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Official Doctor Who Series 1, 5, 31, or Fnarg Thread of Moffat & Smith

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Reno7728 said:
What if we did a Classic (or new) rewatch thread similar to the Lost one last year?

I know I want to watch a lot more classic who, and it would be awesome to have lots of people discussing it

Sounds good, although since the availability of classic Who is a bit patchy, and acquiring a complete set is difficult - to cover it all legitimately, you'd need a collection of audio reconstructions, DVDs, VHS and TV recordings - perhaps it would be simplest to limit it to the currently-available DVDs?

That would still cover a lot of ground, including a good number of classic stories, without making it too difficult to participate in.
 

Reno7728

Member
Keyser Soze said:
Rewatches are cool

Indeed they are - except for me this would be a first watch.

I'm thinking of cherry picking some "classic" episodes and then moving on from there depending on my enjoyment
 
Regulus Tera said:
He fell into the Eye of the Matrix or some shit, and is trapped in the TARDIS or some shit.

Then again, this is Doctor Who. Canon is irrelevant.

The Valeyard was last seen laughing evilly at the end of Trial Of A Time Lord. He was then never mentioned again.
I do think that the
EVIL VOICE
is
some future version of the Doctor, but perhaps not the Valeyard as such.

And all the episodes do survive in audio form - there are various fan projects aimed at providing animated visuals of some sort for the missing episodes.
 
Dr Zhivago said:
The Valeyard was last seen laughing evilly at the end of Trial Of A Time Lord. He was then never mentioned again.
I do think that the
EVIL VOICE
is
some future version of the Doctor, but perhaps not the Valeyard as such.

And all the episodes do survive in audio form - there are various fan projects aimed at providing animated visuals of some sort for the missing episodes.

There is a theory that the Doctor regenerated early so that the Valeyard would never come into existence naturally.
 

Thomper

Member
KibblesBits said:
There is a theory that the Doctor regenerated early so that the Valeyard would never come into existence naturally.
I think that, in the end, none of that stuff matters at all. If the writers of the TV show (i.e., Moffat) want to bring him back, he'll be back. Period. The old stuff is there, but can be ignored/forgotten if they want. Which to me is fine. As long as individual episodes are good/great/amazing, who cares if something clashes with an episode from, like, 38 years ago?
 

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
What about we just pick a handful of serials from each doctor, set a few days aside for each ones.. no need to watch them at the same time, but then we can discuss those 4 or or 8 eps in that lot for a day or 3, then pick another one?
 

Reno7728

Member
Syth_Blade22 said:
What about we just pick a handful of serials from each doctor, set a few days aside for each ones.. no need to watch them at the same time, but then we can discuss those 4 or or 8 eps in that lot for a day or 3, then pick another one?

Sounds like a plan i can get behind
 

Rikyfree

Member
I guess I am in the minority that loved Tennant and thought the End of Time, well the last half at least, was just downright superb.
 

Blader

Member
Rikyfree said:
I guess I am in the minority that loved Tennant and thought the End of Time, well the last half at least, was just downright superb.

+1

I don't think you're in the minority though...there are several thousand Brits who would agree with you. :lol
 

Lard

Banned
Syth_Blade22 said:
What about we just pick a handful of serials from each doctor, set a few days aside for each ones.. no need to watch them at the same time, but then we can discuss those 4 or or 8 eps in that lot for a day or 3, then pick another one?

Sounds good, I'm in.
 
Thomper said:
I think that, in the end, none of that stuff matters at all. If the writers of the TV show (i.e., Moffat) want to bring him back, he'll be back. Period. The old stuff is there, but can be ignored/forgotten if they want. Which to me is fine. As long as individual episodes are good/great/amazing, who cares if something clashes with an episode from, like, 38 years ago?

NO GODDAMNIT, NO!
They've used a ton of old stuff from, "like, 38 years ago" in the recent NuWho and they need to keep using it and following or expanding on ideas.
 
KibblesBits said:
NO GODDAMNIT, NO!
They've used a ton of old stuff from, "like, 38 years ago" in the recent NuWho and they need to keep using it and following or expanding on ideas.

I think tying yourself down to 38 years of continuity is limiting as a writer. Be respectful but don't let continuity keep you from telling a great story. That's the rule I live by.
 
DoctorWho said:
I think tying yourself down to 38 years of continuity is limiting as a writer. Be respectful but don't let continuity keep you from telling a great story. That's the rule I live by.


I'm not saying new ideas and new directions are bad, but honestly the fear of the classic work is just plain stupid and illogical.
 
KibblesBits said:
I'm not saying new ideas and new directions are bad, but honestly the fear of the classic work is just plain stupid and illogical.

Oh yeah. A fear of the classic stuff is down right silly. There is a lot of great content to pull from there.
 

Lard

Banned
DoctorWho said:
I think tying yourself down to 38 years of continuity is limiting as a writer. Be respectful but don't let continuity keep you from telling a great story. That's the rule I live by.

People who say continuity gets in the way of a good story are lazy-ass writers who can't be bothered to take thirty seconds to check a fact.

You can be knowledgeable about it without contradicting it *or* have it bogging you down.
 

Reno7728

Member
Lard said:
People who say continuity gets in the way of a good story are lazy-ass writers who can't be bothered to take thirty seconds to check a fact.

You can be knowledgeable about it without contradicting it *or* have it bogging you down.

But as this continuity is regarding the Valeyard, meaning that the 13th doctor would be evil, then it limits the writing of the show.

Similarly to the limit on regenerations i wouldn't mind a simple explain-away line on both of these issues, as they would limit the show imo
 
Lard said:
People who say continuity gets in the way of a good story are lazy-ass writers who can't be bothered to take thirty seconds to check a fact.

You can be knowledgeable about it without contradicting it *or* have it bogging you down.

I disagree. Comic books are a good example of how bad continuity can bog down a new writer with baggage they'd rather just dismiss than acknowledged. In 38 years (Who is a lot like a comic book IMO) there has been a lot of crap continuity that has come along with the good. Simply dismissing it to expore your own ideas is perfectly fine. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be respectful but don't pander to the continuity fiends (of which there are a very small amount compared to the mass audience) who require every plot point to fit nice and snug with previous history.
 
I would have been happy with Tennent in Fnarg too, but was much happier that Smith debut. That meant everything was a clean break with very little chance to go back to Rose and her family, Martha and her family, and Donna and her family. Clean breaks are cool - expect Wilfred he can come back.
 
Keyser Soze said:
I would have been happy with Tennent in Fnarg too, but was much happier that Smith debut. That meant everything was a clean break with very little chance to go back to Rose and her family, Martha and her family, and Donna and her family. Clean breaks are cool - expect Wilfred he can come back.

And Captain Jack can come back too.
 

Thomper

Member
KibblesBits said:
NO GODDAMNIT, NO!
They've used a ton of old stuff from, "like, 38 years ago" in the recent NuWho and they need to keep using it and following or expanding on ideas.
Oh, I know! I'm totally okay with that. Don't think I'm anti-'old stuff'. I'm just saying that, with a lot of stuff, things aren't *really* set in stone that much. For example, the 13 regenerations thing we've gone over in this thread a few times before. Yes, it's there and has been mentioned in old-Who as a 'rule'. But when push comes to shove, they'll figure out a way to get around that relatively easy.

And that's what I mean with the other old stuff, too. It should remain standing, and it's all important and good, but don't think for a second that a relatively obscure character like the Valeyard (at least to today's viewers) will still be in the same 'state' he was all that time ago (non-existent due to the Doctor's actions, as you say) if they wish to bring him back. The concept behind the Valeyard would still be there, and they'll be able to expand on all that stuff, but the writers probably won't feel *that* restricted by the rules set out by other writers all that time ago. They'll figure out a way around that. Which is good, because story beats almost all.

Not to make this post too long, but I think a decent example of that is the Master. He lost all his regenerations in the old-Who, right? By the time the TV-Movie rolled around, he'd lost them all again and died... again. And then the John Simm-Master was yet another last-ever-Master, but even that particular Master got a second chance in The End of Time. That's what the Who-writers seem to have done almost always: yes, things happen and characters die or never exist. But if they love the concept, like RTD loved the idea of the Master, they'll bring that concept back and nudge around the continuity a bit.

That's probably partially because there's not an entirely proper Doctor Who Continuity. If you take the TV-show, the spin-offs, the books, the audio-stories, the video-games, all that other stuff into account, sure, it ties together, but very difficultly. Even if you take just the TV-show, there's still almost 50 years of TV into account, and within that there's a whole lot of contradictions.

I just don't think people should get too hung up on there being a neat and proper Doctor Who continuity, with a nicely working timeline that has everything plotted out straight. Most writers on the show now or in the past didn't really seem to care about that *that* much too. They'll create new concepts to work with on the show, as well as reusing old concept as they see fit. If they can fit it in with continuity, fine. If they just want to use The Master again even though he's been really, really, really dead half a dozen times now, that's still fine.
 

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
Don't mean to jump in here in the middle of a convo! but whipping up a list now of what eps to watch and on what dates (I'm majorly bored lol) If you have any suggestions for specific stories for the doctors you'd like to see in the list (as you'd like to re watch, or you think it'd be great for those of us that haven't seen much early who to see) post them here, or PM me.

Hunting through this thread now for that list of much watch dr who eps that was posted a few pages back
 
DoctorWho said:
And Captain Jack can come back too.

I still see him as part of Moffat's separate Who Universe - if this season was a rebbot, then they are part of the prologue. Him and Sally should just come back to say hello sometime - if Carey Mulligan starts falling on hard time soonish (and grows her hair long again)
 
Keyser Soze said:
I still see him as part of Moffat's separate Who Universe - if this season was a rebbot, then they are part of the prologue. Him and Sally should just come back to say hello sometime - if Carey Mulligan starts falling on hard time soonish (and grows her hair long again)

And stops boning The Beef.
 
DoctorWho said:
I disagree. Comic books are a good example of how bad continuity can bog down a new writer with baggage they'd rather just dismiss than acknowledged. In 38 years (Who is a lot like a comic book IMO) there has been a lot of crap continuity that has come along with the good. Simply dismissing it to expore your own ideas is perfectly fine. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be respectful but don't pander to the continuity fiends (of which there are a very small amount compared to the mass audience) who require every plot point to fit nice and snug with previous history.
Especially as one of the big things about the show is that history is flexible. What once was now no longer necessarily is.

I recently watched a First Doctor episode that took place 10 million years in the future, involved the destruction of the Earth, and had a human race with apparently slow space travel as it was going to take them 700 years to get to a planet they thought would be habitable. Obviously they haven't adhered to all that.

Also they said the TARDIS was black. :lol
 
JoshuaJSlone said:
Especially as one of the big things about the show is that history is flexible. What once was now no longer necessarily is.

I recently watched a First Doctor episode that took place 10 million years in the future, involved the destruction of the Earth, and had a human race with apparently slow space travel as it was going to take them 700 years to get to a planet they thought would be habitable. Obviously they haven't adhered to all that.

Also they said the TARDIS was black. :lol
:lol

Is that The Ark? I've yet to see it but I believe that ship somehow causes the first Big Bang. Am I wrong?
 
Syth_Blade22 said:
(as you'd like to re watch, or you think it'd be great for those of us that haven't seen much early who to see) post them here, or PM me.

1st:
An Unearthly Child
The Daleks
The Dalek Invasion of Earth
The Daleks' Master Plan (mostly missing)
The Tenth Planet (Most of last ep.missing)

2nd: (missing at least 1 ep unless noted)
The Evil of the Daleks.
Power of the Daleks.
Web of Fear.
Tomb of the Cybermen. (complete)
The War Games (complete)
The Invasion (complete w/cartoons)
Fury from the Deep

3rd:
Any of Series 7
Terror of the Autons
The Daemons
The Time Warrior
The Sea Devils
Planet of Spiders
Three Doctors

4th:
Series 12 (Revenge is shite, but the series has a nice arc)
The Talons of Weng-Chiang.
Pyramids of Mars.
City of Death.
The Robots of Death.
The Seeds of Doom.
Terror of the Zygons.
The Deadly Assassin.
Horror of Fang Rock
The Brain of Morbius
Logopolis.
Series 16 is one long story arc, that varies in quality.

5th:
Caves
5 Doctors
Resurrection

6th:
lol

7th:
Remembrance of the Daleks
Curse of Fenric
Survival


Mixture of good stuff and mythology stuff?
 
No Edge of Destruction or The Chase for the 1st Doctor?

In fact, I'd take out Master Plan and add The Space Museum. Maybe even The Meddling Monk (What was that story called again?)
 
Lard said:
People who say continuity gets in the way of a good story are lazy-ass writers who can't be bothered to take thirty seconds to check a fact.

You can be knowledgeable about it without contradicting it *or* have it bogging you down.

Have you ever looked at the Doctor Who continuity though? It's a mess.
 
The Chase is awful, Edge of Destruction is pretty good; depends on where you want to draw the line on how many stories per doctor you want to watch.
 

HolyCheck

I want a tag give me a tag
infiniteloop said:
The Chase is awful, Edge of Destruction is pretty good; depends on where you want to draw the line on how many stories per doctor you want to watch.

:p I'm setting a pretty heavy schedule!

Will post a rough draft later on today.. but here is the first section! Get started whofans! (Or jump in when ever you want!)

Code:
July 20th		An Unearthly Child		Hartnell
July 23rd		The Daleks			Hartnell
 

ag-my001

Member
infiniteloop said:
4th:
Series 12 (Revenge is shite, but the series has a nice arc)
The Talons of Weng-Chiang.
Pyramids of Mars.
City of Death.
The Robots of Death.
The Seeds of Doom.

Terror of the Zygons.
The Deadly Assassin.
Horror of Fang Rock
The Brain of Morbius
Logopolis.
Series 16 is one long story arc, that varies in quality.

I'd heard from a friend that "The Curse of Fatal Death" (my gateway drug to Who) was a joke about old episode titles, but it never really sunk in until I saw these right here just now.
 
Thomper said:
Oh, I know! I'm totally okay with that. Don't think I'm anti-'old stuff'. I'm just saying that, with a lot of stuff, things aren't *really* set in stone that much. For example, the 13 regenerations thing we've gone over in this thread a few times before. Yes, it's there and has been mentioned in old-Who as a 'rule'. But when push comes to shove, they'll figure out a way to get around that relatively easy.

And that's what I mean with the other old stuff, too. It should remain standing, and it's all important and good, but don't think for a second that a relatively obscure character like the Valeyard (at least to today's viewers) will still be in the same 'state' he was all that time ago (non-existent due to the Doctor's actions, as you say) if they wish to bring him back. The concept behind the Valeyard would still be there, and they'll be able to expand on all that stuff, but the writers probably won't feel *that* restricted by the rules set out by other writers all that time ago. They'll figure out a way around that. Which is good, because story beats almost all.

Not to make this post too long, but I think a decent example of that is the Master. He lost all his regenerations in the old-Who, right? By the time the TV-Movie rolled around, he'd lost them all again and died... again. And then the John Simm-Master was yet another last-ever-Master, but even that particular Master got a second chance in The End of Time. That's what the Who-writers seem to have done almost always: yes, things happen and characters die or never exist. But if they love the concept, like RTD loved the idea of the Master, they'll bring that concept back and nudge around the continuity a bit.

That's probably partially because there's not an entirely proper Doctor Who Continuity. If you take the TV-show, the spin-offs, the books, the audio-stories, the video-games, all that other stuff into account, sure, it ties together, but very difficultly. Even if you take just the TV-show, there's still almost 50 years of TV into account, and within that there's a whole lot of contradictions.

I just don't think people should get too hung up on there being a neat and proper Doctor Who continuity, with a nicely working timeline that has everything plotted out straight. Most writers on the show now or in the past didn't really seem to care about that *that* much too. They'll create new concepts to work with on the show, as well as reusing old concept as they see fit. If they can fit it in with continuity, fine. If they just want to use The Master again even though he's been really, really, really dead half a dozen times now, that's still fine.


Ok, I see where your logic is and I agree with you on most if not all points. I'm just constantly worried about what the writers are doing with Who and if they will forget everything in embrace of new and shiny, all the time...
 

maharg

idspispopd
ag-my001 said:
I'd heard from a friend that "The Curse of Fatal Death" (my gateway drug to Who) was a joke about old episode titles, but it never really sunk in until I saw these right here just now.

My favorite is The Deadly Assassin. Like there's assassins out there who just hand out roses or something.
 
I just got word that the BBC is poised to announce that "Doctor Who: The Complete Fifth Series" will hit Blu-ray and DVD on November 9 and that it will contain a truly tantalizing extra: two newly filmed sequences, both written by Steven Moffat and available only in this collection.

They are called "Meanwhile, in the TARDIS ... " and, as that title suggests, they are drop-in moments that show what happens between the episodes -- I suspect they're the comedy mortar between the story bricks, and with Moffat's wry sensibility and the daft charms of Matt Smith and Karen Gillan, I'm guessing these interstitial escapades have a chance to be pretty entertaining.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/her...hit-home-video-with-a-tantalyzing-extra-.html

6a00d8341c630a53ef0133f26435af970b-250wi
 

Thomper

Member
KibblesBits said:
Ok, I see where your logic is and I agree with you on most if not all points. I'm just constantly worried about what the writers are doing with Who and if they will forget everything in embrace of new and shiny, all the time...
Nah. The people who write Doctor Who now are the ones who grew up with it. They love the original/old stuff way too much to ever throw that by the wayside.
 
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