Officerrob
Banned
Didn't know there was a new one today, I'll give it a listen
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PoliGAF 2016 |OT4| Tyler New Chief Exit Pollster at CNN
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Didn't know there was a new one today, I'll give it a listen
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Hey, I don't disagree that Sanders is unpolished and not really a good general election candidate, but as someone whose primary interest in life is the arts, I have little patience or sympathy for the lowest common denominator that is the bread and butter of politics (which is partially why I do not get very deeply invested in them).
Officerrob
Banned
If that's all it takes to be qualified, maybe you should tell Bernie...
User 463088
Banned
He is free to think she is qualified or not. If he no longer thinks she is, that's a departure from his previous positions on her when she ran in 2008. It's a departure from what he's said about her in this election. He also has set a bar for "qualified," that, interestingly enough, he is the only person who could possibly hope to clear it. Imagine that!
As to your second point about recipients having to understand the context,, that's just not the way public perception works. It's the same way a lot of us know that people won't go along with higher taxes if they're going to get free healthcare. When you have to explain something, you're losing the argument. If you have to qualify each one of your statements, you're losing the argument.
In politics, perception trumps reality. The perception of his words were negative. If he, and his campaign, want to spend the next week doubling down on them and trying to make them palatable, that's a damn waste of time. He couldn't have apologized for it, because it would have made him look completely uninformed, but he (and his team) should have shut the hell up about it.
Everything he said, minus the Iraq War, also applied to Obama, a man he voted for. So why didn't that disqualify him for the presidency? If it's because it wasn't actually about this issues being fundamentally disqualifying and about why he is MORE qualified, sure. But it's wrong, or at least bizarre, to say those issues would disqualify a presidential candidate for Bernie seeing as those weren't disqualifying issues before.
Reptilians are hatched, not born. Checkmate, Slithery Clinton.
User 463088
Banned
This is a great point.
He could have avoided this whole thing by saying "Secretary Clinton thinks I'm not qualified? She is wrong. I am more qualified because I refused to vote for the war in Iraq. I refused to support these disastrous trade deals. I am more qualified because I refuse to accept millions of dollars from Wall Street. That is what it means to be qualified to be President of the United States."
Boom. Done. You've proven you're qualified. Got some digs on her. Move on. No one would say shit about that.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Hmmm, in hindsight that did come off more confrontational than I intended.
More intended as a general statement about what was being posted, why others would take it the way they seem to be (regardless of context), and why I don't think Bernie is a good candidate, aside from his almost supernatural ability to fund-raise.
We cool?
*types with bated breath*
Officerrob
Banned
I see Bernie's loss (when he inevitably loses) like the momentin The Wire. Game was rigged from the beggining buddystringer dies or the parallel of Bunny Colvin losing his job
Did you just finish watching The Wire or something?
Macho Madness
Member
They debuted the Emerson NY poll numbers early on a radio show. They forgot to give Bernie's number though
Trump 53
Cruz 25
Kasich 16
Hillary 54
Trump 53
Cruz 25
Kasich 16
Hillary 54
I see Bernie's loss (when he inevitably loses) like the momentin The Wire. Game was rigged from the beggining buddystringer dies or the parallel of Bunny Colvin losing his job
If he loses it won't be because the game was rigged. It will be because he refused to put the work in and make inroads with african-americans and the party itself. It will be because of all the mistakes he's made along the way and the utter morons running his campaign. It'll be because he's just not that great of a candidate, everyone's kept the kid gloves on until now and at the first sign of real pressure he folds. That's why he's losing.
Yeah, that pissed me off when I saw it, but I doubt they'll go through with it after June 7th. Once Hillary gets enough pledged/super delegates to clinch the nomination, all of the Democrats will call this over and tell Bernie to GTFO in no uncertain terms. I guarantee Obama will endorse her once she has the overall delegates regardless of how much Jeff Weaver screams that supers don't count until the convention.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Officerrob
Banned
So the HUGE swing on the Republican side was their polling falling into line with most others
A bunch of others have already responded. I hope you can see now how Bernie's "unqualified" statement can be seen as sexist and hurtful to women and at very least is tone-deaf, especially for a democratic presidential candidate. Words matter, he should use his more carefully. I'm not saying he's sexist, I'm saying he could have made essentially the same argument without reaching for "unqualified" which has a long and sexist history when applied to women in the workplace.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
So you can ship me a sticker for free, but you're going to charge me $15 shipping for two pint glasses you're selling for $25?
I ordered one
More like welcome to what it's like to be a woman in the public sphere
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
It's a campaign stump speech, likely written not long before it was delivered. He called for Obama to be primaried in 2012 because he thought he needed to have some progressivism scared into him. These are all things that are negatives for Bernie, as a presidential candidate, which is why I did not support him in my state's primary, but it's not inconsistent with the general spirit of his campaign.
Also, there's an "if-then" quality to his statement that is being missed, here. I don't think Bernie actually thinks Hillary is unqualified, so much as he's saying that if he's unqualified, then she's REALLY unqualified because of all the BS on her own record. Again, from the point of view that Sanders really does believe he is a way better candidate and would be a way better president, this is a perfectly reasonable statement to make, notable only because she didn't actually call him unqualified.
Giant Panda
Member
Why has NY tightened up so much? Hillary was supposed to win by a good margin just two weeks ago, but now many polls are making it look like a single digit affair.
User 463088
Banned
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-more-effective-lawmaker-than-bernie-sanders/
I love how almost all the things Sandernistas love him for, Hillary has in spades
I love how almost all the things Sandernistas love him for, Hillary has in spades
Well, the last poll we saw that had it close stupidly polled independents. When you dug into it and polled registered Dems only it was a blowout again.
Macho Madness
Member
Siena Polls have been saying thereabouts this margin for a month now
He's repeated that she's unqualified several times now and has not couched it in an if-then relationship.
Oh, just that technicality, that it's untrue.
Except he didn't say he's MORE qualified, even if he meant that.
Also, even though he wanted to primary Obama, he never did and admitted (I believe) to voting for me. So these things can't wholly render someone unqualified to be president.
I get it if he means more qualified, which he didn't say. Actually if he thinks she's unqualified? That feels a bit dicier given that he voted for Obama.
User 463088
Banned
Um, what?
Siena has it at 55-34, a 21-point gap with 10% up for grabs.
Take a look at page 2. She's beating him in all but 2 demos, but even then it's not too big a win.
Personally, I'm thinking those 10-points break for her. Given her history in the state I'm assuming that they're just checking their options.
Rewatched the HD version recently actually, so it's been on my mind a lot again like it was back when I watched it for the first time. With this presidential election, I feel like it's themes are relevant more then ever.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rquz5vD8qDA
Literally arguing that Hillary raising money for downticket is a bad thing
Literally arguing that Hillary raising money for downticket is a bad thing
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
What he's said subsequently doesn't really matter to me, because what he's said subsequently isn't what set people off. Bernie's originally statement was made in response to a (slightly) misleading report that she had questioned his qualifications, and he turned what he thought was her original statement back on her by hammering the idea of "qualifications" from a different angle than that it's usually approached from. Again, this is classic rhetoric, and not something Bernie should be summarily closed off from because his opponent is a woman and the word in question is one that can have a loaded meaning in some contexts. He should have backpedaled a bit, or dropped it, once it was revealed that her original statement was milder than what he thought, but it's an awkward position to be in, and I appreciate that he's way behind and basically flying by the seat of his pants. Again, as someone who understood what he was saying, I don't really give much of a shit what he said, or that others gave a shit that he said it.
Everybody stop panicking
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/04/sanders-will-certainly-support-clinton.html
*D'oh
Ooh ye--- okay, this fever blows lol.
I'll give credit where credit is due. Good job Bernie for sounding infinitely more sane than Jeff Weaver and Tad Devine.
Sorry, but his word doesn't mean shit to me. I'll believe it when I see it. Until he proves otherwise, he's an annoying liability that needs to go the fuck away.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
That's a remarkably fair article. Good job WaPost.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Good.
Let's keep it clean on Thursday. I think Bernie should apologize for the "unqualified" comment.
Give him a night at the DNC, have him stump for her in the Midwest. I don't think anyone needs to burn any bridges.
Because fuck democracy and all the people who are voting and supporting him! Those fools need to get in line or get their voting ability taken away!
He was always going to support her eventually since they agree on like 90%+ of the issues and he has said in the past he does not want any of the republican candidate in the WH. I don't like his negative attacks on her, but I still think he would have supported her in the end,
Macho Madness
Member
Hillary 56
Bernie 38
Emerson NY
Bernie 38
Emerson NY
Was this one not polled by landline?
Huuuuuge swings. Emersons trolling us all.
This is about what Siena had last month and the month before, so it's generally in-line with everyone else once you take out independents. Any cross-tabs?
Macho Madness
Member
And
Trump 56
Cruz 22
Kasich 17
Emerson NY
No cross-tabs yet for either side
Trump 56
Cruz 22
Kasich 17
Emerson NY
No cross-tabs yet for either side
User 463088
Banned
There last poll was pure shit. They had insane numbers on the GOP and Dem side. This is inline with every other bit of polling from the state.
Aaron Strife
Banned
20-point margin would definitely end a lot of delusions of grandeur I think. Lot of Bernie supporters on my fb pinning everything on NY and CA.
Saw a picture of Bernie's head photoshopped on Goku's body holding up the Spirit Bomb with NY in one hand and CA in the other. Like yeah, good luck with that...
But don't worry, Cali has like 500 delegates so if Bernie wins all of them he'll close the gap. That seems like a reasonable expectation.
Saw a picture of Bernie's head photoshopped on Goku's body holding up the Spirit Bomb with NY in one hand and CA in the other. Like yeah, good luck with that...
But don't worry, Cali has like 500 delegates so if Bernie wins all of them he'll close the gap. That seems like a reasonable expectation.
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