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PoliGAF 2015-2016 |OT3| If someone named PhoenixDark leaves your party, call the cops

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F

Father_Brain

Banned
ivysaur12 said:
With Cruz attacking Trump over "New York values", let's take some time to look at a political attack ad that actually made that point in 2008 with San Fransisco values with a much better effect: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uROhNSsi79E

Like, if you're going to be obnoxiously homophobic, go for broke.
Click to expand...

God, I remember that ad. Possibly the most boring and cheap right-wing depiction of Liberal Decadence and Depravity
 
D

danm999

Member
PBY said:
Yooo don't let the Donald see this, especially right before the debate on the fucking economy.
Click to expand...

Trump would have a fucking field day with this.

Besides the general shadyness of it all there's so much rich potential for Trump to portray Ted as a loser deadbeat husband who has to beg his wife for money.
 
I

ivysaur12

Banned
Melkr_ said:
Oh. Those numbers arent that terrible. Socialism is a politically loaded term (the only concept that has an evident political meaning in that list), of course you will see a divide in those who would support (liberal leaning) and those who dont (right wing). And now with a face put on it I think this number is even more irrelevant.
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Over half the country said in 2015 that they would not vote for a socialist, so I would say those numbers are, in fact, not great.

I think that could change, but this is very different than the conspiracy that Obama is a secret socialist from those who would never vote for a Democratic candidate in 2008/12 anyway.

EDIT: Round up for Q4 fundraising:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11aXA-QnrF552w_rie0a9Fd_YvWWoV86uhn97ZE5ptFo/edit#gid=0
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
danm999 said:
Trump would have a fucking field day with this.

Besides the general shadyness of it all there's so much rich potential for Trump to portray Ted as a loser deadbeat husband who has to beg his wife for money.
Click to expand...

Seriously we need to tweet this at Trump.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
ivysaur12 said:
Over half the country said in 2015 that they would not vote for a socialist, so I would say those numbers are, in fact, not great.

I think that could change, but this is very different than the conspiracy that Obama is a secret socialist from those who would never vote for a Democratic candidate in 2008/12 anyway.

EDIT: Round up for Q4 fundraising:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11aXA-QnrF552w_rie0a9Fd_YvWWoV86uhn97ZE5ptFo/edit#gid=0
Click to expand...

I don't like those numbers for Strickland. How the hell does Portman have $12 million? Oh, that's right, he ran against Fisher. Probably didn't have to spend shit on that race. : sigh :
 
A

And_Gignac

Member
ivysaur12 said:
Over half the country said in 2015 that they would not vote for a socialist, so I would say those numbers are, in fact, not great.

I think that could change, but this is very different than the conspiracy that Obama is a secret socialist from those who would never vote for a Democratic candidate in 2008/12 anyway.

EDIT: Round up for Q4 fundraising:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11aXA-QnrF552w_rie0a9Fd_YvWWoV86uhn97ZE5ptFo/edit#gid=0
Click to expand...

Close to half of the country align with Republicans. Again, Socialism is a politically loaded term, of course you will find a similar divide to Dems/Reps. A strategy to bring down Sanders with the socialism thing would prove to be infertile for the Republicans, imo.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
PBY said:
Holy shit.

Speaking seriously - (A) I work in finance, and its already ridiculous for Cruz to say this given his wife's job, and (B) Is this going to stick? Like... does the base care? Does Cruz's support know what Goldman does, or even care?
Click to expand...

Dunno, but I tweeted the article at Trump so we'll find out.
 
M

Makai

Member
Where the fuck is Trump's last minute skeleton reveal? Surely there's some crazy shit that involves hookers or something.
 
I

Iolo

Member
PBY said:
Holy shit.

Speaking seriously - (A) I work in finance, and its already ridiculous for Cruz to say this given his wife's job, and (B) Is this going to stick? Like... does the base care? Does Cruz's support know what Goldman does, or even care?
Click to expand...

Cruz financed his campaign on the sly with a loan from Wall Street. It doesn't get much simpler.
 
D

danm999

Member
Makai said:
Where the fuck is Trump's last minute skeleton reveal? Surely there's some crazy shit that involves hookers or something.
Click to expand...

Well if it exists and someone outside the GOP has it, obviously they aren't going to let it out of the bag until he's the nominee.

Or maybe someone in the GOP has it, they're hoping Trump will implode on his own so they don't have to take him down and run the risk of him going third party?
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
It's not just the socialism label. It's the tax and spend liberal perception that's more potent. The Obama campaign made it a point to hammer home that he wanted to cut taxes, not raise them, and he wanted deficit reduction.

All of this is less relevant if the election is about terrorism and foreign policy, where Democrats are already starting at a perceived disadvantage.
 
G

GnawtyDog

Banned
Bam Bam Baklava said:
It's not just the socialism label. It's the tax and spend liberal perception that's more potent. The Obama campaign made it a point to hammer home that he wanted to cut taxes, not raise them, and he wanted deficit reduction.
Click to expand...

The label helps a narrative. A strong narrative along with the label is what the GOP will use.

Higher taxes to pay for his programs, including a raise on middle class taxes (and all the misinformation that will come with it), subsidized this, subsided that... universal healthcare bla bla bla...worse than Obamacare on steroids bla bla bla. The narrative writes itself. I think NOT being naive about this is not being "anti-sanders"....."Hillary shill". It's just the reality of what will happen if he gets the nomination. Hec, Hillary will push him on this if it becomes a closely contested primary...I mean you have Chelsea already throwing shade about it (poor form in my view) but that's politics. He will be pushed hard, very hard on this. There hasn't been the need for a large scale smearing campaign on him yet.
 
E

East Lake

Member
Bam Bam Baklava said:
It's not just the socialism label. It's the tax and spend liberal perception that's more potent. The Obama campaign made it a point to hammer home that he wanted to cut taxes, not raise them, and he wanted deficit reduction.
Click to expand...
Which was a miserable failure after the debt exploded, and he still won anyway in 2012.
 
A

And_Gignac

Member
This new Clinton ad gave me a bit of deja vu.

art.clintonad.cnn.jpg
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
East Lake said:
Which was a miserable failure after the debt exploded, and he still won anyway in 2012.
Click to expand...

He also ran on successfully cutting taxes.

If every candidate could just be like Obama, there would be a lot more winners. The comparisons to Obama are not apt, he's a much better candidate than Clinton or Sanders could ever hope to be. So I find your comparisons kind of weak to be honest.
 
D

Daniel B·

Banned
Oh wow (just caught Joe's interview on CNN)! Joe really is feeling it :):



CNN said:
Gloria: Why is she having trouble?

Joe: I think that Bernie is speaking to a yearning, that is deep and real, and he has credibility on it, and that is the enormous concentration of wealth, in a small group of people, with the Middle Class, now, being able to be shown, being left out.

There used to be a basic bargain; if you contributed to the profitability of an enterprise, you got to share in the profit. That's been broken; productivities up, wages are stagnant.

Gloria: But Hillary's been talking about that?

Joe: But it's relatively new for Hillary to talk about that. Hillary's focus has been on other things, up to now, and that's been Bernie's, er, no one questions Bernie's authenticity on those issues.
Click to expand...

Bonus! Bernie responds to Joe's #FeelTheBern interview ;).

P.S. Full disclosure; Imgur isn't PS3 compatible (bummer, man), so I have to turn on my ThinkPad, just to upload an image (time to check Amazon daily bargains - recently snapped up a smart looking Etekcity electric scale for just $12 :) ) ...
 
E

East Lake

Member
Bam Bam Baklava said:
He also ran on successfully cutting taxes.

If every candidate could just be like Obama, there would be a lot more winners. The comparisons to Obama are not apt, he's a much better candidate than Clinton or Sanders could ever hope to be. So I find your comparisons kind of weak to be honest.
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I'm not saying he is Clinton or Sanders. My main point is that this is almost totally speculative and no different from whatever idea is floating around the heads of the pundits on Morning Joe.

Obama had the misfortune of taking over during the financial crisis and having the debt explode under his watch. Whatever Bernie's big gov tax and spend weakness is it'll pale in comparison to what Obama had to put up with between 09-12.
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
East Lake said:
I'm not saying he is Clinton or Sanders. My main point is that this is almost totally speculative and no different from whatever idea is floating around the heads of the pundits on Morning Joe.

Obama had the misfortune of taking over during the financial crisis and having the debt explode under his watch. Whatever Bernie's big gov tax and spend weakness is it'll pale in comparison to what Obama had to put up with between 09-12.
Click to expand...

And I'm telling you that Obama as a candidate was able to get past that but I don't have the confidence that Sanders can because he's no Obama. Just like Dukkakis was no Clinton and that's why he lost 4 years prior. Kerry was ineffective at shaking the perception of weakness and swift boating because he was not a capable candidate.

So you can say Obama was able to overcome this and that but that's no guarantee of anything because Sanders is not Obama.
 
I

ivysaur12

Banned
Melkr_ said:
Close to half of the country align with Republicans. Again, Socialism is a politically loaded term, of course you will find a similar divide to Dems/Reps. A strategy to bring down Sanders with the socialism thing would prove to be infertile for the Republicans, imo.
Click to expand...

Close to half the country aligns with Republicans, but more than half the country would not vote for a socialist president. That would include people who voted for Obama. That's a problem. I don't know if it would hold if Sanders won the nomination, but I don't hand wave it away.

adam387 said:
I don't like those numbers for Strickland. How the hell does Portman have $12 million? Oh, that's right, he ran against Fisher. Probably didn't have to spend shit on that race. : sigh :
Click to expand...

Right? Strickland cannot fuck this up.
 
N

NeoXChaos

Member
Edwards is on fire.

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_268748/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=ykem0hye

ivysaur12 said:
Close to half the country aligns with Republicans, but more than half the country would not vote for a socialist president. That would include people who voted for Obama. That's a problem. I don't know if it would hold if Sanders won the nomination, but I don't hand wave it away.



Right? Strickland cannot fuck this up.
Click to expand...

The Ohio and FL Democrats are notorious for losing winnable races. Ask Bertram and Adam. They know. 06 is their only bright in a 30+ year downward spiral on the state level.
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
And to continue. Obama had a lot of savvy people on his campaign and OFA was one of the most well run political machines we've seen.

Anyone can just say Obama did it, but replicating it is an entirely different beast.
 
I

ivysaur12

Banned
This is literally my porn:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/republican-contested-convention-whispers-trump-cruz-217741

Others, though, are worried. One senior party operative warned that the National Republican Congressional Committee, which is tasked with preserving the House majority, seemed unprepared for the possibility that a Trump or Cruz nomination could adversely impact down-ballot candidates. A top GOP pollster, Dave Sackett, recently warned House Speaker Paul Ryan that, of all the Republican candidates, Cruz would be the biggest drag on House Republicans.
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ALSO LOL

Others complained that the party has come up short in achieving the goals it laid out in the "Growth and Opportunity Project," a post-2012 report that outlined the obstacles the GOP faced in expanding its appeal. Among the suggestions: Taking steps to win over minorities, and softening its opposition to immigration reform.

“Some of the things in the Growth and Opportunity Project haven’t been accomplished,” acknowledged John Ryder, a Tennessee committeeman and the RNC’s general counsel.
Click to expand...
 
I

ivysaur12

Banned
Bam Bam Baklava said:
I don't see how they could predict something like that. How do you do that? Tell which candidate would have the most positive or negative impact on downballot races?
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Probably which candidate would keep the most Republicans home in any R+4<->D+4 districts.

Also, this bodes well for whoever the nominee is ala Indiana:

Nate Silver &#8207;@NateSilver538
Sure seems like the Democratic ground games in Iowa are an order of magnitude better than the Republican ones
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Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Crossposting b/c this is better than the last 3 pages of arguing over socialesm:

Y2Kev said:
Trump: Did anyone see the loan that Ted Cruz got from the big banks? I don't know, I haven't heard about it. I just saw it on the TV on the way over. Anyway, he took this YUGE loan and then he bashed them-- he BASHED them. Lloyd Blankfein is probably reading this and going, "Oh, brother." Anyway, so he took the...he took the loan...what? I love you people. Turn the cameras around. Turn them around. Look at the hat this guy has on. Yes, it's fabulous. What does it say?

*Crowd responds MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN*

I love you people. And you people love me. Anyway, so he took the loan and I heard he LIED about it on his taxes and then he DEFAULTED on it. I mean, I heard that. I don't know, it's what the papers are saying. Ted, I said, Ted, Ted, you got to get this stuff in order. You and Rubio. Rubio that guy. He doesn't even know how to balance his checkbook. *flails around* That's Jeb for you.
Click to expand...
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
Makai said:
Does Trump go to bed at 8 PM or something? I can't believe there still isn't an official response ?:^V
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Tomorrow is Thursday. Trump's usual mode of operating is to do or say something attention-grabbing on Thursday afternoon so that he has cycle domination going into the weekend. (And if another candidate tries a stunt on Friday, it's too late, as most folks have checked-out for the weekend by then.)

He likely has something planned for every Thursday for a while, and probably a stunt planned for the day after Iowa, should he lose.

I'm sure he's cooking-up something. It'll be good.
 
M

Makai

Member
HylianTom said:
Tomorrow is Thursday. Trump's usual mode of operating is to do or say something attention-grabbing on Thursday afternoon so that he has cycle domination going into the weekend. (And if another candidate tries a stunt on Friday, it's too late, as most folks have checked-out for the weekend by then.)

He likely has something planned for every Thursday for a while, and probably a stunt planned for the day after Iowa, should he lose.

I'm sure he's cooking-up something. It'll be good.
Click to expand...
Tomorrow is the debate, though.
 
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