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PoliGAF 2015-2016 |OT3| If someone named PhoenixDark leaves your party, call the cops
- Thread starter Diablos
- Start date
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Then who the F thinks Loretta Lynch is going to indict hillary clinton?
I'm hoping my shares of Trump Sweeps Early States and President Hillary spike tomorrow so I can get in on arbitrage in the Hillary Jail market.
QuiteWhittle
Member
Would this recommendation be public?
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
I do have to think that between now and 2024, a young candidate as far left or more left than Bernie Sanders economically will be voted into the House and will end up being a serious contender for 2024 in the primary. There's too much evidence that Dems under 30 like Socialism for someone not to try to make Socialism their campaign backbone in the future.
No idea. Even if it were, I don't think she would be pressured to indict her party's nominee in an election year.
Coriolanus
Banned
Carson kinda sits in startk contrast to the other three. Mostly curious about when Kasich will drop.
Know who's gonna be at a great age to run for president in 2024?
Oh yes.
There's no realignment on the Republican side, only an initial period of speeches by captains; and voting is by secret ballot, so it should be relatively boring from a violence perspective.
Don't forget that that guy will also be dropping out. You know, that guy.
Black Republican
Member
DWS for 2024 ? reagan type blowout confirmed
ugaboga232
Member
Hmmm, what are people's thoughts on this: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/hillary-clinton-single-payer-health-care-will-never-ever-happen/
Elaugaufein
Member
(Note the following is hypothetical, I cannot see it applying to Clinton. )
If the recommendation was serious and compelling enough, you pretty much have to though. Otherwise it gets leaked, and then you're participating in a cover up in the eyes of the public and you tar your entire party apparatus along with you. Party loyalty has limits.
One would seriously hope that an Attorney General would have ethical discretion far before that point though. You'd hope that an Attorney General who seriously believed their own parties presidential candidate was guilty of serious crimes would prosecute them.
Well I mean she's right. PoliGAF is actually pretty left leaning and you're still in the hole by about 33% if you subtract the number of people who think Single Payer isn't worth fighting for from the ones who think it is. It's certainly not going to happen if basically no one is willing to fight for it. Circular as that may be it's true.
QuiteWhittle
Member
I don't know about 2024 but I'm expecting a Seth Moulton vs. Tom Cotton presidential showdown at some point.
I think I get what she's saying. But I don't like that she said "never." Her word choice could've been more exact.
ugaboga232
Member
Yea thats what upset me, totally reasonable to say single payor isnt coming soon or whatever, but never, ever seems to just paint sanders as crazy to people who trust her but may switch.
QuiteWhittle
Member
Why does the American Left prefer single-payer over a universal multi-payer care system? Honest question since I'm rather uneducated on this.
At a glance, something as sweeping a change as single-payer seems impossible because of the structure of the federal government and the regional dominance of conservatives while I'd imagine we could keep incrementally improving the ACA to match a system like Germany's.
Seems to me she's saying it's not going to happen as it is being proposed now. She wants something to be done, because something is better than nothing. And nothing is exactly what is going to happen if you focus entirely on single payer in this political climate.
I don't think she's suggesting America will never have single payer. I think her argument is we need to start moving in that direction as opposed to skipping ahead to the finish line.
For the record, I'm not a big fan of Obamacare as it is, but, it's still better than not having it if that makes sense. It's a step. Hopefully step 2 gets us closer to single payer whatever and whenever that will be.
I agree though she shouldn't have used those words never. Especially considering her past record on this issue.
Loved reading your story. Pretty cool!!
I would love this. Seth actually represents my district and I really like the guy. Hoping he sticks around for a long time to come!
I consider myself pretty left-wing, I mean I vote exclusively NDP in Canada. But I'm supporting Clinton because the status quo is working for me. The Obama administration's policies on LGBT rights and immigration have allowed me to marry my husband and immigrate here. I want his executive actions on guns (which are now status quo) defended and expanded. I got great health care through the federal marketplace (although Kaiser sucks) and at a reasonable price, but I have met firsthand people whose premiums are too high, so I want a President who will fight for lower health and prescription drug costs.
The LGBT community had its revolution over the past few years, and a very large portion are now happy the way it turned out last June. Sanders' rhetoric talk, at least to me, is off-putting for that reason. I don't want a revolution, I want someone who will expand on what's been achieved wrt LGBT rights to protect us federally in employment, housing, etc. Maybe that's a reason Sanders' revolution message isn't resonating with non-whites and the 45+.
The LGBT community had its revolution over the past few years, and a very large portion are now happy the way it turned out last June. Sanders' rhetoric talk, at least to me, is off-putting for that reason. I don't want a revolution, I want someone who will expand on what's been achieved wrt LGBT rights to protect us federally in employment, housing, etc. Maybe that's a reason Sanders' revolution message isn't resonating with non-whites and the 45+.
gutter_trash
Banned
that is really sad and disappointing. Hillary has the best chance to win but it pains me that Americans will never ever get Single Payer like rest of the Western world.
You guys are so fucked
RustyNails
Member
Sorry but many of the feverish Bernie crazies on reddit has me dismayed as fuck. Some of the things I've read is not something unusual out of propaganda material. This combined with casual sexism (eg "xyz, and people want to make this woman commander in chief??") has me gagging. I don't see you as the enemy either.
Frank the Great
Banned
Predictit has Hillary getting indicted at 35%? I'm gonna short that like a mug. Easy money.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Ted Cruz stole one of his favorite lines.... From a CANADIAN:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...s-from-a-canadian-politician/article28473649/
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...s-from-a-canadian-politician/article28473649/
I'd put that in the same category as Amy Schumer stealing jokes from urban dictionary.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Doesn't Germany have multi-payer? They do alright.
Healthcare doesn't have to be single-player to be fair and reasonable. The problem is underregulation, out of control costs, and a lack of legitimate competition. ACA addresses the last one and does some solid work on the first. Adding a public option and cost controls would take us most of the way to where we need to be.
Awesome. If I hungout at that subreddit long enough I'd probably hate Bernie supporters too. Way to many angry people there.
I may be critical of Hillary at times once she becomes President but I promise I won't be unbearable. She can only do so much with a senate and house working against her. Hopefully that will change at some point during her presidency.
ugaboga232
Member
There will always be shitters in any organization, try not to let them affect your judgement of a group of many many more people. Try to understand where their anger is coming from. Emotions happen for a reason (even if the reasons are dumb). People are worried that Clinton will advance some key issues but stay mum on others because of certain biases she may or may not have.
Butts-a-plenty
Banned
This needs to stop. Switzerland doesn't have single payer, Germany doesn't have single payer, Japan doesn't have single payer. This crazy idea that single payer is the only solution to provide universal healthcare is ridiculous and is damaging to our potential options for improvement.
I'm seriously considering it. Like how do you even think it's possible she will be indicted. Stop listening to conservative radio 24/7. I'm kind of kicking myself too. I would have had money on Trump and Hillary all the way back in August.
GregLombardi
Member
The media love to make it a close race...drives up ratings for results, and fills their corrupt little pockets with money.
And_Gignac
Member
And how Sanders will damage such legacy? In no way he would. You are talking as if he would dismantle all those achievements, In my view, he understands how economics and its relationship with poltics create a new set of privilege that it is not easy to call out or dismantle. And yet, he has never ever downplayed the cultural oppression, that indeed is independent of economics, that minorities suffer. And he has been very vocal about it since day 1. If u think he hasnt, then you are not paying attenton.
Didnt he mean that they are both being unfairly called out for that?
After reading Game Change a few days ago, I definitely think the media is all chasing the grand prize of being the one to bring down the Clintons. They hate the Clintons.
To be totally honest, my assessment is that it's because people are not aware of the universal healthcare systems in the world that aren't single-payer. The countries diplomatically closest to America (Canada, UK) have single-payer systemse.
I mean ....
m.huffpost.com/us/entry/democrat-voting-donald-trump_us_56ad5d02e4b0010e80ea6021
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Democrats are sure going to love that $10T tax break for the rich and the extreme racism. He only has a -70 favorability with Dems.
I mean, if he wins blacks and Latinos like he says he's going to, then obviously Democrats will have to cross over.
Story checks out.
Basileus777
Member
Is this going to become the next silly thing people will diablos over?
Bingo. 538 even talked about this in an article months ago. Even if there isn't a real race - the media will make it so (though I do think there is a real race currently for the Dems)
Aside: I saw this article
http://www.buzzfeed.com/rubycramer/hillary-clinton-wants-to-talk-to-you-about-love-and-kindness
Called an old colleague of mine who is working on the HRC campaign, and she says it's pretty accurate. Colleague is from Minnesota - and called HRC an honorary Minnesotan due to how kind she is in personal matters. Friend had a miscarriage a few months ago, and the campaign gave her paid leave (even though it wasn't part of the job necessarily) and held her job till she got back.
EDIT: Aside, I suspect that's what thawed any ice between Barack and HRC - they both are genuinely kind people who believe in the Golden Rule.
I've heard similar stories about Sanders as well - he's very kind on a personal level.
Grumble - I agree with Sanders' proposals / ideas more than HRC, but I like HRC as a person. Still not sure how to vote.
Jack Remington
Banned
If you want to bet on Hillary, it's actually a great time to get in. Her shares were a lot more expensive a few months ago.
Abinash117
Member
Most of Bernie supporters will mostly go to Hillary, and the ones that might go to Trump are probably mostly independents and/or probably was skeptical of Hillary anyway.
Sanders main focus is the domestic economy and not foreign trade. I think Mitt Romney used similar language against at least China. I don't think Trump will get a lot of crossover support because of trade. Plus, Trump is a broken record I doubt he will have detailed plans or go beyond the " All this foreign places are making our leaders look like losers! I will make deals so good it will make the Chinese's head spin." That real only go so far.
Sanders main focus is the domestic economy and not foreign trade. I think Mitt Romney used similar language against at least China. I don't think Trump will get a lot of crossover support because of trade. Plus, Trump is a broken record I doubt he will have detailed plans or go beyond the " All this foreign places are making our leaders look like losers! I will make deals so good it will make the Chinese's head spin." That real only go so far.
Trump is going to get higher then single digits with blacks so democrats watch out.
(beating everyone other republican' numbers since the first Clinton election)
Is something that is being seriously said.
My brain hurts
Basileus777
Member
Trump's polices are not going to come off as progressive once they are being compared to Hillary's. All of this fear that Trump is going to be the new Reagan has such a weak foundation when his unfavorables with Democrats are horrifically bad.
Yoda
Member
I wouldn't write this off so quickly. He wouldn't need to steal many to tip the scales in his favor. For example, if 6% of college educated whites switched their vote last election, Romney would have won. TPP will drastically lower the quality of life for many people within a short timeframe (see NAFTA). If he can snake oil people into saying he'd stop it, which wouldn't be out of the questions because Bill Clinton was the one who signed the last massive trade agreement into law, people may swallow the bigotry in hopes of stopping more corporatism.
He was also massively unfavored among Republicans when he started his campaign, those numbers have completely flipped.
The ACA ignored the cost of healthcare and focused on insuring people in the admittedly corrupt insurance system we have. There is no downward pressure on healthcare costs because:
- Insurance companies operate as regional monopolies, similar to cable companies there is very little consumer choice in most areas.
- Medicare part D is not allowed to negoiate the price of drugs, thus Big Pharma can jack the price as high was it wants because they KNOW it will be paid for.
- Doctors are in short supply, yet medical school spots rarely increase, why? Because the AMA lobbies to kill expanding residency positions, thus limiting the supply of MDs and inflating their salaries.
- Providers are in a vicious cycle on getting under-reimbursed for expenditures, so they try to pass costs to future expenditures to make up for it, as a result the insurance companies opt to pay even less, than providers try to play accountant even MORE. Now it isn't common to see stupid shit on bills like "$1.75 - bandaid".
- Taxes weren't raised to cover the cost of putting millions of uninsured into the system, instead healthy people were coerced into the insurance market, paying the same obscene premiums for a service 95% of them won't take advantage of. Despite this injection of capital, insurance companies will still pinch pennies and only pay for the bare minimum of extreme cost cases (cancer, major surgery etc...)
The status quo WILL NOT WORK. The ACA was a band-aid, the middle-class of the country is what funds the healthcare industry, the middle-class of this country is not only shrinking, it commands less wealth and less purchasing powering every year... yet prices keep going up?
Basileus777
Member
6% is a huge swing, especially for a candidate not especially popular with that demographic.
They're still very poor to the point where Trump would be in trouble if this were a 2 man primary. Look at Trump's favorables in the latest Selzer poll, he's only +3% with likely Republican voters, which is the worst out of the entire field.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
UK's system is more different from the stereotypical single payer conception than universal multi payer, so I'm not sure that works.
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