then "he just says what they're saying". I fucking love that his attack on Walker was for wrecking Wisconsin's infrastructure, Rubio or Cruz would never dare attack Walker that way because they'd do the same thing
Click to expand...

Right. More specifically, he's an economically centrist, racist/sexist, bombastic hawk. He's America. He says the obvious thing but he also say the racist thing.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Trump is the gift that keeps on giving. He's batshit insane, but he's saying everything about the GOP that the Democrats are too spineless to say because he literally has nothing to lose. He is drowning in money, he will forever be drowning in money, and so what about his reality TV show?

He can go back to all of his money after the election is over, as opposed to all of the other members of the Carnival of Twats who have to crawl back with nothing to show except a lot of bluster.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
Wilsongt said:
Trump is the gift that keeps on giving. He's batshit insane, but he's saying everything about the GOP that the Democrats are too spineless to say because he literally has nothing to lose. He is drowning in money, he will forever be drowning in money, and so what about his reality TV show?

He can go back to all of his money after the election is over, as opposed to all of the other members of the Carnival of Twats who have to crawl back with nothing to show except a lot of bluster.
Click to expand...

Yes, I love it! Best election season to spectate, mostly because of Trump!
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Diablos said:
What does that picture mean?
Click to expand...

The picture is supposed to represent a lost member of the Democrat Party running from voters coming to get ha, or from the DOJ coming to file charges against ha, or because she is Feeling the Bern and she is hence running for ha superdelegates. You can see the impassioned sadness, the fear, the desperation on the part of this member of the Democrat Party's face. The panic is real. The run is real. The woman is ha.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I'll never understand that one poster's obsession with trying to make that gif a thing. Did they create it? Is that why they kept pushing it?
 
B

BertramCooper

Banned
It's going to be real rich hearing the GOP candidates wax poetic about Ronald Reagan in front of Reagan's fucking airplane, and then two minutes later, hear about how shitty and reckless the Iran deal is.

The irony will obviously be completely lost on GOP primary voters.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
BertramCooper said:
It's going to be real rich hearing the GOP candidates wax poetic about Ronald Reagan in front of Reagan's fucking airplane, and then two minutes later, hear about how shitty and reckless the Iran deal is.

The irony will obviously be completely lost on GOP primary voters.
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I've been giggling about that, and about the idea that Reagan's 11th Commandment is about to be flung into the trash heap, set ablaze, stomped-out, and pissed-upon. Jeb's donors are reportedly getting antsy, Rand says he's going after Trump, etc.

Part of me is amazed that the "he's liberal!" attacks haven't been working. What an odd, odd cycle. But then again, to the base voters at least, the folks making those charges don't have much credibility.
 
K

KingGondo

Banned
HylianTom said:
Part of me is amazed that the "he's liberal!" attacks haven't been working. What an odd, odd cycle. But then again, to the base voters at least, the folks making those charges don't have much credibility.
Click to expand...
Trump isn't terribly evasive about it though. He just says he changed his mind, insults the other (eminently insult-able) candidate, and talks some more about how successful and smart he is.

The weakness of the rest of the field is Trump's biggest strength. I thought 2012 was a joke but this is way, way worse.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
KingGondo said:
Trump isn't terribly evasive about it though. He just says he changed his mind, insults the other (eminently insult-able) candidate, and talks some more about how successful and smart he is.

The weakness of the rest of the field is Trump's biggest strength. I thought 2012 was a joke but this is way, way worse.
Click to expand...
His shamelessness about changing his mind is acting like an amazing shield. Off the topic of my head, I can't imagine any other politician who could get away with what he's done so far. As far as the GOP primary goes, he has them figured out.

Meanwhile, my morning reading of FreeRepublic has found a thread on this very topic.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/3337386/posts

There's some angst, for sure. But a lot of folks are hand-waving away the liberal charges.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Y'know, its a good thing he said all that racist stuff from the outset, because a Trump that somehow managed to make it to the general without hostilizing minorities would be a genuine cause for worry.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
sc0la said:
Where is empty vessel? He would tell you this is literally impossible. "the public deficit is the private surplus"
Click to expand...

Government spending is a part of GDP, so it is litterally impossible.

Debt to GDP can go over 100% but government share of GDP cannot.
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
this quote from a cnn piece on debate questions made me laugh:

Gary Bauer said:
Putin is flexing his muscles in Ukraine and Syria. Russian bombers challenge U.S. airspace. Chinese warships recently approached Alaska. The Middle East is unraveling. Iran is promising a second Holocaust and arming Hezbollah. As president you will inherit a shrinking military and face severe restraints on defense spending. What will you do as commander-in-chief to convince the world's dictators that the Obama era is over and that America will return to a robust Reaganesque policy of peace through strength?
Click to expand...


http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/15/opinions/roundup-questions-for-debate/index.html
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
I like how that guy implied that Jinping is a dictator.

Also dear god at Dean Cain.
-
oh shit
Fred Willard said:
"President Ronald Reagan said, 'Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!' Why would the U.S. build one?"
Click to expand...

that's damn good.
 
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