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//: StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty |OT2| GL HF GG

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J

JoeFu

Banned
Hydras are so bad this game :( don't use them unless you have enough roaches and can get upgrades and spread creep everywhere. If you're going against Toss as Zerg, your hydras just melt to colossi. You need so much gas to get the roach/hydra thing that its better just going Muta/ling just because of the better mobility and hit and run capability.. At least that's what I found out whenever I try going hydras. I always lose when I go hydras. I'm terrible at this game but so are hydras.
 
F

Fjord

Member
Pyke Presco said:
Jesus HuK, pay attention to your army. The Stalkers did nothing, just A-moved onto the unbuilt CC and lost 4 Colossi to 5 vikings. Sloppy sloppy play.
Click to expand...

Seriously that seemed like atrocious micro to me. Collosus on the CC while the stalkers ignored the vikings? Then again he still won so maybe we're the newbies that just don't understand how much he needed to kill that gold expansion CC. Hmm but still at least go collosus on the ground army and stalkers on the CC I would think? But yeah several strange lapses in micro for Huk so far today, he is the kind of player that looks away and keeps the macro going though. Kiwi, true to form, has had great micro.
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
JoeFu said:
Hydras are so bad this game :( don't use them unless you have enough roaches and can get upgrades and spread creep everywhere. If you're going against Toss as Zerg, your hydras just melt to colossi. You need so much gas to get the roach/hydra thing that its better just going Muta/ling just because of the better mobility and hit and run capability.. At least that's what I found out whenever I try going hydras. I always lose when I go hydras. I'm terrible at this game but so are hydras.
Click to expand...

A good hydra ball will melt gateway/stargate units though. As long as you don't get rocked by HT's you can destroy any gateway only force, and hydra's just laugh at void rays and phoenixes. Don't throw away use of hydras just because of colossi, and really you shouldn't be worried until he gets 3 or 4 colossus, at which point you should hopefully have some sort of solution, whether it's corrupters or a great speedling flank.

Fjord said:
Seriously that seemed like atrocious micro to me. Collosus on the CC while the stalkers ignored the vikings? Then again he still won so maybe we're the newbies that just don't understand how much he needed to kill that gold expansion CC. Hmm but still at least go collosus on the ground army and stalkers on the CC I would think? But yeah several strange lapses in micro for Huk so far today, he is the kind of player that looks away and keeps the macro going though. Kiwi, true to form, has had great micro.
Click to expand...

I think it was just him not paying attention. The stalkers were getting ripped apart by the bioball and the vikings were melting colossi, and he was just working on the CC. He already killed the SCV so that CC wasn't coming up right then, he should have watched his army and tried to salvage something. He was probably back in his base or busy transferring probes, because there's no other excuse for A-moving your entire army to death like that without killing a single enemy unit.
 
J

JoeFu

Banned
I think I just attack at the wrong time. Colossi with thermal lance just killlll hydras. I also never have enough roaches to support. Been going with the good ole muta/ling lately.
 
V

vicissitudes

Banned
Against zealots/stalkers, roach/hydra is so much better than ling/muta. Once they get out colossus just hatch a few corrupters and you're good to go.

Hydras are also hilariously good against void rays.
 
D

Dreams-Visions

Member
vicissitudes said:
Against zealots/stalkers, roach/hydra is so much better than ling/muta. Once they get out colossus just hatch a few corrupters and you're good to go.

Hydras are also hilariously good against void rays.
Click to expand...
depends on how many stalkers and zealots they have, along with what upgrades. charglot and/or blink and you'll have a problem. in fact, if he just makes sure to have blink, you're in trouble.

I agree about the VR's...but if you have no hydras on the field (not unusual)...well...yea.
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
Yay Kiwi, go Canada! Show them your crazy micro skils!

EDIT: Is QXC going for 5-rax reaper against Protoss? Nope, Stalker push forcing him into marines. Excellent timing push with those 4 stalkers, won it really quick because qxc was macroing up for mass reapers, was not prepared for it.
 
P

Procarbine

Forever Platinum
Pyke Presco said:
A good hydra ball will melt gateway/stargate units though. As long as you don't get rocked by HT's you can destroy any gateway only force, and hydra's just laugh at void rays and phoenixes. Don't throw away use of hydras just because of colossi, and really you shouldn't be worried until he gets 3 or 4 colossus, at which point you should hopefully have some sort of solution, whether it's corrupters or a great speedling flank.
Click to expand...

This is not true. With sufficient sentry numbers to split up the army, gateway units can dominate roach/hydra/speedling. Massing hydras on their own is never a good idea, because of how squishy they are, and their mobility off creep makes any kind of offense hard unless you upgrade overlords and bring them with you for mobile creep spread. Although in levels below mid-high diamond you probably won't see sentry play/building placement good enough to beat roach/hydra with just gateway units.
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
qxc just stomped Kiwi that round, harass everywhere and expanding across the map. Kiwi was just so far behind at eveyr step of the battle.

Game 1 wasn't cheese, Kiwi just pushed with his first 4 stalkers and qxc was working towards a 4-rax or 5-rax reaper build. Had 4 reapers in base waiting to strike out, but just got stomped by the 4 stalker push when a couple more came in behind.

EDIT: Pro, obviously I'm not saying only use hydras. But with something to tank, like zerglings or roaches, hydra's rock gateway forces, especially with the range upgrade leaving them equal with stalkers and outranging the sentries. And they are no slower than the majority of the protoss army: Zealots, Sentries and Immortals are all the same speed as off-creep hydras. They are an excellent unit against protoss, unless there is a critical mass of colossus or a bunch of HTs.
 
D

Deadman

Member
slidewinder said:
What happened in game 1? Some kind of cheese?
Click to expand...

qxc was going for a reaper build he tried to use on huk. seems that kiwikaki had seen that replay and went for extremely fast 2warpgate stalkers and ended it very quickly.
 
H

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
NA SC2 gaf might be interested in a big SEA tournament going on this weekend (theres lots.. like the SEA nation wars, KOTH and others.. but we wont go into that now :p)

Really maybe because they might be names you're going to start to see either climb your ladder, or appear in more tournaments as they get noticed outside of SEA :)

players2.png

http://challonge.com/images/brackets/psf0910.png <-- brackets

and the run down! Today, starting about 10 hours from this post \

Saturday the 9th of October UB Round 1 to 3 completed (stop at Ro4)
Saturday the 9th of October LB Round 1 to 4 completed

and tomorrow

Sunday the 10th of October UB semi-final and final
Sunday the 10th of October LB round 5 to LB final (4 rounds)
Sunday the 10th of October Grand Final - 2x BO5, winner of UB must win once, LB qualifier must win twice

$5000AU (which is pretty much just $5000 us [lol @ your dollar]) prize pool!

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=157909 team liquid thread :)
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
Seen a bunch of games from RedArchon, Azz, Renson and Oxygen. Surprised Ice isn't gonna be playing, he seems like a pretty solid zerg off your server. Anyone wanting to see some games of these players, check out Sephyre's youtube channel, he casts some of the SEA games.

EDIT: qxc just ninja expanding everywhere on the map!

EDIT 2: Kiwi just got rolled by those bioballs. qxc was doing great harass in games 2 and 3, keeping Kiwi in his base while he just controlled the macro game and eventually just rolled right over everything that Kiwi could muster up. Just outplayed him completely.
 
A

Azwethinkweiz

Member
Colkate said:
Did you play the game via Single or Multi player? I don't think you can get any Custom Game achievements via single player.
Click to expand...

Ah, yeah I did it in single player. I guess I'll have to try it again multi.
 
H

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
Deadman said:
Pretty dissapointing, kiwi was good before, kinda meh in this match.

Fenix vs kiwikaki last game today.
Click to expand...

:) quoted you to say fenix vs kiwi.. but you edited it in!

Going for Fenix.. because I like his name
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
elrechazao said:
vod or replay anywhere?
Click to expand...

http://www.esl-world.net/masters/season5/newyork/sc2/groupstage/download/23453458/

EDIT: Kiwi has been relying on this 1-gate robo Zealot/Sentry/Immortal mix and it keeps screwing him over against Terran air superiority. Hopefully we see more stalkers from him. His primary strategy that I've seen in replays and casts is crazily microed blink stalkers off an 8-zealot +1 weapons rush, and we haven't seen anything like that all day today.

EDIT 2: There it is again, that unit comp is getting rocked by these stimmed bioballs. Not sure why he keeps choosing immortal/sentry when it's so weak against the marine heavy mixes he keeps facing. If he didn't get 2-3 immortals and the same in sentries right off the bat he would have so much more gas, could switch the tech route or go into colossus faster. Would love to see him get a twilight with charge considering how heavily he's been relying on zealots all day.
 
F

Fjord

Member
Kiwikaki is taking naps between games and starving apparently. Good photos of him sleeping under a desk and napping after game 1 against qXc. He has only had a hot dog today.

Go zombiekaki! He's a great player I just hope he scrapes and makes day 2 so he can perform to his potential.
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
Glad to see this stalker-colossus mix. Will be much better against the bio-ball and banshee harass we keep seeing him struggle with.

Also wicked hold on the blue-flame hellions.

EDIT: Double stargate...not liking it. Would have preferred double gateway and a twilight to use those stalkers better. 3 or 4 Blinked stalkers with a single observer back home can handle the banshees easy and will be much better at sniping down any vikings that show up to fight the colossi.

EDIT 2: God damnit Kiwi ignore that planetary. Get your own expo up or hit the main. Right now you're just throwing away units for no reason.

Fenix is just crushing in the macro war. And that fleet of vikings is shredding Kiwi's "army" of paper airplanes, the phoenix doesnt stand a chance against vikings. Really would have preferred Blink Stalkers this game.

EDIT 3: Wow, epic hallucinations but just not enough because there was no solution to the vikings. Really well played by Fenix.

Aww, thats it for today isnt it. Damn, now I'm gonna have to actually play starcraft instead of watching it.
 
H

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
gunrun is awesome.

This is his first live in person event he's probably nervous, his glhf streams are great, and his voice is sooo sooothing
 
E

elrechazado

Banned
Syth_Blade22 said:
gunrun is awesome.

This is his first live in person event he's probably nervous, his glhf streams are great, and his voice is sooo sooothing
Click to expand...
I disagree, can't stand listening to the glhf guys, his normal partner is annoying as hell.
 
M

Mystery

Member
Syth_Blade22 said:
gunrun is awesome.

This is his first live in person event he's probably nervous, his glhf streams are great, and his voice is sooo sooothing
Click to expand...

He mumbles a lot, and doesn't sound like he feels confident in what he's saying. He interrupts himself, and a lot of his sentences seem to fizzle out.

Also, I know Husky gets a lot of hate, but he uploaded a series today, TeamLiquid's Jinro vs. Slayer's Boxer. It's only the second match I've seen from Boxer, but it's pretty good.
 
P

Pyke Presco

Member
Corran Horn said:
The matches I saw were all full of terrans doing drops and Protoss not being able to handle it :/
Click to expand...

Drops are the bane of protoss' existence. Their army can fight almost anything straight up, but they just don't have the mobility to handle hit and run stuff like swarms of mutas or medivac drops, especially if there's two or three going on at once. Didn't help that there was never a reserve force of like 3 stalkers and a couple zealots left behind at any of his bases to take care of things and scare off drop harass. He was relying on his fleet of phoenixes to handle harass, but even with like 10 of them he couldnt kill a 4 marauder drop and had to pull his entire army each time. Got harassed to death while Fenix just expanded like a champ all game long.

EDIT: Fjord, phoenix are terrible against vikings. Yeah, they're quick, but they have no range and no damage bonus against armored units, think they do like 10. Great for sniping medivacs or combating mutas, but vikings eat them up in anything even approaching similar numbers, probably even down 2:3 they would still win. When the vikings have one or two extras it's a complete sweep, they might lose a handful vs the entire fleet of phoenixes.
 
J

jasonng

Member
JoeFu said:
I think I just attack at the wrong time. Colossi with thermal lance just killlll hydras. I also never have enough roaches to support. Been going with the good ole muta/ling lately.
Click to expand...

I'm starting to love hydras. They're great learning tools for me as it forces me to pay attention to creep expanding. Definitely keep your hydras in the back when it comes to colossi. A lot of times I already have a spire by the time I get hydras so I like to build a few mutas to keep colossi in check. I guess if you've already invested in a heavy roach army then that spire wouldn't come into play for a while.

Also, most of your ZvZ matches are probably going to have mutas. Hydras are sooooo good against them, you'll grow an appreciation for them.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
My friend decided to stop playing SC2 with me :(

Oh well... I've had my share of fun with him.

RIP ZvZ
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
Were you breaking computer parts every time he beat you? I'd stop playing with you, too.
Click to expand...
Shuuuuuuuut upppppppppppppppppppppp

:/
 
J

jasonng

Member
Actually, that would give me more incentive to play against Ychan. I wanna know how far he'd go. :D

I don't think I've ever played a game with you though, yoshi. ZvZ is my favorite matchup btw. I thought you play brotoss though.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
I'm glad I'm not accepting games from GAFers! People would probably post it on Youtube and share my skills to everyone...

Yeah I played protoss but I made the extremely hard choice and jumped to the zerg bandwagon. I'm not entertained by toss anymore and I have lots and lots of fun as zerg :D
I wanna know how far he'd go
Click to expand...
Trust me... no.
 
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