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PoliGAF 2016 |OT6| Delete your accounts

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M

metalslimer

Member
That's sort of why I think Perez is a fine choice. He doesn't take away any seats. I really don't think we should lose Warren for a VP slot even if we can keep the seat. The fact he can speak Spanish well is also a big plus
 
D

Drakeon

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
Becerra doesn't make sense to me. He's a representative from California. What is the benefit? If you're picking him because he's Hispanic I don't think that makes sense either. Maybe if Rubio was the GOP nominee and was magically winning a large % of Hispanics in polls I could semi understand it as a desperation pick.

But Hillary is going to win Hispanics heavily, and turnout will be high. If he was from Virginia or North Carolina? Sure I'd consider it. But I believe Hillary wants someone with executive experience.

Tim Kaine!
Click to expand...

I think Elizabeth Warren is the best pick at this point, because she's qualified, is a very effective attack dog (as we've seen) and excites the base. Tim Kaine only really checks the qualified box and I don't think he moves the needle much in VA.
 
A

avaya

Member
Black Mamba said:
I'm going to say something that might ruffle some feathers, here.


I don't think the VP matters much. As long as you don't nominate a Palin person, I don't think it moves the needle much. What did Ryan do in Wisconsin, again?

All you need is someone who is ready to take the job, can be an attack dog on the campaign trail, and not say really stupid shit. well..that's about it.

Too much hand-wringing over the VP. That's all just fun and games for media but mostly meaningless.
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I would agree but I think it's more about 2020 and the optics going into that.
 
T

thestopsign

Member
titiklabingapat said:
Susan Collins on MSNBC delicately navigating the question of 'will you vote for Clinton'. She is saying that she is unlikely to vote for Hillary but isn't ruling anything outm and trying to jump through hoops to make it look like she isn't shitting on Trump but isn't supporting his racists statements either. It really highlights how much of a pickle Trump puts downballot races because a great follow up question to something like that would be 'so you'll be voting for Trump, the racist, then?'. Too bad Todd pussied out.
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I've grown up with Susan Collins in Maine and always really admired her. She is a mildly sane R that has a lot of really good side projects that she works on.
 
F

Farmboy

Member
adam387 said:
Kaine is so freakin' borrrinnnngggg. Who does he excite? If Hillary is so contingent upon a 1-2 point boost in Virginia running against Trump, we're so screwed anyway.
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I don't disagree, but he's the embodiment of 'First, Do No Harm'. Which should be more than enough.

GOP veepstakes should be interesting just in terms of who at this point is willing to associate themselves with Trump. Christie, maybe Gingrich... probably few others.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
Farmboy said:
I don't disagree, but he's the embodiment of 'First, Do No Harm'. Which should be more than enough.

GOP veepstakes should be interesting just in terms of who at this point is willing to associate themselves with Trump. Christie, maybe Gingrich... probably few others.
Click to expand...

I just feel like we could push the envelope a little here...If we want someone for 2024, then Becerra is the choice. He's only 58. He'd be fine to run in '24. If we want to fix a weakness in Hillary, Warren is the choice. She's beloved by the far left. She's not an ideologue. She's close enough to Bernie without being in his orbit. She's qualified enough. She's a damn good attack dog.

Kaine has done nothing to show me he'd be a good attack dog. I'd think we'd see some trial balloons coming out somewhere if he was going to get the nod. We've seen Warren and Becerra attack Trump very well.

True, Kaine wouldn't do any harm...but I just don't think he helps enough.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
CkdCC7gW0AAYZdn.jpg
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Bernie giving a strong endorsement of Hillary would end all of the strife right now basically.

But Obama and Warren and Biden talking Hillary up could help a lot too.

CkdBxG3WsAA2hhK.jpg
Click to expand...
 
R

Roland_Gunner

Member
adam387 said:
Kaine is so freakin' borrrinnnngggg. Who does he excite? If Hillary is so contingent upon a 1-2 point boost in Virginia running against Trump, we're so screwed anyway.
Click to expand...

White Catholics? Not a huge demographic group like they were in the 80's but still a worth going after in the NE and Midwest. Kaine won't really help with Hispanics but having a candidate fluent in Spanish won't hurt and I'm not sure how much more a Tom Perez would do.
 
I

itschris

Member
Slate: Never Hillary

Among the dead-enders in Bernieworld, Sanders is still the next president and Clinton is a fate worse than Trump.

“Without all this rigging he would have won already,” said Heather Kim, a schoolteacher and member of a Koreans for Sanders California group. “We all know, she’s stolen the vote, her and the media,” Linda Bassett chimed in.

When confronted with the sheer unlikelihood of fraud being perpetrated on that scale and with the margin of victory, which had climbed to about 3.5 million votes by the end of the night, the women remained credulous. “I don’t put it past them,” Bassett said. “When it goes to be counted, they’ve got all those computerized machines. We know that there’s algorithms.” A third member of this crew—all in their late 50s or early 60s—concurred. “I was there in 2004 in Ohio, I know the shit they pull,” Margie Hoyt said, seeming to nod to accusations of vote machine tampering by Republicans during that election.

...

I heard this a lot among diehard Bernie supporters in the campaign’s last days: Donald Trump is a madman, a bigot, a lunatic who is not fit for the presidency, but he wouldn’t be as bad as Hillary Clinton. They also say they wouldn’t support her even if Sanders endorsed Clinton, which they don’t expect he’ll do because he’s a man of “authenticity.” (Maybe all the accusations of election theft, including implications from the candidate himself, play some role in this view.) “People will say ‘vote for Hillary to defeat Trump’ and to me they’re both trash,” Angel Villasenor, a 32-year-old Latino man who actually supported Clinton in the 2008 primary, told me as he entered the Sanders event. As for Trump: “I think he’s a terrible person, a terrible human being, I don’t support him at all,” he said. But he’s probably not that dangerous. “It has no legs, it’s just nonsense,” Villasenor said of Trump’s xenophobic anti-Mexican rhetoric and policy proposals. “He’s using that as a platform to get all those racist folks behind him.”

...

Trump clearly sees an opportunity in all this. “To all of those Bernie Sanders voters who have been left out in the cold by a rigged system of superdelegates," Trump said in his own speech Tuesday night, "We welcome you with open arms."

He was talking to people very much like Margie Hoyt, who fumes at the thought that she might be asked to cast a ballot for the former secretary of state. Bernie is “my vote and they’re not taking [it] from me in November,” she said. Hoyt then dropped into a whisper: “I will not vote for that bitch. She isn’t getting my vote for nothing.”
Click to expand...
 
K

kirblar

Member
From the ABC poll-
under-30s moved from 64-25 percent Clinton-Trump in March to 45-42 percent in May, suggesting resentment as Clinton’s moved ahead of their true love, Sanders.
Click to expand...
I really hope they just dumpster him after the election.
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
Excitement is overrated.

Anyway, somewhat breaking my own guidance, but Hillary Clinton history making nomination speech page 4 of OT. Top of page 1 Bernie Sanders same boring stump non-concession thread and Why is she a bad candidate.
 
E

eBay Huckster

Member
adam387 said:
Y'all are so mean to Sister Gabbard. We can't all be as ideologically pure and consistent as she has been. Sad.

Westboro is going to protest the GOP convention in Cleveland. Haven't we suffered enough!?
Click to expand...

Plot twist: we transfer the curse onto the GOP in July and the Indians immediately go on an insane run and win it all
 
U

User 463088

Banned
Roland_Gunner said:
White Catholics? Not a huge demographic group like they were in the 80's but still a worth going after in the NE and Midwest. Kaine won't really help with Hispanics but having a candidate fluent in Spanish won't hurt and I'm not sure how much more a Tom Perez would do.
Click to expand...

I'm kinda off the Perez train, tbh. More about Becerra at the moment. Well, more about Warren, but Becerra is my close second. He was great at attacking Trump on MSNBC the other day. Plus, we're going to hit Trump effing hard on being a racist asshole. I feel like a person of color is maybe better positioned to make that argument. In the way you mentioned how Kaine could appeal to white Catholics, I feel that someone like Becerra can better make the argument of why Never Trump.

Plus, our issue with Latino voters is not the percentage of that voting block we get, especially against Trump. To me, it's about turnout. And I can't help but feel putting a Latin/a on the ticket would be a huge motivator for turnout. Plus, I'm loathe to admit, but I do see the benefit of having someone with a y-chromosome.

But, to cycle back, my argument for Warren as a sign of unity is not because of how favorable she's viewed by Bernie supporters. That's part of it. But, if it was only an optics argument an endorsement would, basically, get us the same thing.

Having her actually on the ticket is a way to tell the hardcore Bernie people, "Look. We get it. You don't trust Clinton. Fine. So, her 2nd in command* is going to be Elizabeth Warren. You trust her to do the right thing, right? She didn't endorse her during the primary. She let the process play out. She's against superdelegates. She's no friend to Wall Street. Everything that puts a question mark in your mind about Hillary? Warren will be there to put a period."

*I know that's how none of this works, but shhhhh. We don't have to tell all of them that.
 
J

jiggle

Member
Was newt that unpopular?


Emarv said:
Real talk, every time I bring up Perez to my father-in-law, he says "But he's ugly! At least Castro is photogenic like a real politician".

I'm like, do I have a guy for you!

anigif_enhanced-buzz-15787-1384960445-6.gif
Click to expand...
Not o'malley or warren hot
But still would
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
You don't need to be an attack dog to be VP.
You need to be ready to be President.

Also, the most hardcore Sanderistas aren't going to vote for her regardless. They'll probably vote Trump or something. So who gives a crap about making them feel better.
 
B

Brinbe

Member
It's gonna be Tim Kaine.

Delivers VA
As qualified as anyone as former Gov/Mayor of Richmond/DNC chair/current Senator. Ready to be POTUS should something happen. Puts him above others like Castro/Perez
Her close pal McAuliffe is Gov. Removes problem of replacement in the Senate
Speaks fluent Spanish. Huge plus
Had her back. Endorsing from the start
Was also on the very short list for Obama in 08
 
E

Emarv

Member
The Obama coalition was black, Latino, Asian and young voters, right? At least largely?

Obama campaigning can probably win back over enough of those to help. The question is which ones he can't win back this time?
 
H

Hilbert

Deep into his 30th decade
Oblivion said:
Obama's numbers are super high too. Who the hell are these people?
Click to expand...

Racists.

I am done with these people. As far as I am concerned supporting trump is a racist act. I don't care if you are a lefty, you can still prove yourself to be a racist.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
shinra-bansho said:
You don't need to be an attack dog to be VP.
You need to be ready to be President.

Also, the most hardcore Sanderistas aren't going to vote for her regardless. They'll probably vote Trump or something. So who gives a crap about making them feel better.
Click to expand...

I think we can divide the Bernie people into three groups

1) Democrats: They're back on board with whomever because, you know, they know what's at stake.

2) BUT HILLARY!: They won't vote for Trump because they're not stupid, but they have ral issues with settling on Hillary. Maybe they stay home if there's not something on the ticket to excite them.

3) BERN EM DOWNERS: Ya, they'll vote for whatever 3rd party ends up on their ballot, or just won't vote. The smallest group and who cares, because they've never voted before, and there's nothing we can do to get them.

I think she should focus on that middle group. Can she win them over without someone liek Warren? Absolutely, yes. But it's contingent upon Bernie not being an ass and taking the time to do it. I feel like Warren (or someone like her, I'm open to suggestions) is a quick(er) fix to unity.

If Bernie had some other supporters who weren't...like, under qualified, I'd be open to them. Maybe a Queen/Killer Mike ticket?
 
W

whyamihere

Banned
itschris said:
Slate: Never Hillary

Among the dead-enders in Bernieworld, Sanders is still the next president and Clinton is a fate worse than Trump.
Click to expand...

"There are algorithms"

I do think a little of this is Hillary's inability to connect with young voters, however, I do this Bernie has done nothing to stop (and in some cases, implicitly fan) the idea that this was a rigged election stolen from them. It's helped a bit by the Professional Left, the Glenn Greenwalds of the world who work on a model that Both Sides Are The Same. Will it hold? I don't think so, at least not entirely.

Reporters are looking for a story that says is "WILL BERNIE SUPPORTERS GO TO CLINTON?" which is both a story, and it's not, at this point. We don't know, and anecdotally getting evidence isn't really the most constructive use of everyone's time. But I expect it to persist until the convention.
 
I

Iolo

Member
Senator Elizabeth Warren will soon endorse presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and, while not currently interested in serving as her running mate, has not ruled it out, several sources close to Warren told Reuters.
Click to expand...
.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
shinra-bansho said:
Excitement is overrated.

Anyway, somewhat breaking my own guidance, but Hillary Clinton history making nomination speech page 4 of OT. Top of page 1 Bernie Sanders same boring stump non-concession thread and Why is she a bad candidate.
Click to expand...

PoliGAF. Where even the mods complain about OT.
 
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