Thaedolus
Member
Have you not seen the hearings by our intelligence community about our election machines being under attack? Voter registration databases? Disinformation campaigns? Cyberwar is warfare. How is this hard to grasp or hysterical?
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PoliGAF 2017 |OT4| The leaks are coming from inside the white house
- Thread starter Spoiled Milk
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Have you not seen the hearings by our intelligence community about our election machines being under attack? Voter registration databases? Disinformation campaigns? Cyberwar is warfare. How is this hard to grasp or hysterical?
BoogieWoogie
Banned
Can't wait to see Fox News reporting in the future that people dying from the AHCA don't actually exist and their loved ones weeping for their deaths should be killed alongside them.
Autodidact
Banned
I bet Murkowski. She's safe until 2022.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Even Fox is reporting on this number
McConnell, what did you do
McConnell, what did you do
skullmuffins
Banned
Trump's margin of victory in key states was so small that you could point to any number of things and say "that's why she lost!" and you'd be right, in a sense. But by the same token, you can't *discount* the other factors. It's entirely possible that Hillary would have won, even with a flawed campaign strategy, if it weren't for Russian fake news propaganda plus the continued drip-feed of DNC + Podesta hacked emails.
VendettaRed07
Member
is it really electoral suicide?
Democrats actually have to be capable of unseating republicans in red areas the same way the GOP has been at the reverse
As in.. does this passing mean Ted Cruz loses his seat in Texas in 2018
They are correct for banking on that it won't. There's no reason right now to think that the democrats have their shit together to where they need to worry about it.
Stopped caring.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Absolutely this is suicide
Yes, this puts Ted Cruz squarely into play
They started messing with middle class white people. You don't do that. This is the single worst possible bill they could ever make for 2018.
If they had lead good, moral lives they wouldn't be dying.
Autodidact
Banned
Fox News could actually be useful for once in its miserable existence.
benicillin
Banned
I mean this is kind of the problem with telling people for years you can give them a better healthcare plan and then all of your options making more people uninsured.
VendettaRed07
Member
It isn't enough for just three senators to stop this. The party can push one of them to take a dive
People like Ted need to be worried about their seat for this thing to stop
StopMakingSense
Member
And the increases for middle class old white people not yet at Medicare age, which ACA was great for, are insane.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Wouldn't this crash the healthcare industry almost instantly?
What kind of market can sustain losing 15 million customers in a single year?
What kind of market can sustain losing 15 million customers in a single year?
TestOfTide
Banned
Except we already DO know lots of tangible stuff such as:
- Manafort having been paid millions of dollars to lobby for Putin
- Flynn having made calls to the Russian Ambassador to promise him that the sanctions would be lifted (violation of the Logan Act)
- Page basically admitting that he met with Kislyak multiple times and refuses to disclose what those meetings were about
- J D Gordon saying that he pushed to soften the Ukraine portion of the GOP platform under Trump's orders
- Russia having been involved in the hacks and leaks of democratic emails according to 17 different intelligence agencies as well as the FBI
- FBI having used the infamous steele dossier to get FISA warrants on Page
- Sessions having multiple undisclosed meetings with Kislyak which he suddenly has no recollection about although he admits he did as a Trump Foreign Policy Advisor
- The IC confirming that Kislyak is a Russian Spy Recruiter.
- Trump trying to get Comey to end the investigation into Flynn
- Flynn having illegally lobbied for the Turkish government while National Security Advisor
- Trump trying to get the DNI to lie about the Russia investigation to make him look better
- Trump firing Comey, lying about the reason for firing him, then later admitting that he fired him for doing the Russia investigation
- Roger Stone being in constant contact with Russian Hacker Guccifer 2.0
And that's just off the top of my head
First off that was the FBI saying back in January that they weren't YET going to definitively say that Flynn committed a crime, and considering that we are already at the point where Flynn is literally asking for Immunity, that was clearly just the FBI holding that as leverage over Flynn.
Second, it's absolutely not just Flynn. Read my above portion for other people who are also suspected.
You don't get it. You think they would be after Flynn on a GUESS that he may have done something bad?
Guess what Obama did on the same night that it came out that Flynn had called the Russian ambassador?
THIS: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/12/...tude-to-share-intercepted-communications.html
Flynn isn't being investigated on a GUESS. Flynn is being investigated because the NSA already has the proof that he was colluding with Russia.
Information moves faster, but actual investigation still takes a long ass time.
I agree that it's very unlikely that Trump gets impeached, but the Russia investigation is NOT just about impeaching Trump, it's about:
- Tackling the issue of deliberate fake news
- Tackling issues about cybersecurity in America
- Tacking issues about vote integrity
- Understanding the extent of Russia's capabilities to undermine Western Secular Democracy (because it's not just the US they have been targeting. Don't believe me? Ask Germany and France.)
I agree that the GOP has the advantage of being a million times better at winning elections, however if there is one that can get almost every voter to hate Republicans, it would be Republicans passing a bill that completely fucks with their healthcare in VERY notable ways.
There was a recent survey that showed that 45% of voters say their most important issue is Healthcare. I doubt that is all democrats.
benicillin
Banned
It would almost certainly bring on a recession.
Depends entirely on how much they were putting in as opposed to taking out.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Since Trump reacts entirely by how the media reacts, I'm pretty sure someone is getting a very angry phone call as soon as he turns on the TV
Macho Madness
Member
15 million in a year is absolutely disgusting. Insane from a political perspective too.
metalslimer
Member
You guys underestimate just how evil all republicans are including the moderate darlings. We're past the point of thinking they have any feelings left in them.
Definitely a lot of people are going to lose their jobs. ACA was completely positive for the HC industry, they were able to recoup the costs from people just showing up at the ER.
StopMakingSense
Member
Since the majority is due to the removal of the mandate, it's gonna hurt.
That's a fair point actually. For a market that literally shits itself at the slightest bit of uncertainty, this is basically blowing up the house.
Autodidact
Banned
No, we get it. Why else do you think I mock the Moderate Darlings endlessly?
WhateverItTakes
Banned
It was why Obama fought tooth and nail for even the crippled version of his healthcare bill. One for those things you can't put back in the box.
tedrotheredro
Member
I hope the tick, tick, tick's wait until after the health care vote. I don't want any treason distractions.
benicillin
Banned
Those premium increases for older people are *insane.* You can hear the AARP lumbering towards this bill like the Ents at Isengard.
Box of Kittens
Banned
Need to be blaring these numbers out as loudly and as often as possible before the vote and after. Run hard on health care in 2018 and 2020.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Every major news station in the country is playing these numbers.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Republican senators need a level of concern alert meter to help us understand what this means. Are we yellow, orange, hot pink?
Autodidact
Banned
Motorized scooters sound like locusts descending upon the Capitol.
BoogieWoogie
Banned
Ah shit, right on cue:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...1_story.html?tid=sm_tw&utm_term=.d569bf433889
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...1_story.html?tid=sm_tw&utm_term=.d569bf433889
Wow...
Did we have a number for how many people would lose employer-based insurance before? I don't remember seeing a number for that for AHCA.
That 4 million might be even more damaging than 22, because it blows up so many GOP arguments.
These are people who WANT healthcare and are actively working and contributing to it...and 4 million of them are about to lose it.
Did we have a number for how many people would lose employer-based insurance before? I don't remember seeing a number for that for AHCA.
That 4 million might be even more damaging than 22, because it blows up so many GOP arguments.
These are people who WANT healthcare and are actively working and contributing to it...and 4 million of them are about to lose it.
not when his base takes their medical advise from Fox and Friends and Alex Jones.
Won't be too long til social security is privatized.
They are evil, not insane. Angering old white people will annhilate their party.
This seems like the boom?
In 10 years compared to current law, mostly because all the sick and poor will be dead so insurers won't have to pay for their care!
Box of Kittens
Banned
Why do people accuse me of being alt-right just because all of my political posts are nothing but alt-right talking points about the FAKE NEWS Washington Post with a throwaway line about not supporting Trump?
benicillin
Banned
If they've questioned Page in March they've almost certainly brought others in for questioning since.
Autodidact
Banned
"Because I'm Canadian and Canada is so liberal and accepting I voted for Trudeau I can't possibly be alt-right."
balladofwindfishes
Member
Strip out everything that only effects the poor and this is STILL a suicide bill
They couldn't have crafted a worse bill if they tried!
They couldn't have crafted a worse bill if they tried!
RumbleHumble
Banned
Is it weird that I think this is too mild to be the bomb? Maybe like prelude to the bomb.
Macho Madness
Member
Oh that push is coming, I'm aware. And yeah, Trump's core base isn't abandoning him. I'm not worried about them.
So premiums also go up in 2018 before tapering off in 2020 with more likely than not shittier benefits included in the plans. Rising premiums + 15 million kicked off insurance + 4 million of those currently getting insurance through work, in an election year? If they get rewarded for this, we might as well bow to our GOP overlords, because the party is Teflon.
Above posters are right, if with a law like this Democrats cannot do something radical like win Texas, similar to Brown back in 09, then the party is shit. This is an electoral gift. You could campaign on this for a decade.
I expect this bill will pass, the $300 billion deficit decrease gives McConnell a lot of leeway to bribe moderate Senators and probably brings Paul, Cruz and Lee back on board.
Above posters are right, if with a law like this Democrats cannot do something radical like win Texas, similar to Brown back in 09, then the party is shit. This is an electoral gift. You could campaign on this for a decade.
I expect this bill will pass, the $300 billion deficit decrease gives McConnell a lot of leeway to bribe moderate Senators and probably brings Paul, Cruz and Lee back on board.
balladofwindfishes
Member
They're already leaving him according to polls. When they start dying off, it'll only accelerate it. They don't like this bill.
Fenderputty
Banned
Seems pretty mild.
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