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PoliGAF 2016 |OT11| Well this is exciting

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B

balladofwindfishes

Member
I like how the bar was set so low for Trump and he still managed to find a way to not clear it.

On the most watched debate in history.

If there ever a time to mess up that badly, it wasn't last night's debate.


I don't think the other two debates will be watched as much, since the novelty will have worn off. So Trump has very little room to make up ground.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
Finale Fireworker said:
Hair Mouse, the articulate vermin, paws through Donald Trump's hair and takes its perch at the stern of his scalp. Its small claws pierce Donald's head-skin. Though small, they seem to needle straight into his brain.

"You did well," says Hair Mouse. It has a voice like the sound of burning wood. It is not a friendly voice.

Donald does not feel he did well. In fact, he feels distinctly unwell. His daughter will not speak to him. He is disturbed by the example he is setting for his sons. He wishes this could all stop.
Click to expand...
I pre-ordered the book.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
Clinton's performance was like watching a very surgical, well crafted gameplan in effect. She didn't deviate at all, and while there were a few moments I thought she should have gone off script overall it was a great performance and a clear win for her. We saw what preparation and hard work (you know, the type of traits a president requires) can do. On the flip side we also saw what not preparing can do, especially when you already know nothing. Trump was terrible in nearly every way imaginable. He violated every "don't" that exists for US political debates and discourse; and yet some of the media still want to give him a passing grade.

I thought Trump started out...normal. He was rambling on trade but had the right answer for many Americans, whereas Clinton waffled on TPP. Yet even on trade Trump missed an opportunity to counter attack. In 07/08 we constantly harped on the fact that Hillary loves to use the successes of Bill's terms as a blanket for herself, but if you bring up any of his failures she attempts to distance herself. It's a pretty blatant thing that a good opponent can exploit in a debate. She got away with it on NAFTA and Trump had little to say...because he wasn't prepared for this. In fact he whiffed or missed on multiple counter attacks all night.

IMO the turn of the debate came when Hillary brought up Trump's inheritance. My initial reaction to this was ehhhh, she's going negative first how will this play out...and then I realized oh wait never mind, this is Donald Trump. He took the bait, and that's when he went completely rabid. He never calmed down after that. A few days ago I mentioned that passive aggressive jabs are a great way to rile Trump up and it's clear the Clinton camp had a few lined up.

One major disappointment I had: early in the debate Clinton brought up Trump's positive reaction to the 08 housing crash, and Trump responded by interjecting "that's just good business." Bill Clinton, Obama, W Bush, etc would have taken that and made it the moment of the night."That's not good business. That's regular Americans losing their jobs. That's middle class families losing their homes. That's small businesses going out of business. In America we don't cheer for our neighbors to lose everything so we can win a few bucks. blah blah blah." It was a missed opportunity. At the same time I can't say I disagree with the strategy overall. Clinton's camp did not want to get Trump into the types of memorable, entertaining back-and-forth jab fests that he dominated in the GOP debates. She's not witty enough to last in those types of competitions, most people aren't in fact.

The question: where do we go from here. The reports are pretty unanimous in terms of Trump being slammed, fact checked, etc. This is going to be a bad week for him. And if Pence is as weak as I assume he'll be in the VP debate, it'll be another bad week for Trump. The biggest takeaway I have for Trump is that he refused to blame Lester (who I thought did a great job), instead blaming the host college/microphone. Trump is claiming he won the debate, loudly. Which suggests he's going to walk into the next debate unprepared again, ready to fall for another bait trap.
 
T

Thequietone

Member
jack_package_200 said:
What is this even supposed to be saying?

Ben Garrison is a mess. Sad.
Click to expand...
That the moderator might as well have been Hillary. They are mad that the media are actually holding him responsible for his words and actions but barely touching Clinton, but if I was them I'd do the same. Trump is too dangerous to even allow anywhere near the White House.


Edit: I also liked the not so subtle plug for his new hotel near the White House.
 
N

NeoXChaos

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
Clinton's performance was like watching a very surgical, well crafted gameplan in effect. She didn't deviate at all, and while there were a few moments I thought she should have gone off script overall it was a great performance and a clear win for her. We saw what preparation and hard work (you know, the type of traits a president requires) can do. On the flip side we also saw what not preparing can do, especially when you already know nothing. Trump was terrible in nearly every way imaginable. He violated every "don't" that exists for US political debates and discourse; and yet some of the media still want to give him a passing grade.

I thought Trump started out...normal. He was rambling on trade but had the right answer for many Americans, whereas Clinton waffled on TPP. Yet even on trade Trump missed an opportunity to counter attack. In 07/08 we constantly harped on the fact that Hillary loves to use the successes of Bill's terms as a blanket for herself, but if you bring up any of his failures she attempts to distance herself. It's a pretty blatant thing that a good opponent can exploit in a debate. She got away with it on NAFTA and Trump had little to say...because he wasn't prepared for this. In fact he whiffed or missed on multiple counter attacks all night.

IMO the turn of the debate came when Hillary brought up Trump's inheritance. My initial reaction to this was ehhhh, she's going negative first how will this play out...and then I realized oh wait never mind, this is Donald Trump. He took the bait, and that's when he went completely rabid. He never calmed down after that. A few days ago I mentioned that passive aggressive jabs are a great way to rile Trump up and it's clear the Clinton camp had a few lined up.

One major disappointment I had: early in the debate Clinton brought up Trump's positive reaction to the 08 housing crash, and Trump responded by interjecting "that's just good business." Bill Clinton, Obama, W Bush, etc would have taken that and made it the moment of the night."That's not good business. That's regular Americans losing their jobs. That's middle class families losing their homes. That's small businesses going out of business. In America we don't cheer for our neighbors to lose everything so we can win a few bucks. blah blah blah." It was a missed opportunity. At the same time I can't say I disagree with the strategy overall. Clinton's camp did not want to get Trump into the types of memorable, entertaining back-and-forth jab fests that he dominated in the GOP debates. She's not witty enough to last in those types of competitions, most people aren't in fact.

The question: where do we go from here. The reports are pretty unanimous in terms of Trump being slammed, fact checked, etc. This is going to be a bad week for him. And if Pence is as weak as I assume he'll be in the VP debate, it'll be another bad week for Trump. The biggest takeaway I have for Trump is that he refused to blame Lester (who I thought did a great job), instead blaming the host college/microphone. Trump is claiming he won the debate, loudly. Which suggests he's going to walk into the next debate unprepared again, ready to fall for another bait trap.
Click to expand...

how does she bait him a townhall when the audience ask questions?
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
The Iraq War "fact check" by Holt wasn't even a fact check. Someone saying something and a moderator asking a question about what you said isn't fact checking.

It would be like asking Hillary why she supported the war, only for her to say "no I didn't" and the moderator pressing her to answer the question because she did support the war. That's just not a fact check.
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
It took me a long time to wind down after the debate last night. I am so glad it took all of two minutes for Trump to completely unravel. However, I did not expect him to self sabotage to the incredible levels he did last night. Holt wasn't doing anything, and prior to the debate I assumed that would mean Trump just dominating everything, but he is so fucking dumb and incoherent he barely pieced together a single salient sentence. It was truly staggering. The questions on race were surreal. How do you bridge the massive gap you have with blacks and hispanics? "Nationwide stop and frisk" He didn't try to put out a grease fire with water so much as he tried to put one out with gasoline. Unbelievable.

I hope Trump and his crew keep telling him he won last night. Everyone needs to play along. If he thinks that is a winning performance, let's have a debate every week until election.
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
Blader said:
That said, the most bizarre thing that came up last night, even by Trump's standards and stood out to me as a different kind of crazy, was accusing Hillary of fighting ISIS for her entire adult life. What the hell does that even mean?!
Click to expand...

What I think he was trying to say is that Hillary's been involved in the War on Terror for quite a while, but has been unsuccessful because ISIS still exists.
 
T

Teggy

Member
Wolf is getting an important answer from the head of the NAACP about how race was discussed during the debate and he interrupts him for "breaking news". The TV ratings for debates.

Pretty sure that could have waited.
 
P

paradox121

Member
Ithil said:
1) Openly rig online polls.
2) Use the polls you just openly rigged as proof your candidate is winning.
3) Lose on election day because your rigged polls were in fact not accurate, being rigged.
4) Complain that the election itself must be fraudulent because the online polls you openly rigged said your candidate would win.
5) ????
6) Complain some more.

The screenshot of the Trump subreddit posting all the polls and telling people to stuff them with votes should be circulated on the news.
Click to expand...

The cyclical nature of Trump and his supporters is deliciously hilarious. Supporters rig polls > Trump reposts rigged polls > Supporters repost Trump reposting rigged polls. Them living in their own little world under the belief that Trumps performance was top notch is probably the best outcome possible because it will fuel Trump to do nothing different next time.

Trump doesn't want to look silly and over-prepared like Killary. Better do less work next time.
 
T

tuffy

Member
Donald J. TrumpVerified account
‏@realDonaldTrump
Well, now they're saying that I not only won the NBC Presidential Forum, but last night the big debate. Nice!
Click to expand...
Another debate victory such as the one last night will lose him the election altogether.
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
80 million is crazy. This means that over 25% of Americans watched the debate. 80 million is also well over half the number of registered voters in this number.

I know numbers are skewed due to all the amused, bewildered, and terrified foreigners tuning in
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Valhelm said:
80 million is crazy. This means that over 25% of Americans watched the debate. 80 million is also well over half the number of registered voters in this number.

I know numbers are skewed due to all the amused, bewildered, and terrified foreigners tuning in
Click to expand...
Only the streaming numbers would include foreigners. That 80 million from TV is all Americans.
 
A

ampere

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
With his stop and frisk rant last night, is it possible for him to hit <1%-0% on a poll of African Americans?

After the DNC he was teetering around 2-3%. Can it go lower?
Click to expand...

CCCPTPSWMAITuJj.jpg
 
N

Nazgul_Hunter

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
Only the streaming numbers would include foreigners. That 80 million from TV is all Americans.
Click to expand...

Yup. The 80 million number came from Nielsen ratings for 12 of the networks that carried it. I think there's a couple channels that still haven't reported ratings (PBS?) and there's been no streaming data.

It also doesn't include watch parties here in the US either.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Nazgul_Hunter said:
Yup. The 80 million number came from Nielsen ratings for 12 of the networks that carried it. I think there's a couple channels that still haven't reported ratings (PBS?) and there's been no streaming data.

It also doesn't include watch parties here in the US either.
Click to expand...

It'll easily break 81 million in TV numbers alone once the last few networks come in. With streaming in there, it very well might actually hit 100million.

There's also people catching replays of it today on YouTube. My mom didn't watch it live, but she watched it this morning.
 
sazzy

sazzy

Member
if Trump and his little pepes 'won' the debate, according to them, why are they whining like petulant little children about the mic/moderator/cnn/other polls/RIGGED/etc?

edit- and I'm also shocked, SHOCKED, that no one in his campaign thought to remind him to not to be a sexist bunghole re: Alicia
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
sazzy said:
if Trump and his little pepes 'won' the debate, according to them, why are they whining like petulant little children about the mic/moderator/cnn/other polls/RIGGED/etc?
Click to expand...
Because they know they didn't actually win and it's all a delusion, but if they break the delusion than the whole operation collapses on itself.
 
B

Beer Monkey

Member
"Undecideds" on my Facebook are saying that there was no winner last night.

Of course, given that these "undecideds" come from the rural Ohio town I was born in, this means that Trump got his fucking ass beat. ;)
 
J

Joeytj

Banned
Hillary's really hitting her stride right now in that North Carolina rally. She sounds confident AF and barely even reading her lines, just enjoying the whole thing.

Best Hillary yet.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Joeytj said:
Hillary's really hitting her stride right now in that North Carolina rally. She sounds confident AF and barely even reading her lines, just enjoying the whole thing.

Best Hillary yet.
Click to expand...

I was having a conversation with Cybit a few months ago, you can find it in one of the old threads, and we were talking about how Clinton was at her best in 2008 (in terms of likability) when her back was against the wall and she just threw it all out there in an attempt to keep fighting. How she basically cut loose out of necessity and had to exit her comfort zone.

starmud said:
The NC rally speech was her best in sometime, she performs better when pressed and it shows...
Click to expand...

Like she knows what she's got to do, she just won't do it until she has to.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
Giuliani is attacking Hillary for being too stupid because she let bill cheat and didn't know.

Good look assholes.
 
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