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[duckroll]

Also, does anyone remember whether William have any interaction with Maeve? I'm asking this because based on her "memory" she was not always a prostitute.

No, William and Logan never share a scene with Maeve. They do have scenes with the prostitute Maeve is with.

Same thing with Hector, they encountered a bunch of different wanted posters in Sweetwater but none has Hector's name on it.

They have also never run into Teddy. Any scene where Dolores encounters Teddy is part of a different scene. She never interacts with William and then interacts with Teddy in the same scene.

These could all be coincidences, but they're also parts of what makes this theory interesting to muse over.

 

[Charles Brandon]

it's the logo stuff that makes the theory real. Without that corroboration it's just an interpretation that, while it hasn't been disproved, doesn't have much supporting evidence besides the fact that it hasn't been shown to be untrue. Except the logos, the logos are a clear indicator of the passage of time. The only other explanation is a continuity error.

 

[Chuckie]

They do have scenes with the prostitute Maeve is with.

Her name is Clementine Pennyfeather thank you very much!

 

[Chumley]

This thread right now

 

[duckroll]

Her name is Clementine Pennyfeather thank you very much!

You know her name. Weirdo! I bet you know Hector's snake-tattoo lady's name too.

(Are the names ever actually mentioned on the show outside the credits? I seriously haven't noticed...)

 

[Charles Brandon]

also that hack critic who poo-poohed the theory after having watched four episodes can fuck off. It's still alive you dick. What do you say now?

 

[Rentahamster]

They didn't though. The directly interacted with MiB multiple times (even viewing him on their tablets). MiB's interaction with the present narrative is 100% confirmed. It's not in doubt. He also interacts with Hector, Teddy, and numerous other hosts we know are part of the present storylines in Westworld.

No one has directly interacted with William and Logan other than Dolores. There is a host sent to bring her home... back to the farm. But the Delos control room conversation was about Dolores alone with no confirmation of other guests with her, and the instruction was to flag it with Behavioral to recover her and do a diagnostic, not "send a host to bring her back on loop" so it's not explicit that the events are related. If there is a single scene of the current control room actually acknowledging William and Logan, the theory is dead. That has't happened yet. It's a low bar.

For all we know, that employee or host who was tasked to bring her back could have been under Behavior's control.

William and Dolores' current chain of events is this, right?

Dolores goes home, sees her dad shot, kills the bandit in the barn, runs away, stumbles upon William's camp.

When she first sees her dad shot, it's not the old dad, it's the new dad. Presumably, if William's adventures are in the past, then Dolores wouldn't have memories of her replacement dad yet.

Unless the show edits in the time jump cuts very haphazardly for some reason.

 

[Charles Brandon]

For all we know, that employee or host who was tasked to bring her back could have been under Behavior's control.

William and Dolores' current chain of events is this, right?

Dolores goes home, sees her dad shot, kills the bandit in the barn, runs away, stumbles upon William's camp.

When she first sees her dad shot, it's not the old dad, it's the new dad. Presumably, if William's adventures are in the past, then Dolores wouldn't have memories of her replacement dad yet.

Unless the show edits in the time jump cuts very haphazardly for some reason.

We see Dolores skip backwards and forwards in time (in her head anyway). First she pulls the gun from the dresser, then it isn't there anymore, now she's being shot by the bandit, now she dodges and takes his gun instead. The bandit is coming to rape her, or is it the MIB? There is no way to be sure about exactly when any of her interactions take place. They are being deliberately obfuscated. The editing is such that at first glance it appears that everything is in sequence but if you really dig into it they always stop short of anything conclusive.

 

[Chuckie]

You know her name. Weirdo! I bet you know Hector's snake-tattoo lady's name too.

(Are the names ever actually mentioned on the show outside the credits? I seriously haven't noticed...)

Armistice!

I think Clementine's first name was mentioned once. When I looked her name up it looked familiar.
But yeah names seem to be rarely mentioned.

 

[elrechazado]

also that hack critic who poo-poohed the theory after having watched four episodes can fuck off. It's still alive you dick. What do you say now?

I think he'd say you are taking it a bit personally...

 

[duckroll]

By the end of the season how many more times do you think we'll see Hector's ridiculous one handed rifle reload animation?

also that hack critic who poo-poohed the theory after having watched four episodes can fuck off. It's still alive you dick. What do you say now?

Lol, calm down dude.

 

[Charles Brandon]

I AM CALM!!!!

 

[The Mule]

They do have scenes with the prostitute Maeve is with.

Didn't the prostitute make a comment to Maeve that she should've paid him for saving her? If I didn't misinterpret that, it puts William and Maeve (as a prostitute) in the same timeline.

 

[Mr. Pointy]

Hey. Listen.

Spoiler

Westworld shrinks everyone to microscopic size.

 

[Corpekata]

For all we know, that employee or host who was tasked to bring her back could have been under Behavior's control.

William and Dolores' current chain of events is this, right?

Dolores goes home, sees her dad shot, kills the bandit in the barn, runs away, stumbles upon William's camp.

When she first sees her dad shot, it's not the old dad, it's the new dad. Presumably, if William's adventures are in the past, then Dolores wouldn't have memories of her replacement dad yet.

Unless the show edits in the time jump cuts very haphazardly for some reason.

We don't know if this is for sure. There's a reason the show opens with her paired up with the park staff and not with William.

Logan suggests to William that the park sent her to him to keep him engaged since he was not all that into things. Which sounds silly to William, but we actually see something like this in this episode when the guests with Hector are "arrested" and thrown into a plot where "a girl will come smuggle them in a key" by the people in the park. So we do know the park staff willingly manipulate guests.

So the assumption for the past theory is it's either part of another Dolores story (if it's in the past, it is possible she's got an entirely different routine), a different glitch, or Logan's theory.

Didn't the prostitute make a comment to Maeve that she should've paid him for saving her? If I didn't misinterpret that, it puts William and Maeve (as a prostitute) in the same timeline.

No she says this about a customer that was a really good lay and had a big dick. It's part of their routine as we see it "echo" for Maeve.

 

[biggersmaller]

Hey. Listen.

Spoiler

Westworld shrinks everyone to microscopic size.

I don't think so. If Westworld would have to go to the trouble of shrinking one of these bastards down for construction purposes, why make it microscopic to begin with?

 

[Nodnol]

By the end of the season how many more times do you think we'll see Hector's ridiculous one handed rifle reload animation?

Rediculously cool, right?

He's done it twice? I need to see it at least twice more.

 

[Grizzlyjin]

I was super against the William = Man in Black theory...but I'm slowly wondering. Them being vague about who Delores was traveling with in the control room got my gears turning.

 

[The Real Napsta]

Rediculously cool, right?

He's done it twice? I need to see it at least twice more.

Anyone have a .gif?

 

[Dmax3901]

You guys all look me in the eye and tell me there wasn't fuck loads of moon symbolism going on in this Ep.

 

[shira]

 

[Corpekata]

Think they are referring to where he reloaded the gun by thrusting it forward with one hand, then pulled it back.

 

[EatChildren]

Caught up.

I fucking love this show.

 

[Kayhan]

William's story is set 30 years in the past. He is part of the event. The event is very similar to the old movie with Yul Brynner as the murderous robot.

But in this version of the event Dolores will be Yul Brynner and hunt William=Young MiB.

Remember how intimately familiar MiB is with Dolores.

Remember, Dolores was the "first one". Somehow even though she went berserk 30 years ago they didn't get rid of her. Just mind wiped her. At some point she will regain her memories of rebelling 30 years earlier. But this time around her revolution will be smarter, recruit more hosts, and perhaps be focussed on more than just "kill all humans".

I am sorry to spoiler this new HBO show for you guys but THE TRUTH WILL OUT.

 

[Charles Brandon]

I don't see how that can have happened and the park stayed open. But otherwise seems reasonable and along the lines of what we have been discussing. No need for the condescension though.

actually did you edit that? I'm sure it said something condescending before. Now I look silly.

 

[Kayhan]

I don't see how that can have happened and the park stayed open. But otherwise seems reasonable and along the lines of what we have been discussing. No need for the condescension though.

actually did you edit that? I'm sure it said something condescending before. Now I look silly.

You are remembering the time before your mind wipe.

 

[Charles Brandon]

goddamn mindwipes

 

[Chiaroscuro]

While everything point to the different timelines theory, including how vague the park staff were, the thing that is hard to swallow is if something bad happened while the park was already opened (Arnold stuff seems to have happened during the 3 years beta test) how the park stayed open, how they did not change the fundamentals of the A.I. in order to prevent it to ever happen again, plus how Dolores was not retired to the cold storage but remain in the park, even wiped. One revolution I can understand in the story. Two, separated by 30 years, not.

 

[More_Badass]

While everything point to the different timelines theory, including how vague the park staff were, the thing that is hard to swallow is if something bad happened while the park was already opened (Arnold stuff seems to have happened during the 3 years beta test) how the park stayed open, how they did not change the fundamentals of the A.I. in order to prevent it to ever happen again, plus how Dolores was not retired to the cold storage but remain in the park, even wiped. One revolution I can understand in the story. Two, separated by 30 years, not.

People have died in Disney and other theme parks. Hell, that incident with the alligator was this year. The park and resorts are still open. You fix the mistake and move on. Is getting onto Kingda Ka trusting that it doesn't fly off the tracks that much different than going to Westworld and trusting the hosts? In both cases, you're hoping the machines don't go haywire

 

[Chiaroscuro]

People have died in Disney and other theme parks. Hell, that incident with the alligator was this year. The park and resorts are still open. You fix the mistake and move on. Is getting onto Kingda Ka trusting that it doesn't fly off the tracks that much different than going to Westworld and trusting the hosts? In both cases, you're hoping the machines don't go haywire

Exactly. Fix the mistakes. To keep Dolores (or any host, as they show in case of her father) working after a majorincident is not fix a mistake.

 

[convo]

So after rewatching episode 3 just before Dolores shoots that guy from GTA5 she flashes back to when MIB was in the barn with her and he said this:

Spoiler

Why don't we reacquaint ourselves, Dolores?
Start at the beginning.

This seems huge to me.
When she tries to flee after shooting that guy she apparently gets shot but it seems to be just a memory and continues to run away to where William and his friend is. But what if she really got shot and fell unconscious but is dreaming/remembering about the time where she succesfully ran away from that particular scene and is remembering the time she first ran across William/past-MIB. So the words the MIB spoke in the barn to Dolores would make sense . This would make sense of any time discrepency since even if she somehow remembers MIB when she's with young William in a future episode, that could be her just dreaming about her past with William and recalling MIB would make her wake up again or something. Everything we're seeing with Dolores and William interacting could just be her re-experiencing old memories while she's unconscious waiting to get cleaned up.

 

[More_Badass]

Exactly. Fix the mistakes. To keep Dolores (or any host, as they show in case of her father) working after a majorincident is not fix a mistake.

And even then it takes a lot of fuck-ups for a park to close. Ever heard of Action Park? It was an infamous amusement park, and it took twenty years and a ton of lawsuits after six deaths and reports of underage untrained stage and poor safety conditions to finally close

If Westworld only had one critical failure in thirty years, that's a great track record

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Could Teddie be the MIB?
#savemyteddiesavetheworld

 

[Neoweee]

While everything point to the different timelines theory, including how vague the park staff were, the thing that is hard to swallow is if something bad happened while the park was already opened (Arnold stuff seems to have happened during the 3 years beta test) how the park stayed open, how they did not change the fundamentals of the A.I. in order to prevent it to ever happen again, plus how Dolores was not retired to the cold storage but remain in the park, even wiped. One revolution I can understand in the story. Two, separated by 30 years, not.

We know that there are at least some Hosts that were present back then and are still present now. Armistice (Snake Bandit) was in the "training" flashbacks, in a very different role.

We also know Elon Musk's wife was present back then, so she was either used for 30+ years, or the William stuff is a flashback.

 

[ZOONAMI]

Didn't the prostitute make a comment to Maeve that she should've paid him for saving her? If I didn't misinterpret that, it puts William and Maeve (as a prostitute) in the same timeline.

We don't know if this is for sure. There's a reason the show opens with her paired up with the park staff and not with William.

Logan suggests to William that the park sent her to him to keep him engaged since he was not all that into things. Which sounds silly to William, but we actually see something like this in this episode when the guests with Hector are "arrested" and thrown into a plot where "a girl will come smuggle them in a key" by the people in the park. So we do know the park staff willingly manipulate guests.

So the assumption for the past theory is it's either part of another Dolores story (if it's in the past, it is possible she's got an entirely different routine), a different glitch, or Logan's theory.



No she says this about a customer that was a really good lay and had a big dick. It's part of their routine as we see it "echo" for Maeve.

Wait, I do vaguely recall Clementine talking to maeve right after being rescued by william.

What episode would that be? 2 I think. Gonna check

 

[ZOONAMI]

We know that there are at least some Hosts that were present back then and are still present now. Armistice (Snake Bandit) was in the "training" flashbacks, in a very different role.

We also know Elon Musk's wife was present back then, so she was either used for 30+ years, or the William stuff is a flashback.

Yeah the welcome host lady was in the training dancing scene too. This really might be just an Easter egg for eagle eyed viewers, just having some of the cast volunteer to do that scene dancing.

 

[Corpekata]

Wait, I do vaguely recall Clementine talking to maeve right after being rescued by william.

What episode would that be? 2 I think. Gonna check

Episode 3 IIRC is the one where he rescues her during the shootout so it would be that one or episode 4 if such a scene exists.

 

[Charles Brandon]

What's this training dance?

 

[Admiral Woofington]

What's this training dance?

During the flashbacks when Hannibal is talking about Arnold or something they show early training scenes where they show the robots learning to dance.

 

[Palmer_v1]

I kept thinking of Delos as DEL OS, i.e. Delete Operating System.


#TinFoilTime

 

[Chiaroscuro]

We know that there are at least some Hosts that were present back then and are still present now. Armistice (Snake Bandit) was in the "training" flashbacks, in a very different role.

We also know Elon Musk's wife was present back then, so she was either used for 30+ years, or the William stuff is a flashback.

I mean, if Dolores was involved in a major incident / fuck up, she would not remain active, they would put her in cold storage like her father.

 

[Corpekata]

I mean, if Dolores was involved in a major incident / fuck up, she would not remain active, they would put her in cold storage like her father.

That's presuming the staff is purely logical, which we clearly know isn't true. I mean, even if she wasn't involved, just updating her in the first place is odd given we know the 2nd oldest model was pretty far behind. We have seen both Ford and Bernard indulge their inner mad scientist already with Bernard quite directly working to hide that something is off with Dolores right now.

 

[More_Badass]

That's presuming the staff is purely logical, which we clearly know isn't true. I mean, even if she wasn't involved, just updating her in the first place is odd given we know the 2nd oldest model was pretty far behind.

Delores seems to be a legacy item, a historical relic, and a point of pride for the park. A walking reminder of "Look how far we've come". She's special

I'd imagine they would rather upgrade and replace parts rather than put her in cold storage.

 

[ZOONAMI]

No maeve and Clementine scene after william rescued her.

 

[-griffy-]

I saw a write-up with an interesting theory yesterday that suggests there are two Dolores bodies. Remember the hosts are essentially software in a hardware chassis, so it's plausible that the Dolores currently in the park is actually an updated body with Dolores' AI transferred over. And then the Dolores that Bernard is meeting is actually an old body, which he transfers her "mind" over to when her other body is sleeping. This might explain a great many things, namely how he is keeping his meetings with her a secret.

 

[ZOONAMI]

The thing that doesn't make sense to me is that the new hosts are like 3d printed and the old flashbacks they were sort of like your standard robot with skin on them. So I don't really see how they could upgrade Delores without basically completely rebuilding her unless they just mean they kept her programming intact, which would actually point towards her having the same role since the parks inception.

 

[Cornballer]

- Lengthy Evan Rachel Wood interview with Huffington Post/AOL (~23 min video and pull quotes)

Join Evan Rachel Wood when she comes to discuss her role on HBO’s “Westworld.” Wood plays Dolores, a host who spends her days around the family ranch, dreaming of a bright future and preferring to see the beauty in the world. Interview at AOL HQ in NYC for BUILD Series.

 

[Snakethesniper]

I think I'm enjoying the show, but now I wonder, I'm the only one who thinks that it's a little too slow paced? I'm ok with a slow developing of sentience, but I don't know, for a hour long episode each I think they could speed it up a little, but probably it's just me

 

[Kuros]

I think I'm enjoying the show, but now I wonder, I'm the only one who thinks that it's a little too slow paced? I'm ok with a slow developing of sentience, but I don't know, for a hour long episode each I think they could speed it up a little, but probably it's just me

My wife has given up on it for the same reason.

 

[ZOONAMI]

I think I'm enjoying the show, but now I wonder, I'm the only one who thinks that it's a little too slow paced? I'm ok with a slow developing of sentience, but I don't know, for a hour long episode each I think they could speed it up a little, but probably it's just me

My wife has given up on it for the same reason.

Tbh I fell asleep during ep 4 it was going so slow. Woke up, rewound and watch the Hopkins Meredith scene and was like ok mind blown again. It does feel like the pacing could be better though. Seems like some scenes drag on for too long. I feel like a lot of the park hq scenes that don't involve Hopkins or Bernard could be completely scraped, except for the one of maeve waking up there. I feel like I don't really need to know what Hemsworth Sr is attempting to direct honestly. Just keep it in the park as much as possible imo. The hq set also just really clashes with the whole western vibe.