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[Debirudog]

Not a Christian, but growing up muslim, by my mom's response to all my questions about inconsistencies and contradictions involved in Islam was to stop asking questions.

I figure it's not too different from many Christian families.

I kept questioning the faith with my mom and she said exactly that.

 

[Balphon]

I'm sure Trump will solve the controversy over the divinity of Christ in his first week in office.

No big deal.

 

[VanMardigan]

There's a ton of resources for Christian folks with questions, no need to get into the "it all falls apart when you start asking questions" trope.

And this SHOULD be a big deal to evangelicals, but of course Trump controversies just get buried by the next one so no one will care about the heresy.

 

[Foffy]

Darkest before dawn assumes there is always a dawn. There are a thousand different ways the world can end at any given moment.

Perhaps, but I am an optimist enough to assume even if we fuck up, it will force a course correction.

Even the failure of rentier Capitalism is something that can be corrected, and in fact may only happen via a collapse and a revolt. When people just stop trying to assimilate and demand the system to burn in Hades, but that involves a falling down of the masses.

I know for a fact that's likely to come, and that darkness may be our only way to ever see light anytime soon.

Hell.

Hell is a state of mind and experience. For many Americans, they've been it even before 2008.

 

[sphagnum]

Hell is a state of mind and experience.

Papist heretic!

 

[Diablos]

This is just the beginning. If you thought this year was bad, hold on to your butts.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Good news, Heitkamp and Manchin are probably staying in the Senate (Heidi is gonna get killed in 2018, but hopefully we replace her with a senator from Arizona).

Bad news, it's because Trump is wildly racist.

President-elect Donald Trump, who repeatedly lashed out at Mexican immigrants during the campaign, is scrambling to appoint a Hispanic official to serve in his Cabinet amid criticism that his incoming administration lacks diversity at the highest levels.

The search has intensified in recent days, and sources within the transition say officials are determined to have a Hispanic in a prominent role. According to a transition official, Trump has narrowed his focus to agriculture secretary as the best possibility of the few remaining openings, which also include veterans affairs and the U.S. trade representative.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/trump-hispanic-cabinet-233020

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I wonder how Trump came to the conclusion that the token Hispanic should be the agricultural secretary

Probably the same way Ben Carson is head of urban development

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Heitkamp isn't done yet, don't underestimate midterms backlash. The GOP doesn't have that attitude and that's why they had a senator from fucking Illinois for six years.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Heitkamp isn't done yet, don't underestimate midterms backlash. The GOP doesn't have that attitude and that's why they had a senator from fucking Illinois for six years.

I'm expecting big midterm backlash and I think we'll do well and I think even Manchin and Tester and Brown will win without a ton of fuss.

But ND is R+35 now and that's just really rough...

 

[Subtle]

Whats a good political economy book? I don't know much about the economy and I want to learn about how it pertains to politics.

 

[Valhelm]

Whats a good political economy book? I don't know much about the economy and I want to learn about how it pertains to politics.

 

[kirblar]

Whats a good political economy book? I don't know much about the economy and I want to learn about how it pertains to politics.

In addition to political economy, Public Choice is something you should look into as well. (Unfortunately, can't find my Syllabus from school) - it's the opposite approach, using economic tools to analyze politics.

 

[thepotatoman]

Not a Christian, but growing up muslim, my mom's response to all my questions about inconsistencies and contradictions in Islam was to stop asking questions.

I figure it's not too different from many Christian families.

I wouldn't call that good evidence of there being no answer to those questions, but I would call it good evidence of how seriously most people take their religions to not care to know the answer to those questions.

It feels annoying to me because it makes Christianity preettttty close to a polytheist religion to me.

Technically I don't really think so, but, honest question, does that matter outside of semantics?

 

[AntraxSuicide]

This is actually pretty interesting and in a logical world more evangelicals would be upset over this. But they're obviously too far gone into the realm of white nationalism for most of them to care and they'll just use flimsy justifications anyway about how God can use bad people blah blah.

Evangelicals shouldn't care about this at all logically since that council meeting was done by a bunch of bishops and shit. They're always giving the "I don't worship no pope!" line when Catholicism comes up.

Evangelical Christianity is a nest of contradictions. I'm not a Christian anymore (was Protestant), but I always respected Catholics for trying to reason their religion together. To me, it was the difference between science fantasy hand-waving things and science fiction trying to explain them.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Evangelicals shouldn't care about this at all logically since that council meeting was done by a bunch of bishops and shit. They're always giving the "I don't worship no pope!" line when Catholicism comes up.

Evangelical Christianity is a nest of contradictions. I'm not a Christian anymore (was Protestant), but I always respected Catholics for trying to reason their religion together. To me, it was the difference between science fantasy hand-waving things and science fiction trying to explain them.

It might be a regional thing (I'm not from the South and admittedly the only southerner I went to church with before I left was a total prick who asked me if I was saved when I mentioned that I voted for Obama) but I've never really felt that from evangelicals here. They have plenty of hypocrisy in their own ways, but they never shied away from answering questions (even if the answers were usually terrible, especially because they were usually secluded from non-Christians) and seemed to largely respect early Catholic church stuff, usually only being against the Catholic church that Luther rebelled against (though I doubt they really know details about any of that lol).

Man, I feel dirty having to defend white Evangelicals since they're usually pretty terrible though. I'm not sure where I stand wrt religion but I sure as fuck am glad I'm not involved with that anymore.

 

[Foffy]

Papist heretic!

Papa? :3c

 

[kess]

I would be shocked if one in ten lay evangelicals could define the difference between monophysitism and miaphysitism and why that might be relevant.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

It might be a regional thing (I'm not from the South and admittedly the only southerner I went to church with before I left was a total prick who asked me if I was saved when I mentioned that I voted for Obama) but I've never really felt that from evangelicals here. They have plenty of hypocrisy in their own ways, but they never shied away from answering questions (even if the answers were usually terrible, especially because they were usually secluded from non-Christians) and seemed to largely respect early Catholic church stuff, usually only being against the Catholic church that Luther rebelled against (though I doubt they really know details about any of that lol).

Man, I feel dirty having to defend white Evangelicals since they're usually pretty terrible though. I'm not sure where I stand wrt religion but I sure as fuck am glad I'm not involved with that anymore.

I could see it being regional. As a rural southerner who grew up Southern Baptist, the lack of structure and theology is an issue. Instead of consistent beliefs, each congregation is like a cult and they only appear united to others. I mean, I highly doubt any of my preachers had done any theology schooling. They were just old guys who had been accepted by the community to be pastors. Half the time if you had a theological question, they'd just make shit up on the spot (you could see the gears turning) that was straight illogical.

My wife was a Baptist growing up in Maryland, but their pastors were always going to theological conferences and had studied biblical things a lot. I would trust that over what I grew up with, which I'd argue is consistent with Southern religion.

 

[sphagnum]

The first few ecumenical councils, or at least Nicaea, are generally recognized by Protestants. People seem to start to think the church "officially" became corrupted after the fall of the Western Empire from what I can figure, since the pope grew in power after that.

Protestants also don't tend to know much about Orthodoxy, I find.

Protestantism in general is a bundle of contradictions.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Technically I don't really think so, but, honest question, does that matter outside of semantics?

Some people in my life have just been dismissive of other cultures in part because of polytheism ("they're savages, they worship so many gods!") so The Trinity annoys me deeply because those people in my life were (or at least had as their identity as) Christian.

It's a minor thing, but it annoys me.

 

[benjipwns]

It may be so.

Things get darkest before the dawn

Well, congratulations! You got yourself caught! Now what's the next step in your master plan?

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Well, congratulations! You got yourself caught! Now what's the next step in your master plan?

Great line from Martin O'Malley.

O'Malley should have been in more of the movie, can't believe they wrote him such a small part.

 

[benjipwns]

And obviously Reagan installing Pinochet was a humanitarian disgrace.

Wow, the Governorship of California was more powerful back in the 1970s than I thought.

 

[whyamihere]

The tweet he was responding to was about how "History shows that democrats are the racist party." I can't even at this point. Democrats have done a terrible job with messaging the idea that the parties drastically reversed belief systems decades ago.

I just saw this. I mean, lol, this is what hyper partisan Republicans say to justify the bigotry of the Republican party. It has nothing to do with Democrats today.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Wow, the Governorship of California was more powerful back in the 1970s than I thought.

California is big enough to secede from the United States (according to Jill Stein). Of course Reagan could install a dictator of Chile.

(Got the dates wrong on that!)

 

[sc0la]

I wonder how Trump came to the conclusion that the token Hispanic should be the agricultural secretary

Probably the same way Ben Carson is head of urban development

Because they don't have a Secratary of Trump Tower Burrito Bowls.

 

[benjipwns]

The parties didn't drastically reverse themselves though in any kind of official platform position. Southerners just moved to the Republican Party.

The Negro

We urge the congress to enact at the earliest possible date a federal anti-lynching law so that the full influence of the federal government may be wielded to exterminate this hideous crime. We believe that much of the misunderstanding which now exists can be eliminated by humane and sympathetic study of its causes. The president has recommended the creation of a commission for the investigation of social and economic conditions and the promotion of mutual understanding and confidence.

The Negro

We renew our recommendation that the Congress enact at the earliest possible date a Federal Anti-Lynching Law so that the full influence of the Federal Government may be wielded to exterminate this hideous crime.

Negroes

Our Negro citizens have participated actively in the economic and social advances launched by this Administration, including fair labor standards, social security benefits, health protection, work relief projects, decent housing, aid to education, and the rehabilitation of low-income farm families. We have aided more than half a million Negro youths in vocational training, education and employment. We shall continue to strive for complete legislative safeguards against discrimination in government service and benefits, and in the national defense forces. We pledge to uphold due process and the equal protection of the laws for every citizen, regardless of race, creed or color.

The Democratic Party is responsible for the great civil rights gains made in recent years in eliminating unfair and illegal discrimination based on race, creed or color,

The Democratic Party commits itself to continuing its efforts to eradicate all racial, religious and economic discrimination.

We again state our belief that racial and religious minorities must have the right to live, the right to work, the right to vote, the full and equal protection of the laws, on a basis of equality with all citizens as guaranteed by the Constitution.

We highly commend President Harry S. Truman for his courageous stand on the issue of civil rights.

Civil Rights

We condemn bigots who inject class, racial and religious prejudice into public and political matters. Bigotry is un-American and a danger to the Republic.

We deplore the duplicity and insincerity of the Party in power in racial and religious matters. Although they have been in office as a Majority Party for many years, they have not kept nor do they intend to keep their promises.

The Republican Party will not mislead, exploit or attempt to confuse minority groups for political purposes. All American citizens are entitled to full, impartial enforcement of Federal laws relating to their civil rights.

We believe that it is the primary responsibility of each State to order and control its own domestic institutions, and this power, reserved to the states, is essential to the maintenance of our Federal Republic. However, we believe that the Federal Government should take supplemental action within its constitutional jurisdiction to oppose discrimination against race, religion or national origin.

We will prove our good faith by:

Appointing qualified persons, without distinction of race, religion or national origin, to responsible positions in the Government.

Federal action toward the elimination of lynching.

Federal action toward the elimination of poll taxes as a prerequisite to voting.

Appropriate action to end segregation in the District of Columbia.

Enacting Federal legislation to further just and equitable treatment in the area of discriminatory employment practices. Federal action should not duplicate state efforts to end such practices; should not set up another huge bureaucracy.

We are proud of the record of the Democratic Party in securing equality of treatment and opportunity in the nation's armed forces, the Civil Service, and in all areas under Federal jurisdiction. The Democratic Party pledges itself to continue its efforts to eliminate illegal discriminations of all kinds, in relation to (1) full rights to vote, (2) full rights to engage in gainful occupations, (3) full rights to enjoy security of the person, and (4) full fights to education in all publicly supported institutions.

Recent decisions of the Supreme Court of the United States relating to segregation in publicly supported schools and elsewhere have brought consequences of vast importance to our Nation as a whole and especially to communities directly affected. We reject all proposals for the use of force to interfere with the orderly determination of these matters by the courts.

The Democratic Party emphatically reaffirms its support of the historic principle that ours is a government of laws and not of men; it recognizes the Supreme Court of the United States as one of the three Constitutional and coordinate branches of the Federal Government, superior to and separate from any political party, the decisions of which are part of the law of the land. We condemn the efforts of the Republican Party to make it appear that this tribunal is a part of the Republican Party.

We condemn the Republican Administration's violation of the rights of Government employees by a heartless and unjustified confusing of "security" and "loyalty" for the sole purpose of political gain and regardless of consequences to individual victims and to the good name of the United States. We condemn the Republican Administration's misrepresentation of facts and violation of individual rights in a wicked and unprincipled attempt to degrade and destroy the Democratic Party, and to make political capital for the Republican Party.

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 deserves and requires full observance by every American and fair, effective enforcement if there is any default.

Resting upon a national consensus expressed by the overwhelming support of both parties, this new law impairs the rights of no American; it affirms the rights of all Americans. Its purpose is not to divide, but to end division; not to curtail the opportunities of any, but to increase opportunities for all; not to punish, but to promote further our commitment to freedom, the pursuit of justice, and a deeper respect for human dignity.

We reaffirm our belief that lawless disregard for the rights of others is wrong—whether used to deny equal rights or to obtain equal rights.

We cannot and will not tolerate lawlessness.

—full implementation and faithful execution of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and all other civil rights statutes, to assure equal rights and opportunities guaranteed by the Constitution to every citizen;

—improvements of civil rights statutes adequate to changing needs of our times;

—such additional administrative or legislative actions as may be required to end the denial, for whatever unlawful reason, of the right to vote;

—immigration legislation seeking to re-unite families and continuation of the "Fair Share" Refugee Program;

—continued opposition to discrimination based on race, creed, national origin or sex. We recognize that the elimination of any such discrimination is a matter of heart, conscience, and education, as well as of equal rights under law.

In all such programs, where Federal initiative is properly involved to relieve or prevent misfortune or meet overpowering need, it will be the Republican way to move promptly and energetically, and wherever possible to provide assistance of a kind enabling the individual to gain or regain the capability to make his own way and to have a fair chance to achieve his own goals. In all matters relating to human rights it will be the Republican way fully to implement all applicable laws and never to lose sight of the intense need for advancing peaceful progress in human relations in our land. The Party of Abraham Lincoln will proudly and faithfully live up to its heritage of equal rights and equal opportunities for all.

From its beginning, our Party has led the way for equal rights and equal opportunity. This great tradition has been carried forward by the Nixon Administration.

Through our efforts de jure segregation is virtually ended. We pledge continuation of these efforts until no American schoolchild suffers educational deprivation because of the color of his skin or the language he speaks and all school children are receiving high quality education. In pursuit of this goal we have proposed $2.5 billion of Federal aid to school districts to improve educational opportunities and build facilities for disadvantaged children. Further to assure minority progress, we have provided more support to predominantly black colleges than ever before—twice the amount being spent when President Nixon took office.

Additionally, we have strengthened Federal enforcement of equal opportunity laws. Spending for civil rights enforcement has been increased from $75 million to $602 million—concrete evidence of our commitment to equal justice for all. The President also supported and signed into law the Equal Employment Opportunity Act of 1972, which makes the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission a much more powerful body.

Working closely with leaders of construction unions, we have initiated 50 "home-town" plans which call for more than 35,000 additional minority hirings in the building trades during the next four years. We will continue to search out new employment opportunities for minorities in other fields as well. We believe such new jobs can and should be created without displacing those already at work. We will give special consideration to minority Americans who live and make their way in the rural regions of our Country—Americans too often bypassed in the advances of the general society.

We have made unprecedented progress in strengthening minority participation in American business. We created the Office of Minority Business Enterprise in March 1969 to coordinate the Federal programs assisting members of minority groups who seek to establish or expand businesses. We have more than tripled Federal loans, guarantees and grants to minority-owned businesses. More minority Americans are now in our Nation's economic mainstream than at any other time in our history, and we pledge every effort to expand these gains.

Minority businesses now receive 16 per cent of the Small Business Administration dollar—more than double the proportion in 1968. Many Minority Enterprise Small Business Investment Companies have been licensed since 1969 to provide venture capital for minority enterprises. More than $200 million is now available through this program, and we have requested additional funding.

In late 1970, we initiated a combined Government-private program to increase minority bank deposits. This year our goal of $100 million has been reached four times over.

We pledge to carry forward our efforts to place minority citizens in responsible positions—efforts we feel are already well under way. During the last four years the percentage of minority Federal employees has risen to a record high of almost 20 per cent and, perhaps more important, the quality of jobs for minority Americans has improved. We have recruited more minority citizens for top managerial posts in Civil Service than ever before. We will see that our progress in this area will continue and grow.

In 1970 President Nixon approved strong new amendments to the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and we pledge continued vigilance to ensure that the rights affirmed by this act are upheld.

As the Party of Lincoln, we remain equally and steadfastly committed to the equality of rights for all citizens, regardless of race. Although this nation has not yet eliminated all vestiges of racism over the years we are heartened by the progress that has been made, we are proud of the role that our Party has played, and we are dedicated to standing shoulder to shoulder with black Americans in that cause.

Elsewhere in this platform, we set forth a number of specific proposals that will also serve to improve the quality of life for blacks. During the next four years we are committed to policies that will:

Encourage local governments to designate specific enterprise zones within depressed areas that will promote new jobs, new and expanded businesses, and new economic vitality;

Open new opportunities for black men and women to begin small businesses of their own by, among other steps, removing excessive regulations, disincentives for venture capital, and other barriers erected by the government;

Bring strong, effective enforcement of federal civil rights statutes, especially those dealing with threats to physical safety and security which have recently been increasing; and

Ensure that the federal government follows a non-discriminatory system of appointments up and down the line, with a careful eye for qualified minority aspirants.
...
Remain fully committed to the fair enforcement of all federal civil rights statutes and continue minority business enterprise and similar programs begun by Republican Administrations but bungled by overregulation and duplication during the Carter Administration.

Equal Rights

Since its inception, the Republican Party has stood for the worth of every person. On that ground, we support the pluralism and diversity that have been part of our country's greatness. "Deep in our hearts, we do believe":

• That bigotry has no place in American life. We denounce those persons, organizations, publications and movements which practice or promote racism, anti-Semitism or religious intolerance.

• That the Pledge of Allegiance should be recited daily in schools in all States. Students who learn we are "one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all" will shun the politics of fear.

• In equal fights for all. The Reagan-Bush Administration has taken to court a record number of civil fights and employment discrimination cases. We will continue our vigorous enforcement of statutes to prevent illegal discrimination on account of sex, race, creed, or national origin.

• In guaranteeing opportunity, not dictating the results of fair competition. We will resist efforts to replace equal rights with discriminatory quota systems and preferential treatment. Quotas are the most insidious form of reverse discrimination against the innocent.

WE BELIEVE that we honor our multicultural heritage by assuring equal access to government services, employment, housing, business enterprise and education to every citizen regardless of race, sex, national origin, religion, age, handicapping condition or sexual orientation; that these rights are without exception too precious to be jeopardized by Federal Judges and Justice Department officials chosen during the past years—by a political party increasingly monolithic both racially and culturally—more for their unenlightened ideological views than for their respect for the rule of law. We further believe that we must work for the adoption of the Equal Rights Amendment to the Constitution; that the fundamental right of reproductive choice should be guaranteed regardless of ability to pay; that our machinery for civil rights enforcement and legal services to the poor should be rebuilt and vigorously utilized; and that our immigration policy should be reformed to promote fairness, non-discrimination and family reunification and to reflect our constitutional freedoms of speech, association and travel. We further believe that the voting rights of all minorities should be protected, the recent surge in hate violence and negative stereotyping combatted, the discriminatory English-only pressure groups resisted, our treaty commitments with Native Americans enforced by culturally sensitive officials, and the lingering effects of past discrimination eliminated by affirmative action, including goals, timetables, and procurement set-asides.

Individual Rights. The protection of individual rights is the foundation for opportunity and security.

The Republican Party is unique in this regard. Since its inception, it has respected every person, even when that proposition was not universally popular. Today, as in the day of Lincoln, we insist that no American' s rights are negotiable.

That is why we declare that bigotry and prejudice have no place in American life. We denounce all who practice or promote racism, anti-Semitism, or religious intolerance. We believe churches and religious schools should not be taxed; we defend the right of religious leaders to speak out on public issues; and we condemn the cowardly desecration of places of worship that has shocked our country in recent years.

Asserting equal rights for all, we support the Bush Administration's vigorous enforcement of statutes to prevent illegal discrimination on account of sex, race, creed, or national origin. Promoting opportunity, we reject efforts to replace equal rights with quotas or other preferential treatment. That is why President Bush fought so long against the Democrat Congress to win a civil rights bill worthy of that name.

We renew the historic Republican commitment to the rights of women, from the early days of the suffragist movement to the present. Because legal rights mean little without opportunity, we assert economic growth as the key to the continued progress of women in all fields of American life.

Civil and Equal Rights

We don't have an American to waste. Democrats will continue to lead the fight to ensure that no Americans suffer discrimination or deprivation of rights on the basis of race, gender, language, national origin, religion, age, disability, sexual orientation, or other characteristics irrelevant to ability. We support the ratification of the Equal Rights Amendment; affirmative action; stronger protection of voting rights for racial and ethnic minorities, including language access to voting; and continued resistance to discriminatory English-only pressure groups. We will reverse the Bush Administration's assault on civil rights enforcement, and instead work to rebuild and vigorously use machinery for civil rights enforcement; support comparable remedies for women; aggressively prosecute hate crimes; strengthen legal services for the poor; deal with other nations in such a way that Americans of any origin do not become scapegoats or victims of foreign policy disputes; provide civil rights protection for gay men and lesbians and an end to Defense Department discrimination; respect Native American culture and our treaty commitments; require the United States Government to recognize its trustee obligations to the inhabitants of Hawaii generally, and to Native Hawaiians in particular; and fully enforce the Americans with Disability Act to enable people with disabilities to achieve independence and function at their highest possible level.

 

[benjipwns]

More importantly:

Pornography

America's children deserve to be free from pornography. We applaud Republicans in the 100th Congress who took the lead to ban interstate dial-a-porn. We endorse legislative and regulatory efforts to anchor more securely a standard of decency in telecommunications and to prohibit the sale of sexually explicit materials in outlets operated on federal property. We commend those who refuse to sell pornographic material. We support the rigorous enforcement of "community standards" against pornography.

Delivery of Mail

We pledge a more efficient and frequent mail delivery service.

 

[benjipwns]

DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMP:

We favor a revision of the procedure for the election of the President and Vice President which will more exactly reflect the popular vote.

We recommend to Congress the submission of a constitutional amendment providing equal rights for women.

We favor equal pay for equal work regardless of sex.

We propose a well-paid and efficient Federal career service.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

I have never seen Nazis love a non-Aryan like they love Duterte.

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/814126514115661824

That's an endorsement............

 

[benjipwns]

lol at those red bars after 1968

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

I like how the Democrats basically didn't write a platform in 1988.

The GOP had them beat a few times over...

 

[Dominican Power]

 

[benjipwns]

This is the entire 1880 Democratic Party Platform, the shortest by far after the Civil War:

The Democrats of the United States, in Convention assembled, declare:
1. We pledge ourselves anew to the constitutional doctrines and traditions of the Democratic party as illustrated by the teachings and example of a long line of Democratic statesmen and patriots, and embodied in the platform of the last National Convention of the party.

2. Opposition to centralization and to that dangerous spirit of encroachment which tends to consolidate the powers of all the departments in one, and thus to create whatever be the form of government, a real despotism. No sumptuary laws; separation of Church and State, for the good of each; common schools fostered and protected.

3. Home rule; honest money, consisting of gold and silver, and paper convertible into coin on demand; the strict maintenance of the public faith, State and National, and a tariff for revenue only.

4. The subordination of the military to the civil power, and a general and thorough reform of the civil service.

5. The right to a free ballot is the right preservative of all rights, and must and shall be maintained in every part of the United States.

6. The existing administration is the representative of conspiracy only, and its claim of right to surround the ballot-boxes with troops and deputy marshals, to intimidate and obstruct the election, and the unprecedented use of the veto to maintain its corrupt and despotic powers, insult the people and imperil their institutions.

7. We execrate the course of this administration in making places in the civil service a reward for political crime, and demand a reform by statute which shall make it forever impossible for a defeated candidate to bribe his way to the seat of the usurper by billeting villains upon the people.

8. The great fraud of 1876-77, by which, upon a false count of the electoral votes of two States, the candidate defeated at the polls was declared to be President, and for the first time in American history, the will of the people was set aside under a threat of military violence, struck a deadly blow at our system of representative government. The Democratic party, to preserve the country from the horrors of a civil war, submitted for the time in firm and patriotic faith that the people would punish this crime in 1880. This issue precedes and dwarfs every other. It imposes a more sacred duty upon the people of the Union than ever addressed the conscience of a nation of free men.

9. The resolution of Samuel J. Tilden not again to be a candidate for the exalted place to which he was elected by a majority of his countrymen, and from which he was excluded by the leaders of the Republican party, is received by the Democrats of the United States with deep sensibility, and they declare their confidence in his wisdom, patriotism, and integrity, unshaken by the assaults of a common enemy, and they further assure him that he is followed into the retirement he has chosen for himself by the sympathy and respect of his fellow-citizens, who regard him as one who, by elevating the standards of public morality, merits the lasting gratitude of his country and his party.

10. Free ships and a living chance for American commerce on the seas, and on the land no discrimination in favor of transportation lines, corporations, or monopolies.

11. Amendment of the Burlingame Treaty. No more Chinese immigration, except for travel, education, and foreign commerce, and that even carefully guarded.

12. Public money and public credit for public purposes solely, and public land for actual settlers.

13. The Democratic party is the friend of labor and the laboring man, and pledges itself to protect him alike against the cormorant and the commune.

14. We congratulate the country upon the honesty and thrift of a Democratic Congress which has reduced the public expenditure $40,000,000 a year; upon the continuation of prosperity at home, and the national honor abroad, and, above all, upon the promise of such a change in the administration of the government as shall insure us genuine and lasting reform in every department of the public service.

In 1932, Hoover dumped out 7800 words. While FDR didn't even crack 1500 and was pithy on the issues in a way that's retrospectively funny:

The Democratic Party solemnly promises by appropriate action to put into effect the principles, policies, and reforms herein advocated, and to eradicate the policies, methods, and practices herein condemned. We advocate an immediate and drastic reduction of governmental expenditures by abolishing useless commissions and offices, consolidating departments and bureaus, and eliminating extravagance to accomplish a saving of not less than twenty-five per cent in the cost of the Federal Government. And we call upon the Democratic Party in the states to make a zealous effort to achieve a proportionate result.

We favor maintenance of the national credit by a federal budget annually balanced on the basis of accurate executive estimates within revenues, raised by a system of taxation levied on the principle of ability to pay.

We advocate a sound currency to be preserved at all hazards and an international monetary conference called on the invitation of our government to consider the rehabilitation of silver and related questions.

We advocate a competitive tariff for revenue with a fact-finding tariff commission free from executive interference, reciprocal tariff agreements with other nations, and an international economic conference designed to restore international trade and facilitate exchange.

We advocate the extension of federal credit to the states to provide unemployment relief wherever the diminishing resources of the states makes it impossible for them to provide for the needy; expansion of the federal program of necessary and useful construction effected [sic] with a public interest, such as adequate flood control and waterways.

We advocate the spread of employment by a substantial reduction in the hours of labor, the encouragement of the shorter week by applying that principle in government service; we advocate advance planning of public works.

We advocate unemployment and old-age insurance under state laws.

We favor the restoration of agriculture, the nation's basic industry; better financing of farm mortgages through recognized farm bank agencies at low rates of interest on an amortization plan, giving preference to credits for the redemption of farms and homes sold under foreclosure.

Extension and development of the Farm co-operative movement and effective control of crop surpluses so that our farmers may have the full benefit of the domestic market.

The enactment of every constitutional measure that will aid the farmers to receive for their basic farm commodities prices in excess of cost.

We advocate a Navy and an Army adequate for national defense, based on a survey of all facts affecting the existing establishments, that the people in time of peace may not be burdened by an expenditure fast approaching a billion dollars annually.

We advocate strengthening and impartial enforcement of the anti-trust laws, to prevent monopoly and unfair trade practices, and revision thereof for the better protection of labor and the small producer and distributor.

The conservation, development, and use of the nation's water power in the public interest.

The removal of government from all fields of private enterprise except where necessary to develop public works and natural resources in the common interest.

We advocate protection of the investing public by requiring to be filed with the government and carried in advertisements of all offerings of foreign and domestic stocks and bonds true information as to bonuses, commissions, principal invested, and interests of the sellers.

Regulation to the full extent of federal power, of:
(a) Holding companies which sell securities in interstate commerce;
(b) Rates of utilities companies operating across State lines;
(c) Exchanges in securities and commodities. We advocate quicker methods of realizing on assets for the relief of depositors of suspended banks, and a more rigid supervision of national banks for the protection of depositors and the prevention of the use of their moneys in speculation to the detriment of local credits.

The severance of affiliated security companies from, and the divorce of the investment banking business from, commercial banks, and further restriction of federal reserve banks in permitting the use of federal reserve facilities for speculative purposes.

We advocate the full measure of justice and generosity for all war veterans who have suffered disability or disease caused by or resulting from actual service in time of war and for their dependents.

We advocate a firm foreign policy, including peace with all the world and the settlement of international disputes by arbitration; no interference in the internal affairs of other nations; and sanctity of treaties and the maintenance of good faith and of good will in financial obligations; adherence to the World Court with appending reservations; the Pact of Paris abolishing war as an instrument of national policy, to be made effective by provisions for consultation and conference in case of threatened violations of treaties.

International agreements for reduction of armaments and cooperation with nations of the Western Hemisphere to maintain the spirit of the Monroe Doctrine.

We oppose cancelation of the debts owing to the United States by foreign nations.

Independence for the Philippines; ultimate statehood for Puerto Rico.

The employment of American citizens in the operation of the Panama Canal.

Simplification of legal procedure and reorganization of the judicial system to make the attainment of justice speedy, certain, and at less cost.

Continuous publicity of political contributions and expenditures; strengthening of the Corrupt Practices Act and severe penalties for misappropriation of campaign funds.

We advocate the repeal of the Eighteenth Amendment. To effect such repeal we demand that the Congress immediately propose a Constitutional Amendment to truly represent [sic] the conventions in the states called to act solely on that proposal; we urge the enactment of such measures by the several states as will actually promote temperance, effectively prevent the return of the saloon, and bring the liquor traffic into the open under complete supervision and control by the states.

We demand that the Federal Government effectively exercise its power to enable the states to protect themselves against importation of intoxicating liquors in violation of their laws.

Pending repeal, we favor immediate modification of the Volstead Act; to legalize the manufacture and sale of beer and other beverages of such alcoholic content as is permissible under the Constitution and to provide therefrom a proper and needed revenue.

We condemn the improper and excessive use of money in political activities.

We condemn paid lobbies of special interests to influence members of Congress and other public servants by personal contact.

We condemn action and utterances of high public officials designed to influence stock exchange prices.

We condemn the open and cover resistance of administrative officials to every effort made by Congressional Committees to curtail the extravagant expenditures of the Government and to revoke improvident subsidies granted to favorite interests.

We condemn the extravagance of the Farm Board, its disastrous action which made the Government a speculator in farm products, and the unsound policy of restricting agricultural products to the demands of domestic markets.

We condemn the usurpation of power by the State Department in assuming to pass upon foreign securities offered by international bankers as a result of which billions of dollars in questionable bonds have been sold to the public upon the implied approval of the Federal Government.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

It's pretty amazing how many of the actual words in that platform are just them whining about the Klan not being able to murder black voters in 1876.

 

[benjipwns]

A few choice cuts from third parties past:

We declare, therefore,

First—That the union of the labor forces of the United States this day consummated shall be permanent and perpetual; may its spirit enter into all hearts for the salvation of the Republic and the uplifting of mankind.

Second—Wealth belongs to him who creates it, and every dollar taken from industry without an equivalent is robbery. "If any will not work, neither shall he eat." The interests of rural and civic labor are the same; their enemies are identical.

Third—We believe that the time has come when the railroad corporations will either own the people or the people must own the railroads, and should the government enter upon the work of owning and managing all railroads, we should favor an amendment to the Constitution by which all persons engaged in the government service shall be placed under a civil service regulation of the most rigid character, so as to prevent the increase of the power of the national administration by the use of such additional government employees.

Finance—We demand a national currency, safe, sound, and flexible, issued by the general government only, a full legal tender for all debts, public and private, and that without the use of banking corporations, a just, equitable and efficient means of distribution direct to the people, at a tax not to exceed 2 per cent per annum, to be provided as set forth by the sub-treasury plan of the Farmers' Alliance, or a better system; also by payments in discharge of its obligations for public improvements.

1. We demand free and unlimited coinage of silver and gold at the present legal ratio of 16 to 1.

2. We demand that the amount of circulating medium be speedily increased to not less than $50 per capita.

3. We demand a graduated income tax.

4. We believe that the money of the country should be kept as much as possible in the hands of the people, and hence we demand that all State and national revenues shall be limited to the necessary expenses of the government, economically and honestly administered.

5. We demand that postal savings banks be established by the government for the safe deposit of the earnings of the people and to facilitate exchange.

Transportation—Transportation being a means of exchange and a public necessity, the government should own and operate the railroads in the interest of the people. The telegraph and telephone, like the post office system, being a necessity for the transmission of news, should be owned and operated by the government in the interest of the people.

Land—The land, including all the natural sources of wealth, is the heritage of the people, and should not be monopolized for speculative purposes, and alien ownership of land should be prohibited. All land now held by railroads and other corporations in excess of their actual needs, and all lands now owned by aliens, should be reclaimed by the government and held for actual settlers only.

SOCIAL DEMANDS.


1. Reduction of the hours of labor in proportion to the progress of production.

2. The United States shall obtain possession of the railroads, canals, telegraphs, telephones and all other means of public transportation and communication; but no employee shall be discharged for political reasons.

3. The municipalities to obtain possession of the local railroads, ferries, water works, gas works, electric plants and all industries requiring municipal franchises; but no employee shall be discharged for political reasons.

4. The public lands to be declared inalienable. Revocation of all land grants to corporations or individuals the conditions of which have not been complied with.

5. Legal incorporation by the states of the local trades unions which have no national organization.

6. The United States to have the exclusive right to issue money.

7. Congressional legislation providing for the scientific management of forests and waterways and prohibiting the waste of the natural resources of the country.

8. Inventions free to all; the inventors to be remunerated by the nation.

9. Progressive income tax and tax on inheritances; the smaller incomes to be exempt.

10. School education of all children under 14 years of age to be compulsory, gratuitous and accessible to all by public assistance in meals, clothing, books, etc., where necessary.

11. Repeal of all pauper, tramp, conspiracy and sumptuary laws. Unabridged right of combination.

12. Official statistics concerning the condition of labor. Prohibition of the employment of children of school age and of the employment of female labor in occupations detrimental to health and morality. Abolition of the convict labor contract system.

13. Employment of the unemployed by the public authorities (county, city, state and nation).

14. All wages to be paid in lawful money of the United States. Equalization of women's wages with those of men where equal service is performed.

15. Laws for the protection of life and limb in all occupations, and an efficient employers' liability law.

POLITICAL DEMANDS.


1. The people to have the right to propose laws and to vote upon all measures of importance, according to the referendum principle.

2. Abolition of the veto power of the executive (national, state and municipal) wherever it exists.

3. Municipal self-government.

4. Direct vote and secret ballots in all elections. Universal and equal right of suffrage without regard to color, creed or sex. Election days to be legal holidays. The principle of proportional representation to be introduced.

5. All public officers to be subject to recall by their respective constituents.

6. Uniform civil and criminal law throughout the United States. Administration of justice to be free of charge. Abolition of capital punishment.

The Progressive Party
• demands negotiation and discussion with the Soviet Union to find areas of agreement to win the peace.
• calls for the repeal of the peacetime draft and the rejection of Universal Military Training.
• calls for the immediate cessation of the piling up of armament expenditures beyond reasonable peacetime requirements for national defense.
• demand the repudiation of the Truman Doctrine and the Marshall Plan.
• will work to realize the ideal of the United Nations as a world family of nations.
• will work through the United Nations for a world disarmament agreement to outlaw the atomic bomb and all other instruments of mass destruction.
• condemns segregation and discrimination in all its forms and in all places.
• calls for a Constitutional amendment which will prohibit every form of discrimination against women.
• recognizes the just claims of the Japanese Americans for indemnity for the losses suffered during their wartime internment.
• demands abolition of Jim Crow in the armed forces.
• promotes the peaceful use of atomic energy to realize its potential as a source of power and as a tool in science, medicine and technology.
• demands the enactment of a minimum wage of $1 an hour.
• stands for the family-type farm as the basic unit of American agriculture and call for a long-range national land policy designed to discourage the growth of corporation farms.
• calls for a 5-year program of price supports for all major crops.
• supports the right of every American to good health through a national system of health insurance.
• propose a program of Federal assistance for the establishment of day care centers for all children.
• calls for the overhaul of the tax structure.
• calls for a system of federal scholarships in order to enable all those with necessary qualifications but without adequate means of support to obtain higher education in institutions of their own choice.
• calls for the enactment of legislation to promote science, including human and social sciences.

Herein will be set forth the policies, attitude, proposals and position of this Party and its candidates, with matters of deepest concern to the average American, his home, his family, his property, his employment, his right to safety and security in the pursuit of the activities of his daily life, his right to freedom from interference and harassment from and by the government at all levels and, lastly, his pride in himself and this nation and all that it has stood for.

We feel that this American has an intense devotion to his country, glorifies in its accomplishments and is saddened by its failures and shortcomings; that he is tolerant of the mistakes of political leaders if he senses their actions to be in good faith and directed to the best interest of the country, but be is confused and dismayed when these leaders desert the principle of government for the people and dedicate themselves to minority appeasement as the country bums and decays.

This document treats both foreign and domestic policy and is basically designed to present the proposals and action programs of this Party and its candidates in the area of:

1. Peace abroad and domestic tranquility at home.

2. An enlightened and advancing educational program, assisted but not controlled by the federal government.

3. Job training and opportunity for all Americans willing and able to seek and hold gainful employment.

4. An alliance and partnership with the private sector of our economy seeking an end to poverty among our people.

5. Efficiency and prudence in governmental spending leading to a helpful and stable economy free from the need for ever continuing taxation.

6. Inclusion of the farmer in our program of prosperity through his own efforts rather than total reliance on government subsidy.

7. Reestablishment of the authority and responsibility of local government by returning to the states, counties and cities those matters properly falling within their jurisdiction and responsibility.

8. Ending the inflationary spiral of the past decade through fiscal responsibility and efficiency in all echelons of government.

9. The orderly and economical utilization of the natural resources of this nation coupled with a sensible program of conservation of these resources.

10. An insistence that the laboring man and woman be given his fair share of responsibility and reward for the development of the mighty potential of this nation.

11. A re-dedication of this country to the love of God and country and the creation of a judiciary mindful of the attitudes of the people in this regard.

Trump is George Wallace's fourth incarnation confirmed.

*forerunner of the Socialist Party that Debs ran under most years, he like Nader's relationship with the Greens was a quasi-independent in many elections

 

[benjipwns]

regarding the American/"socialism"/Sanders debate from a few days ago, they didn't do all that shabby getting that 1896 platform enacted despite never much over a million votes

 

[benjipwns]

The entire 1844 Whig Platform wouldn't fill one page of this year's GOP one:

Resolved, That, in presenting to the country the names of Henry Clay for president, and of Theodore Frelinghuysen for vice-president of the United States, this Convention is actuated by the conviction that all the great principles of the Whig party—principles inseparable from the public honor and prosperity—will be maintained and advanced by these candidates.

Resolved, That these principles may be summed as comprising, a well-regulated currency; a tariff for revenue to defray the necessary expenses of the government, and discriminating with special reference to the protection of the domestic labor of the country; the distribution of the proceeds of the sales of the public lands; a single term for the presidency; a reform of executive usurpations;—and, generally—such an administration of the affairs of the country as shall impart to every branch of the public service the greatest practicable efficiency, controlled by a well regulated and wise economy.

Resolved, That the name of Henry Clay needs no eulogy; the history of the country since his first appearance in public life is his history; its brightest pages of prosperity and success are identified with the principles which he has upheld, as its darkest and more disastrous pages are with every material departure in our public policy from those principles.

Resolved, That in Theodore Frelinghuysen we present a man pledged alike by his revolutionary ancestry and his own public course to every measure calculated to sustain the honor and interest of the country. Inheriting the principles as well as the name of a father who, with Washington, on the fields of Trenton and of Monmouth, perilled life in the contest for liberty, and afterwards, as a senator of the United States, acted with Washington in establishing and perpetuating that liberty, Theodore Frelinghuysen, by his course as Attorney-General of the State of New Jersey for twelve years, and subsequently as a senator of the United States for several years, was always strenuous on the side of law, order, and the constitution, while as a private man, his head, his hand, and his heart have been given without stint to the cause of morals, education, philanthropy, and religion.

And it's obvious they were going to lose putting a name like Frelinghuysen on the ticket.

 

[Infinite Stars]

The best way to describe the Trinity is probably as a crystal with multiple faces. Each face is its own unique figure, but each is a part of God. The fact that someone who openly denies the Trinity is speaking is just baffling, because that's probably one of the oldest resolved controversies in the Church.

Basically, the lack of outrage by Evangelicals is irritating to me, as a former Protestant(and currently attempting to become a Catholic). It's not even this big issue, in terms of Christian Canon it's up there with Circumscion and the 3 parts of God.

 

[mo60]

This year is just the wind up for 2017 isn't it?

US politics will probably be worse then this year next year. Politics in the rest of the world probably won't be as bad because I don't expect anything like Brexit next year to happen. A lot of the major elections happening in Europe next year should be pretty predictable, but their may be a wildcard next year in the first round of the french presidential elections.

 

[Plinko]

The best way to describe the Trinity is probably as a crystal with multiple faces. Each face is its own unique figure, but each is a part of God. The fact that someone who openly denies the Trinity is speaking is just baffling, because that's probably one of the oldest resolved controversies in the Church.

Basically, the lack of outrage by Evangelicals is irritating to me, as a former Protestant(and currently attempting to become a Catholic). It's not even this big issue, in terms of Christian Canon it's up there with Circumscion and the 3 parts of God.

Agreed. As a protestant, it is mind-boggling to me.

That said, it isn't surprising in the least. Throughout this entire election, evangelicals hand-waved away Trump's affairs, harassment of women, attacks on the poor, stiffing of contractors, tax evasion, and more--all of which go solidly against Christian teachings. Sadly, I'm not sure why this would be any different. The true colors have been shown. Having their personal choice in power is more important to them than their religion.

 

[Aaronology]

There's a ton of resources for Christian folks with questions, no need to get into the "it all falls apart when you start asking questions" trope.

And this SHOULD be a big deal to evangelicals, but of course Trump controversies just get buried by the next one so no one will care about the heresy.

Using the word "trope" hand-waves the fact that the bible is demonstrably inconsistent. It should not surprise that a group of people with a noted ability to ignore such inconsistency would care about Trump's.

 

[PantherLotus]

Using the word "trope" hand-waves the fact that the bible is demonstrably inconsistent. It should not surprise that a group of people with a noted ability to ignore such inconsistency would care about Trump's.

The point being that pointing out inconsistencies in the Bible is something of a My First Atheism that never produces results and actually exacerbates the problem. If any of that worked the party and its constituents would maybe focus on helping the poor.

 

[TestOfTide]

This year is just the wind up for 2017 isn't it?

Consider 2016 a lesson to never assume the worst won't happen.

But 2017 and 2018 are going to be an opportunity for us if we take advantage of it correctly. The last time we had an unpopular GOP POTUS for midterms, Democrats won big. The only reason that the GOP didn't lose seats in 2002 was because Bush had high favorability for his response to 9/11.

There are just too many ways for Trump and/or the GOP to piss off voters:

- Any war with Iran that involves boots on the ground will hurt them.
- If they really do try to undermine SS/Medicare they will face massive backlash from the AARP
- If Trump fails to build the impossible wall then his fanbase will be disappointed
- If Trump fails to get a Muslim ban enacted (which we know numerous GOP Senators won't sign on to) that will Also disappoint his fanbase
- The Trump voters that are desperate for their jobs back aren't going to be happy if Trump keeps making up bullshit job announcements while they still have no jobs
- If Netanyahu is actually found guilty of corruption by Israeli courts then that will hurt the GOP that defended him
- If the GOP tries to sign antiLGBTQ stuff into law they will face major backlash (it's part of the reason Kennedy has ruled in favor of LGBTQ rights usually)
- If Trump treats the official POTUS twitter like his normal twitter account he will learn the hard way that there are regulations to that account
- Even if the deplorables have become pro-Putin, there are numerous GOP Senators that will not sign on to that.
- Trump still has numerous investigations that he has to hope doesn't turn up an easy conviction. Every Democratic AG is salivating at the prospect of successfully convicting Trump

 

[Wilsongt]

A millionare Televangelist is going to be praying at the inauguration.

Appropriate.

 

[RustyNails]

A millionare Televangelist is going to be praying at the inauguration.

Appropriate.

Is Jimmy Swaggart alive? He'd have made it better.

 

[Crocodile]

Consider 2016 a lesson to never assume the worst won't happen.

But 2017 and 2018 are going to be an opportunity for us if we take advantage of it correctly. The last time we had an unpopular GOP POTUS for midterms, Democrats won big. The only reason that the GOP didn't lose seats in 2002 was because Bush had high favorability for his response to 9/11.

There are just too many ways for Trump and/or the GOP to piss off voters:

- Any war with Iran that involves boots on the ground will hurt them.
- If they really do try to undermine SS/Medicare they will face massive backlash from the AARP
- If Trump fails to build the impossible wall then his fanbase will be disappointed
- If Trump fails to get a Muslim ban enacted (which we know numerous GOP Senators won't sign on to) that will Also disappoint his fanbase
- The Trump voters that are desperate for their jobs back aren't going to be happy if Trump keeps making up bullshit job announcements while they still have no jobs
- If Netanyahu is actually found guilty of corruption by Israeli courts then that will hurt the GOP that defended him
- If the GOP tries to sign antiLGBTQ stuff into law they will face major backlash (it's part of the reason Kennedy has ruled in favor of LGBTQ rights usually)
- If Trump treats the official POTUS twitter like his normal twitter account he will learn the hard way that there are regulations to that account
- Even if the deplorables have become pro-Putin, there are numerous GOP Senators that will not sign on to that.
- Trump still has numerous investigations that he has to hope doesn't turn up an easy conviction. Every Democratic AG is salivating at the prospect of successfully convicting Trump

I feel only the worst of Trump voters will care about the WALL or the Muslim Ban in a few months time. Those seem like things Trump will be hurt the most by if he sincerely tries (succeed or fail) to make them reality than if he just pretends he never said that shit.

The rest of the list I agree on you with. I also envision that if they try to go through with the ACA repeal without a real and good replacement (which they don't have) they will suffer for it politically too.

 

[Wilsongt]

Is Jimmy Swaggart alive? He'd have made it better.

No. Some lady I never heard of. But she's one of those faith for money, or gospel of thieves, or whatever those people are called.

https://www.google.com/amp/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_58652b51e4b0de3a08f76147/amp?client=safari

 

[zethren]

No. Some lady I never heard of. But she's one of those faith for money, or gospel of thieves, or whatever those people are called.

https://www.google.com/amp/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_58652b51e4b0de3a08f76147/amp?client=safari

Oh my god, what a hack...