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[EverydayBeast]

PS4 pro is reasonable in 2024, ps5 pro sounds like a gigantic upgrade.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Why do PC people shit up threads like these.

Get out

Pc gamers priorities are removing viruses, always suspecting hardware failure and knowing population count on random games.

 

[Senua]

PS4 pro is reasonable in 2024

 

[jm89]

PS4 pro is reasonable in 2024

 

[EverydayBeast]

I plan to keep my base PS5 but I just want to know what the Pro will look like...

First serious post

 

[Mister Wolf]

Why do PC people shit up threads like these.

Get out

 

[RoadHazard]

Dunno why, but this bolded part's gonna trigger a small rant from me.

If Sony don't slow down or stop the PC ports for non-GAAS titles they aren't getting near 12% this time around. Because for the core who'd buy a Pro, there's less reason to do so when they can get those 1P games on an as-good-or-better PC shortly after the PS5 versions release, and still play their multiplats with better settings in the meantime on the same PC.

The fact Sony's inadvertently ported almost all of their big non-GAAS titles since 2020 to PC by now, only halfway through the console gen, and only have a handful of actual exclusive 1P left, is insanely short-sighted of them. If the Nvidia leak's true, the only games 1P that could still exclusive to PS5 that'll be left (non-GAAS) by EOY, are Astro's Playroom and Spiderman 2. A whopping 1.5 games (Astro's more of a "demo" not a full game).

Every single port since 2020 was Sony giving less and less reason for PS5/PC core enthusiasts to consider a PS5 Pro and it's a damn shame. Hopefully they are changing that strategy because, yeah, great tech aside the Pro could face a big challenge hitting even 8% of PS5 lifetime sales when all's said and done, if they don't have the 1P exclusives (actual exclusives, not timed 1-2 year exclusives before porting to PC) to push it. Because besides just that software issue, PSVR2 isn't hitting the same way PSVR1 did (which benefited the PS4 Pro), and there is no 4K TV market rush/growth like when the PS4 Pro was a thing, either.

So in what world is a PS5 Pro whose big selling point to hardcore/core enthusiasts (vast majority of Pro customers) is playing 1P timed exclusives at settings still lower than an inevitable PC ports 1-2 years later (or Day 1 in some cases, for non-GAAS you never know), going to do 12% of the install base numbers let alone higher?

Well sorry for the semi-rant I just had to look at the sales part from the perspective of what drivers are or aren't present to push PS5 Pro the same way PS4 Pro was pushed. But most critically how the biggest driver potentially absent is 100% of Sony's own doing. I hope that's changed internally because both PS5 & the Pro, and also systems like PS6, definitely need that big driver back.

Also one other thing: why are people still obsessed with TFs? I thought that poison went away a couple years ago but people are still determining all performance gains from TF paper specs. Did we learn nothing from the PS5 vs. Series X TF nothingburger?

I'm pretty sure most people who buy Pro consoles do it exactly because they don't have a PC that can achieve the same or better results.

 

[Leonidas]

What about the CPU? It is the same shitty zen 2?

Seems so, sadly...

Throw all the RT at me bruh - ps5 pro Bro vs RT hoe hoes

If you cared that much about RT, you'd be on PC already, not waiting for 4 years after PS5 abysmal RT for decent RT in PS5 Pro... you won't be getting all the RT on PS5 Pro, and if they somehow do manage path tracing, image quality/resolution will be abysmal.

 

[hussar16]

There's literally zero games out right now or coming in the near future I would consider buying a PS5 Pro for.

I guess avatar game is only game tht comes close to looking next gen in parts. But even that game looks kind of last gen in some areas

 

[Gaiff]

I guess avatar game is only game tht comes close to looking next gen in parts. But even that game looks kind of last gen in some areas

Alan Wake 2 doesn’t look next-gen?

 

[hussar16]

Alan Wake 2 doesn’t look next-gen?

Honestly order 1886 looked more ps5 then Alan wake 2

 

[Tqaulity]

So all this commotion on these "leaked" specs and people drawing conclusions about performance when they don't have anywhere near the full story. These leaked specs are incomplete at best and possibly misleading at worst. SO many details not even mentioned in there: CPU, RAM, shader config, GPU arch, clock speeds etc. How could you possibly draw any real conclusions about perf from that?

There are only 3 things that we can comfortable deduce from these leaks:

1. PS5 Pro will indeed have some proprietary machine learning super resolution scaler (YAY!). This can be huge for IQ and perf if used correctly. Here's to hoping the IQ looks better than FSR2 which has literally destroyed IQ in many games
2. The GPU will NOT be using RDNA2 again. It will clearly RDNA3 or later derived. The number of 67TFLOPs in FP16 clearly matches AMD's dual issue RDNA3 GPUs available today.
3. Sony will lean heavily in improving the RT performance in the PS5 Pro. This is great as it's been a severe limitation of the base console. Would love to see full (or more complete RT) in games like Witcher 3, Cyberpunk, Alan Wake 2, Returnal, GT7, and many more while maintain high resolutions and frame rates.

THAT'S IT. With no real details on the CPU, GPU, or RAM, everything that people are discussing is still very much conjecture and rumors. Those 3 points already indicate an upgrade that could easily be well beyond what the PS4 Pro was because it's not about raw GPU power, resolutions, and FPS. Sony address the 2 most glaring limitations of the PS5 base and this is the smartest thing they could have done for a PS5. ML can do more for overall perf than pushing a few more TFLOPs any day and more capable RT can have much more impact on the graphics than just pushing a few percentage more pixels. So there is plenty to be excited about.

Furthermore, all of the disappointed expressed over the +45% "rendering performance" i believe is taken out of context. It's been discussed at nauseum already but clearly the TFLOP calculations that are extrapolated from the 67TFLOPs in FP16 figure does NOT equal +45% higher compute. In fact, it's closer to ~65% more compute. The more plausible explanation for the +45% rendering performance is due to a ROPs increase from 64-96 which was also heavily rumored in the earlier leaks. That would make more sense and is a figure that is much more closely aligned to using the term "rendering performance" as opposed to just saying the GPU is +45% faster. In other words, I don't believe it's accurate to deduce that the PRO's GPU is "only" 45% faster based on the limited data and the careful wording that was used in the docs.

We still have a LOT to learn here folks. But from the tease we've gotten, it's shaping up to be bigger upgrade than most of you seem to realize.

 

[Senua]

Honestly order 1886 looked more ps5 then Alan wake 2

 

[welshrat]

I'm pretty sure most people who buy Pro consoles do it exactly because they don't have a PC that can achieve the same or better results.

Not true. Just always loved the ps eco system in my living room. PC belongs in my office.

 

[RoadHazard]

Not true. Just always loved the ps eco system in my living room. PC belongs in my office.

I said most, not literally everyone.

 

[hussar16]

 

[SlimySnake]

So all this commotion on these "leaked" specs and people drawing conclusions about performance when they don't have anywhere near the full story. These leaked specs are incomplete at best and possibly misleading at worst. SO many details not even mentioned in there: CPU, RAM, shader config, GPU arch, clock speeds etc. How could you possibly draw any real conclusions about perf from that?

There are only 3 things that we can comfortable deduce from these leaks:

1. PS5 Pro will indeed have some proprietary machine learning super resolution scaler (YAY!). This can be huge for IQ and perf if used correctly. Here's to hoping the IQ looks better than FSR2 which has literally destroyed IQ in many games
2. The GPU will NOT be using RDNA2 again. It will clearly RDNA3 or later derived. The number of 67TFLOPs in FP16 clearly matches AMD's dual issue RDNA3 GPUs available today.
3. Sony will lean heavily in improving the RT performance in the PS5 Pro. This is great as it's been a severe limitation of the base console. Would love to see full (or more complete RT) in games like Witcher 3, Cyberpunk, Alan Wake 2, Returnal, GT7, and many more while maintain high resolutions and frame rates.

THAT'S IT. With no real details on the CPU, GPU, or RAM, everything that people are discussing is still very much conjecture and rumors. Those 3 points already indicate an upgrade that could easily be well beyond what the PS4 Pro was because it's not about raw GPU power, resolutions, and FPS. Sony address the 2 most glaring limitations of the PS5 base and this is the smartest thing they could have done for a PS5. ML can do more for overall perf than pushing a few more TFLOPs any day and more capable RT can have much more impact on the graphics than just pushing a few percentage more pixels. So there is plenty to be excited about.

Furthermore, all of the disappointed expressed over the +45% "rendering performance" i believe is taken out of context. It's been discussed at nauseum already but clearly the TFLOP calculations that are extrapolated from the 67TFLOPs in FP16 figure does NOT equal +45% higher compute. In fact, it's closer to ~65% more compute. The more plausible explanation for the +45% rendering performance is due to a ROPs increase from 64-96 which was also heavily rumored in the earlier leaks. That would make more sense and is a figure that is much more closely aligned to using the term "rendering performance" as opposed to just saying the GPU is +45% faster. In other words, I don't believe it's accurate to deduce that the PRO's GPU is "only" 45% faster based on the limited data and the careful wording that was used in the docs.

We still have a LOT to learn here folks. But from the tease we've gotten, it's shaping up to be bigger upgrade than most of you seem to realize.

There is a pretty simple explanation for the 45% figure not aligning with the 65% tflops increase. And we simply have to take cernys word for it. Increasing CUs doesn’t get us a linear performance increase. Amd had to add infinity cache to each rdna 2 and rdna 3 gpu to get around that bottleneck and thats something Xbox and ps simply can’t have due to costs. That’s why xbox’s 20% advantage didn’t translate into 20% performance in so many games.

The same thing is happening here.

 

[welshrat]

I said most, not literally everyone.

Yes fair enough, I thought that after replying

 

[Dorfdad]

Am i? I am comparing it to Sonys own 45% estimate which is in comparison to the ps5, not pc. We know how ps5 games perform, we can easily deduce what that 45% extra power will buy us.

Things will be different for ray traced games which is good news for future AAA games.

Which IMHO is today’s 3d niche. I’d rather have games run better than have reflective lighting from a trash can. I just really hate how all new tech focuses on some new niche instead of fixing the last gen’s issues first!

Sony should imho double the cpu and gpu components and added 6-8 additional ram. Yes that’s going to cost more. It make the pro 699. Enthusiasts would have no issue paying the premium and the 5 still exists for the peasants.

 

[Self_Destructive]

PC gamers are in this thread... because console gamers need to use PC products to equate potential performance of the PRO.. and thus we have to come in and correct misinformation.

 

[Erebus]

So what's the equivalent Nvidia GPU for these specs?

 

[SlimySnake]

So what's the equivalent Nvidia GPU for these specs?

3070. With frame Gen tech.

 

[Self_Destructive]

So what's the equivalent Nvidia GPU for these specs?

4070 - 4070ti IMO.

 

[jm89]

PC gamers are in this thread... because console gamers need to use PC products to equate potential performance of the PRO.. and thus we have to come in and correct misinformation.

Go back to system wars remi

 

[Senua]

Very poor, cherry picked shot of AW2. The Order is artistically great, but it's still a PS4 game dude, poor textures and it's soft as all hell. Not to mention that horrendous aspect ratio.

 

[Self_Destructive]

Go back to system wars remi

I'm needed everywhere.

 

[winjer]

So what's the equivalent Nvidia GPU for these specs?

IT should be around the performance of 7700XT, in rasterization. So in between a 3080 and a 3070.
In RT workloads, it's much harder to tell.

 

[MisterXDTV]

So all this commotion on these "leaked" specs and people drawing conclusions about performance when they don't have anywhere near the full story. These leaked specs are incomplete at best and possibly misleading at worst. SO many details not even mentioned in there: CPU, RAM, shader config, GPU arch, clock speeds etc. How could you possibly draw any real conclusions about perf from that?

There are only 3 things that we can comfortable deduce from these leaks:

1. PS5 Pro will indeed have some proprietary machine learning super resolution scaler (YAY!). This can be huge for IQ and perf if used correctly. Here's to hoping the IQ looks better than FSR2 which has literally destroyed IQ in many games
2. The GPU will NOT be using RDNA2 again. It will clearly RDNA3 or later derived. The number of 67TFLOPs in FP16 clearly matches AMD's dual issue RDNA3 GPUs available today.
3. Sony will lean heavily in improving the RT performance in the PS5 Pro. This is great as it's been a severe limitation of the base console. Would love to see full (or more complete RT) in games like Witcher 3, Cyberpunk, Alan Wake 2, Returnal, GT7, and many more while maintain high resolutions and frame rates.

THAT'S IT. With no real details on the CPU, GPU, or RAM, everything that people are discussing is still very much conjecture and rumors. Those 3 points already indicate an upgrade that could easily be well beyond what the PS4 Pro was because it's not about raw GPU power, resolutions, and FPS. Sony address the 2 most glaring limitations of the PS5 base and this is the smartest thing they could have done for a PS5. ML can do more for overall perf than pushing a few more TFLOPs any day and more capable RT can have much more impact on the graphics than just pushing a few percentage more pixels. So there is plenty to be excited about.

Furthermore, all of the disappointed expressed over the +45% "rendering performance" i believe is taken out of context. It's been discussed at nauseum already but clearly the TFLOP calculations that are extrapolated from the 67TFLOPs in FP16 figure does NOT equal +45% higher compute. In fact, it's closer to ~65% more compute. The more plausible explanation for the +45% rendering performance is due to a ROPs increase from 64-96 which was also heavily rumored in the earlier leaks. That would make more sense and is a figure that is much more closely aligned to using the term "rendering performance" as opposed to just saying the GPU is +45% faster. In other words, I don't believe it's accurate to deduce that the PRO's GPU is "only" 45% faster based on the limited data and the careful wording that was used in the docs.

We still have a LOT to learn here folks. But from the tease we've gotten, it's shaping up to be bigger upgrade than most of you seem to realize.

Agreed with this.

The only other spec we can be sure about is memory clock speed:

2250 Mhz vs 1750 Mhz of the standard PS5

That would translate to 576 GB/s vs 448 GB/s if the memory bus stays at 256-bit

 

[Chuck Berry]

All those SBI games in 8K

 

[sachos]

Up to x4 RT combined with PSSR, will it be enough to push path tracing in some games? Seems like its too early for it, more like a task for the PS6 but I really hope so. At least lets hope for more RTGI in future games.

 

[ultrazilla]

I still think ray tracing is way over rated at this point and not worth the trade off in performance loss. Performance>graphics.

I would have rather Sony not even bothered with ray tracing and instead concentrated on getting a 60fps performance standard for all games(resolutions varying of course).

I haven't seen a game yet where it truly blew me out of the water with ray tracing being used. /shrugs

 

[Self_Destructive]

Up to x4 RT combined with PSSR, will it be enough to push path tracing in some games? Seems like its too early for it, more like a task for the PS6 but I really hope so. At least lets hope for more RTGI in future games.

No, it wont.

 

[Wolfpact1983]

Seems so, sadly...


If you cared that much about RT, you'd be on PC already, not waiting for 4 years after PS5 abysmal RT for decent RT in PS5 Pro... you won't be getting all the RT on PS5 Pro, and if they somehow do manage path tracing, image quality/resolution will be abysmal.

It was a joke you bum

 

[ChiefDada]

And yet this console won't even be on a level of 3080 4 years later.

3070. With frame Gen tech.

Not True. It really depends on how comparable RDNA 2 card, i.e. 6700xt, render budget allocation is between raster and RT on a game by game basis. Taking Avatar Pandora as an example, expected PS5 Pro performance can/will change depending on split between raster and RT budget. As I said before, the more RT intensive prior and future games become, the more impressive PS5 Pro will compare to it's RDNA 2/3 counterparts at all levels. PSSR will be the star though because again it can theoretically produce better image quality than 7900xtx 4k at the cost of ~1ms assuming internal 1440p/PSSR Quality.

Note 1: For reference, Ratchet PS5 RT accounted for ~13% of total 33ms frame budget in a scene where there was very little reflective surfaces.
Note 2: 6700xt at 4k is likely gimped due to memory constraints as it is not a 4k card, potentially undercutting PS5 and PS5 Pro potential. Just something to keep in mind.

 

[Gaiff]

3070. With frame Gen tech.

Lol come on man. Don’t downplay it. The 3070/2080 Ti are at best 50% faster. More commonly they’re 20-30% faster. It seems to be a 6800 in terms of raw raster specs.

 

[playsaves3]

Its a great comparison, and it will be even greater when DF compares the PSSSR to DLSS and the PS5 Pro GPU to GPUs up to 4 years old.

Will digital foundry still do it with cpus that are 3x better?

 

[Schmendrick]

Yeah they are running into tdp limits here. Ps5 already hits 230 watts at times. Ps4 would top out at 150 watts. So it’s not like they are not trying, but consoles have to be small, they need to have cpus and gpus packed together dang they need to fit in a tidy console tdp budget.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the ps6 tops out at 30 tflops. Only a 3x upgrade in raw performance.

Wut ...... There are ITX builds with 4090s...
This has nothing to do with tdp limitations. This is all budget.

 

[Gaiff]

Wut ...... There are ITX builds with 4090s...
This has nothing to do with tdp limitations. This is all budget.

Lovelace is a lot more power efficient than RDNA3.

 

[Bigfroth]

Smart it will be the best place to play the biggest game of the decade GTA 6. At least till the PC version comes out.

 

[playsaves3]

4 years ago and not much has changed. Comparing $500-600 consoles to $2000 PC parts is just stupid and that’s what you’re doing

You’re not the target market. This isn’t intended to be a $3000 console

It’s intended to run PS5 games at quality settings and 60 fps, with better RT and IQ at an affordable price

4 years ago and not much has changed. Comparing $500-600 consoles to $2000 PC parts is just stupid and that’s what you’re doing

You’re not the target market. This isn’t intended to be a $3000 console

It’s intended to run PS5 games at quality settings and 60 fps, with better RT and IQ at an affordable price

Minor thing this will be more 600-700

 

[playsaves3]

I have a PS5 and I will likely end up getting a PS5 Pro at some point too.

I just won't buy any PS5 software for it, I wait for those to come to PC. I use my PS5 for backwards compatibility and am hoping that PS5 Pro enhances my BC games in some way...

Wouldn’t the pro be better than a large amount of GPUs

 

[Ownage]

PS4 pro is reasonable in 2024, ps5 pro sounds like a gigantic upgrade.

This will be my upgrade.

 

[Schmendrick]

Lovelace is a lot more power efficient than RDNA3.

Irrelevant as we're not talking anywhere near 4090 performance....

 

[Gaiff]

Irrelevant as we're not talking anywhere near 4090 performance....

It is relevant because Lovelace’s scaling is much more efficient than RDNA3. You’d have to use RDNA3 cards for your point to be valid.

A 4090 can still perform fantastically even with a power limit of 80%.

 

[Audiophile]

If GTAVI can hit 40fps internally on the PS5 Pro then theoretically there's nothing stopping this hardware from using frame-gen to bring it up to 60fps Locked or ~80fps VRR.

 

[Mobilemofo]

Going to be interesting how they advertise this, show games in 8K and disappoint the 4K owners when the games drop, show off both resolutions, or show only 4K to avoid negative feedback from those without 8K sets.

Nobody has an 8k TV, and I'm betting nobody gives a shit about 8k gaming.

 

[Unknown?]

You get this machine if you're not a little poor ass bitch

 

[Mobilemofo]

Some people forget the reality of GTA 6.

Some folk just don't give a shit about gta6. I'm sure it will be marvellous etc, but after years of it, I'm bored of GTA.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Honestly order 1886 looked more ps5 then Alan wake 2

If you really believe this, then that should tell you everything you need to know.

 

[Physiognomonics]

There is a pretty simple explanation for the 45% figure not aligning with the 65% tflops increase. And we simply have to take cernys word for it. Increasing CUs doesn’t get us a linear performance increase. Amd had to add infinity cache to each rdna 2 and rdna 3 gpu to get around that bottleneck and thats something Xbox and ps simply can’t have due to costs. That’s why xbox’s 20% advantage didn’t translate into 20% performance in so many games.

The same thing is happening here.

They wouldn't talk about relative performance here. They just don't want to write down the actual (low) numbers for that. Here many people will probably be disappointed when they read the actual clocks of the machine under normal conditions, like Heisenberg warned us plenty of times. Kepler already tweeted that 45% would mean they actually downclocked the GPU compared to PS5. I think he tweeted that because it's a way to disclose info without being in trouble.

By the way because of memory bandwidth I think they may have done the right thing. PS4 Pro was often bottlenecked by its bandwidth. Low Tflops count but at least efficient this time.