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PoliGAF 2016 |OT10| Jill Stein Inflatable Love Doll

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Boke1879

Member
Whether ya'll like it or not, this is gonna be a big story all week. It's not going away by plugging your ears and pretending it's nothing to worry about.

Of course it's going to be a story. It would have been one without all the crazy conspiracies.

She'll have to talk about it tomorrow, and she'll have to have a good week "optics" wise as far as health goes.

It'll be brought up at the debates and she can talk about it again.
 
I'm going back to bed, we've now reached the stage where people actually talk about Clinton needing to step down so Sanders can take over and are completely serious.


Morning/Night Y'all
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Are there really people that exist that don't like Trump but will say "well I guess Hillary's health sucks so I won't vote for here" based on a single fainting episode?

These feels more like an alt-right "victory" than something that will a legitimate impact on this election.

It'll be a thing on the cable channels for a few days, to know how it's going to play in the general public we'll need to see how the local coverage is though.

I'm going back to bed, we've now reached the stage where people actually talk about Clinton needing to step down so Sanders can take over and are completely serious.


Morning/Night Y'all

Oh just shoot me where I stand.
 

Diablos

Member
Are there really people that exist that don't like Trump but will say "well I guess Hillary's health sucks so I won't vote for here" based on a single fainting episode?

These feels more like an alt-right "victory" than something that will a legitimate impact on this election.
Someone who doesn't like Trump isn't going to all of the sudden vote for him because Hillary got sick/passed out due to overheating/whatever the root cause is. The concern is that it will depress turnout from typically reliable Democratic and Independent voters. Certainly, if her health would somehow turn into an ongoing issue heading into election day, that could happen.

Politics aside I'd be lying if I said I wasn't worried about her jumping on a plane and flying over to the other end of the US for the next 3 days to presumably aggressively campaign after what happened today.
 

royalan

Member
If I were Team Clinton, I'd get her in front of the press ASAP on this. They can't ignore this, because her health is becoming a genuine question with mounting points of concern, even without the conspiracy crazies jumping onto it and turning the dial up to 11.

There's the fainting episode that resulted in a concussion she sustained two years ago.

There's the consistent cough that her team has begun blaming on pollen but, let's be real, that excuse is bullshit and the fact that that's the story even made me a little worried. Anyone following this election knows that The Cough has been a problem since the Nevada caucuses. That was February. It's likely nothing (damn Hill, just spit the damn phlegm out and drink some tea with honey before you get on stage), but it sure ain't helping.

And now yet another fainting episode. This one with video.

People in here can cry "Diablos!" all you want, but this is how narratives work. Every attack that has been effective at bringing down Hillary's numbers are the attacks the play into an existing narrative about her. It's why anything she does that can be perceived as being secretive damages her more than it would any other politician. These ongoing issues with her health, though likely nothing, are providing real hooks for the conspiracy nuts to latch onto.

The Clinton Campaign would be wise to take this seriously, because pretty soon it won't just be the nuts asking questions.
 
Jesus, stop saying this. It's a gross distortion of reality. They're not "health rumors" in the same way people saying 9/11 was an inside job are not "national security rumors."

It's unfortunate that she fainted. It sucks. It would have been a big story even if Alex Jones wasn't pushing straight sewage onto the internet.

People with sense and sensibility are not supposed to accept as true utter bullshit from conspiracy theorists. The right does not and the left does. Repeatedly.
I am not particularly worried about people with sense and sensibility. I am concerned about Average-Americans, as many continuously prove to lack those qualities.

I said elsewhere that I had two primary concerns regarding this incident: Hillary's actual health and the political fallout from the story and specifically that disturbing video. My first concern has been moderately allayed. She appears to be ok, and that's great news. On this front I am very relieved.

Still...

I recognize the fallout from this story will be significant due to how strongly it plays into the smear campaign Trump has been building. This will be a bullet in a gun that was formerly unloaded, unthreatening and fairly harmless. How well the GOP aims it and what damage will result remains to be seen. I'm bracing.
 

Wilsongt

Member
The response of the media and GAF to this latest "episode" by Hillary is absolutely fucking disgusting. The concern trolling, calling in her health as a factor on whether she can lead or not...

Fuck the right for ever making this a goddamn issue. This is sickening.
 

studyguy

Member
Are there really people that exist that don't like Trump but will say "well I guess Hillary's health sucks so I won't vote for here" based on a single fainting episode?

These feels more like an alt-right "victory" than something that will a legitimate impact on this election.

It at least 'confirms' all the bullshit rumormongering from the right about her failing health even if none of the bs is related to this. They'll get to go on about how she has x years to live and anything else now unabated. Media will pounce on it because it's a story to angle, worst yet it's on 9/11.

Diablosing is stupid but this warrants a bit of it. There aren't any positives to spin out of this just more 'questions' to ask about her health from the right.

I agree with the idea of getting her ass out there now for a presser. She did three this weekend already. Do more.
 
If I were Team Clinton, I'd get her in front of the press ASAP on this. They can't ignore this, because her health is becoming a genuine question with mounting points of concern, even without the conspiracy crazies jumping onto it and turning the dial up to 11.

There's the fainting episode that resulted in a concussion she sustained two years ago.

There's the consistent cough that her team has begun blaming on pollen but, let's be real, that excuse is bullshit and the fact that that's the story even made me a little worried. Anyone following this election knows that The Cough has been a problem since the Nevada caucuses. That was February. It's likely nothing (damn Hill, just spit the damn phlegm out and drink some tea with honey before you get on stage), but it sure ain't helping.

And now yet another fainting episode. This one with video.

People in here can cry "Diablos!" all you want, but this is how narratives work. Every attack that has been effective at bringing down Hillary's numbers are the attacks the play into an existing narrative about her. It's why anything she does that can be perceived as being secretive damages her more than it would any other politician. These ongoing issues with her health, though likely nothing, are providing real hooks for the conspiracy nuts to latch onto.

The Clinton Campaign would be wise to take this seriously, because pretty soon it won't just be the nuts asking questions.
Agreed, on all fronts. Every word.
 

Boke1879

Member
Are there really people that exist that don't like Trump but will say "well I guess Hillary's health sucks so I won't vote for here" based on a single fainting episode?

These feels more like an alt-right "victory" than something that will a legitimate impact on this election.

I think people are worried that people will stay home, Which i highly doubt would be the case.

AA's, Latino's etc aren't going to stay home and risk a Trump Presidency.

Not to mention Clinton's ground efforts are strong.
 
Seriously guys, wake me up on this issue once polls start showing that fence sitters or people who Clinton should be winning the votes of aren't voting for Clinton because they are worried about her health.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
I am not particularly worried about people with sense and sensibility. I am concerned about Average-Americans, as many continuously prove to lack those qualities.

I said elsewhere that I had two primary concerns regarding this incident: Hillary's actual health and the political fallout from the story and specifically that disturbing video. My first concern has been moderately allayed. She appears to be ok, and that's great news. On this front I am very relieved.

Still...

I recognize the fallout from this story will be significant due to how strongly it plays into the smear campaign Trump has been building. This will be a bullet in a gun that was formerly unloaded, unthreatening and fairly harmless. How well the GOP aims it and what damage will result remains to be seen. I'm bracing.


I'm suggesting that people here should not be dressing up right wing conspiracy theories as journalism, which I've seen for three hours now. Anyway, obviously 9/11 means she can't do anything else today so she just has to wait until tomorrow. Definitely with a press gaggle.

It at least 'confirms' all the bullshit rumormongering from the right about her failing health even if none of the bs is related to this. They'll get to go on about how she has x years to live and anything else now unabated. Media will pounce on it because it's a story to angle, worst yet it's on 9/11.

Diablosing is stupid but this warrants a bit of it. There aren't any positives to spin out of this just more 'questions' to ask about her health from the right.

I agree with the idea if getting her as out there now for a presser. She did three this weekend already. Do more.

And she will have to address it or she'll pay the price. I think she will.

I actually do not believe the GOP or Trump himself will touch this.
 

Ecotic

Member
At this point in the campaign the Clinton campaign just needs to win more days than Trump does. This fainting episode means the next half week will be a loss.
 

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
If I were Team Clinton, I'd get her in front of the press ASAP on this. They can't ignore this, because her health is becoming a genuine question with mounting points of concern, even without the conspiracy crazies jumping onto it and turning the dial up to 11.

There's the fainting episode that resulted in a concussion she sustained two years ago.

There's the consistent cough that her team has begun blaming on pollen but, let's be real, that excuse is bullshit and the fact that that's the story even made me a little worried. Anyone following this election knows that The Cough has been a problem since the Nevada caucuses. That was February. It's likely nothing (damn Hill, just spit the damn phlegm out and drink some tea with honey before you get on stage), but it sure ain't helping.

And now yet another fainting episode. This one with video.

People in here can cry "Diablos!" all you want, but this is how narratives work. Every attack that has been effective at bringing down Hillary's numbers are the attacks the play into an existing narrative about her. It's why anything she does that can be perceived as being secretive damages her more than it would any other politician. These ongoing issues with her health, though likely nothing, are providing real hooks for the conspiracy nuts to latch onto.

The Clinton Campaign would be wise to take this seriously, because pretty soon it won't just be the nuts asking questions.

Bingo.

Add it to my "tie this to senior citizens" idea to make it look like Trump is attacking old people and you've got yourself a stew going.
 

HylianTom

Banned
Lol, wow I never knew about this. Just saw the video. It's even worse than HIllary's, lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnOnDatqENo

I keep saying.. the early 90s were magical. Soooo many jokes off of that one.

---

Congrats, Adam - sweet, sweet news! Big wedding, small wedding, eloping?
(and I like a long engagement. Being able to say "fiancé" is pretty fun.)

---

And on Hillary's health, I think Cesare needs to pass me the bottle.

Less because of thinking that it's politically hamrful, more because the coverage is going to annoy the dickens out of me. I'm glad she got in front of cameras pretty quickly, and hope that she does another appearance first thing tomorrow morning. Avoid today - the media is going to be harping on Kaepernick, and stepping into this on 9/11 is a bad look. Just get rested-up today, get ahead of it tomorrow morning, release more medical records in the coming days, and then give a major policy speech later in the week to move the story along.


It's just another signpost about this whole campaign. I felt joy in 2008 and 2012, but this is more of a "we-have-a-mission;let's-get-this-shit-over-with" feeling.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The OT thread is a shitshow and a half. Good god. I couldn't even get through one page of it.
KuGsj.gif
 

Debirudog

Member
The response of the media and GAF to this latest "episode" by Hillary is absolutely fucking disgusting. The concern trolling, calling in her health as a factor on whether she can lead or not...

Fuck the right for ever making this a goddamn issue. This is sickening.

.
 
The video isn't even that bad. It's heat exhaustion. But fox is gonna get their medical a-team to say it's cancer or a stroke.

And when people say it's not a big deal they don't disagree it won't dominate the news (because the media sucks and aimlessly reporting health rumors is easier than digging around trumps stuff) but they know it won't affect the actual election

There's a kind of has lighting going on with the health I'm even kinda falling for it.
 
It's worth remembering we had a president serve an entire term of his presidency while suffering from early dementia.

And one who couldn't walk (but was a top tier president)

And one who had a stroke while in office (although this one ended badly)
 
It is a fair point that the video of Bush passing out and puking on the Japanese prime minister was a worse moment and it didn't sink him. I would point out, though, that we were in a different media environment then, Bill wasn't making an issue of Bush's health, Bush was an incumbent president, and he was a man. The dynamic is very different in this case. I am worried about whether the Andrea Mitchells of the media world treat this as a permanent beat to cover.
 
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.
 

Wilsongt

Member
The video isn't even that bad. It's heat exhaustion. But fox is gonna get their medical a-team to say it's cancer or a stroke.

And when people say it's not a big deal they don't disagree it won't dominate the news (because the media sucks and aimlessly reporting health rumors is easier than digging around trumps stuff) but they know it won't affect the actual election

There's a kind of has lighting going on with the health I'm even kinda falling for it.

Dr. Keith Ablow with the hot scoops on her cognitive impairments.
 

HylianTom

Banned
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.

Hear, hear! Bring-on the damn melancholy, already!

(and reaaaaaalllly damn convenient news-wise that this is the first NFL Sunday)
 

Debirudog

Member
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.

Totally agreed. Fuck the heat. Can't walk anywhere without getting cooked.
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.

Yup. This summer especially has been hot as all holy hell. There's been days after walking from my subway station to work where I've felt like fainting from the heat and I wear a short sleeves and jeans to work.
 

Pixieking

Banned
It seems you're implying that Clinton will garner sympathy due to the amount of Americans dealing with health concerns or the health concerns of elderly relatives. I don't find this argument convincing in any way.

I'm aiming for empathy, actually, not sympathy. Anyone who has experience with dizzy/fainting spells, or a relative who suffers from them, will know that a) they can happen just because, or b) they can happen due to a wider health issue, or just heatstroke, lack of fluids, lack of food, lack of iron/sugar, etc.

A Trump advert making this A Big Thing will backfire because people will be able to empathize with feeling overworked and overheated. They'll see it's not A Big Thing, unless hospitalization occurs, and will potentially feel annoyed/hurt by Trump's campaign suggesting otherwise.
 

Boke1879

Member
It is a fair point that the video of Bush passing out and puking on the Japanese prime minister was a worse moment and it didn't sink him. I would point out, though, that we were in a different media environment then, Bill wasn't making an issue of Bush's health, Bush was an incumbent president, and he was a man. The dynamic is very different in this case. I am worried about whether the Andrea Mitchells of the media world treat this as a permanent beat to cover.

Me personally. She gets out in front of it tomorrow. goes through with what's on her schedule and she looks fine.

I'd rather they talk about this than emails. Because if she's out there looking good etc this is easier to manage. Even with that terrible video.
 

Mizerman

Member
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.

Same. Miami during summertime was hot as hell.
 
This feels like a nothingburger. Ever had to be helped to the hospital or to an ambulance before? It's a pretty awkward thing.

The alt-right will spin it but it's not a big deal unless there's frequency in these events. A one-off 'not feeling well' shouldn't concern anyone.
 
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.
Hear hear. I'm in Virginia. It's a goddamn humid, buggy 90+ degree nightmare outside from May to September.
 
I was just gonna quote this.

My guess is it was likely dehydration. If she didnt drink a lot last night or this morning it can catch up. I had the same thing happen. I hadn't drank. Didn't have a/c and almost passed out at 830 am. Drank water was fine in an hour.



The Washington Posts article is very fair, and not really sensational. I'm kinda not bothered.
Yeah if that how it plays. It's nothing. The fever swamps will analysize the video but they arent changing anything.

I do want her to be super hydrated and side on caution though. I'd rather people think she's hiding something than have another episode.
 

royalan

Member
This feels like a nothingburger. Ever had to be helped to the hospital or to an ambulance before? It's a pretty awkward thing.

The alt-right will spin it but it's not a big deal unless there's frequency in these events. A one-off 'not feeling well' shouldn't concern anyone.

This isn't the first time Hillary has fainted.
 

Grexeno

Member
I don't think this is a complete nothingburger, but I also don't feel like this will ultimately end up being a big thing. It'll be a thing, but not a big thing.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
The GOP? Sure. But what makes you think Donald "Literally Nothing is Off Limits" Trump is going to stay away from this clear pain point?

Because it's a lot more effective to just let the media play it over and over without attacking her for fainting. Did he even do any of the health stuff directly? I think you get a lot about stamina but that's really old.
 

studyguy

Member
Zero chance of empathy from this guys, I don't see the Clinton campaign pulling a miracle like that from this in the slightest.

No one wants to be labeled the senior candidate that cashes sympathy checks based on supposed ill health.
 

Boke1879

Member
The GOP? Sure. But what makes you think Donald "Literally Nothing is Off Limits" Trump is going to stay away from this clear pain point?

I don't think Trump mentions it today simply because of 9/11.

Because if he does. I think the argument can be made that he's turning this day which should be about the people we lost. Into a presidential political issue.
 

Revolver

Member
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.

I'm with you. As someone with MS, summer is just miserable. The heat and humidity are torture. At least in cooler weather I can go outside without nearly collapsing.
 

Particle Physicist

between a quark and a baryon
I really think some of you have blind spots here. Certainly fainting doesn't mean anything necessarily, but how many presidential candidates faint on video? Further, how many of such candidates have faced health rumors, be they from fringe sources or not? She was on Kimmel fucking talking about her health opening pickle jars.

This is a big deal, and she can't handwave it away.

I agree. As far as stupid optics go, it's a big deal. As far as actual health goes, it's not necessarily a big deal.
 

Crayons

Banned
Can I just say that summer is a gross, disgusting, thoroughly overrated season?

I spent two years in Honolulu and I was pretty miserable with it being summer-like weather 12 months a year.

Let's wrap this sun worshipping up. Gimme grey skies, a coffee, and a sweater.
Ohh, summer. Headaches, I can't wear black, sweaty sex, expensive air conditioning bills. Let's get to the fall already, where I can wear black, have less headaches, wear my fall clothes, have pumpkin flavored everything, and have less sweaty sex
 
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