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[Variahunter]

You are just asserting things that are not correct. Please keep going.

You have no idea of what you're talking about, admit it, you're just completely lost.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

It's also allegedly not any stronger than a PS4. Rumors will keep running rampant until we get something more reliable.

Lets hope the Matrix demo rumor is true.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

ohhh...Let me see well.


I'm going to put on my glasses.

You had a radical change, I almost didn't recognize you.

 

[FireFly]

I agree with your first paragraph.
However, the problem with the S in the amount of RAM and its ridiculous speed. It's even worse than the One X on that matter.

RAM is used to store all the 3D models (objects, environment, textures, NPCs), from 1 zone to next zone, or by streaming on the fly if open world.

So in that case, like Stalker 2 being open world, they need to have a total amount of assets streaming at all times that fits into that ridiculous amount of ram. So they would of course begin to reduce resolution, then textures resolution, environment details like rocks, grass etc...
But sometimes it's not enough. And you have to reduce your initial vision/scope for the game because you take that platform into account for the development.

Well, the bottleneck you're describing is the process of moving data from the SSD into memory, which is limited by the 2.4 GB/s transfer rate. However UE5's streaming system has been shown to require under 1 GB/s, so I don't think that is an issue. The speed of the GDDR6 memory on the Series S comes in when the data is being sent to the GPU for processing, but since the S has only 38% of the CUs of the X, it makes sense that it has only 40% of the memory banwidth. If we look to equivalent PC parts, they also have reduced memory bandwidth. Eg. the 5 TF RX 5500 XT also has 224.0 GB/s.

But yes, the game needs to be designed to allow the current scene to fit into the memory pool of the Series S, which imposes additional constraints. However that's not the same as optimizing for performance, which the Stalker developers seem to be referring to here. If the game fits into memory but isn't running at locked 30, then it's just a question of tweaking the settings and/or resolution.

 

[ZoukGalaxy]

Here the room

 

[adamsapple]

Well, the bottleneck you're describing is the process of moving data from the SSD into memory, which is limited by the 2.4 GB/s transfer rate. However UE5's streaming system has been shown to require under 1 GB/s, so I don't think that is an issue.

The Matrix Awakens demo needed only 300MB/s, for reference. (per DF)

 

[MarkMe2525]

You have no idea of what you're talking about, admit it, you're just completely lost.

I give you credit for one thing. You have the ability to say really stupid things with great confidence. In some areas of life, that will get you far. Here, it's just going to get you laughed at.

 

[Variahunter]

Well, the bottleneck you're describing is the process of moving data from the SSD into memory, which is limited by the 2.4 GB/s transfer rate. However UE5's streaming system has been shown to require under 1 GB/s, so I don't think that is an issue. The speed of the GDDR6 memory on the Series S comes in when the data is being sent to the GPU for processing, but since the S has only 38% of the CUs of the X, it makes sense that it has only 40% of the memory banwidth. If we look to equivalent PC parts, they also have reduced memory bandwidth. Eg. the 5 TF RX 5500 XT also has 224.0 GB/s.

But yes, the game needs to be designed to allow the current scene to fit into the memory pool of the Series S, which imposes additional constraints. However that's not the same as optimizing for performance, which the Stalker developers seem to be referring to here. If the game fits into memory but isn't running at locked 30, then it's just a question of tweaking the settings and/or resolution.

Yes that’s why the game might constrained on its initial visions by Series constraints. Meaning if they wanted to make a scene with lot of differents NPC, objects etc, so using too much different assets to fit into the ram OR ram bandwidth being too slow to charge all of them in time, they might not be able to and would either have a bottleneck or a lot of framerate problems in the second case, which would fit in the optimization process. Meaning they would have to remove some assets from the scene.

They are different angles to approach this problem, but reducing resolution and capping frame rate to 30 fps can only work until a point.

 

[Variahunter]

I give you credit for one thing. You have the ability to say really stupid things with great confidence. In some areas of life, that will get you far. Here, it's just going to get you laughed at.

Meanwhile you said nothing to contradict me on the technical side. You’re just full of shit.

 

[FireFly]

Yes that’s why the game might constrained on its initial visions by Series constraints. Meaning if they wanted to make a scene with lot of differents NPC, objects etc, so using too much different assets to fit into the ram OR ram bandwidth being too slow to charge all of them in time, they might not be able to and would either have a bottleneck or a lot of framerate problems in the second case, which would fit in the optimization process. Meaning they would have to remove some assets from the scene.

They are different angles to approach this problem, but reducing resolution and capping frame rate to 30 fps can only work until a point.

Yes, but we're not talking about the game "on its initial visions". We're talking a product that already runs on the Series S, but seems to be a few frames short. For all we know there are no issues with RAM because the scope of game was effectively budgeted earlier, and now all that remains is some tweaking of settings. If you're claiming to know that RAM usage is currently the main issue, you're going to have provide some direct quotes from the developer confirming this.

 

[HogIsland]

I'd argue both flagship consoles are also, developer's become more competent with the hardware but also more ambitious.

The Series S hate on here is well known but the real test IMO will be GTA 6, if it can produce a decent version of that then that should silence it's critic's.

There is no silencing the critics. Game developers are the critics and they're saying it's a problem.

Bringing Dune Awakening to the Xbox Series S will be a "challenge", according to Funcom chief product officer

Chief Product Officer at Funcom Scott Junior speaks on the task of bringing Dune Awakening - a stunning and technically advanced game - over to weaker hardware.

www.vg247.com

 

[MarkMe2525]

Meanwhile you said nothing to contradict me on the technical side. You’re just full of shit.

That short of a memory? I already explained where you were in error. You repeating or restating the same nonsense does not change the facts of the matter. There is no need for me to waste further time debunking someone who has shown they do not even know what they do not know.

 

[Negotiator101]

There is no silencing the critics. Game developers are the critics and they're saying it's a problem.

Bringing Dune Awakening to the Xbox Series S will be a "challenge", according to Funcom chief product officer

Chief Product Officer at Funcom Scott Junior speaks on the task of bringing Dune Awakening - a stunning and technically advanced game - over to weaker hardware.

www.vg247.com

Nobody is saying it's not more difficult to produce a game on a weaker platform, that's just reality but so far all the major releases have come to the system right? I'm saying if the biggest release of the generation and one of the most if not the most demanding games of the generation comes to the console in good shape then one must concede that the issues have been exaggerated, we shall see.

 

[Variahunter]

Yes, but we're not talking about the game "on its initial visions". We're talking a product that already runs on the Series S, but seems to be a few frames short. For all we know there are no issues with RAM because the scope of game was effectively budgeted earlier, and now all that remains is some tweaking of settings. If you're claiming to know that RAM usage is currently the main issue, you're going to have provide some direct quotes from the developer confirming this.

They’re saying that S still needs optimizations. Ram being much more of a factor than GPU, that you said yourself, is easily scalable, so yes those difficult optimizations have more probability to come from the lack of ram and its slow speed.

 

[Variahunter]

That short of a memory? I already explained where you were in error. You repeating or restating the same nonsense does not change the facts of the matter. There is no need for me to waste further time debunking someone who has shown they do not even know what they do not know.

You explained nothing of value, you just didn’t understand what I was explaining because you’re out of your line in that field, so you jumped to conclusions with the limited knowledge you have.

 

[FireFly]

They’re saying that S still needs optimizations. Ram being much more of a factor than GPU, that you said yourself, is easily scalable, so yes those difficult optimizations have more probability to come from the lack of ram and its slow speed.

RAM utilization being less scalable than GPU performance implies that you would need to budget for RAM at the beginning, and then make performance optimizations at the end of the project. And if we believe the 35 average figure, the game should already be very close to a locked 30, so no "difficult" optimizations would be required.

(You also keep bringing up the speed of the RAM, when the streaming bottleneck is from the SSD into memory, which is dictated by the 2.4 GB/s transfer speed. Once the assets are in memory, not having enough memory bandwidth to the GPU would just mean lower than expected framerates, so you're back to general performance optimizations. But S does not have a shortage of memory bandwidth when compared to equivalent PC GPUs. The One X had more bandwidth but it was also a different architecture with less effective colour compression)

 

[MarkMe2525]

You explained nothing of value, you just didn’t understand what I was explaining because you’re out of your line in that field, so you jumped to conclusions with the limited knowledge you have.

Again, you just asserting things does not make them correct. You continually keep presenting false assumptions and misunderstandings as a foundation of your claims. Meanwhile, the facts and methods used in modern game development contradict your narrative. The irony in you asserting others "are jumping to conclusions due to their limited knowledge" is delicious. Best of the day, yet it is still early.

 

[DenchDeckard]

framerate is the last thing they work on, so hopefully all is fine.

 

[Roberts]

Nobody is saying it's not more difficult to produce a game on a weaker platform, that's just reality but so far all the major releases have come to the system right? I'm saying if the biggest release of the generation and one of the most if not the most demanding games of the generation comes to the console in good shape then one must concede that the issues have been exaggerated, we shall see.

Also the article says “will be” instead of “is”. Kind of a big difference.