Pretty much. I don't think anyone could ever invoke the fifth amendment again if we are going to go by the republican definition of waiving the right.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2014 |OT| Kay Hagan and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad News
- Thread starter bananas
- Start date
- Status
Pretty much. I don't think anyone could ever invoke the fifth amendment again if we are going to go by the republican definition of waiving the right.
WayneMorse
Banned
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/13/u...ins-within-republican-party.html?ref=politics
NY Times did a good article on the interesting assortment of candidates who are vying to take out Kay Hagan.
NY Times did a good article on the interesting assortment of candidates who are vying to take out Kay Hagan.
The militias that showed up want to manufacture a landmine for them to step on themselves, so unfortunately in this case it's better to back off than let themselves invent a last stand for propaganda purposes.
The politicians that flared this up even more with political grandstanding should be ashamed of themselves.
Metaphoreus
This is semantics, and nothing more
That's not "brain-dead logic." It's a valid logical inference (albeit one that we don't permit be made in a criminal proceeding, of course). And the two privileges have important differences. The inference to be drawn when a person refuses to testify before Congress on account of executive privilege is not that a crime was committed. It would be more general, such as that there's something (embarrassing or ethically wrong, but not necessarily criminal) the person wants to hide. (Of course, one could also infer that the privilege is being invoked sincerely, on account of beliefs about the proper scope of Congressional inquiry.)
On the other hand, when a person invokes the right against self-incrimination, the natural inference is that testifying would incriminate the person. There's just no other basis on which to assert that right.
I'm not sure how the distinction between voluntary speech and compelled speech is relevant to what I said. "This standard" that you refer to appears to be your creation, not mine.
I say that her invocation of the privilege against self-incrimination is "clearly disingenuous" because she asserted it in Congress--which cannot prosecute her--but later provided a "lengthy interview" to the DOJ--which can. In other words, she appears to believe that what she told DOJ (but refused to tell Congress) could not incriminate her, which means that she had no basis for asserting the privilege before Congress. These circumstances are not at all typical in criminal proceedings.
Bad news for Slay Magan.
Just goes to show the Republican bastion NC has become recently.
It's unbelievable that any politician defended these dimwits. He has ignored court orders for 20 years and owes hundreds of thousands of dollars in fees. The natural progression is to confiscate cattle that were STILL on federal lands. Yet the governor and other republican morons said they went about this the wrong way? I mean what? Are we just supposed to just let people steal from the government? O that's right...... It's only bad if it's a poor person stealing. If someone steals a million dollars it's fuck da government.
So, solar power road prototype is gonna get a trial run.
http://www.bonnercountydailybee.com/news/local/article_604a09ac-baf0-11e3-94d2-0019bb2963f4.html
http://focusforwardfilms.com/films/30/solar-roadways
http://www.bonnercountydailybee.com/news/local/article_604a09ac-baf0-11e3-94d2-0019bb2963f4.html
http://focusforwardfilms.com/films/30/solar-roadways
speculawyer
Member
Yeah, this seems to be standard paranoia and overreaching because 'da evil gubmint'. The sense of entitlement is amazing.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
My favorite thing is them saying this shows how much the federal government has 'overreached'. I've heard people ask what would the founders think?
Um.... well we kinda know what they thought of people disobeying federal orders and claiming they're standing up for natural rights just ask George Washington:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Fuck yeah hexagons, the official polygon of tomorrow!
Also -
The panels also include a heating element that can be activated to melt snow and ice from the surface and LED lights that will eventually be programmable into traffic lines, safety messages and more.
Seriously, just give it all the money, I don't even give a shit about feasibility, I want future roads dammit.
and for real, either the US or China (who invest shitload into it) is going to control the worldwide solar market, and you know we'll end up with this technology, long term, it is the energy solution; you need to be shortsighted (or in the pocket of oil companies) to don't see it.
empty vessel
Member
These circumstances are exceedingly common in criminal proceedings. Many people voluntarily speak to the police without incriminating themselves and then invoke the Fifth Amendment against compelled testimony.
The same people cheering for this guy are the same ones constantly bitching about 'moochers', 'welfare queens', and 'takers'. This rancher is the very definition for those terms yet they either don't care or they're so full of themselves that they can't see the massive, massive hypocrisy they're engaged in.
Metaphoreus
This is semantics, and nothing more
A Congressional hearing is not a criminal trial. Calling these circumstances "exceedingly common" could only make sense if you ignore that obvious distinction.
speculawyer
Member
Interesting . . . I think it should be tested . . . but I'm not sure why we would want to do that when we already have millions of acres of rooftops not yet covered with solar panels. Especially since those rooftops are right above the places we use the electricity. And if every roof were covered with solar panels, we would probably have far more electricity that we know that to do with (at least during daylight hours).
I've just got maybe a 1/4 of my roof covered with solar panels and I generate enough electricity for my house and my car and I'll have plenty to spare such that the utility will have to write me a check. Granted, I live in a sunny place and I don't drive much but I'm certain I could cover a full time commuting car as is and with a little more panels (which I can easily do), I could handle two electric cars.
speculawyer
Member
You know, I think the left-wing press needs to keep talking about this issues . . . especially with effective reports like that Assaf Manzi piece on the Daily Show. And with enough awareness of this issue, it will completely backfire on the GOP.
1) People will learn about the issue and go get the necessary ID to vote; and
2) This intentional effort to suppress the vote will create so much resentment against the GOP that they'll lose various minority groups for many years to come.
I think that already happened in 2012 (although many of the restrictions were not in place due to courts putting on stays). However, I do worry about reduced turn-out once Obama is no longer on the ticket. The GOP do have a point . . . the damn Dem voters are lazy and they won't show up for the 2014 elections.
You know what . . . someone should use that as a way to try to motivate a get-out-the-vote effort . . . you not showing up during mid-term elections is exactly what they are trying to do!
Also, too. Every panelist on MTP aside from the lone Democrat was either bitching or celebrating how the initial rollout was disastrous, and how Sebellius' resignation proves Obama's scared of what will follow at the midterms.
Um...can I just point out that the rollout, as bad as it was, was fixed months ago, and despite that, we reached the stated goals that Sebellius set BEFORE the rollout happened?
Um...can I just point out that the rollout, as bad as it was, was fixed months ago, and despite that, we reached the stated goals that Sebellius set BEFORE the rollout happened?
I don't understand. Wouldn't Obama had made Sebellius resign much earlier if he was afraid that the rollout would affect the mid-terms?
Get your level-headed common sense out of here. We've got a narrative to sell.
speculawyer
Member
No. That is a lazy biased inference which is easily jumped to by people paranoid against the perceived "other".
(often black guy, muslim, mexican etc.)
You may take the 5th when you know you are completely innocent but fear the government is trying to railroad you. You may take the 5th when you know you are completely innocent but you feel you may accidentally say something stupid which will be misinterpreted or abused by prosecutors. You may take the 5th when you know you are completely innocent but you committed some OTHER crime but fear that talking about the current issue may end up leading to talking about the other crime.
You shouldn't draw ANY CONCLUSIONS from someone taking the fifth. Perhaps it may raise your suspicions but you really have nothing solid to go on just from someone invoking the 5th.
If you really it is a 'valid logical inference' then you should agree to having your phone tapped by the state . . . because if you don't then you are obviously trying to hide something, right?
Don't you think it is a bit unfair that all these people on the right assume this IRS woman is criminally guilty of something for taking the fifth and that Eric Holder is criminally guilty of something for taking executive privilege . . . but they don't say anything like that about all the Chris Christie administration people that have taken the fifth. And on the other side, the Rachel Maddow show has practically talked about the Bridgetgate scandal non-stop yet she's never once said that anyone is guilty of anything just because they invoked the fifth.
speculawyer
Member
The Onion is so awesome.
http://www.theonion.com/articles/nation-recalls-simpler-time-when-health-care-syste,34957/
Part of that was read aloud during an I^2 debate on Obamacare:
http://intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/past-debates/item/1016-obamacare-is-now-beyond-rescue
That debate will probably be funny to listen to years from now when 1/2 the people are on the wrong side of history.
http://www.theonion.com/articles/nation-recalls-simpler-time-when-health-care-syste,34957/
Part of that was read aloud during an I^2 debate on Obamacare:
http://intelligencesquaredus.org/debates/past-debates/item/1016-obamacare-is-now-beyond-rescue
That debate will probably be funny to listen to years from now when 1/2 the people are on the wrong side of history.
RustyNails
Member
Sunday morning has gone to the dogs. Anyone know how George Snuffalaupugus did today?
NYCmetsfan
Banned
Just watch MHP on sundays. Her show is great
speculawyer
Member
Well don't be surprised if they all end up like Fox "News". They are for-profit shows and the only people that watch them beside political geeks like you guys, are crank old white people. So the shows are going to end up catering to what they WANT TO HEAR in order to get good ratings.
WayneMorse
Banned
I stopped watching the Sunday shows a long time ago, it's awful.
Also I hate to say it but I'm kinda growing tired of Real Time, back when Maher did Politically Incorrect the show was interesting because you had celebrities and interesting people talk about politics and current events. Now the show just has boring Beltway hacks who regurgitate the stupid partisan talking points, at least Maher calls them out on their bullshit though.
Also I hate to say it but I'm kinda growing tired of Real Time, back when Maher did Politically Incorrect the show was interesting because you had celebrities and interesting people talk about politics and current events. Now the show just has boring Beltway hacks who regurgitate the stupid partisan talking points, at least Maher calls them out on their bullshit though.
benjipwns
Banned
It's more circle jerky talking head and less panely/roundtabley or at least that's how it feels.
speculawyer
Member
On April 4, 2014, he had 2 conservatives and that helps make it lively. But when it is all or mostly liberals, it becomes a bit of a circle jerk. I just hope he can keep getting conservatives that will appear on the show. 2 conservatives makes it interesting. 1 liberal, 1 conservative, and 1 silly celebrity works. But when you get 2 or more liberals, it loses some of the fireworks.
But I tend to like the show no matter what if for nothing else than the monologue and the New Rules.
Eh, they usually just spout the same trite talking points.
speculawyer
Member
Well they are conservatives. What do you expect? Deep thinking?
It is fun to watch them slaughtered. I just hope Bill Maher doesn't end up like Rachel Maddow . . . all the conservatives are too pussy to go on the show.
My guess is that it's because roads are (mostly) public land and are managed by the government (on various levels), so it's easier to get such project up and running.
But whatever man, fucking hexagons!
speculawyer
Member
Yes, Hexagons indeed.
But I think roads are a weird place considering they have cars/trucks going over them and dripping oil on them (although I hope that will be reduced with EVs).
I think the public works angle is the big pull for it.
That aside, having the ability to build roads and provide "free" power sources to the areas the road services simultaneously will be fantastic. Nobody builds roads to remote places because there's nothing there, and there's nothing there because people aren't there, and people aren't there because they have no utilities.
Never running out of gas too...just pull over and plug into the road, or even further down the road just embedding wireless charging modules into the road itself to charge whilst driving.
That aside, having the ability to build roads and provide "free" power sources to the areas the road services simultaneously will be fantastic. Nobody builds roads to remote places because there's nothing there, and there's nothing there because people aren't there, and people aren't there because they have no utilities.
Never running out of gas too...just pull over and plug into the road, or even further down the road just embedding wireless charging modules into the road itself to charge whilst driving.
Plus a heating element in the road to melt ice and snow, getting rid of the need for salting and plowing.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
The pessimist in me wonders what kind of extreme weather they get in Idaho though? Only the thaw is wrapping up here in Minnesota and the roads are just ridden with potholes
My main concern is keeping the panels clean.
Fuck us.
Every time I read about Thorium I wonder why can't we be using that as part of our infrastructure. We actually had the option to start developing the technology decades ago, but we passed on it because the byproducts weren't as useful to weapon development as our standard nuclear power.
Fuck us.
There is also a bunch of cool shit you can do if you have smart roads, look at their prototype, they use LEDs for road marks and that allows you to change lanes on the fly and to put driving info on the fucking road (also, it will get hacked and people will put penis pictures there, and I think we can all get behind that).
They also built a prototype pressure sensitive plates, so you can have a warning on the fucking road if a kid or a deer is crossing it.
I don't know if this will work, I really don't, but I'm fucking sick and tired that as a society we're not even trying to do cool shit, we have the technology to do so much.
edit: they got under one mil in total, this is fucking nothing. more research and more fucking hexagons please!
They also built a prototype pressure sensitive plates, so you can have a warning on the fucking road if a kid or a deer is crossing it.
I don't know if this will work, I really don't, but I'm fucking sick and tired that as a society we're not even trying to do cool shit, we have the technology to do so much.
edit: they got under one mil in total, this is fucking nothing. more research and more fucking hexagons please!
Idaho gets a fair bit of snow I think.
Pot holes may not be much of a problem depending on the material. We only get them because the roads are asphalt, a better material may fix the problem.
Street sweepers, boom.
That's the most frustrating things about following all this cool tech.
I'm even more pissed after finding out that the hadron collider got cock blocked in the US cause of "lol why are we wasting money on science". Learnt about this through Particle Fever Movie, which I recommend.
I'm still fucking pissed at this, the US willfully gave its supremacy in nuclear physics research to Europe because OMG deficits runaway spending.
Fucking hell, Desertron was going to have 5 times the energy of that puny "Large" Hadron Collider; or as they would've said in Texas, "you call that thing large? that's cute".
Not to mention its named was 100 times more badass.
Fucking Clinton, 2nd worst Democratic president post WWII.
benjipwns
Banned
What's the rankings?
Worst to best -
Kennedy
Clinton
Truman
Carter
LBJ
Though to be fair, such rankings are silly, ask me again, you might get a different answer.
God bless Vasili Arkhipov, you sexy Russian devil.
Also, this is why if we're going by decision making and not outcomes (which I think it's a fair way to rank presidents) Reagan will always be the fucking worst.
People always focus on his terrible economic policies, but this is peanuts next to his handling of the cold war. That fucking idiot ended détente, withdrawn from SALTII and extended the cold war for another decade just because he listened to a bunch of idiot hacks who pushed the totally discredited idea that the Soviets are building up their military to attack the US.
We had some fucking close calls in the 80s, that dumbass put all of human civilization in danger for no good fucking reason, you can say that in the 60s the US really didn't understand the soviets, we certainly didn't understand them in the 40s and 50s, but in the 80s?
For fuck's sake even the CIA didn't get that wrong, and the CIA is wrong about everything all the time.
There are too many of these damned stories for my heart to handle. Thank crap that armament reductions and safeguard mechanisms (that actually were enforced and worked) won out.God bless Vasili Arkhipov, you sexy Russian devil.
Also, this is why if we're going by decision making and not outcomes (which I think it's a fair way to rank presidents) Reagan will always be the fucking worst.
People always focus on his terrible economic policies, but this is peanuts next to his handling of the cold war. That fucking idiot ended détente, withdrawn from SALTII and extended the cold war for another decade just because he listened to a bunch of idiot hacks who pushed the totally discredited idea that the Soviets are building up their military to attack the US.
We had some fucking close calls in the 80s, that dumbass put all of human civilization in danger for no good fucking reason, you can say that in the 60s the US really didn't understand the soviets, we certainly didn't understand them in the 40s and 50s, but in the 80s?
For fuck's sake even the CIA didn't get that wrong, and the CIA is wrong about everything all the time.
Or ideologues in general. People love a dumb sunuvabitch who can't do anything but stick to his guns and make a mess. FUCK SUBTLETY FUCK SELF DOUBT OOH RAH OOH RAH
I guess you should skip Command and Control then, even though it's a fascinating read.
Damn, I grew up having nightmares about nuclear war (thanks Threads, and thank you adults in my life who thought that's an thing for a 9 years old to watch) and sheeeeit, if knew half the things in this book I would've never slept in the 80s.
Good thing Reagan watched a made for TV movie with Steve Gutenberg and John Lithgow so he understood that nuclear war is bad, mmmkay?
Man, if that fucker watched Threads instead we would've had total nuclear disarmament in five minutes, The Day After is like the care bear movie next to it.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked