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[Burai]

Although corrected with usb flash drives in the next few days.

Perhaps in three months time Sony will correct this by updating the firmware to let us install Windows 7 and let Dragona play HD-DVDs? :lol

 

[gofreak]

Compared to dropping the PS2 BC and a couple of USB ports I'd say linux is a small feature.

Neither of these were taken away from an existing system. If your system had PS2 BC or had 4 USB ports it still has those. Sony went on to market other versions without those features, but the customer knew what they were buying into. This is the first time - I think? - Sony has firmware disabled a feature on existing systems.

Legally I guess they'd argue it's a choice, and wave EULAs in front of the court (whether they're worth, nothing or something). If there was a legal challenge, as long as they could drag it out in the courts ad nauseum it would be a small price to pay for them given what they think is at stake (the security of the system). There are some fairly high profile clients of PS3 Linux though, so will be interesting to see what if any reaction there is.

 

[Brofist]

Perhaps in three months time Sony will correct this by updating the firmware to let us install Windows 7 and let Dragona play HD-DVDs? :lol

I'd like for them to release a proper set of drivers that would allow me to install Windows 7 on an older Vaio first :lol

 

[iapetus]

Isn't bait and switch illegal?

 

[Drame]

I can't really say that this affects me as I have never installed nor have I thought about installing linux to my 60gb.

Sucks for the peeps that use it, though.

 

[Clear]

I'm shocked that people are acting so surprised about this. I mean when the OtherOS support was cut from the slim sku's the writing was on the wall as far as I was concerned.

As to legal fallout... not a chance. This is a firmware change, that relates to the ability to run software. These are things that are always subject to revision because they aren't hardware dependent like USB support/BC.

 

[Dead Man]

Thinking about it more, it really pisses me off. I can't think of anything else where this sort of shit would be okay.

If Sony wants to stop having OtherOS on future systems, fine (they have already done this), but to disable a feature on a product someone has already bought? Absolutley fucked.

 

[iapetus]

I'm shocked that people are acting so surprised about this. I mean when the OtherOS support was cut from the slim sku's the writing was on the wall as far as I was concerned.

So when do you believe a firmware update will remove backwards compatibility from early PS3s?

 

[gofreak]

So when do you believe a firmware update will remove backwards compatibility from early PS3s?

When it presents a security/piracy risk?

You can't compare Linux to something like BC, though I'm sure some people will try.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

i'll believe it when i see it

 

[Burai]

There are some fairly high profile clients of PS3 Linux though, so will be interesting to see what if any reaction there is.

Very little I'd imagine. These customers are almost certainly still using the same firmware that it shipped with from the factory and have likely not even seen the XMB since they first set up OtherOS.

I highly doubt some university using Cell for serious crunching is likely to be using their PS3s to play Uncharted 2. This will only affect casual Linux users.

 

[Jocchan]

So when do you believe a firmware update will remove backwards compatibility from early PS3s?

When they start selling PS2 games off the PSN and/or more collection discs?
J/k, it won't happen

Spoiler

hopefully

.

 

[hteng]

imo it's like this.

you wanna use sony's online services, you'll need to comply with their standards, this means removing the install linux feature.

now if you don't care about PSN, then you can do w/e you want with your hardware.

 

[gofreak]

When they start selling PS2 games off the PSN and/or collection discs?

I guess they'll be disabling PSone BC any day now, then...

 

[gofreak]

Very little I'd imagine. These customers are almost certainly still using the same firmware that it shipped with from the factory and have likely not even seen the XMB since they first set up OtherOS.

I highly doubt some university using Cell for serious crunching is likely to be using their PS3s to play Uncharted 2. This will only affect casual Linux users.

Yeah, but it's gonna shrink the market of systems for future purchases even further. Slim stopped the supply, and now among second hand systems, not every one will be usable.

Might make it profitable for those who don't upgrade in the longer term though.

Whether anyone could sue on that basis - for limiting the pool of usable second hand systems - I kind of doubt, though.

 

[Ninja Moomin]

You are joking right ?

When i bought my 60gig machine, it said that i could install another os, this has been taken away. Somone from sony didn't sneak into your house, steal your ps2 chip, and block your usb ports, you knew that the console did not have those features when you bought it, I paid for linux, ok i don't use it, but i paid for it and they're taking it away ??

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Seriously... this just sums up this whole thread... such a tiny % of users actually make any real use of this feature...and yet removing it is the end of the world...


This is almost as funny as OMG THEY CHANGED TEH FONT.

Given a choice i'd rather sony prioritised security over a random feature that a tiny fraction of the userbase gets any real value from.

Anyone who thinks that they shouldn't take the security of the PSN very seriously is on crack... look what happened to PSO on DC once the hackers were in...? they ruined it.

ok i don't use it, but i paid for it and they're taking it away ??

Guess you should be writing them a cheque for all the features they added for free since you paid for the all of the system OS functions as part of your purchase price?

 

[Whogie]

I'm shocked that people are acting so surprised about this. I mean when the OtherOS support was cut from the slim sku's the writing was on the wall as far as I was concerned.

I had always assumed that that was removed because they didn't feel it was worth the cost to support it on more hardware. And I'd guess that may also attribute to why they didn't hesitate to drop it so quickly for fat as well.

I'm really disappointed by this news. Linux on the PS3 was a great learning tool for me -because- it was so wonky. I learned a lot about Linux trying to sync my PS3 controller with Bluetooth, or using the VRAM as a pagefile (which made the speed bearable), etc. And, of course, I used it as a computer to...

 

[Burai]

Isn't bait and switch illegal?

It would be if OtherOS was an advertised feature. I've just scoured the packaging of my 60GB and it doesn't mention the ability to install another OS, nor does the manual in the box.

OtherOS was always an unsupported feature. Sony never made any attempt to advertise it's existence.

 

[Benedict]

imo it's like this.

you wanna use sony's online services, you'll need to comply with their standards, this means removing the install linux feature.

now if you don't care about PSN, then you can do w/e you want with your hardware.

Would you agree to buy a car that after a couple of years get some of its features taken away without some sort of compensation?

The Other-OS option was a selling point in their offer, sold with the hardware, which they can't take away without offering some sort of compensation or not do it at all.

I think this is illegal in some countries.

 

[Burai]

The Other-OS option was a selling point in their offer, sold with the hardware, which they can't take away without offering some sort of compensation or not do it at all.

No it wasn't. As shitty as this is, Other OS was never advertised by Sony and was always provided on the basis that it was unsupported and deployed at the end users own risk.

 

[snap0212]

http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

 

[Oozinator]

I call Revenge Time !

I am not going to update my Phat PS3 to this new firmware and will wait for working hacks to be released.

However, I'll buy a new PS3 slim console which will HURT Sony because they are selling the console at a loss and while I won't be buying more games than before.

 

[Burai]

http://www.playstation.com/ps3-openplatform/index.html

You'd have a point if that was linked anywhere on PlayStation.com.

There are only two ways you can find that page and that's via an external search engine or by opening the online manual and searching (you can no longer browse to that section) for "Other OS". You can't even find it via the main PlayStation.com search.

Unless you already knew it existed, there's no way you'd accidentally stumble upon it.

 

[commissar]

imo it's like this.

you wanna use sony's online services, you'll need to comply with their standards, this means removing the install linux feature.

now if you don't care about PSN, then you can do w/e you want with your hardware.

Well no it's not. I don't give a shit about PSN atm, but you can bet that future games I want to play will require a firmware update.

 

[iapetus]

It would be if OtherOS was an advertised feature. I've just scoured the packaging of my 60GB and it doesn't mention the ability to install another OS, nor does the manual in the box.

OtherOS was always an unsupported feature. Sony never made any attempt to advertise it's existence.

The manual in my box does. It's clearly visible in the menus and has been since day one. Sony run websites devoted to it. It was a supported feature.

 

[Burai]

I call Revenge Time !

I am not going to update my Phat PS3 to this new firmware and will wait for working hacks to be released.

However, I'll buy a new PS3 slim console which will HURT Sony because they are selling the console at a loss and while I won't be buying more games than before.

This is the worst revenge plan ever. It's like cutting off your own dick if you found out your wife was cheating. "Haha! No more sex for that bitch!"

Spending $300 on hardware that still doesn't support Other OS is pretty dumb. If you're that worried why not sell your PS3 and games and buy an Xbox 360 and a Blu-ray player? That way you not only deprive Sony of any more of your software purchases, you also directly benefit their competition.

 

[CrushDance]

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Seriously... this just sums up this whole thread... such a tiny % of users actually make any real use of this feature...and yet removing it is the end of the world...


This is almost as funny as OMG THEY CHANGED TEH FONT.

Given a choice i'd rather sony prioritised security over a random feature that a tiny fraction of the userbase gets any real value from.

Anyone who thinks that they shouldn't take the security of the PSN very seriously is on crack... look what happened to PSO on DC once the hackers were in...? they ruined it.




Guess you should be writing them a cheque for all the features they added for free since you paid for the all of the system OS functions as part of your purchase price?

.........

 

[gofreak]

The manual in my box does. It's clearly visible in the menus and has been since day one. Sony run websites devoted to it. It was a supported feature.

Their otheros site says that "Note that SCE does not provide any support for the installation and the use of Linux operating systems on a PS3™ system." so by that measure it was 'unsupported'.

Not to say it wasn't a 'promoted' feature though...that's more debateable.

 

[Burai]

The manual in my box does. It's clearly visible in the menus and has been since day one. Sony run websites devoted to it. It was a supported feature.

No it doesn't. The Quick Reference guide makes no reference to Other OS whatsoever.

 

[antiloop]

Linux users are a vocal minority. Most likely Sony will regret this when they all unite to break the PS3 OS.

 

[Azerach]

The manual in my box does. It's clearly visible in the menus and has been since day one. Sony run websites devoted to it. It was a supported feature.

40Gb PS3 from late 2007 and there is no mention whatsoever of otherOS in any of the manuals or documentation (I know i'm lame for still having all that stuff lying around )

 

[Jocchan]

I guess they'll be disabling PSone BC any day now, then...

I wasn't serious (I stealth-edited my post to clarify it was a joke)
But anyway PSone BC still being enabled wouldn't mean much, because it's a much older system (the number of people still able to use original discs is lower), so it can't be used as proof to rule out the possibility of them disabling PS2 BC (not that I believe they will).

 

[mclem]

They shouldn't, one day a console maker might rig the thing to blow the fuck up if you even tweak a screw on the outside.

That's okay, the Slim version will have the dynamite removed to save costs.

 

[Dr Frasier Crane]

Would you agree to buy a car that after a couple of years get some of its features taken away without some sort of compensation?

The Other-OS option was a selling point in their offer, sold with the hardware, which they can't take away without offering some sort of compensation or not do it at all.

I think this is illegal in some countries.

I would be happy for them to remove a feature that may impact on the safety of not only my car but the environment in which the cars live. More than 99% don't use this, but 99% of people would for pirating if there was the option. Sony are just trying to protect their money in a way they didn't with the PSP.

This really is no big deal and it is all due to geohot's hacking. Ask anyone in the street "Are you upset Sony are removing Other OS from the PS3?" if you get more than 1% that don't go "What the fuck?" then I will eat my own penis. And with an appropriate randomised sample not just 4 friends. I don't chew my cock willy-nilly.

 

[commissar]

"Design and specifications subject to change without notice"

Right on the back of the box :/

 

[Jamesearlcash]

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Seriously... this just sums up this whole thread... such a tiny % of users actually make any real use of this feature...and yet removing it is the end of the world...

I guess you probably own a game that only a small percentage of ps3 owners use ? How would you feel if that stopped working, even though you'd paid for it ?

 

[Dragon]

Never used it, want more than 256 megs of ram to do my programming in Linux, however I can see why people would be upset. Mostly because this is a complete reactionary move based on that geohat guy. We should blame the real culprit here. Down with geohat!!!

I guess you probably own a game that only a small percentage of ps3 owners use ? How would you feel if that stopped working, even though you'd paid for it ?

Your analogy doesn't make sense.

The hilarious thing is, it's not like it's hard to install Linux on your own computer. It takes like 20 minutes to install Karmic Ubuntu.

 

[Azerach]

I guess you probably own a game that only a small percentage of ps3 owners use ? How would you feel if that stopped working, even though you'd paid for it ?

So what about companies disabling multiplayer servers for games only 2 years old? people paid good money to play those games. OMG NOES time for a class action suit! right?

 

[Mad_Ban]

Sucks that Sony are removing it. But I think those who mainly purchased PS3's for OtherOS use will be fine methinks (military, colleges etc who don't care about connecting to PSN).

 

[No_Style]

So what about companies disabling servers for games 2 years old? people paid good money to play those games. OMG NOES time for a class action suit! right?

This is by far the best analogy.

And I think your avatar best describes some of the reactions here. :lol

 

[Ninja Moomin]

I guess you probably own a game that only a small percentage of ps3 owners use ? How would you feel if that stopped working, even though you'd paid for it ?

Except that's not what we're talking about... at. all.


We are not talking about a core feature of the PS3 being removed... and you know what, if cross game chat came out and a small amount of old games didn't work with it... I'd be happy with that... because the benefit is greater than the loss.

Likewise - keeping the PS3, and by extension the PSN, secure is very important to maintaining core features that a large majority of gamers would care about if some hacker screwed them up.

 

[iapetus]

No it doesn't. The Quick Reference guide makes no reference to Other OS whatsoever.

I'm pretty positive there was reference to it in print material with my day-one hardware. Even if I'm wrong, it's clearly there in the official online documentation.

 

[iapetus]

We are not talking about a core feature of the PS3 being removed... and you know what, if cross game chat came out and a small amount of old games didn't work with it... I'd be happy with that... because the benefit is greater than the loss.

That's a hideous analogy. If cross game chat came out and an entire genre of old games stopped working completely you might be closer.

 

[Clear]

PS3's backwards compatibility was never a pure firmware/software solution, it always required at least some hardware support to function, so it is a touch unfair to compare OtherOS support to BC capability.

I'd also add that the whole "piracy concerns" thing is a complete red herring imho. They cut it from the slim models before geohot announced a thing, so there's no doubt some other reasoning behind this move.

To be honest I suspect its more to do with memory saving than anything else.

 

[Ninja Moomin]

That's a hideous analogy. If cross game chat came out and an entire genre of old games stopped working completely you might be closer.

No worse than the one i was presented with.


So.... we're talking about a genre of games never actively promoted or supported by the platform holder, not commonly bought by the userbase, and not supported by the latest hardware revision anyway....?

 

[mclem]

I can't wait until someone finds an exploit involving a "The Dark Knight" bluray disc. The number of exploding heads will be legendary.

Casino Royale would be funnier.

 

[Trailblaster]

Some where Geohat is sitting infront of his computer, with a big shit eatting grin on his face becase his actions got a rise out of Sony even if he didn't fully hack the PS3.

 

[Burai]

I'm pretty positive there was reference to it in print material with my day-one hardware. Even if I'm wrong, it's clearly there in the official online documentation.

Again, it's not. You have to specifically search for "Other OS" in the manual to find it. It cannot be browsed to.

 

[lupinko]

Some where Geohat is sitting infront of his computer, with a big shit eatting grin on his face becase his actions got a rise out of Sony even if he didn't fully hack the PS3.

Pretty much.

 

[Trailblaster]

PS3's backwards compatibility was never a pure firmware/software solution, it always required at least some hardware support to function, so it is a touch unfair to compare OtherOS support to BC capability.

I'd also add that the whole "piracy concerns" thing is a complete red herring imho. They cut it from the slim models before geohot announced a thing, so there's no doubt some other reasoning behind this move.

To be honest I suspect its more to do with memory saving than anything else.

Nothing about this makes any sense.