When it's the president doing the lying I think it should be, but yeah, it won't be.
Also, please don't let it be Tulsi come 2020. Seriously, I'm not even a fan of Bernie, but I will take him any day over her.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2016 |OT16| Unpresidented
- Thread starter ItWasMeantToBe19
- Start date
- Status
When it's the president doing the lying I think it should be, but yeah, it won't be.
Also, please don't let it be Tulsi come 2020. Seriously, I'm not even a fan of Bernie, but I will take him any day over her.
This is the main reason I dislike the "corronation" narrative of 2016. Anybody else was free to run, and they would have had a "historically bad" candidate to run against in the primary. They didn't run.
Dominican Power
Member
No one expected Bernie Sanders make noise and start a movement.
shinra-bansho
Member
What movement? The one led by Liberal Icon Tulsi Gabbard and incorruptible hero Alan Grayson. There is no movement, only memes. The people organising and mobilising are the groups with the most to lose the Planned Parenthoods and immigration groups.
Someone had to be not-Hillary.
The advent of social media and digital fundraising from poor college kids simply made that candidate stick around longer that the Bradleys and Deans of the past.
Someone had to be not-Hillary.
The advent of social media and digital fundraising from poor college kids simply made that candidate stick around longer that the Bradleys and Deans of the past.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
Warren would have a lot more fundraising cash than Gillibrand. NE is a fundraising powerhouse and Warren wouldn't have much competition there, unlike Gillibrand in NY.
Personally I don't think she's a good politician, and the dumbest thing we could do is trot out an east coast professor against Donald Trump.
Money wise I think it's going to be Booker (Cali/Silicon Valley, Seattle) v Warren (NE). Money alone doesn't win so I'm hoping to god that someone ensures neither become the nominee. My fear is that Booker sweeps the south and pretty much has the nom in the bag early.
shinra-bansho
Member
My mistake. I thought Gillary was supposed to have been a fundraising star. And she does seem to be. But Warren is too. The national profile probably helping.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
She does very well in New York for her campaigns but senate races are different from national presidential primaries. She has no competition for NY cash in a senate race, whereas in a national race I don't think she would dominate the state's fundraising community like say...George W Bush dominated Texas or Obama dominates Chicago. Booker does a lot of fundraisers in NY too, Warren win over some of the more liberal NY donors, etc.
Aside from charter school fuckery (which I don't entirely understand but I'll trust others when they say there is bad news there) why is Booker bad again? Is he like super corrupt or something?
Also some reading (though some of these articles may have already been posted in here):
How the blueprint for from Jesse Jackson's 1984 campaign may be important for the future
Battle over Identity Politics, explained (makes some arguments we've made in here before)
Also some reading (though some of these articles may have already been posted in here):
How the blueprint for from Jesse Jackson's 1984 campaign may be important for the future
Battle over Identity Politics, explained (makes some arguments we've made in here before)
gutter_trash
Banned
New Jersey is synonymous with corruption; many political careers have been killed do to it regardless of party lines
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
If you listen to people from Newark, he seems more interested in his own profile than actual politicking. The famous story about him running to grab a woman diapers made him look really good, but the issue wasn't that she couldn't afford them but that the roads needed plowing and the city hadn't been up to the task. This Politico article covers it pretty well http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/07/cory-booker-hillary-clinton-veep-newark-214030
That Slate article is really good, I was going to share it earlier but I was on mobile.
BoosterDuck
Banned
oh boy, another neo-nazi rally is about to start yippee PRAISE MEIN FUHRER
edit: goddamn, this fucking dad rock is grating my ears
edit: goddamn, this fucking dad rock is grating my ears
I voted for Sanders and then Clinton. I loved Sanders, but realize he was far from perfect. I wasn't a fan of Clinton, and didn't think she was a good candidate, but I thought she would win and be a pretty decent president. At least a lot better than Bill. I don't like Gabbard or Booker for 2020. I like Warren, but I have concerns about her in a general and she's probably too old. Kamala Harris is my favorite of the potential contenders, as far as I can tell so far, but who knows what will happen. 4 years is a long time.
But can we please stop this stupid fucking labeling and insulting of voters who all mostly agree on shit? Whether it's calling other posters corporate shills or alt-left racists, can we please just stop this damn infighting? It's annoying as shit.
I just hope that whatever job I find after graduating this month has good healthcare, or I'm screwed. A lot of my family is probably screwed regardless, because we're all on the exchanges and heavily subsidized.
To be fair, Bernie has a very folksy atmosphere about him, a "working man" if you will. Even his history reflects this, parents died when he was young, worked odd/blue collar jobs like being a Carpenter, ran for office in a story that almost seems cut from an under dog movie etc. Warren may project in image of a "liberal elite" even though she is very much for people.
Like I have said before, the next democratic president will be someone we haven't even heard of yet and that will be in 2024.
Though fundraising shouldn't be an issue, Trump and Bernie have both proved the donor class isn't as important anymore.
NYTimes - Trump Fires Senior Advisers Son From Transition for Sharing Fake News
Well... that's something.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
Anyone was free to run against a powerful member of the party who was entirely behind her, regardless if she was a good candidate or not.
The coronation was a thing. It wasn't the only thing, but there were plenty of people here who wanted exactly that.
Indeed. Keep the pressure on.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
The main reason I don't like the coronation narrative is because she was the prohibitive nominee in 2008 too until she lost to a better candidate.
And_Gignac
Member
He got 47%. Let it go. Bernie side of the narrative won.
cooljeanius
Member
Exactly, which is why it was stronger this time around. The coronation of 2008 was upset on the understanding that she'd get it next time around, i.e., this time around in 2016. While in 2008 she could still run again later, 2016 was pretty much her last chance, hence the stronger desire for a coronation for her this time.
He is not even president yet. Least scandal-ridden presidency right to the most scandal-ridden in history. And a media totally complicit in allowing this monster to thrive.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I think the honeymoon with the media will end
Ultimately, scandals and controversy make a ton of money. A lot more money than reporting random 1k meaningless jobs Trump is claiming he helped bring when he didn't do anything.
Right now covering him as the president-elect is the big story. He isn't really able to actually do anything of consequence, so the couple things he claims to do now are all he can claim.
When he actually starts building a record, it'll change. The media wasn't really all that kind of Bush towards the end when everything started falling apart.
Ultimately, scandals and controversy make a ton of money. A lot more money than reporting random 1k meaningless jobs Trump is claiming he helped bring when he didn't do anything.
Right now covering him as the president-elect is the big story. He isn't really able to actually do anything of consequence, so the couple things he claims to do now are all he can claim.
When he actually starts building a record, it'll change. The media wasn't really all that kind of Bush towards the end when everything started falling apart.
I would assume it is in fact due to the attention given to them spreading the Pizzagate nonsense, but only Michael Flynn the son was deemed expendable and not worth the trouble.
They are not complicit in the sense they are particularly positive about Trump even now, far right media like Fox News aside. They keep allowing Trump to win headlines over manufactured controversies like Hamilton dispute while giving relatively minor coverage to huge breeches in ethics like Ivanka listening in on calls or the Trump University settlement.
They keep letting an absolute buffoon control how he wants coverage to go. His victory rally is absurd for example yet they keep cutting from huge diplomatic mistakes to hear Trump fellate himself on TV with his horrendous third grade speaking talent for his white supremacist audience.
shinra-bansho
Member
That's Mitten's number, not Birdie's.
Also, what narrative? Winning nothing, be it the primary, lower race primaries and elections, ballot measures - clearly provides a compelling narrative. A mandate and authority.
Seriously, what movement?
Where is this movement?
The organisation, whose name no one even remembers, has done zero and from memory already imploded.
What tangibles have been delivered? Go on.
Obama ran against Hillary and won. There was proof in 2008, exactly the previous primary, that it could be done.
metalslimer
Member
I want to see the receipts
Rick Santorum is the devil. He basically just told a dreamer that is a mechanical engineer supporting her community that she should get fucked and go to a different country. Incredible lack of empathy. It's one thing to spew that shit from a podium, it's another to look them in the eye and still hold that view or not even attempt to moderate it.
OWS 2.0.
Haha seriously people most of us are old enough to remember 2008 and even voted in it. Bernie was a shitty candidate and didnt do what he needed to do to win and was demolished by votes. Just stahp lol
Can we stop with this stupid fucking bullshit about Bernie and Hillary already? It's over. They both fucking lost and now here we are still fighting the battle but the war is over. We need to get past this otherwise we're gonna get creamed in '18 and '20. Bernie and Hillary are out there fighting this orange fucking monster. How about we follow their example because I don't want 8 years of this shit.
Sorry for being angry but man, we gotta wake up already. The man is so damaging and he's not even president yet.
Sorry for being angry but man, we gotta wake up already. The man is so damaging and he's not even president yet.
Exactly.
In-fucking-deed.
shinra-bansho
Member
This is all segue from that Warren will lose if she runs in the next Primary.
minor effort
Banned
That's still the funny thing. People want to believe the Clintons are the all-controlling puppetmasters of the Democratic party who can bend anyone to their will and crush all opposition, but still got beat by a freshman Senator the first time Hillary ran.
Sometimes people just lose primaries.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Santorum, like Huckabee or Cruz, is a genuine, glassy-eyed evangelical and nationalist nutcase. They represent a core component of the modern GOP, which is why its party line is "Fuck you, we got ours, we'll always have it, we'll do anything to keep you down and out, and we do it because we're American, righteous, and take our authority from God."
But their are pointless narratives to post rationalize!
This is my favorite typo of the week btw
Wait, where is Hillary fighting Trump? I know Bernie is, but Hillary seems to have Romneyed-out of the spotlight. Its to be expected I suppose after such an embarrassing loss, though her losing relevancy is probably the only silver lining of the situation, even if I would have preferred the alternative.
But this is the reality we live in, and questioning ourselves and looking at what failed is the only way to move past this, so I think the infighting is necessary- finding out what direction the party needs to move. Its the perfect time for the progressives to make their mark, the situation with the Dakota Access Pipeline reinvigorated my optimism. Bernie was there at the white house, loudly protesting it and in the back of my mind, even as a supporter I thought he was wasting his time but something actually came of it. Who would have known.
Someone here remarked that the 2016 primaries were a coronation. I'm using 2008 as an example of how you can have 'heavily backed' candidate up against a contender and the contender won.
So yes, I'm basically saying that candidates could have gone up against Hillary and tried to take her down. Hillary having majority of the party backing is not an excuse to be wielded as reasons why a candidate couldn't have run against her.
God knows Chaffee and Webb threw their hats in the ring, and even Martin O'Malley gave it a shot.
Don't read too fast, Amirox.
shinra-bansho
Member
That pipeline is going ahead when Trump is sworn in anyway.
This gives me an idea. Obama should do a bunch of executive orders and similar actions just so trump has to waste time undoing them.
Dems need to fix their shit at the local and state level first and foremost. I don't want constitutional amendments for everything the GOP holds near and dear to their hearts. We have to stop them from steamrolling all the Gov seats and state legislatures
I expect Dems to take a huge clobbering in 2018 in the Senate and lose even more ground in state elections. 2020 is our best hope. I have a great deal of respect for Pelosi but picking her as the leader again is just stupid politics.
I expect Dems to take a huge clobbering in 2018 in the Senate and lose even more ground in state elections. 2020 is our best hope. I have a great deal of respect for Pelosi but picking her as the leader again is just stupid politics.
- Status