-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2016 |OT6| Delete your accounts
- Thread starter Spoiled Milk
- Start date
- Status
You really think he will concede in front of a rally audience?
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I'm just glad that Trump is such a shitty candidate, that if it comes down to it they can say fuck off and just freeze Sanders out completely.
If he seriously takes the campaign to DC, that's what they should do.
I wonder what the party can do to prevent pompous asses like Sanders from doing that shit?
Box of Kittens
Banned
I go back and forth on my least favorite aspect of the Sanders campaign, but the way it has encouraged people to lose faith in the legitimacy of our democracy.
I know the issues with understanding how provisional ballots work didn't start with this year or with this campaign, but it's part of a larger problem. I've seen several posts on my Facebook feed this night that seek, in one way or another, to delegitimize Hillary Clinton's nomination, which is really frustrating to read.
excelsiorlef
Member
Like I said over there, the difference between how her people cheered mentions of Sanders and his people booed mentions of Clinton just says it all.
shinra-bansho
Member
My thinking is he does it after DC. But who knows with bitter Bernie.
Doubt it will be at a rally. Most likely a press release. His crowd will eat him alive if he concedes.
Box of Kittens
Banned
I expect it won't be that different from his standard stump. Honestly, when does he ever deviate much from it? To the extent that there will be any sort of endorsement of Clinton, it will be more anti-Trump than pro-Clinton.
Black Mamba
Member
Okay, after more thought I'm back on the "he'll concede soon" train. Just let my emotional reaction to him not conceding get the better of me for a moment.
We have these pros to look at from his speech.
1. Was very late, less viewers.
2. Was short, very unlike Bernie
3. Congratulated Hillary, no Hillary attacks
4. Lots of Trump attacks.
5. Mostly spoke in past tense in the first half.
Furthermore, he's meeting Obama on Thursday. He's also going to lose his legislative support as the superdelegates leave him (they already said they would). All the supers will be in hillary's corner, for the most part.
The media will laugh at him for being a sore loser and ignore him as an actual competitor going forward.
He's losing most of his staff and is out of money to do anything of importance.
He'll probably concede on Tuesday night or Wednesday next week.
I think he made a mistake in his speech. If his goal is to let everyone vote, including DC which is fine, he doesn't have to fully concede. He could have done this.
"Yes, it looks dire going forward. Secretary Clinton has amassed the majority of pledged delegates and currently has crossed the threshold should the super delegates not change their mind. And make no mistake, Secretary Clinton securing the nomination would be a glass ceiling moment in our politics, one that I would be proud to have been a part of. But I will not give up until every vote in this election has been counted. It would be a disservice to the hard working people in DC to bow out before their voices are heard and once all the votes are counted and all the voices are heard, then we will decide how to proceed!"
Something along those lines.
There is a part of me that does fear that Sanders is a curmudgeon and will be guided by his emotions rather than his brain. I highly doubt he takes this to the convention, he'd be such a fucking moron to do so, but there is still a possibility.
We have these pros to look at from his speech.
1. Was very late, less viewers.
2. Was short, very unlike Bernie
3. Congratulated Hillary, no Hillary attacks
4. Lots of Trump attacks.
5. Mostly spoke in past tense in the first half.
Furthermore, he's meeting Obama on Thursday. He's also going to lose his legislative support as the superdelegates leave him (they already said they would). All the supers will be in hillary's corner, for the most part.
The media will laugh at him for being a sore loser and ignore him as an actual competitor going forward.
He's losing most of his staff and is out of money to do anything of importance.
He'll probably concede on Tuesday night or Wednesday next week.
I think he made a mistake in his speech. If his goal is to let everyone vote, including DC which is fine, he doesn't have to fully concede. He could have done this.
"Yes, it looks dire going forward. Secretary Clinton has amassed the majority of pledged delegates and currently has crossed the threshold should the super delegates not change their mind. And make no mistake, Secretary Clinton securing the nomination would be a glass ceiling moment in our politics, one that I would be proud to have been a part of. But I will not give up until every vote in this election has been counted. It would be a disservice to the hard working people in DC to bow out before their voices are heard and once all the votes are counted and all the voices are heard, then we will decide how to proceed!"
Something along those lines.
There is a part of me that does fear that Sanders is a curmudgeon and will be guided by his emotions rather than his brain. I highly doubt he takes this to the convention, he'd be such a fucking moron to do so, but there is still a possibility.
I think people are getting a little het up. Bernie wasn't going to drop today. Why would he? They've already announced he's going to the White House Thursday at his request. Everything's all set up for him to meet with Obama and then drop out.
There's no real chance Bernie's going to the convention. Pro tip, when they fire all the staffers and take the embargo off the Politico postmortem hit piece it's kind of a secret signal that the campaign is over. (And I agree that, just like every single Politico postmortem hit piece, when Devine and Weaver say that Devine and Weaver were blameless and it was all the candidate's fault you have to consider the source a little. The whole point of going on record for that piece is to cover your ass and explain how you're still a good campaign manager, you just had a bad candidate.)
Frankly I doubt Bernie will make it to DC. Not only is it literally the worst demographics in the entire country for him but he'll be going there after Obama has already endorsed Hillary Clinton. He'd lose worse there than he has anywhere else. Why go out on a bad note?
It's over, guys. Our long national nightmare is finally over.
There's no real chance Bernie's going to the convention. Pro tip, when they fire all the staffers and take the embargo off the Politico postmortem hit piece it's kind of a secret signal that the campaign is over. (And I agree that, just like every single Politico postmortem hit piece, when Devine and Weaver say that Devine and Weaver were blameless and it was all the candidate's fault you have to consider the source a little. The whole point of going on record for that piece is to cover your ass and explain how you're still a good campaign manager, you just had a bad candidate.)
Frankly I doubt Bernie will make it to DC. Not only is it literally the worst demographics in the entire country for him but he'll be going there after Obama has already endorsed Hillary Clinton. He'd lose worse there than he has anywhere else. Why go out on a bad note?
It's over, guys. Our long national nightmare is finally over.
shinra-bansho
Member
Concession via press release would be such a pathetic move.
Although it doesn't actually seem implausible.
Although it doesn't actually seem implausible.
I think he'll give a speech with Obama nearby after their meeting. Probably not the Rose Garden.
Box of Kittens
Banned
Rule #1 of actually being able to occasionally get something out of Politico is never take the article completely at face value. Always look for who is trying to convey a message and what their agenda might be.
Black Mamba
Member
Yeah, this is what I'm in agreement with.
He still might go to DC just to let everyone count.
I guess...I'm just a bit confused as to why his speech took that turn at the end. It could have been so much better.
As I've said for months, my one worry with Sanders is what he's going to do to a generation of potential voters going forward. I don't want them so alienated they avoid the political process altogether.
I am glad you wrote this post because I'm a few beers in tonight and it was coming out far less articulate.
I think that Politico piece is Devine, by the way. Not Weaver. Weaver seems like he lives to blow smoke up Sanders' ass.
Still don't think he makes it to D.C., I originally guessed Wednesday but it may be a couple days later.
I'm just having a hard time seeing him handling his crowd at this point. During that speech any mention of Hillary is going to be met with boos, and he has so far shown an unwillingness/inability to be able to handle his crowds. The optics of having the crowd constantly boo Hillary while giving a concession speech will be awful. That's why I think it's going to be through a press release. His fan base at those rallies is pretty rabid. Lots of vocal hard core Bernie bros who hate the establishment, and he has been feeding them this entire time. Hard for me to see him doing anything, but a press release after tonights speech. His crowd will eat him alive during a concession speech.
User 463088
Banned
I don't necessarily disagree with you pigeon, but Obama better not appear with him publicly before he meets with Hillary. That shit would be completely disrespectful.
This is exactly right. I was alluding to this when I called Politico the official unofficial GOP mouthpiece -- Politico isn't really a journalism producer, it's a leak distributor. If you're in DC and you need to leak something, meet with Politico and they'll ghostwrite an article to your specifications. It's pretty clear from reading their pieces over time.
I will say it's actually pretty poor form of them to put out the postmortem literally before Bernie's speech. Usually you let them bury the corpse a little. Another reason the campaign pretty much has to be over is, how exactly does Bernie work with Weaver, Devine, or (rapid response director) Casca now that they're on record as thinking Bernie is a crazy person? If the article's even a little bit true he's not going to be super happy about it. Things literally can't just keep going as normal now.
Politics is a hell of a drug.
There's a leaked email chain between Weaver and Casca in which Casca is excoriating the campaign for fucking up in Nevada. Unless they're so irresponsible as to cc a bunch of people in that thread (which would actually surprise me, like, there's a limit to dumbness), that leak came from Weaver or Casca. (Vox pointed this out, so don't give me credit for it.)
I wouldn't even worry about it. People change as they get older. The big issue is getting people to vote on non presidential race years. Democrats just need to keep building on the Obama coalition, and they are going to be fine.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
I finally read up on the Honduras stuff.
-Economically left guy is president of Honduras.
-He's kind of Putin-esque though in terms of murdering journalists and wanting to extend his rule indefinitely.
-Conservative Party in Honduras sees an opportunity with this lefty president trying to alter constitution to extend his reign and a military coup occurs.
-The U.S. (along with everyone else in the world) condemns the coup but eventually works with the Honduras government to have new elections where the lefty president isn't up for election instead of restoring the former president to power like some wanted.
And that's the thing.
Okay, this is as dumb as I thought it was going to be.
-Economically left guy is president of Honduras.
-He's kind of Putin-esque though in terms of murdering journalists and wanting to extend his rule indefinitely.
-Conservative Party in Honduras sees an opportunity with this lefty president trying to alter constitution to extend his reign and a military coup occurs.
-The U.S. (along with everyone else in the world) condemns the coup but eventually works with the Honduras government to have new elections where the lefty president isn't up for election instead of restoring the former president to power like some wanted.
And that's the thing.
Okay, this is as dumb as I thought it was going to be.
Officerrob
Banned
I think he's out Friday or Saturday. Staying in until "the last vote is cast" is nice in theory and all, but he's going to be absolutely destroyed in DC
RastaMentality
Banned
How do you check online if your vote counted?
I don't know. I know he wasn't going to concede today, but I expected more. When the the crowd boo's your opponent when you mention she did something any rational adult would do, and you say and make no action regarding their booing, it just invalidates anything you were trying to accomplish.
I assume that Bernie knows he is done. You have to be a fucking moron or close minded to not see that. A lot of his speech was geared in a pastish tense kind of way. But then he talks about fighting on to the DC primary and doesn't defend the only person capable of defeating the doucher he was just dissing? Come on.
Seriously, fuck Bernie.
I assume that Bernie knows he is done. You have to be a fucking moron or close minded to not see that. A lot of his speech was geared in a pastish tense kind of way. But then he talks about fighting on to the DC primary and doesn't defend the only person capable of defeating the doucher he was just dissing? Come on.
Seriously, fuck Bernie.
I don't know that I believe all the craziness in that article, but I definitely believe that Bernie is high on having huge cheering crowds dote on his every word.
And, I mean, in fairness, I might be too. That's a lot of adulation to handle.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
The heat coming off this take killed the dinosaurs.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1229715
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1229715
http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/ballot-status
I guess I was wrong about being able to check online everywhere. You have to call a number in a lot of places.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Bernie could at least throw DC a bone and say hes going to compete there because he wants to support their statehood movement.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
California - http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/ballot-status/
nvm beaten. i take too long to read apparently
excelsiorlef
Member
As a post mortem I want to say this:
In this entire bullshit debacle mess of a primary not once did Clinton ever attack, critcize or diminish anyone who came out in support of Sanders, not once did she go after anyone who endorsed him.
Sanders? I don't think there was one endorsement of Clinton that he didn't turn around and attack the organization for.
PP, Emily's List, that AIDS group (which didn't even endorse Clinton), HRC, the list goes on. He could not respect that anyone wouldn't endorse him, or would prefer Clinton and so if they endorsed Clinton well fuck them they're the enemy.
It is toxic shameful behaviour. I am glad he's about done and may he never get a spotlight this again. He's created a horrificly agressive angry group of young people, who are convinced that the first woman nominee for President has stolen the election and silenced their vote, he has created a group of bitter cynical people who will likely disengage from politics when he's gone. I care about progressive politics both in the States and here in Canada, and I don't want progressivism to be represented /actively damaged by an idealogue who can't answer questions, has no plans, has few details. It's not good enough to have ideas, you have to have a means to enact them and Sanders does not and cannot and if he was allowed to try I firmly believe he'd hurt the cause more than help.
So long Senator Sanders, please do the right thing and not fuck this up for Clinton and the future of the Democratic party.
In this entire bullshit debacle mess of a primary not once did Clinton ever attack, critcize or diminish anyone who came out in support of Sanders, not once did she go after anyone who endorsed him.
Sanders? I don't think there was one endorsement of Clinton that he didn't turn around and attack the organization for.
PP, Emily's List, that AIDS group (which didn't even endorse Clinton), HRC, the list goes on. He could not respect that anyone wouldn't endorse him, or would prefer Clinton and so if they endorsed Clinton well fuck them they're the enemy.
It is toxic shameful behaviour. I am glad he's about done and may he never get a spotlight this again. He's created a horrificly agressive angry group of young people, who are convinced that the first woman nominee for President has stolen the election and silenced their vote, he has created a group of bitter cynical people who will likely disengage from politics when he's gone. I care about progressive politics both in the States and here in Canada, and I don't want progressivism to be represented /actively damaged by an idealogue who can't answer questions, has no plans, has few details. It's not good enough to have ideas, you have to have a means to enact them and Sanders does not and cannot and if he was allowed to try I firmly believe he'd hurt the cause more than help.
So long Senator Sanders, please do the right thing and not fuck this up for Clinton and the future of the Democratic party.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
It's winding down. He could have come out and attacked Clinton. He didn't. He'll go to DC and lose bad on Tuesday. And a couple days later he'll probably concede. I thought he'd go to the convention but now? Nah.
And_Gignac
Member
It is not unusual for left wing populists to become messianic due to the adulation they receive from their hopeless supporters.
It is also not unusual for lefty leaders who envelope themselves in higher moral values to be resentful, distrustful and slightly authoritarian.
I dont know if such is the current state of Bernard Sanders. I am gonna say no, for the moment.
It is also not unusual for lefty leaders who envelope themselves in higher moral values to be resentful, distrustful and slightly authoritarian.
I dont know if such is the current state of Bernard Sanders. I am gonna say no, for the moment.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
and all of the states he didnt win "we're not in the south anymore"
that was the beginning of the downturn in my opinion of him. it cemented with the planned parenthood and the AIDS activist thing.
User 463088
Banned
Hell, not only are they maybe in the south now, New Jersey, New Mexico and South Dakota don't exist in Bernieland. Not a SINGLE mention of them. Madness.
excelsiorlef
Member
Started with his response to the data theft for me that's when I went hmmm this guy, and then with PP I was like oh fuck no. That was it for me. That and talking to a lot of people here and starting to see that I too had bought into the 25 years of Clinton bullshit, I started to listen to her and see how charming she actually is, she's just awkward and more of an intellectual than a social person.
This is like the third "violence directed towards Trump" thread in a week, not sure why this is the one blowing up.
All it really means is that e-mail chain got outside of Weaver and Casca. If Casca was really that frustrated he could have sent it on in an attempt to reach someone else in the campaign. Article way too eager to paint Devine in a decent light, though.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
the disparaging of voters is what ticks me off the most, personally. just showing respect to people for turning out is the bare fucking minimum i expect out of a person who makes their living being a politician
like, fuck you, you serve us, we don't serve you.
i was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt on the data thing, but not anymore. i was never exactly a proponent of the Dem party or the DNC
Black Mamba
Member
Feels like someone could call California already.
Hillary had a +400k vote lead after early votes.
She still has a +400k vote lead still now with over 50% in. The vote totals from today are basically 50/50 in many places or slight edge to Hillary.
I don't see how Sanders is going to win. LA County, which he's not winning, has barely reported any results. He's down 90k votes there with like 70% of the vote outstanding.
Double digit win looks like a real possibility. Maybe the AP and others just waiting for a big Los Angeles dump.
Hillary had a +400k vote lead after early votes.
She still has a +400k vote lead still now with over 50% in. The vote totals from today are basically 50/50 in many places or slight edge to Hillary.
I don't see how Sanders is going to win. LA County, which he's not winning, has barely reported any results. He's down 90k votes there with like 70% of the vote outstanding.
Double digit win looks like a real possibility. Maybe the AP and others just waiting for a big Los Angeles dump.
BlastProcessing
Member
It's why it's vitally important to surround yourself with a team of people that you can trust. Sander's campaign was run by mercenaries and cast offs from the Democrat island of misfit toys.
The one part of his speech that really bothered me was the Clinton line that got boos. You have to know that that is the response you will get when you mention Clinton. You have to be prepared to deal with that. Or you could just not give a damn I suppose. I think the point of this speech was to set himself up for negotiations. He is still trying to gain leverage. That's not beyond the pale, but I am not sure I can trust him to have the light touch necessary to not overplay his hand.
Feelsbadman
Yah know, for such a "grassroots" campaign, it's amazing how top-down, didactic, and dare I say, authoritarian the Sanders campaign turned out to be. I'm seriously wondering if his personality or his policies had a bigger role in triggering this or if they are, in fact, mutually exclusive. Whatever. In any case, his policies are fundamentally oppositional to how most of the Democratic party and it's allies operate. If he flipped out on Barney Frank, Planned Parenthood, and HIV researchers, I can only imagine what he would do if something as complex as a labor union defied him on, say, guns.
Yup, thank you, Pigeon. If a provisional ballot didn't count or was discarded, why would they give it to you in the first place? As an appointed election official (chief inspector), I can assure you that provisional ballots count, so long as you complete the necessary follow through before the deadline. Fucking hell.
Funny enough, you can make a legit argument that many labor unions are part of the establishment (not sarcastically using that phrase either).
excelsiorlef
Member
He was never grassroots beyond funding.
I've said it a million times, Clinton outgrassrooted Sanders by a fucking mile.
She didn't fly to The Vatican in the middle of an election. She didn't limit her major interactions with her supporters to mainly large masturbatory rallies, she was meeting one on one, meeting with community leaders, her boots were on the ground, so were Bill's. She ran an amazing ground campaign, she worked her fucking ass off and she gets no credit for her hard work because of her last name and who she is married too, shock surprise.
TheLaughingStock
Member
Can't do that when Trump discussed it earlier in the day.
Unless he wanted to say Trump isn't the answer so vote Hillary in the meantime.
Black Mamba
Member
Darrell Issa only winning his primary 52-44 so far. If that holds, there's a chance in the GE the same challenger can defeat him?
There are more Dems in a GE and if Trump is going to be slaughtered...
Oh god I'd love to remove Issa from the House.
There are more Dems in a GE and if Trump is going to be slaughtered...
Oh god I'd love to remove Issa from the House.
This was probably already posted and is hours old, but holy shit at this:
[QUOTE="@NoahCRothman]As of mid-May, the Trump campaign and outside groups had $2.7 million cash on hand. HRC and groups have $76.6 million cash on hand right now[/QUOTE]
https://twitter.com/NoahCRothman/status/740283562319073280
[QUOTE="@NoahCRothman]As of mid-May, the Trump campaign and outside groups had $2.7 million cash on hand. HRC and groups have $76.6 million cash on hand right now[/QUOTE]
https://twitter.com/NoahCRothman/status/740283562319073280
RustyNails
Member
I guess California is sending message that the country belongs to handful of billionaires. Great going, Cali.
I'm sure he was fine with the National Nurses Union, the New York Transit Union, et al. supporting him, not to mention he'd need a hella establishment of some kind of enact half of his proposals. Labor has been an important component of democratic socialism in many countries.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked