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[Pixieking]

'We're called redneck, ignorant, racist. That's not true': Trump supporters explain why they voted for him

They see an outsider unbeholden to a corrupt and rotten political system and brave enough to stake bold positions. They consider him fearless enough to defy the confines of political correctness. They view him as a vastly successful businessman, but possessing a common touch: a workingman’s billionaire

They see someone who's already turning their back on them.

Also, the point about "successful businessman"? These are people who never believed anything about him not paying contractors, buying Chinese steel or filing for bankruptcy. Impervious to fact, basing everything on "feelings".

They lost the WH and continue to get clobbered in state legislatures across the country. Vermont of all states has a Republican Gov now! They lost ground. Tons of it.

Come on man - haven't you read the past couple of dozen pages where everyone's talking about how to recapture House and Senate? Because winning the WH when you have a minority senate is just what Obama's had to put up with, and would have made Hillary a lame-duck for 4 years.

Yea, no doubt it's bad. But also, if you admit defeat like this, then you're just disrespecting everyone who relies on the Democrats in the future - everyone from Adam to people who use Planned Parenthood. No, everything is not doomed. Because if you believe that, there is literally nothing you can do, and a modern-day Hitler is in power for 8 years. We cannot let that happen.

 

[Metalingus5150]

You know it's bad when your roommate, who is here illegally, says that Trump will be a great president.

 

[Aaron Strife]

They lost the WH and continue to get clobbered in state legislatures across the country. Vermont of all states has a Republican Gov now! They lost ground. Tons of it.


Oh, it's going to be a loon. Brace yourself. The court is gone for the rest of your adult life once Breyer and RBG are out.

Also I think Trump is going to bend to the will of his party, not to mention his top advisors and cabinet. Case in point, this is what Kellyanne Conway just said:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-clinton-obama-to-calm-anti-trump-protesters/

We're doomed.

Ok this election sucked but people are so fixated on Vermont having a GOP governor and it really isn't that big of a deal. Dude was the lt governor for years and has a Dem+wacky far left third party supermajority that will override any veto he makes. Just about the only state where the GOP is further down the hole is Hawaii where the Democrats just picked up the only State Senate seat held by a Republican giving them a 25-0 majority.

 

[Totakeke]

You know it's bad when your roommate, who is here illegally, says that Trump will be a great president.

Maybe he really wants to go back home.

 

[kingkitty]

I guess one silver lining to this election is that it might help us make some okay gains on the state level in 2018, which we really need to do. Although maybe Trump passes the bar of not flashing his dick in public, leading us to lose another midterm bigly. But I want to stay optimistic.

 

[A Human Becoming]

He had Clinton at 80% election day too.

Nate Cohn actually laid out how Trump could win. Silver was only about well Polls could be wrong.

FiveThirtyEight had 71% for Clinton on election day which I saw someone post here before is the same percentage Trump's internal data had. He got it wrong like everyone else, but at least he was right that forecasters were too confident.

I don't want to hear 'trash Nate' from anyone here again. Nate got so much shit for factors he was right about, specifically undecideds and polling errors going one direction. People were so confident Hillary was going to win they dismissed anything that showed concern and I was wrong to get sucked into it.

 

[Gruco]

He had Clinton at 80% election day too.

Nate Cohn actually laid out how Trump could win. Silver was only about well Polls could be wrong.

Cohn obliterated Silver this cycle. Absolutely flawless victory

And people said not to worry about Bernie poisoning the well.

TBH we should also be more upset w Hills for poisoning the well against Obama. It ended up not mattering because Obama was amazing, anti-Bush, Great Recession, etc. But given the tea party backlash and now this, it's worth saying.

Obviously the latent Obama-hate would have come out in some way eventually but her behavior in 2008 was unacceptable. Next primary with Democrats needs to involve people being friends.

 

[royalan]

I guess one silver lining to this election is that it might help us make some okay gains on the state level in 2018, which we really need to do. Although maybe Trump passes the bar of not flashing his dick in public, leading us to lose another midterm bigly. But I want to stay optimistic.

We can't let that happen. As Democrats we cannot continue to let Republicans create and control narratives.

 

[geomon]

I guess one silver lining to this election is that it might help us make some okay gains on the state level in 2018, which we really need to do. Although maybe Trump passes the bar of not flashing his dick in public, leading us to lose another midterm bigly. But I want to stay optimistic.

If this election taught us anything, we can't take any anti Trump sentiment at face value. We have to get out there and work our asses off to get those votes and start winning some races.

 

[Aaron Strife]

I think the biggest thing Democrat voters need to adapt to is this idea of electing GOP downballot as checks and balances for a Democratic president is a fucking stupid idea. Oh gee, you split your ballot for Hillary and your GOP Congressfuck who you rewarded for not hating gays as much? Well cool, now Trump is president and Republicans have total control of the government. That worked.

But I guess I don't really know how to overcome that since it's more of an annoying feel-good "good government" tendency everyone slightly rational seems to be programmed with.

Liberals need to stop throwing a fucking parade for every Republican who steps out of line. Like, okay cool if we can get Susan Collins' vote every once in a while, but let's not start talking about how great John Kasich or Chris Christie is because a Democrat is almost always preferable.

John McCain spent this whole election washing Trump's balls after a fucking draft dodger mocked him for being captured while saying they would block any Hillary appointee for four years without question. And he's still held up as an example of a "reasonable" Republican. Fuck that noise.

 

[thebloo]

Because he didn't have Hillary at a 6,000% chance to win.

I basically never call people out, but you have never contributed in this thread, ever. You just like to spill your bitterness all over the place.

Believing someone is right just because they've been right before is a big reason why we're here.

One of the 1600 guys (Favreau) made this point talking about the Obama campaign from 2008. Some of those guys (including himself) were low level with not much experience. Winning in 2008 just made them winners, not all-knowing.

 

[Pixieking]

We can't let that happen. As Democrats we cannot continue to let Republicans create and control narratives.

Yeah, another media failing that we both need to address amongst ourselves, and need to make sure doesn't occur in the media again. Just because Trump passes a bar, doesn't mean that we should congratulate him or accept that he's done good.

Fuck that noise, yo.

I think the biggest thing Democrat voters need to adapt to is this idea of electing GOP downballot as checks and balances for a Democratic president is a fucking stupid idea. Oh gee, you split your ballot for Hillary and your GOP Congressfuck who you rewarded for not hating gays as much? Well cool, now Trump is president and Republicans have total control of the government. That worked.

But I guess I don't really know how to overcome that since it's more of an annoying feel-good "good government" tendency everyone slightly rational seems to be programmed with.

Liberals need to stop throwing a fucking parade for every Republican who steps out of line. Like, okay cool if we can get Susan Collins' vote every once in a while, but let's not start talking about how great John Kasich or Chris Christie is because a Democrat is almost always preferable.

John McCain spent this whole election washing Trump's balls after a fucking draft dodger mocked him for being captured while saying they would block any Hillary appointee for four years without question. And he's still held up as an example of a "reasonable" Republican. Fuck that noise.

Again, it seems so bizarre that American politics and political discussion is like this. People dismiss approaching potentially racist/sexist WWC to get their votes, and yet are happy when anti-abortion Republicans cross the aisle.

Like, you wot mate?

 

[Totakeke]

Because liberals are rational actors... I don't know what can be done.

Like even if democrats had the Senate majority, I don't see democrats blocking SC appointment for four years.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Because liberals are rational actors... I don't know what can be done.

Like even if democrats had the Senate majority, I don't see democrats blocking SC appointment for four years.

They should really stop being rational actors. It's what got us into this mess.

 

[Totakeke]

They should really stop being rational actors. It's what got us into this mess.

A non working government also plays into the republican hands. There's no winning play.

 

[Diablos]

You know it's bad when your roommate, who is here illegally, says that Trump will be a great president.

...what

 

[royalan]

Because liberals are rational actors... I don't know what can be done.

You can be a rational actor without being a fucking idiot. You can be rational without capitulating.

Case in point, Van Jones. One of the best surrogates on CNN, but one of the MOST aggravating. Because for every minute he spent giving good commentary on the election, he'd spend TWO minutes trying to capitulate and find "common ground" with a Trump surrogate.. Every time I turned away from CNN it was because of him. You don't find "common ground" with fucking Jeffrey Lord, a man who truly believes that the Democrats are the party that still represents racism in America. You just don't. You weaken yourself when you do.

And that right there is the Democratic party nutshell. We like to be right, but we continuously fail to be unyielding in our rightness. Where Republicans are unyielding period, right or wrong.

We need more Elizabeth Warrens and Cory Bookers; people who are absolutely bullish.

 

[GutsOfThor]

I think people forgot how quickly things can change. It sucks right now. It's awful. But remember back after W was elected, and Dems were in a fetal position saying 2012 would be their next best chance since George Allen was being anointed as W's natural successor? Dems were in disarray, Dean was being branied about as the savior since Kerry was too milquetoast and cost everyone the election, and talking heads proclaimed that if Dems ever wanted to win again then they needed to make peace with religious voters and find another southern candidate.

And then W's second term started and voila. Policies matter. Cabinets matter. Hell, even SC appoinement matters. Bendark Kirik. Harriet Meirs. The Saudi Port flare up. Social Secuirty privatization. Alberto Gonazalez. The wholescale cleanup of U.S. Attorneys.

Democrats just need to be ready to pounce, recognzing that Trump and his team are an order of magnitude more incompetent and vindictive than W and his team could ever hope to be. The fuckups will happen, and soon.

We didn't lose this election by a landslide. We lost by a few hundred thousand votes mainly by shooting ourselves in the foot and some truly terrible campaign decisions. I honestly don't see the need to "blow up" they party. It does need to be rebuilt, preferably from the local level up, that much is obvious. But this will be a great time to hone in on some truly progressive ideals that prospective candidates can spar over the next four years.

Thanks for this. I guess you're right. After what happened Tuesday, who knows what the fuck can happen going forward.

 

[Totakeke]

You can be a rational actor without being a fucking idiot. You can be rational without capitulating.

Case in point, Van Jones. One of the best surrogates on CNN, but one of the MOST aggravating. Because for every minute he spent giving good commentary on the election, he'd spend TWO minutes trying to capitulate and find "common ground" with a Trump surrogate.. Every time I turned away from CNN it was because of him. You don't find "common ground" with fucking Jeffrey Lord, a man who truly believes that the Democrats are the party that still represents racism in America. You just don't. You weaken yourself when you do.

And that right there is the Democratic party nutshell. We like to be right, but we continuously fail to be unyielding in our rightness. Where Republicans are unyielding period, right or wrong.

We need more Elizabeth Warrens and Cory Bookers; people who are absolutely bullish.

I agree on Van Jones, people find him likeable compared to the filth on CNN but I find him to be part of the problem.

 

[Pixieking]

A non working government also plays into the republican hands. There's no winning play.

It's who controls the narrative, though, and for all Obama's fantastic oratory skills, the GOP are the absolute best at playing the media. WH, Senate and Congress GOP controlled, and I can bet that if something goes wrong, they'll swing the "Democrats are stopping us" line.

Straight-up, the Democrats need incredibly pragmatic people, both in legislature, and in their spin-room.

 

[Totakeke]

It's who controls the narrative, though, and for all Obama's fantastic oratory skills, the GOP are the absolute best at playing the media. WH, Senate and Congress GOP controlled, and I can bet that if something goes wrong, they'll swing the "Democrats are stopping us" line.

Straight-up, the Democrats need incredibly pragmatic people, both in legislature, and in their spin-room.

Right, so it goes back to the problem of messaging to the part of america that is dominated partly by radio talk shows and who knows what else on the internet at this point.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

A non working government also plays into the republican hands. There's no winning play.

It's who controls the narrative, though, and for all Obama's fantastic oratory skills, the GOP are the absolute best at playing the media. WH, Senate and Congress GOP controlled, and I can bet that if something goes wrong, they'll swing the "Democrats are stopping us" line.

Straight-up, the Democrats need incredibly pragmatic people, both in legislature, and in their spin-room.

Yup. The only reason why the GOP gets to say 'Dems ruin everything!' is because they have the loudest people and can easily blame groups at a time. (IE the whole 'Call it what it is HIllary, islamic terrorism'). Democrats would never do that because they're stepping on eggshells perpetually.

Democrats need to get as loud and as nasty as the GOP. The US has always been red and Dems have always had to hold onto what they have, in doing so they've lost alot of bite because they're afraid to lose anything that they're grasping.

 

[jtb]

You can be a rational actor without being a fucking idiot. You can be rational without capitulating.

Case in point, Van Jones. One of the best surrogates on CNN, but one of the MOST aggravating. Because for every minute he spent giving good commentary on the election, he'd spend TWO minutes trying to capitulate and find "common ground" with a Trump surrogate.. Every time I turned away from CNN it was because of him. You don't find "common ground" with fucking Jeffrey Lord, a man who truly believes that the Democrats are the party that still represents racism in America. You just don't. You weaken yourself when you do.

And that right there is the Democratic party nutshell. We like to be right, but we continuously fail to be unyielding in our rightness. Where Republicans are unyielding period, right or wrong.

We need more Elizabeth Warrens and Cory Bookers; people who are absolutely bullish.

There is no common ground with hostage-takers.

 

[royalan]

Democrats need to get as loud and as nasty as the GOP. The US has always been red and Dems have always had to hold onto what they have, in doing so they've lost alot of bite because they're afraid to lose anything that they're grasping.

Completely agreed.

In hindsight, I have to give Bernie Sanders credit for saying something that I criticized at the time: in his Rachel Maddow interview when he pointed out that there was no Left version of Fox News. He's very right about that. There's an imbalance in the force, because there is no strong far left media. So the only place to get your news are the battleground news media outlets that are always trying to represent both groups.

It's not that I necessarily WANT a left version of ignorant-ass Fox News. But without it, there's no steady drumbeat coming from the left about how the ideas and policies the right wants to push are just the fucking worse. We don't have a strong media outlet that will be spending its time zeroing in on every. single. misstep (real or imagined) that the Trump administration will make in the next four years. And I do think we're weaker without it.

 

[Revolver]

Yup. The only reason why the GOP gets to say 'Dems ruin everything!' is because they have the loudest people and can easily blame groups at a time. (IE the whole 'Call it what it is HIllary, islamic terrorism'). Democrats would never do that because they're stepping on eggshells perpetually.

Democrats need to get as loud and as nasty as the GOP. The US has always been red and Dems have always had to hold onto what they have, in doing so they've lost alot of bite because they're afraid to lose anything that they're grasping.

We need a Weiner to be a dick! I hate his ass now but he did at least show some backbone with the GOP.

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

Because liberals are rational actors... I don't know what can be done.

Like even if democrats had the Senate majority, I don't see democrats blocking SC appointment for four years.

They wouldn't need to block, just vote no.

 

[Totakeke]

They wouldn't need to block, just vote no.

What's the difference? Honest question.

 

[Pixieking]

Completely agreed.

In hindsight, I have to give Bernie Sanders credit for saying something that I criticized at the time: in his Rachel Maddow interview when he pointed out that there was no Left version of Fox News. He's very right about that. There's an imbalance in the force, because there is no strong far left media. So the only place to get your news are the battleground news media outlets that are always trying to represent both groups.

It's not that I necessarily WANT a left version of ignorant-ass Fox News. But without it, there's no steady drumbeat coming from the left about how the ideas and policies the right wants to push are just the fucking worse. We don't have a strong media outlet that will be spending its time zeroing in on every. single. misstep (real or imagined) that the Trump administration will make in the next four years. And I do think we're weaker without it.

Yeah... The GOP could have zero grassroots 50 State strategy, but with Fox, they'd still have a mobilizing force to push agendas, pressure the liberals, and generally keep people angry and motivated.

 

[MIMIC]

I basically never call people out, but you have never contributed in this thread, ever. You just like to spill your bitterness all over the place.

Give me a break. This place is an echo chamber (as dozens of people have pointed out over the last few days) and would be a complete waste of time. I remember posting here about the commander in chief forum (because no other thread on GAF was talking about it) and all I said was that I was watching it before I was attacked.

 

[31GhostsIV]

Hey US PoliGAF,

Some light Sunday reading for y'all.

Is the wall actually going to happen? http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...mp-republicans-mandate?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

 

[dramatis]

We need a Weiner to be a dick!

Could you

not say it that way

 

[Totakeke]

Give me a break. This place is an echo chamber (as dozens of people have pointed out over the last few days) and would be a complete waste of time. I remember posting here about the commander in chief forum (because no other thread on GAF was talking about it) and all I said was that I was watching it before I was attacked.

I wasn't involved during the primaries nor the aftermath of it. But to me anyone who keeps saying "echo chamber" is someone who wishes there was more of an echo chamber.

If you have actual disagreements bring it out. If you lose the argument fair and square, it means the place becomes less of an echo chamber.

 

[Diablos]

They wouldn't need to block, just vote no.

McConnell is going to nuke the filibuster for SCOTUS confirmations. He'll just make 50 votes a requirement and they've got that.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

I'm pretty sure the KGB would have found some pretty damning emails Bernie had sent. You don't have a radical past without having sent some emails you regret.

Gilibrand would have easily won, Bernie and Hillary were both badly flawed.

The Deep State should have won this for us but instead they broke for Trump

 

[Revolver]

Could you

not say it that way

Sorry. That was bad.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Kellyanne Conway threatened to sue or imprison Harry Reid this morning for criticizing Trump. Harry Reid continued to give zero fucks.

 

[MIMIC]

I wasn't involved during the primaries nor the aftermath of it. But to me anyone who keeps saying "echo chamber" is someone who wishes there was more of an echo chamber.

If you have actual disagreements bring it out. If you lose the argument fair and square, it means the place becomes less of an echo chamber.

Are you saying that there wasn't a dominant narrative being pushed and that it just came down to "losing the argument fair and square"?

 

[Totakeke]

Did she do it through an official statement or on cable news media?

Are you saying that there wasn't a dominant narrative being pushed and that it just came down to "losing the argument fair and square"?

What is the narrative you're talking about.

 

[Debirudog]

I was hoping Conway would just fly away to some other country and take all the Trump money but she insists to just blabber on and defend Trump. :/

 

[Diablos]

Kellyanne Conway threatened to sue or imprison Harry Reid this morning for criticizing Trump. Harry Reid continued to give zero fucks.

Reid probably figures he has nothing to lose as his career is over.
I can't see how he can be sued or imprisioned though. That is nuts.

 

[metalslimer]

Good for you Reid

 

[smurfx]

think i'm finally at acceptance. in the end things won't get better for my generation and will stay around the same or worse. oh well maybe the next generation will do better than us.

 

[Wilsongt]

Kellyanne Conway threatened to sue or imprison Harry Reid this morning for criticizing Trump. Harry Reid continued to give zero fucks.

Kellyanne also attacked the protestors again this morning.

If it were Trump protesters, they would be showing their right to assemble and show their frustration, but since it is Hillary supporters, they are cry babies and should be studying or getting a job or something.

The right is nothing but a sack of shit. There are very, very, very few logical and empathetic people on the right anymore.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Kellyanne Conway threatened to sue or imprison Harry Reid this morning for criticizing Trump. Harry Reid continued to give zero fucks.

Reid's going to be a thorn in the side of the Trump administration for as long as he possibly can be heh

 

[BreezyLimbo]

I wasn't involved during the primaries nor the aftermath of it. But to me anyone who keeps saying "echo chamber" is someone who wishes there was more of an echo chamber.

If you have actual disagreements bring it out. If you lose the argument fair and square, it means the place becomes less of an echo chamber.

There was definitely an echo chamber. I should know, I was part of it last month.

 

[sturgboski]

Hey US PoliGAF,

Some light Sunday reading for y'all.

Is the wall actually going to happen? http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...mp-republicans-mandate?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

I like how Trump won the EC but lost PV and its a mandate to govern whereas as Obama handily won both in both his terms and the Republicans were like "that dont mean shit, we arent going to do fuck all over anything he wants." Fuck the GOP and its supporters, seriously.

As for Kellyanne's threats: see Democrats who sat at home because Hillary wasnt excited or she didnt personally come and have dinner at your house or whatever, this is what you get. You have a president who threatened to jail his opponent in the white house and now you have any people who criticize said president or ruling party being threatened with libel and jail time. As many pointed out after Debate #2, that is a 3rd world dictatorship.

 

[Totakeke]

There was definitely an echo chamber. I should know, I was part of it last month.

Sure, I'll take your word for it. But repeating "echo chamber" is counter-productive.

 

[kirblar]

I like how Trump won the EC but lost PV and its a mandate to govern whereas as Obama handily won both in both his terms and the Republicans were like "that dont mean shit, we arent going to do fuck all over anything he wants." Fuck the GOP and its supporters, seriously.

As for Kellyanne's threats: see Democrats who sat at home because Hillary wasnt excited or she didnt personally come and have dinner at your house or whatever, this is what you get. You have a president who threatened to jail his opponent in the white house and now you have any people who criticize said president or ruling party being threatened with libel and jail time. As many pointed out after Debate #2, that is a 3rd world dictatorship.

Obama needed to go HAM and didn't in his first term. Nuke the fillibuster, pass everything, etc.

 

[Pixieking]

Generalised comments about echo chamber seem pointless... Sure, it might've been this time last week, but how is that relevant now? We've got a good discussion going and we can, maybe, turn it into some grassroots activism, right?

Wibbling about "echo chambers" is counter-productive. Got an idea? Post it.

Watching Gilmore Girls season 2: "You can't argue with cold hard facts."

Yeahhhhhhhh... no.

 

[sturgboski]

Obama needed to go HAM and didn't in his first term. Nuke the fillibuster, pass everything, etc.

But we had to reach across the aisle and mend the country, etc, etc. You know, exactly what the GOP has not and will not ever do.

Then again, even if he did go ham and pass everything, which he finally did with EO, those are easily overturned as we will see starting in January.