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[BotoxAgent]

Rolling Stone Interview with Bernie



The fuck answer is that

Wow, dis guy!!

 

[Emarv]

Rolling Stone Interview with Bernie



The fuck answer is that

This dude....man....

Now, is it easy to do? No. How do you do it? It's a good question. And the truth is, right now I'm a bit busy running for president to have figured that out, other than to tell you that it requires a mass-based political effort bringing millions of people together to stand up and fight back. Unions could play an important role.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Play the anti semite card at every turn.

I'm not going to debate the conflict, lord knows I've done this enough but this line...

Substitute black, women, latino, gay, trans, etc in this and the phrase would be clearly seen, rightfully, as a dismissal of very real issues those people face.

But with Jews, it seemingly gets a pass.

edit: I'm not saying this isn't used as a defense wrongly in many areas. But its constantly become something that every israeli thread is filled with before the issue at hand is even discussed.

Like all those other "cards" these defenses can be used wrongly but they shouldn't be so blatantly disregarded as the antisemitism one is.

 

[BotoxAgent]

This guy is really not serious about governing.

 

[Poodlestrike]

I don't think Gotchaye means or intends this at all but with all of this hardening around Israel even with things that aren't related all I hear is "we don't care about jewish issues/jews are on their own"

To be honest that's kinda the history of Jews though :-/

Yup. Here we go again.

 

[hawk2025]

*swats away the question* kind of sums up Bernie's campaign!

 

[aspiegamer]

I wouldn't be surprised if those people are being instigated by conservative groups. My theory is that conservatives want to fracture the social progressive movement by redirecting the focus away from social issues.

Given r/s4p was organized by a marketing firm, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if there was some actual collaboration behind the scenes on a conservative cause. It's surprising that more political and social causes haven't hijacked more unconventional forms of media, frankly. For example, keeping even 1 person on staff who was clever enough to hide their tracks when editing particular Wikipedia articles. Someone thinking truly long-term could work their way from nothing to an admin in a few years. And I swear I'm not just saying this because I'd be perfect for it and really need 'work at home' stuff. No, but seriously, it's unethical as hell.

It's frankly not hard. It's way too easy to do stuff like that and get away with it. You'd need opposition to have staff to specifically try to research and fish out people who were doing it, which would also be 100% possible to do and maintain. Again, seriously not hard.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Given r/s4p was organized by a marketing firm, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if there was some actual collaboration behind the scenes on a conservative cause. It's surprising that more political and social causes haven't hijacked more unconventional forms of media, frankly. For example, keeping even 1 person on staff who was clever enough to hide their tracks when editing particular Wikipedia articles. Someone thinking truly long-term could work their way from nothing to an admin in a few years. And I swear I'm not just saying this because I'd be perfect for it and really need 'work at home' stuff. No, but seriously, it's unethical as hell.

It's frankly not hard. It's way too easy to do stuff like that and get away with it. You'd need opposition to have staff to specifically try to research and fish out people who were doing it, which would also be 100% possible to do and maintain. Again, seriously not hard.

Bernie Sanders and Street Sharks may have more in common than we originally thought.

 

[RustyNails]

I'm not going to debate the conflict, lord knows I've done this enough but this line...

Substitute black, women, latino, gay, trans, etc in this and the phrase would be clearly seen, rightfully, as a dismissal of very real issues those people face.

But with Jews, it seemingly gets a pass.

Im talking about Bibi and his hawkish coalition. Any criticism of Israel is taken as criticism of The Jewish People. I'm pretty sure the UN was called anti semetic for asking Israel to respect the 67 borders at one point. We need to seperate the Jewish identity from the Israeli neocon, hawkish politics.

 

[Emarv]

(Copying from the OT, just in case some of you don't venture over there..)

The title of this article might make you think it's negative, but trust me on this: it's a damn nice peek at Hillary.

It's a long one, so settle in.

NYMag: Hillary Clinton’s Campaign Was Never Going to Be Easy. But Did It Have to Get This Hard?

In better news, Hilary wants Texas! Come down and visit, girl.

“Texas!” she exclaimed, eyes wide, as if daring me to question this, which I did. “You are not going to win Texas,” I said. She smiled, undaunted. “If black and Latino voters come out and vote, we could win Texas,” she told me firmly, practically licking her lips.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Im talking about Bibi and his hawkish coalition. Any criticism of Israel is taken as criticism of The Jewish People. I'm pretty sure the UN was called anti semetic for asking Israel to respect the 67 borders at one point. We need to seperate the Jewish identity from the Israeli neocon, hawkish politics.

And some of those calls are legit even when they come from horrible people. Some are bogus too! If we're not to be as bad as Bibi and Hamas in their black and white thinking we need to be able to dig deeper and discuss things beyond who they come from.

And to the bold. I don't attach my identity to bibi. But I reject any outside force trying to police any jewish persons identity in regards to their attachment to Israel. That's for them and for the Jewish people collectively to decide.

 

[HUELEN10]

And some of those calls are legit even when they come from horrible people. Some are bogus too! If we're not to be as bad as Bibi and Hamas in their black and white thinking we need to be able to dig deeper and discuss things beyond who they come from.

And to the bold. I don't attach my identity to bibi. But I reject any outside force trying to police any jewish persons identity in regards to their attachment to Israel that's for them and for the Jewish people collectively to decide.

Thank you for saying this.

 

[Spoiled Milk]

This isn't something someone "explains"

This is probably one of the best on the internet.

Anyone is going to be subject to criticism from either side though.

http://www.vox.com/2016/1/20/10775868/israeli-palestinian-conflict-explained

Great video, but I still don't know why Palestinians can't vote in Israeli elections. And I just looked it up and Palestinians living in the West Bank or Gaza strip can't vote. Even after watching that video, I'm confused: if Israel insists there is only one state (with regions of limited self governance), why can't the Palestinians vote?

I mean thats the conflict right there to put it tersely. Giving the Palestinians a vote would mean they will lose the Jewish majority in the parliament. You want to know Israel's end goal here? The goal is to maintain status quo. Boogeymans the Hamas. Exercise military options to garner support and polarize the hawks. Keep occupying territories thats outside the 67 borders. Keep demolishing Arab farms, houses and businesses and parachute settlers there. Play the anti semite card at every turn.

Well. Hamas is a real Bogeyman because they're a bonafied terrorist organization. But sure, I understand maintaining an apartheid to secure Jewish majority in government.

 

[Poodlestrike]

Im talking about Bibi and his hawkish coalition. Any criticism of Israel is taken as criticism of The Jewish People. I'm pretty sure the UN was called anti semetic for asking Israel to respect the 67 borders at one point. We need to seperate the Jewish identity from the Israeli neocon, hawkish politics.

First of all, who's "we?" Bibi and co want to invoke anti-Semitism as a defense, that's annoying, but it's not something you get to dictate as acceptable or unacceptable.

Second of all, who the hell are you to claim that the Jewish identity is tied to Israeli neocons now? I know plenty of Jews who don't support Bibi. Yeah, people defend Israel; sometimes, they are treated unfairly, and sometimes they are subjected to anti-Semitic attacks. But that doesn't mean we're somehow in lockstep.

 

[User 463088]

There should seriously be rules against doctors making you wait for an appointment in the waiting room for 30+ minutes after your scheduled time. I can see now why people with jobs don't go to the doctor. It can be an all morning/all afternoon affair.

This is the one thing I love about my Doctor. I can be in and out in less than 20 minutes total. I've never, ever waited longer than 5 minutes in his office. Like, they're on the damn ball .It's insane.

 

[Gotchaye]

The ADL is supported almost universally by every jewish person I know. And its mission statement is exactly what they do. They are not AIPAC.

Look at their news room, its dominated by progressive causes, not "palestinians aren't people"

I'm literally shocked that someone would say opposed the ADL because they hold different views on Israel, as if the issue is black and white all around.

And again comparing them to those hate groups. I'm not sure you realize it but as a Jew these posts are deeply disturbing for what they represent, especially with the rise of Trump. I posted a few weeks ago about a visceral antisemitic incident. We need the ADL. And what I'm hearing is "well whatever forget that and all their work, they don't back Palestine 100% and oppose Israel so they need to go"

I like the ADL; I think mostly they do lots of good in the US. Also Jewish, by the way. But, look, clearly they're pretty concerned with advocacy for Israel above and beyond advocacy against antisemitism - this is how the ADL itself understands what it's doing. I see two links on your page about that. If I click on "Israel and International" I get links about how Iran is very scary and about how BDS is wrong. If I go to their Campus Affairs page I get links to guides for effectively advocating for Israel on campus. Various explainers and fact sheets they've got scattered around go well out of their way to defend Israeli policy.

Again, I think there's a pretty big distinction between "they don't back Palestine 100% and oppose Israel" and "they back Israel 100%". Like, I have a lower opinion of them after going through their website for a bit than I had before - they're clearly concerned with pro-Israel advocacy to the detriment of their actual mission, and it doesn't seem at all crazy to me that people who are pretty invested in pro-Palestinian groups would find working with them really distasteful.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Great video, but I still don't know why Palestinians can't vote in Israeli elections. And I just looked it up and Palestinians living in the West Bank or Gaza strip can't vote. Even after watching that video, I'm confused: if Israel insists there is only one state (with regions of limited self governance), why can't the Palestinians vote?

Because it doesn't insist there is only one state. Palestine is under military occupation.

 

[RustyNails]

And some of those calls are legit even when they come from horrible people. Some are bogus too! If we're not to be as bad as Bibi and Hamas in their black and white thinking we need to be able to dig deeper and discuss things beyond who they come from.

And to the bold. I don't attach my identity to bibi. But I reject any outside force trying to police any jewish persons identity in regards to their attachment to Israel. That's for them and for the Jewish people collectively to decide.

Well if you're going to attach Jewish identity to Bibi's politics, then thats legitimizing the anti semitism card draw every time someone criticizes. Its a closed loop. I want to criticize Bibi and Lieberman but not be labeled as ISRAEL HATER or someone who hates the Jewish people. For that there has to be an external standard of whats acceptable criticism and what isnt.

 

[ugaboga232]

RE: doctors making you wait, outside of shitty doctors, doctors have a lot of documentation/note writing to do and no where near enough time for the patients. Blame AMA for capping residency slots/and our shitty health insurance system.

 

[Nazgul_Hunter]

This answer really got my goat

Wtf? Asking specifics is unfair because nobody in history has done it?

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I like the ADL; I think mostly they do lots of good in the US. Also Jewish, by the way. But, look, clearly they're pretty concerned with advocacy for Israel above and beyond advocacy against antisemitism - this is how the ADL itself understands what it's doing. I see two links on your page about that. If I click on "Israel and International" I get links about how Iran is very scary and about how BDS is wrong. If I go to their Campus Affairs page I get links to guides for effectively advocating for Israel on campus. Various explainers and fact sheets they've got scattered around go well out of their way to defend Israeli policy.

Again, I think there's a pretty big distinction between "they don't back Palestine 100% and oppose Israel" and "they back Israel 100%". Like, I have a lower opinion of them after going through their website for a bit than I had before - they're clearly concerned with pro-Israel advocacy to the detriment of their actual mission, and it doesn't seem at all crazy to me that people who are pretty invested in pro-Palestinian groups would find working with them really distasteful.

I mean I see here that "I went to find things on their website that confirm my statement." I mean Israel and International is one of 5 sections on the web and Israel isn't the numerical majority of their recent press releases. And I think your statement about them being more concerned with israel than other things is flatly wrong (even beyond the trouble with distinguishing them)

And of course the organization tasked with defending jews is going to defend half the worlds jews (and criticizing some of them for violating civil rights!). Again this isn't AIPAC or Pam Geller.

I think opposing BDS and advocating against some of the horrible anti-israeli lies is an honorable cause while at the same time I think opposing bibi is a necessary thing for Israelis and Jews to do as well (to a certain extent as I oppose his government and policies not the office of PM).

Again your kind of confirming the point I raised. If we're going to have every deviation from some every changing "progressive slate" be how we cast off supporters we're in for a lot of trouble as a progressive movement.

 

[RustyNails]

First of all, who's "we?" Bibi and co want to invoke anti-Semitism as a defense, that's annoying, but it's not something you get to dictate as acceptable or unacceptable.

Second of all, who the hell are you to claim that the Jewish identity is tied to Israeli neocons now? I know plenty of Jews who don't support Bibi. Yeah, people defend Israel; sometimes, they are treated unfairly, and sometimes they are subjected to anti-Semitic attacks. But that doesn't mean we're somehow in lockstep.

Lets not play semantics games regarding we, you, I, etc. If I dont get to call Bibi's bullshit regarding his antisemetic card he plays, you're advocating for a chilling effect. It IS unacceptable. You dont think its unacceptable? I'm surprised at this kind of thinking.

Jewish Identity is not in lockstep with Bibi's politics. I'm just saying we should not see it in lockstep! You need to calm down. I understand its a passionate topic. But we are all on the same side: safety for Israel, muzzling of Hamas and equal rights for Palestinians. I believe we need to be dispassionate when discussing this topic otherwise we'll go nowhere. I admit I'm just a lowly poster on neogaf.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

It's time to Make Britain Great Again.

Never have so many risked so much for so little.

I'm talking, of course, about Britain's upcoming vote on whether to leave the European Union. So-called "Brexit" — get it, as in British exit? — would be the economic equivalent of quitting your job because you think you can get it back minus all the parts you don't like. In other words, a fantasy. But, with apologies to Harry Potter, it might be Britain's most popular one to the point that there's a real, albeit slight, chance it could prevail in the June 23 poll. In which case, to extend this metaphor, Britain would be left out of work and out of friends. Indeed, Britain's Treasury estimates it could send them into a recession costing as many as 500,000 to 800,000 jobs.

What in the name of rational self-maximizers is going on? The same thing that's happening everywhere else. Right-wing populists are trying to make their country great again by, you guessed it, keeping immigrants out and negotiating great, and I mean great, deals. In Britain's case, the U.K. Independence Party (UKIP) wants to leave the 28-nation free trade zone that is the EU in hopes of coming to terms on a new free trade pact with the now-27-nation EU that wouldn't require them to follow Brussels' diktats on, say, how strong vacuum cleaners are allowed to be, or, more saliently, how many immigrants they have to accept from the rest of Europe.

It almost sounds reasonable. Until, that is, you actually think about it. UKIP is asking for all of the benefits of EU membership without any of what it thinks are the costs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...the-rise-of-far-right-politicians-everywhere/

 

[Cesare Borgia]

This answer really got my goat

Wtf? Asking specifics is unfair because nobody in history has done it?

I suppose he means that he's not going to do it alone because political revolution, but even that is vague. If he can't even spark a political revolution to even come close to beating Hillary Clinton, how does he spark one in say...May 2017 to force Paul Ryan to say "you know what, all these kids from Wisconsin keep calling my office, I guess I have to raise taxes now."

 

[Sirpopopop]

I know talking about crazy Facebook comments is old hat here.

However, I recently compared Donald Trump to Andrew Jackson. Apparently the Berniebros took it as me saying that Donald is a man of even and fine temper and someone who will make a great President. And that I was also insulting Bernie Sanders.

I mean, I just can't...

How do you combat this? Just how?

 

[B-Dubs]

I know talking about crazy Facebook comments is old hat here.

However, I recently compared Donald Trump to Andrew Jackson. Apparently the Berniebros took it as me saying that Donald is a man of even and fine temper and someone who will make a great President. And that I was also insulting Bernie Sanders.

I mean, I just can't...

How do you combat this? Just how?

Seriously, did NO ONE pay attention in their high school American History classes?

 

[Tarydax]

Now, is it easy to do? No. How do you do it? It's a good question. And the truth is, right now I'm a bit busy running for president to have figured that out, other than to tell you that it requires a mass-based political effort bringing millions of people together to stand up and fight back. Unions could play an important role.

Oh my god.

 

[Poodlestrike]

Lets not play semantics games regarding we, you, I, etc. If I dont get to call Bibi's bullshit regarding his antisemetic card he plays, you're advocating for a chilling effect. It IS unacceptable. You dont think its unacceptable? I'm surprised at this kind of thinking.

Jewish Identity is not in lockstep with Bibi's politics. I'm just saying we should not see it in lockstep! You need to calm down. I understand its a passionate topic. But we are all on the same side: safety for Israel, muzzling of Hamas and equal rights for Palestinians. I believe we need to be dispassionate when discussing this topic otherwise we'll go nowhere. I admit I'm just a lowly poster on neogaf.

Yeah, sorry, it's just kind of a sore subject. I agree that Bibi and co. hide behind the anti-Semitism defense too much, just like I think that a lot of anti-Semites hide behind anti-Israel causes. It's a hideously complex situation, and I don't think boiling it down to "Israel bad, Palestine good" helps anything, which is (to loop things back around to how this discussion got started) what people are doing when they throw the ADL to the curb because they advocate for Israel.

 

[RustyNails]

Can we make a thread about Bernie RS interview? Its gone too far now and he's a dead horse, but he still doesnt have specifics.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Hmm, going to see if we can try this in Doug Owens' campaign.

http://www.vox.com/2016/5/30/11764840/voter-turnout-demobilization-experiment

Telling people in "large families" that they're bigots stops them from going to the polls.

The fact that a large effect only shows up in large families seems really fishy, but Utah is probably the best place to try this.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Well if you're going to attach Jewish identity to Bibi's politics, then thats legitimizing the anti semitism card draw every time someone criticizes. Its a closed loop. I want to criticize Bibi and Lieberman but not be labeled as ISRAEL HATER or someone who hates the Jewish people. For that there has to be an external standard of whats acceptable criticism and what isnt.

I never said attach them to bibi's policies. And again I'm not going to litigate what their attached to because like I said, that's their and their choice alone.

To the bolded this is a mirror to a lot of people who issue criticisms and when challenged are more concerned with the label of islamophobe/racist/sexist/antisemitism than actually trying to figure out that more why you were called that. If your critcism are valid and not antisemetic then you have nothing to worry about.

We don't have a "external standard" for debates about race, gender, sexual attraction. They've always been self policed (and have changed over time)

Listen, the left gets called the real racists/sexist/homophobes by the right all the time. We rightly dismiss these spurious charges. One can do the same for spurious charges of antisemitism. I think most people, or at least honest people, realize any specific criticism of military action, occupation and settlement are usually valid. But they often times seep into wider criticisms, like criticisms of gaza turning into charges of genocide and targeting children (blood libel). Its a tough thing to actually call. But "you know it when you see it" is generally a good definition

Me, poodle, chechov (I know I'm spelling this name wrong but I'm too lazy to look it up) and many other jews and non jews here have debated these issues without charges of antisemitism (though sometimes there are because there never will be a firm definition).

 

[Crayons]

I am so sick of hearing about Bernie

 

[User 463088]

Oh my god.

He's too busy running for President to release his taxes, to understand how his policies could be implemented, to actually vote in the Senate....he's so busy. Good thing he can get some rest in about 7 days. Nice cup of tea. Maybe a book.

 

[AndyD]

This answer really got my goat

GIANT PICTURE

Wtf? Asking specifics is unfair because nobody in history has done it?

Have mods addressed the recent trend of posting screenshots of text instead of text? It's quite annoying, especially on mobile with images off.

 

[bananas]

In better news, Hilary wants Texas! Come down and visit, girl.

“Texas!” she exclaimed, eyes wide, as if daring me to question this, which I did. “You are not going to win Texas,” I said. She smiled, undaunted. “If black and Latino voters come out and vote, we could win Texas,” she told me firmly, practically licking her lips.

My pants just got tighter.

 

[AndyD]

I never said attach them to bibi's policies. And again I'm not going to litigate what their attached to because like I said, that's their and their choice alone.

To the bolded this is a mirror to a lot of people who issue criticisms and when challenged are more concerned with the label of islamophobe/racist/sexist/antisemitism than actually trying to figure out that more why you were called that. If your critcism are valid and not antisemetic then you have nothing to worry about.

We don't have a "external standard" for debates about race, gender, sexual attraction. They've always been self policed (and have changed over time)

Listen, the left gets called the real racists/sexist/homophobes by the right all the time. We rightly dismiss these spurious charges. One can do the same for spurious charges of antisemitism.

Me, poodle, chechov (I know I'm spelling this name wrong but I'm too lazy to look it up) and many other jews and non jews here have debated these issues without charges of antisemitism (though sometimes there are because there never will be a firm definition).

I think he means in the public at large. Sure you can have a reasoned debate with 1-2 occasional people, but at large it's impossible.

 

[Iolo]

Have mods addressed the recent trend of posting screenshots of text instead of text? It's quite annoying, especially on mobile with images off.

You'll have to get Twitter to up their character limit first.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I think he means in the public at large. Sure you can have a reasoned debate with 1-2 occasional people, but at large it's impossible.

This is true of everything.

 

[benicillin]

Can we make a thread about Bernie RS interview? Its gone too far now and he's a dead horse, but he still doesnt have specifics.

Bernie is old news. Anything about his campaign until he drops and endorses Clinton isn't worth posting about IMO, because it's just going to turn into the same conversation every time.

 

[Gotchaye]

I mean I see here that "I went to find things on their website that confirm my statement." I mean Israel and International is one of 5 sections on the web and Israel isn't the numerical majority of their recent press releases. And I think your statement about them being more concerned with israel than other things is flatly wrong (even beyond the trouble with distinguishing them)

And of course the organization tasked with defending jews is going to defend half the worlds jews (and criticizing some of them for violating civil rights!). Again this isn't AIPAC or Pam Geller.

I think opposing BDS and advocating against some of the horrible anti-israeli lies is an honorable cause while at the same time I think opposing bibi is a necessary thing for Israelis and Jews to do as well (to a certain extent as I oppose his government and policies not the office of PM).

Again your kind of confirming the point I raised. If we're going to have every deviation from some every changing "progressive slate" be how we cast off supporters we're in for a lot of trouble as a progressive movement.

I didn't say they were more concerned with Israel than anything else. To be clear, I was using "above and beyond" to mean that they were concerned with pro-Israel advocacy that is not just opposition to antisemitic anti-Israel attitudes. This is clearly how they understand what they're doing - this isn't just a disagreement about when criticism of Israel becomes antisemitism.

Ultimately I don't really know how lots of people end up interacting with the ADL. The NPR story that kicked this off suggested that until very recently it had been focused on antisemitism - the story is about how its new president wants to get back to doing work for a wide variety of causes. So mostly I expect that many activists' experience with the ADL has been restricted to fighting about Israel/Palestine, where the ADL clearly is much more concerned with advocating for Israel than with worrying about Palestinians.

 

[The Lamonster]

Do you guys think Obama is going to start campaigning for Clinton after next week's primaries, regardless of whether Sanders chooses to stay in the race?

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Do you guys think Obama is going to start campaigning for Clinton after next week's primaries, regardless of whether Sanders chooses to stay in the race?

No. That doesn't feel like Obama's way.

 

[Emarv]

Do you guys think Obama is going to start campaigning for Clinton after next week's primaries, regardless of whether Sanders chooses to stay in the race?

I think he'll wait until the convention.

 

[Spoiled Milk]

Because then they'd run the show since I'm pretty sure there's more of them. A two state solution is the only one that's going to work, Bibi needs to dig his head out of his ass and admit this to himself.

No. That's wrong. It would be close but it would still be Jewish majority.

Do you guys think Obama is going to start campaigning for Clinton after next week's primaries, regardless of whether Sanders chooses to stay in the race?

He's already been privately telling donors to coalesce around Clinton. I don't know if he'll do it publicly, though.

 

[nature boy]

Clinton interview with Chris Hayes at 4.00pm

 

[Wallach]

Do you guys think Obama is going to start campaigning for Clinton after next week's primaries, regardless of whether Sanders chooses to stay in the race?

He'll definitely throw some weight around publicly. I dunno about actively campaigning until after the convention, I think that might depend on how bad Sanders catches foot in ass on the 7th.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Clinton interview with Chris Hayes at 4.00pm

Same on CNN.

 

[Holmes]

I think Obama will invite both Clinton and Sanders to the White House within a week after the 7th and they'll discuss the convention and the fall campaign.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Oh man I really want Hillary to invest in Texas (I mean, you know, as long as 270 is pretty clear).

Even just losing it by under 5 points would be pretty remarkable.

Texas Democrats almost tied the State House in 2008 (74-76) when Obama was losing by double digits.

 

[whyamihere]

Oh my god they're so bad at this

https://twitter.com/samsteinhp/status/737694174103867394

@samsteinhp
This from @rick_wiley is just wrong. Romney still woulda lost even if he won OH, VA, FL http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...irector-says-he-still-sees-republican-winning