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[Zippedpinhead]

I hate EVE runs, I'm not great at the game but I have a -19 streak going on Eve. Trying to get something, anything, going is a pain.

Get some damage? no spirit hearts, health ups or bombs for tinted rocks
Get good items? yeah haven't seen a "good" item since ipecac 18 runs ago (got really close on that one).

need items? yeah no keys for you.

Had a couple of decent runs were I got a lot of devil rooms, but I would seemingly always get the three chests (with absolutely nothing inside them other than enemies and bombs)

I'm going to have to do an isaac run, anything to take this taste out of my mouth. Blue baby unlocking the D6 wasn't this bad.

 

[SerTapTap]

I hate EVE runs, I'm not great at the game but I have a -19 streak going on Eve. Trying to get something, anything, going is a pain.

Are you activating Whore ASAP? Get to 1 heart immediately and don't pick up health (except to get you to 1 full heart), try your very best not to take damage after the first floor and damage yourself before the first boss room not during. Whore's effect will deal good enough damage to make quick work of the first few floors, and you'll get a better impression of how good/bad your build will be by the end of Caves. I always try, but usually fail, to get a high devil deal low health run with her, but if you end up with tons of heart containers just play it like a normal run. She's no Judas or Azazel, but if you can beat the game as Isaac pre-D6 you can beat it with Eve.

And at least her runs either get up to speed or go to shit fast. Anything's better than Maggie.

Spoiler

Well except The Lost

 

[Palette Swap]

I hate EVE runs, I'm not great at the game but I have a -19 streak going on Eve. Trying to get something, anything, going is a pain.

Get some damage? no spirit hearts, health ups or bombs for tinted rocks
Get good items? yeah haven't seen a "good" item since ipecac 18 runs ago (got really close on that one).

need items? yeah no keys for you.

Had a couple of decent runs were I got a lot of devil rooms, but I would seemingly always get the three chests (with absolutely nothing inside them other than enemies and bombs)

I'm going to have to do an isaac run, anything to take this taste out of my mouth. Blue baby unlocking the D6 wasn't this bad.

The ideal setup, one I ran into a few times, is trading all your red hearts for Dark Bum and various dark shit. Eve is clearly made for devil deals.

 

[SerTapTap]

With Eve I'll even take not so great Devil deals just to get rid of hearts, ideally Abaddon or Dead Cat but you're rarely that lucky. Also don't forget Blood Machines hurt your hearts first unless they'll take what's left of your last heart (annoying, because many items make it preferable to be at empty red hearts + soul/black hearts than at one/half a red heart). You can save up a Temperance card for some emergency bloodletting if you accidentally heal (items like Magic Mushroom are too good to ignore but annoyingly heal you)

 

[aku:jiki]

Eve is a character I wish they would've rebalanced for Rebirth, because she doesn't really make much sense. Her only quirk, Whore status, is negated if you can't earn devil deals or get that lovely 3 red chest deal on the second floor, meaning you're probably gonna see bullshit angel rooms for the rest of the run.

She really should've started with 1 heart and be a character you can't take HP ups with, not one where you're constantly paranoid over the fact that an unlucky Justice card spawn can ruin your run. Basically, she's just a crap Judas and a poorly thought-out glass cannon build, and they didn't improve her at all...

 

[SerTapTap]

Yeah a tweak definitely would have been appreciated. ??? and Azazel actually do "no heart runs" way better than her. Also, some way to suppress red chest devil rooms or increase devil room spawn rate would be nice for her.

Lazarus is lamer though. He's a NEW character and his only gimmick is effectively 1 extra heart container that erases all your others if you need to use it. Dunno what the grand plan there was.

 

[aku:jiki]

Now you're just being mean, game... No man should ever have to make this choice!

That's OK, the game made up for it later on...

Every pill in that screenshot is Luck Up. Ended up with 100% poison teeth with massive damage, but it was kind of hard not to take items you don't want in that sludge of chests so I ended up with Technology 2. Got Tiny Planet and Mom's Eye (also 100% proc after like 50 luck ups, obviously) to make up for it and make it a little more fun. I had 90% of the followers too but they disappeared after a few rooms. Dad's Key showed up early to ruin the reroll fun, as I had to keep it to see how easily Mega Satan would go down (very easily btw).

Oh, for those that don't know how Blank Card + Jera shenanigans work, all the cloned chests will contain the same thing as the chest you cloned and I cloned an item drop chest, so those are all items.

Lazarus is lamer though. He's a NEW character and his only gimmick is effectively 1 extra heart container that erases all your others if you need to use it. Dunno what the grand plan there was.

I don't get Lazarus either. I was so convinced that he was going to get an unlock that made him more than just "crap Isaac with no D6", but nope, he's just useless. It would've been funny, and useful, if he started with the D20.

 

[SerTapTap]

(billions of pickups)

I've still never gotten to do this. I try to keep combos like this in mind but never see 'em. Haven't gotten Blank Card in a while either, for a while I was getting it + Chaos Card every few runs. Also I keep getting Sharp Plug in stores AFTER 9 volt. Why on earth do they prevent Sharp Plug if you already have a partial charge?!

I don't get Lazarus either. I was so convinced that he was going to get an unlock that made him more than just "crap Isaac with no D6", but nope, he's just useless. It would've been funny, and useful, if he started with the D20.

Only slightly interesting thing I can think of for Lazarus is he starts out able to use Suicide King. Which I've still never seen and don't even know if it's worth wasting your current life for even if you have lives. His "get hit, leak creep" is way worse than even Dead Bird. If his extra life kept your heart containers or something unlike other extra life items he might at least be a decent safety character. But even as that, Azazel kicks his ass for a "beginner"/safe character.

 

[CassSept]

Eve was actually the first character I cleared in Rebirth (e.g. doing everything on hard, I need to do it with Azazel but I want to unlock every item first), she's incredibly powerful right off the bat if you go with 1 hp.

 

[aku:jiki]

I've still never gotten to do this. I try to keep combos like this in mind but never see 'em. Haven't gotten Blank Card in a while either, for a while I was getting it + Chaos Card every few runs. Also I keep getting Sharp Plug in stores AFTER 9 volt. Why on earth do they prevent Sharp Plug if you already have a partial charge?!

Well, it doesn't hurt that I purposely unlocked only Jera on this save file. Every time the game wants to spawn a rune, it's Jera

Only slightly interesting thing I can think of for Lazarus is he starts out able to use Suicide King. Which I've still never seen and don't even know if it's worth wasting your current life for even if you have lives. His "get hit, leak creep" is way worse than even Dead Bird. If his extra life kept your heart containers or something unlike other extra life items he might at least be a decent safety character. But even as that, Azazel kicks his ass for a "beginner"/safe character.

There's something I've never gotten to do! Suicide King + pretty much any extra life.

Then again, that still doesn't validate Lazarus since Suicide King + Judas Shadow is clearly better. Maybe if Lazarus Rags and Judas Shadow swapped stats? That way you could chose between having 3 red hearts with base damage or to die on the first floor and get 2x damage, no extra life and only one red. A bit too powerful, maybe, but so is Azazel...

 

[Kaybe]

I defeated It Lives on the Darkness Falls challenge but no victory trophy. Had to continue to Sheol and then I died. Am I missing something or was it just a bug?
And are there any tips for Suicide King? That one is just the worst.

Managed to beat Family Man on my first try when I got it. I thought it was pretty fun. Rotten Baby is the best.

 

[CassSept]

I defeated It Lives on the Darkness Falls challenge but no victory trophy. Had to continue to Sheol and then I died. Am I missing something or was it just a bug?

Darkness Falls requires Satan.

 

[SerTapTap]

The runes/cards seem to have wonky percents. I get the Destruction and Passage runes all the damn time, a couple of the others I haven't even seen or only got once out of a couple dozen hours. Never seen Suicide King, only got Rules Card once (fortunately--useless crap), but I got Chaos Card a ton especially before unlocking Card Against Humanity

I defeated It Lives on the Darkness Falls challenge but no victory trophy. Had to continue to Sheol and then I died. Am I missing something or was it just a bug?
And are there any tips for Suicide King? That one is just the worst.

Managed to beat Family Man on my first try when I got it. I thought it was pretty fun. Rotten Baby is the best.

Gotta go to Satan for Darkness Falls, it's also not the only one requiring a later boss kill. If you see the light/hatch and not the trophy, go on. If you see atrophy and a devil/angel room get the trophy.

Suicide King is tricky, try to always open secret rooms, but it can be weird--I think shots have to be at a certain height to actually activate the wall when exploding.

Practice dodging shots in the first room until you kinda get the hang of it. Use momentum to your advantage, I always ran forward before firing. Shots when you're going too slow will loop back faster. Be VERY accurate, taking single shots directly at center mass of enemies. Enemies seem to be infinitely tall, so just aim directly at the with enough distance. Rocks are NOT infinitely tall, so bombing them requires a lot of care.

If you can get boomerang in a shop, definitely get it. It scales to your damage, and will be an instant kill on almost anything, and it's usable multiple times per room. It is basically a free ticket to winning and it's rather common to boot.

Don't press X to skip boss cutscenes on controller. You will shoot on the first frame of the boss fight, and probably get hurt. Very annoying.

 

[Kaybe]

Darkness Falls requires Satan.

All right, thanks. The skull icon on the map was on Womb II so I thought that was the goal. Too bad I threw the run away in Sheol since I thought it glitched.

Suicide King is tricky, try to always open secret rooms, but it can be weird--I think shots have to be at a certain height to actually activate the wall when exploding.

Practice dodging shots in the first room until you kinda get the hang of it. Use momentum to your advantage, I always ran forward before firing. Shots when you're going too slow will loop back faster. Be VERY accurate, taking single shots directly at center mass of enemies. Enemies seem to be infinitely tall, so just aim directly at the with enough distance. Rocks are NOT infinitely tall, so bombing them requires a lot of care.

If you can get boomerang in a shop, definitely get it. It scales to your damage, and will be an instant kill on almost anything, and it's usable multiple times per room. It is basically a free ticket to winning and it's rather common to boot.

Don't press X to skip boss cutscenes on controller. You will shoot on the first frame of the boss fight, and probably get hurt. Very annoying.

Rocks aren't infinitely tall? I seem to hit some from time to time when I try to target enemies. And I'll try learning the in and outs of those shots.
And thanks for the boomerang advice. I think I've ignored it because I confused it with the My Reflection effect but I remembered it's a different thing. And I won't make skip mistakes, I've bound all the face buttons to something else. (can't even remember what X did)

 

[test_account]

I just finished all challenges. The hardest one for me was probably Suicide King. Cloud saving makes it quite easy to complete all challenges though, since you can basically save in every room.

I dont know if i will go for the platinum trophy. I got like 70% of the trophies, but the one collecting all items will take such a long time i imagine.

By the way, yesterday i beat Isaac with The Lost, but i got the D6 item for that, not Isaac's Heart. I also didnt get a trophy for it. Does anyone know why that happened?

 

[YianGaruga]

I just finished all challenges. The hardest one for me was probably Suicide King. Cloud saving makes it quite easy to complete all challenges though, since you can basically save in every room.

I dont know if i will go for the platinum trophy. I got like 70% of the trophies, but the one collecting all items will take such a long time i imagine.

By the way, yesterday i beat Isaac with The Lost, but i got the D6 item for that, not Isaac's Heart. I also didnt get a trophy for it. Does anyone know why that happened?

You probably beat Isaac with ??? (Blue Baby), not with the Lost.

 

[SerTapTap]

I just finished all challenges. The hardest one for me was probably Suicide King. Cloud saving makes it quite easy to complete all challenges though, since you can basically save in every room.

I dont know if i will go for the platinum trophy. I got like 70% of the trophies, but the one collecting all items will take such a long time i imagine.

By the way, yesterday i beat Isaac with The Lost, but i got the D6 item for that, not Isaac's Heart. I also didnt get a trophy for it. Does anyone know why that happened?

Did you use the Ankh? Those type of revival items respawn you AS that character and you no longer count as your original character for that run (thus Lazarus' Rags, Judas' Shadow, Ankh are all useless for unlock runs).

And like I said above, Seed exploit + BASE MENT makes collecting almost all items very easy. Angel room items, meatboy/bandage girl, and Black Lotus/Missing no will still be a pain. There's a PS4 seed for Godhead though.

 

[test_account]

You probably beat Isaac with ??? (Blue Baby), not with the Lost.

Ah, thats it. I thought ??? was The Lost, but i see that this is another character.

Did you use the Ankh? Those type of revival items respawn you AS that character and you no longer count as your original character for that run (thus Lazarus' Rags, Judas' Shadow, Ankh are all useless for unlock runs).

And like I said above, Seed exploit + BASE MENT makes collecting almost all items very easy. Angel room items, meatboy/bandage girl, and Black Lotus/Missing no will still be a pain. There's a PS4 seed for Godhead though.

I thought ??? was The Lost, that was the problem I havnt unlocked The Lost yet, i didnt know about that it was an own character before now.

How does the seed exploit works?

 

[SerTapTap]

Ah, thats it. I thought ??? was The Lost, but i see that this is another character.



I thought ??? was The Lost, that was the problem I havnt unlocked The Lost yet, i didnt know about that it was an own character before now.

How does the seed exploit works?

You just enter a seed, exit out to the file select, then go back in and start the run as normal, it'll be based on that seed but enable unlocks. I would say your gameplan should be complete all challenges and boss kills normally, unlock The Lost, probably seed exploit to get Holy Mantle or something tolerable for The Lost, then use the BASE MENT seed to gather ALLLLLL the items you've unlocked in one crazyass run, then after all items in all item pools in BASE MENT start spawning as Breakfast (milk carton that gives +1HP) you can go to the Stats page and find what few items you're still missing. The Lost and 100% collection are really the only things you should need a seed for

 

[test_account]

You just enter a seed, exit out to the file select, then go back in and start the run as normal, it'll be based on that seed but enable unlocks. I would say your gameplan should be complete all challenges and boss kills normally, unlock The Lost, probably seed exploit to get Holy Mantle or something tolerable for The Lost, then use the BASE MENT seed to gather ALLLLLL the items you've unlocked in one crazyass run, then after all items in all item pools in BASE MENT start spawning as Breakfast (milk carton that gives +1HP) you can go to the Stats page and find what few items you're still missing. The Lost and 100% collection are really the only things you should need a seed for

I see. Thanks for the info =) Yeah, i dont have that many trophies left that arent based on The Lost and on collecting all items. One of the trophies are also glitched it seems (to take no damage in The Chest or Dark Room).

 

[SerTapTap]

I see. Thanks for the info =) Yeah, i dont have that many trophies left that arent based on The Lost and on collecting all items. One of the trophies are also glitched it seems (to take no damage in The Chest or Dark Room).

Dead Boy (that trophy) is fixed as of 1.03 on PS, I believe I got it just the other day. BTW, if you can, might want to save scum immediately before earning any trophy that would take more than an hour or two on a second file. The random unlock bug is still in effect. Based on my hit/miss rate, it looks like there's about a 10% chance for one to not unlock. Not sure it affects all trophies equally, but if Real Plat God happened to be one I missed...I would not be a happy camper. I haven't bothered save scumming yet, but I'm going to do it right before earning plat/real plat god if I remember.

 

[aku:jiki]

Oh, wow, I've never had the D4 (or a dice room) treat me well but I was on Caves 2 with a straight garbage build and about to give up, when D4 gave me homing triple shot and turned everything around. Took it all the way to the end and ruined The Lamb's face.

Also, now that I've found Cancer (the trinket) several times today, I hate the nerf its received. They seem to have really ramped up its effect where it does more and more the faster your base tear rate is, and it pretty much does nothing at all if you have a low rate now. From what I can recall, it was always a noticeable difference in WotL. It was my favorite trinket for a reason, now Curved Horn is just overall better.

 

[Haunted]

Hmm, first time the game gave me trouble with saves (Steam version). It apparently didn't record my last gaming session, the unlocks are gone and the donation machine is set back to what it was at the start of last time.

The achievements I got are still there, so I know it wasn't a fever dream. Didn't tell me anything about cloud saves and local saves being out of sync (which games usually do when there's a difference) at startup just now, either...

Is this a known problem and can I do anything to prevent this in the future?

 

[Manu]

I just realized I didn't unlock Isaac's Tears, neither the trophy or the item, after killing Isaac with Isaac.

Are some of the unlocks bugged?

 

[Kid Ska]

It's pretty lame that you need a minimum of 100 deaths to complete the game.

 

[buy teh haloz]

You just enter a seed, exit out to the file select, then go back in and start the run as normal, it'll be based on that seed but enable unlocks. I would say your gameplan should be complete all challenges and boss kills normally, unlock The Lost, probably seed exploit to get Holy Mantle or something tolerable for The Lost, then use the BASE MENT seed to gather ALLLLLL the items you've unlocked in one crazyass run, then after all items in all item pools in BASE MENT start spawning as Breakfast (milk carton that gives +1HP) you can go to the Stats page and find what few items you're still missing. The Lost and 100% collection are really the only things you should need a seed for

Is there really any point in using seeds to get every item though? I figure if you're planning to 100% you'll get them just by playing anyway. Except for Meat Boy/Bandage Girl I guess.

 

[aku:jiki]

Is there really any point in using seeds to get every item though? I figure if you're planning to 100% you'll get them just by playing anyway. Except for Meat Boy/Bandage Girl I guess.

The problem with item collecting is really the angel room items. The angel rooms are so bad now that you want to do everything you can to avoid them in normal play, meaning your odds of finding the rare angel drops are very low as you never get the rooms to begin with.

They really need to clean up the angel rooms and make them less crap. It doesn't make any sense that it takes more skill and requires more sacrifice than a devil room, but always gives you Dead fucking Sea Scrolls.

 

[thequickandthedead]

Is it possible to defeat It Lives with half a heart?

 

[Ferrio]

The problem with item collecting is really the angel room items. The angel rooms are so bad now that you want to do everything you can to avoid them in normal play, meaning your odds of finding the rare angel drops are very low as you never get the rooms to begin with.

They really need to clean up the angel rooms and make them less crap. It doesn't make any sense that it takes more skill and requires more sacrifice than a devil room, but always gives you Dead fucking Sea Scrolls.

The thing that gets me is that this was a well known and vocal issue of the previous game. Yet they still didn't fix it, hell they made it worse.

 

[Haunted]

Is it possible to defeat It Lives with half a heart?

If you're OP enough, sure.

The longer the fight, the more likely it is you're going to get hit.

I just realized I didn't unlock Isaac's Tears, neither the trophy or the item, after killing Isaac with Isaac.

Are some of the unlocks bugged?

Did you use an "extra life" item, like Lazarus' Rags or Judas' Shadow? Those actually make you respawn as another character and count the completed run for that character instead. Otherwise that seems like a bug.

 

[Renpatsu]

Got quite the lucky break on Suicide King challenge. Devil room with Brimstone, then later shops with pill bag and PHD, and then finally three Guppy items in the Womb.

 

[I Wanna Be The Guy]

So I just unlocked

Spoiler

The Lost and gave him a run. AHAHAHAHAHAHA. Seriously, fuck off. How is this fair? You cant gain any hearts whatoever and the game doesn't even balance that by giving you any starting items or good damage. You can take devil deals for free but that doesn't make up for shit, especially since devil rooms still aren't guaranteed. I made it to the fourth floor boss in this first Lost run.

Yeah I wont be picking this character again for a while.

 

[Haunted]

So I just unlocked

Spoiler

The Lost and gave him a run. AHAHAHAHAHAHA. Seriously, fuck off. How is this fair? You cant gain any hearts whatoever and the game doesn't even balance that by giving you any starting items or good damage. You can take devil deals for free but that doesn't make up for shit, especially since devil rooms still aren't guaranteed. I made it to the fourth floor boss in this first Lost run.

Yeah I wont be picking this character again for a while.

Spoiler

It's a classic 1cc hitless run, it's supposed to be super hard.

 

[autoduelist]

Is it possible to defeat It Lives with half a heart?

Absolutely. I think the eyes are the most dangerous -- 2 spawn at first, take them out. Once you kill them, 2 more spawn one at a time. Focus on them while dodging the heart. Now just dodge MH bullets, and she'll spawn various enemies at intervals. Be ready for some brimstone circling at the end.

Is there really any point in using seeds to get every item though? I figure if you're planning to 100% you'll get them just by playing anyway. Except for Meat Boy/Bandage Girl I guess.

I just got the platinum.
I have over 72 mom kills, plus hundreds of quick restarts both from doing The Lost as well as Isaac D6 runs.
Despite that, I was missing 3 common items (eight ball, mongo, and something else), 1 secret room item (missing no.), and iirc 4 or 5 angel room items.

Sure, I might have found the Eight Ball next run. But if a month and a half of fairly heavy play (it was the only game I played for that time) didn't turn up common items, you can understand the potential issue with specialty items, especially 'special' items like god head that have negative modifiers on availability based on your current inventory.

With what, something like 350 items in the game, and each game lasting, say, 45 minutes to an hour, trying to find every item w/o any form of abuse (be it seeds, treasure room restarting, infinite D6, etc) would drive you to drink... though you'd always have some people who found everything quickly, because, well, RNG. Angel Room items being the worst case, since you won't even see one till at least floor 3, and even then they aren't guaranteed, and even if one shows up it often doesn't even have items but eternal hearts... and even if it did have an item, it's most likely a common angel room item, not the rare ones like sacred heart and godhead.

Fortunately, while abusing a seed for infinite D6 (for meatboy/girl) I worked out a way to abuse arcades into infinite pickup generators, and then furthermore learned that if you a) avoid certain items and b) don't exhaust the treasure room pool you will also have a much higher chance at seeing rare angel items. (I couldn't find seeds for everything).

 

[I Wanna Be The Guy]

Spoiler

It's a classic 1cc hitless run, it's supposed to be super hard.

Is that considered a spoiler? I've seen people openly talking about that character here so I didn't think spoiler tagging was necessary.

But yeah I'm aware of that. Just seems a tad too insane.

 

[Lethe82]

So... the hearts that characters have... is this reflective of how Issac feels about them? Also I'm beginning to wonder if his mother actually tried to kill him...

 

[Manu]

Did you use an "extra life" item, like Lazarus' Rags or Judas' Shadow? Those actually make you respawn as another character and count the completed run for that character instead. Otherwise that seems like a bug.

Nope. I'm not sure why it happened then.

And for some reason it seems to be getting harder to reach the end with Isaac, I get shit loadout after shit loadout.

 

[SerTapTap]

So... the hearts that characters have... is this reflective of how Issac feels about them? Also I'm beginning to wonder if his mother actually tried to kill him...

Well the other characters

Spoiler

ARE isaac, except, possibly, Lazarus, Azazel, and it's not explicitly stated but quite likely that ??? and The Lost are Isaac posthumously

.

A lot's open to interpretation, but I would say child abuse and attempted filicide are quite probable.

Spoiler

It's a classic 1cc hitless run, it's supposed to be super hard.

Spoiler

The Lost

plays NOTHING like a 1CC run in any game I've ever played and I've played a few dozen bullet hell shmups. There is NO GAME that starts you with ONE hit, NO bombs, NO lives. That is not the challenge of 1CC clears. It's what would happen if someone who's never played bullet hell games made a game based on their bad impressions of one (and given the bullet patterns of some bosses, I assume Ed has at least played some or understands them well enough that shouldn't be the problem here)

Is it possible to defeat It Lives with half a heart?

Easily. All of It Lives' patterns are quite dodgeable, the enemies it spawns aren't really too bad. Just never stand ABOVE it (if it goes back to the ceiling it will hurt you), and be VERY careful when killing the first 2-4 eyes that spawn. They're the only thing I'm afraid of in that fight.

Is there really any point in using seeds to get every item though? I figure if you're planning to 100% you'll get them just by playing anyway. Except for Meat Boy/Bandage Girl I guess.

The angel room and secret room collectables can be about as bad as Meat Boy/Bandage Girl, but generally speaking no, you're absolutely not going to get 100% collection simply by playing the game "normally". You'd probably have to play dozens or hundreds of hours of non-exploiting gameplay AFTER unlocking everything to get it, and that's 100% bullshit. It's pure RNG, no challenge at all, and I have no problem with exploiting my way out of something that's not an actual skill based "challenge".

 

[aku:jiki]

It's what would happen if someone who's never played bullet hell games made a game based on their bad impressions of one (and given the bullet patterns of some bosses, I assume Ed has at least played some or understands them well enough that shouldn't be the problem here)

Funny, I'd say the bullet patterns are proof that he knows nothing about shmups and has only seen a few screenshots of Touhou or whatever. They're all extremely simple patterns, and he does the opposite of most danmaku games in that he does simple patterns with fast-moving bullets as opposed to slow-moving, very intricate patterns.

A good example is Krampus' simple little pattern (which is also the same as Fallen's pattern, which is kinda lazy).

 

[buy teh haloz]

I just got the platinum.
I have over 72 mom kills, plus hundreds of quick restarts both from doing The Lost as well as Isaac D6 runs.
Despite that, I was missing 3 common items (eight ball, mongo, and something else), 1 secret room item (missing no.), and iirc 4 or 5 angel room items.

Sure, I might have found the Eight Ball next run. But if a month and a half of fairly heavy play (it was the only game I played for that time) didn't turn up common items, you can understand the potential issue with specialty items, especially 'special' items like god head that have negative modifiers on availability based on your current inventory.

With what, something like 350 items in the game, and each game lasting, say, 45 minutes to an hour, trying to find every item w/o any form of abuse (be it seeds, treasure room restarting, infinite D6, etc) would drive you to drink... though you'd always have some people who found everything quickly, because, well, RNG. Angel Room items being the worst case, since you won't even see one till at least floor 3, and even then they aren't guaranteed, and even if one shows up it often doesn't even have items but eternal hearts... and even if it did have an item, it's most likely a common angel room item, not the rare ones like sacred heart and godhead.

Fortunately, while abusing a seed for infinite D6 (for meatboy/girl) I worked out a way to abuse arcades into infinite pickup generators, and then furthermore learned that if you a) avoid certain items and b) don't exhaust the treasure room pool you will also have a much higher chance at seeing rare angel items. (I couldn't find seeds for everything).

Honestly seems kind of crazy that Eight Ball would be one of your last items, since even though it doesn't show up that often it's still part of the boss item pool, which is pretty small.

 

[Celegus]

Still need the rest of the boss kills with ??? (other than D6), but this run looks promising with Polyphemus, Halo and Cat o Nine Tails as my first three items! Dark Bum or Mitre for ez mode please!

 

[SerTapTap]

Funny, I'd say the bullet patterns are proof that he knows nothing about shmups and has only seen a few screenshots of Touhou or whatever. They're all extremely simple patterns, and he does the opposite of most danmaku games in that he does simple patterns with fast-moving bullets as opposed to slow-moving, very intricate patterns.

A good example is Krampus' simple little pattern (which is also the same as Fallen's pattern, which is kinda lazy).

I meant more like Isaac, It Lives, Lamb and Blue Baby. They're clearly intended to be bullet hell lite, Isaac's fat hitbox and incredibly inconsistent movement speed means anything more complex would be a pretty dick move. It Lives has some of the classic "weave between fairly light patterns" shots, too. It's still more bullet hell than stuff you'd see in Gradius (which is closer to Krampus' stuff).

The bullet patterns aren't quite proper bullet hell, but I think as-is they make more sense for BOI's gameplay than more directly ripping the extremely intricate, very tight patterns. That stuff's meant for a game where you have strict control over movement speed (and often a slow down button), and a very explicit and small hitbox (isaac's hitbox is neither)

 

[Kid Ska]

Honestly, Eve is kind of a poor man's Judas.

 

[SerTapTap]

Honestly, Eve is kind of a poor man's Judas.

She is, though with the benefit of having the damage buff in every room...if your health is low enough. The difference is Eve's benefits taper off quickly, but Judas' stay constant (judas gains health, eve often can't without losing damage, they both gain damage/tears up equally). So Eve is "better" for the first couple floors but then worse for the rest of the run.

Funny enough Eve could seriously benefit from Book of Belial's devil room effect even without the damage buff.

 

[autoduelist]

Honestly seems kind of crazy that Eight Ball would be one of your last items, since even though it doesn't show up that often it's still part of the boss item pool, which is pretty small.

I absolutely agree - and that's sort of the point. Basing a collectible trophy on the RNG is cruel and inhumane. I count us lucky it was exploitable, else hunting down those last couple of items would all be worse than Pure Bladestone in Demon's Souls.

 

[Kid Ska]

She is, though with the benefit of having the damage buff in every room...if your health is low enough. The difference is Eve's benefits taper off quickly, but Judas' stay constant (judas gains health, eve often can't without losing damage, they both gain damage/tears up equally). So Eve is "better" for the first couple floors but then worse for the rest of the run.

Funny enough Eve could seriously benefit from Book of Belial's devil room effect even without the damage buff.

Yeah, I guess it's cool that Eve has that motivation for taking deals, but I'd probably be doing that with Judas anyway more easily, and still be better off for it. I'd rather play Judas 100% of the time.

 

[SerTapTap]

Yeah, I guess it's cool that Eve has that motivation for taking deals, but I'd probably be doing that with Judas anyway more easily, and still be better off for it. I'd rather play Judas 100% of the time.

Yeah, only real benefit of Eve for me is she looks way cooler. If I have spare hearts I'll take not-so-great devil deal items that turn you into a demon just because it looks cool. Almost the only reason I'll take Lord of the Pit (I mean, flying is good, but it's probably the worst way to get flying).

 

[Caderfix]

Everytime I see this thread in the first page I smile. Such a simple and good game getting the attention it deserves.

I'm working on hard mode now and, God Damn, those mask/heart enemies are EVERYWHERE lol

 

[CassSept]

Easily. All of It Lives' patterns are quite dodgeable, the enemies it spawns aren't really too bad. Just never stand ABOVE it (if it goes back to the ceiling it will hurt you), and be VERY careful when killing the first 2-4 eyes that spawn. They're the only thing I'm afraid of in that fight.

Unless you are huge, when I reached It Lives with Leo and no orbitals it was painful, I'm pretty sure some of the more intricate patterns were pretty much impossible to avoid.

 

[SerTapTap]

Unless you are huge, when I reached It Lives with Leo and no orbitals it was painful, I'm pretty sure some of the more intricate patterns were pretty much impossible to avoid.

I don't think size altering items actually alter Isaac's hitbox, they just make it harder to dodge because you're no longer as sure of your hitbox. Unless they fixed that in rebirth, I'm pretty sure it doesn't do it in the original. Either way, Isaac is very much a "get as far away from the bullets as possible" style game. If it had a grazing mechanic I'd go nuts because Isaac is never moving at the same speed and his hitbox is so fat.