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Do people still doubt a PC PlayStation Storefront is coming?

Is a PC PlayStation Storefront coming?


  • Total voters
    233
I still don't see an argument that shows why 3rd party publishers wouldn't jump at royalty deals with Sony to support a PC store.
I don’t think Sony needs to do any royalty deals. They can just lay down the law - if you want to launch on Playstation you need to also make the game available on our PC storefront and cross-buy. No third party is going to skip out on a Playstation release because of this.
 
Who would have known there was THIS much tribalsim when it comes to PC gaming? Sony is a bigger player in the gaming space than EA, Ubisoft or Epic, so to write them off as just being "another publisher" who will fail is being a little disingenuous. They would have benefited greatly if a new game like Helldivers 2 was only available on their storefronts. Future ports like Spiderman 2, Horizon Forbidden West, God of war, Stellar Blade, Death Stranding 2, Wolverine and Bloodborne remake are definelty big enough IPs to get people to use their launcher. They dont need to be the market leader to consider it a success.


If people were content with buying a ps4 just to play Spiderman or God of War, then I dont see how making the game available on Pc under their own store, is any worse than asking people to buy the game after paying 399.99 or 499.99, lol. The argument against it doesnt make sense when you consider people bought a console just for FFXVI. From an objective standpoint, it makes total sense. You want day and date on PC for AAA first party games? This is the only way I can see it happening.
 
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Who would have known there was THIS much tribalsim when it comes to PC gaming? Sony is a bigger player in the gaming space than EA, Ubisoft or Epic, so to write them off as just being "another publisher" who will fail is being a little disingenuous. They would have benefited greatly if a new game like Helldivers 2 was only available on their storefronts. Future ports like Spiderman 2, Horizon Forbidden West, God of war, Stellar Blade, Death Stranding 2, Wolverine and Bloodborne remake are definelty big enough IPs to get people to use their launcher. They dont need to be the market leader to consider it a success.


If people were content with buying a ps4 just to play Spiderman or God of War, then I dont see how making the game available on Pc under their own store, is any worse than asking people to buy the game after paying 399.99 or 499.99, lol. The argument against it doesnt make sense when you consider people bought a console just for FFXVI. From an objective standpoint, it makes total sense. You want day and date on PC for AAA first party games? This is the only way I can see it happening.

Tribalism is always more fervent on gaming forums than in reality.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Tribalism is always more fervent on gaming forums than in reality.
This is the epitome of irony. You've been on a fanboy crusade for 6 pages, even saying if Sony adopts Nintendo's strategy, they will, "eat their lunch", as if Nintendo's first-party output doesn't utterly embarrass Sony in terms of sales and popularity.

Then you talk about Sony locking the Elden Ring sequel to their stores and seriously think because they got a handful of 1st-party games that did mildly well on PC, they're in a unique position to do something the others have not.

Come on.
 

ReBurn

Gold Member
Another strawman.

1. Again, I'm not even stating that a Sony store would necessarily be successful, rather that the odds of one happening are high.
2. The larger assumption is that it would fail because others have failed but with no analysis of the actual situation. Which is again why I've asked repeatedly for an analysis as to why the PSP was successful and why people have largely avoided answering. The one person who tried to answer gave a really poor answer for its success.

"It's Sony" isn't the argument. The argument is that Sony has the ability to leverage an entire console storefront, significant royalties/revenue, AND their first party software support.

Out of all the other companies, none of them check all of those boxes and the boxes they do check, they don't check nearly as thoroughly as Sony.

I think it's somewhat humorous that Sony has successfully taken on Nintendo, Sega, and Microsoft in the console space, Nintendo once in the handheld space, but people are arguing that Sony has no chance at taking on Valve in the PC space.

Sony has already done things that numerous companies have failed at but more importantly their current position gives them a massive leg up and they don't have the same barriers of entry.

When looking at the streaming services and which ones are successful and which ones aren't, you also look at a future state. Some of these streaming services are going to outright fail and some are going to be successful outside of Netflix. A proper analysis of strengths and weaknesses will show that they're not all the same.

Anyone comparing Sony and EA or Sony and Ubisoft isn't making a sensible analysis. These companies were no more likely to have a successful PC storefront than they would having their own console.
I never said a Sony PC storefront would fail. I also don't think you know what a strawman argument is.

I'm sure that if Sony were to create a PC storefront for their games and sell them there exclusively some people would go there to buy them. Some people went to EGS to get Alan Wake 2 and other exclusive titles, but some people refused to because exclusivity in the PC space is just not generally welcomed.

If Sony had crossbuy with console and trophy integration in their store the people who want those things would probably buy there. It would probably be the easiest way to ease console gamers who don't want to have to rebuy their library over to PC. But what is going to keep people buying there when most of the other storefronts will have more games available and people already prefer them?

I think to be most successful on PC Sony is going to have to also sell their games on other storefronts. If they try to build an exclusive storefront model on the strength of their console games the general PC gaming market won't get on board. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.
 
I never said a Sony PC storefront would fail. I also don't think you know what a strawman argument is.

I'm sure that if Sony were to create a PC storefront for their games and sell them there exclusively some people would go there to buy them. Some people went to EGS to get Alan Wake 2 and other exclusive titles, but some people refused to because exclusivity in the PC space is just not generally welcomed.

If Sony had crossbuy with console and trophy integration in their store the people who want those things would probably buy there. It would probably be the easiest way to ease console gamers who don't want to have to rebuy their library over to PC. But what is going to keep people buying there when most of the other storefronts will have more games available and people already prefer them?

I think to be most successful on PC Sony is going to have to also sell their games on other storefronts. If they try to build an exclusive storefront model on the strength of their console games the general PC gaming market won't get on board. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.

Man, I'm not going to get into it with you again. Your track record speaks for itself.
 

Celcius

°Temp. member
My concern is if Sony makes a PC storefront are they going to support it 10 years from now?
What if they decide it’s not worth it and want to shut it down later?
 

Braag

Member
My concern is if Sony makes a PC storefront are they going to support it 10 years from now?
What if they decide it’s not worth it and want to shut it down later?
This happened to Bethesda's storefront. I never used their storefront but I believe they migrated the games to Steam.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
My concern is if Sony makes a PC storefront are they going to support it 10 years from now?
What if they decide it’s not worth it and want to shut it down later?
This is exactly what will happen. Sony cannot half-ass a PC storefront and the only way for it to survive would be for them to port their games Day 1 on it which will never happen.

Otherwise, who cares about a Sony store that has their games 1-3 years after their console launch?
 
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I've always thought they would no point in not doing it really. The only real question was would they leave steam or give people the option of both. With trophies I can see them using that as some small incentive to use their store. Maybe introduce cross save.
 

Nigel

Member
I don’t think they will. If you look at their movie department, they’ve never made a streaming service to compete like all other production companies. They’ve only licensed their movies to these competitors and made far more from it.
 

David B

An Idiot
As far as this topic goes, I see Sony making a Sony Linux PC in the future. PS9 may be a custom 1000 to $2000 PC with AMD parts in it or maybe they go ARM Silicon, make there own OS with there own games of course and 3rd party games. I think after 2050 that's how it will be.
 

Jigsaah

Member
Spit Take GIF
Hey! What's so funny!?

Granted I have not seen the PS5 store...but I don't see folks complaining about it either.
 

near

Gold Member
Another strawman.

1. Again, I'm not even stating that a Sony store would necessarily be successful, rather that the odds of one happening are high.
2. The larger assumption is that it would fail because others have failed but with no analysis of the actual situation. Which is again why I've asked repeatedly for an analysis as to why the PSP was successful and why people have largely avoided answering. The one person who tried to answer gave a really poor answer for its success.

"It's Sony" isn't the argument. The argument is that Sony has the ability to leverage an entire console storefront, significant royalties/revenue, AND their first party software support.

Out of all the other companies, none of them check all of those boxes and the boxes they do check, they don't check nearly as thoroughly as Sony.

I think it's somewhat humorous that Sony has successfully taken on Nintendo, Sega, and Microsoft in the console space, Nintendo once in the handheld space, but people are arguing that Sony has no chance at taking on Valve in the PC space.

Sony has already done things that numerous companies have failed at but more importantly their current position gives them a massive leg up and they don't have the same barriers of entry.

When looking at the streaming services and which ones are successful and which ones aren't, you also look at a future state. Some of these streaming services are going to outright fail and some are going to be successful outside of Netflix. A proper analysis of strengths and weaknesses will show that they're not all the same.

Anyone comparing Sony and EA or Sony and Ubisoft isn't making a sensible analysis. These companies were no more likely to have a successful PC storefront than they would having their own console.
I think people are avoiding discussing the PSP because it's irrelevant. The reason(s) the PSP succeeded in terms of its hardware sales have no correlation to how a PlayStation PC storefront could succeed. You're trying to compare two entirely different markets and products to support your argument. One is a multimedia portable gaming device, while the other is a software application entering a different competing space. We understand that Sony is capable of competing, but there are also many reasons to assume a PS PC storefront would possibly fail, and I think people in this thread have tried to explain that to you in numerous ways. No one is really arguing that they won't try, or at least develop a launcher of sorts.

Your whole counterargument as to why it won't fail is contingent on wild assumptions, that in reality aren't probable. Sony would not forgo there 30% commission on PSN to select publishers/devs in order to entice them to distribute on a new PC storefront, I think this is what you're saying when you mention leveraging there console storefront. Even if they did do this, there is absolutely nothing here at the moment to indicate that they would do this in the future. Others have already suggested that Epic's moneyhats haven't worked very well. Someone else has also mentioned Microsoft's store, and its offerings.

It's possible it could succeed, but it's also very very possible it's set up to fail. Don't fuck with Valve dude. :messenger_winking_tongue:
 
I think people are avoiding discussing the PSP because it's irrelevant. The reason(s) the PSP succeeded in terms of its hardware sales have no correlation to how a PlayStation PC storefront could succeed. You're trying to compare two entirely different markets and products to support your argument. One is a multimedia portable gaming device, while the other is a software application entering a different competing space. We understand that Sony is capable of competing, but there are also many reasons to assume a PS PC storefront would possibly fail, and I think people in this thread have tried to explain that to you in numerous ways. No one is really arguing that they won't try, or at least develop a launcher of sorts.

Your whole counterargument as to why it won't fail is contingent on wild assumptions, that in reality aren't probable. Sony would not forgo there 30% commission on PSN to select publishers/devs in order to entice them to distribute on a new PC storefront, I think this is what you're saying when you mention leveraging there console storefront. Even if they did do this, there is absolutely nothing here at the moment to indicate that they would do this in the future. Others have already suggested that Epic's moneyhats haven't worked very well. Someone else has also mentioned Microsoft's store, and its offerings.

It's possible it could succeed, but it's also very very possible it's set up to fail. Don't fuck with Valve dude. :messenger_winking_tongue:

You're not getting the point of bringing it up.

The argument people are making is that Sony would never do this because they'd evaluate the market and realize they couldn't compete since so many others have failed.

Yet you could argue that challenging Nintendo in the handheld market was just as daunting if not more so.

I have yet to make a single argument as to why it wouldn't fail. My point remains that it makese sense for Sony to try and I think they will.

You bring up Epic and moneyhatting, but Sony doesn't need to moneyhat. You bring up Microsoft, but they do not have a successful track record in gaming, their 1st party is significantly behind Sony as is their 3rd party support.
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
No it wouldn't they could control the third party key market that way. They still should do steam releases but people are forced to pay the highest price if they want to get the games on steam.
Controlling the third-party market could increase revenue.

Creating a new infrastructure on a new platform, managing and maintaining that infrastructure, ensuring its features are comparable to the already-established PC platform with the largest install base, and promoting a new client to people who already use the most widely accepted client and don't want another one could cost far more than controlling third-party keys would ever bring in.
 

StueyDuck

Member
With the news of Sony adding PC support for PSVR2 are people still in doubt that they're planning a PC Storefront?

In 2022, I called out that Sony had a unique ability in the VR space and we're about to see it play out here and that they would eventually leverage that in a PC Storefront.

Games like Horizon Call of the Mountain and Gran Turismo 7 are going to be ported to PC with VR support.

They aren't going to sell PSVR2 on PC and not port these games over and they aren't going to keep selling these games through Steam just to hand over 20-30 percent of their revenue to Valve. That's not what Totoki means when he thinks about growth and margins. Sony is thinking why pay 20-30% to Valve to sell our games, when we can sell our own games AND get paid from 3rd party publishers for selling their games.

Everything Sony has been building for the last few years points to it.

I've heard people say, Epic is failing and even ABK and T2 failed and they have COD and GTA.

Epic only has Fortnite and while it's a major game, they don't have enough continued support to bring in enough users. It's why they approached Sony about getting their games exclusively on EGS, they desperately needed them. ABK and T2 didn't have 3rd party publishers on board for theirs. No one game can make a successful storefront.

Sony brings something unique to the space as a publisher and an existing Storefront. No one else has the following:

  • VR Support - Meta and Valve
  • Extremely popular 1st party titles - Nintendo
  • An industry-dominant storefront and the ability to leverage royalties across multiple storefronts - Nobody
    • Primarily as a result, their relationship with 3rd parties

Steam has never really had real competition before. CDPR and Epic were both too small to compete. Arguing that ABK and T2 could have been real competitors is like suggesting either of them could create their own subscription service successfully. Their content catalog isn't big enough for that and it isn't big enough for a storefront.
Not sure about a storefront but there'll definitely be first party titles that log into psn and pop trophies and so on
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
Sony typically has better UI design in my opinion, which is a big drawback of the Xbox app.
Sony's newest storefront is actually a giant step backward from what it used to be. It doesn't even show the most basic content like videos or even images for games.
Ex.: https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP0177-PPSA09770_00-UNICORNOVERLORD0

Unless you already know about Unicorn Overlord, that page gives you next to nothing to decide whether you should buy it.

I don't think I've ever come across a Steam store page that didn't have at least a few images of a game. The vast majority have videos as well. If I find an interesting-looking game on the PS Store I basically have to Google it because there is no information except a written summary. It's ass-backwards.
 

Jigsaah

Member
Sony's newest storefront is actually a giant step backward from what it used to be. It doesn't even show the most basic content like videos or even images for games.
Ex.: https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP0177-PPSA09770_00-UNICORNOVERLORD0

Unless you already know about Unicorn Overlord, that page gives you next to nothing to decide whether you should buy it.

I don't think I've ever come across a Steam store page that didn't have at least a few images of a game. The vast majority have videos as well. If I find an interesting-looking game on the PS Store I basically have to Google it because there is no information except a written summary. It's ass-backwards.
Is it like this on the PS5 as well?
 

Senua

Member
Who would have known there was THIS much tribalsim when it comes to PC gaming? Sony is a bigger player in the gaming space than EA, Ubisoft or Epic, so to write them off as just being "another publisher" who will fail is being a little disingenuous. They would have benefited greatly if a new game like Helldivers 2 was only available on their storefronts. Future ports like Spiderman 2, Horizon Forbidden West, God of war, Stellar Blade, Death Stranding 2, Wolverine and Bloodborne remake are definelty big enough IPs to get people to use their launcher. They dont need to be the market leader to consider it a success.


If people were content with buying a ps4 just to play Spiderman or God of War, then I dont see how making the game available on Pc under their own store, is any worse than asking people to buy the game after paying 399.99 or 499.99, lol. The argument against it doesnt make sense when you consider people bought a console just for FFXVI. From an objective standpoint, it makes total sense. You want day and date on PC for AAA first party games? This is the only way I can see it happening.
What If a great part of Helldivers success is because it was released on Steam.
 

Don Carlo

Member
Don't think it's about competing with Steam, moreso a convenience for those on PC. PlayStation obviously does not have a catalog of PC games as grand as ... well ... PC.
 

Sinfulgore

Member
My argument is that they'll be successful, my argument is that they have every opportunity to be successful and that it makes sense to attempt it.

You keep arguing that they won't have 3rd party games, when their leverage dictates that they would.

You say no one would buy these games through a Sony PC storefront, but in reality you don't know that. Again, there are millions of new steam users every year. What were they doing before this? Why did they select Steam? You've got to really deep dive into these things rather than just make blanket statements.

Helldivers is still growing out of its server issues, the game is a couple weeks old and continuously getting more players. Are you going on record that Helldivers will never surpass Apex Legends on Steam?

EGS doesn't have enough games. Same thing with Microsoft and Minecraft. EGS actually has Genshin Impact as well. The problem with EGS is that their model doesn't work and it doesn't work because they lack the leverage to garner support from 3rd parties without losing a ton of money to do it. They can offer low royalties on the PC games but that is it. Sony can offer low royalties on PC games AND low royalties on console games.
I have never once argued that Sony's PC Storefront wouldn't have any third-party games. That's not the issue yet you keep bringing this up, the issue is that no one would buy these games. I know because we already have proof of this with the Epic Games Store. Seriously, give me one reason why a PC gamer would buy Dragon Age 4 on a Sony PC Storefront over Steam, EA, or Epic Games Store.

You are the one making blanket statements because you clearly have no idea how PC gaming works. Before Steam PC games came on disks with an activation code and a storefront like Steam wasn't necessary. How do you not know this? Steam became popular because it was first just like Netflix which allowed them to build a large install base and improve on it over time with little to no competition. What you are suggesting Sony do is like telling a movie studio to build their own streaming service to compete with Netflix. Well, many tried and we know how well that went.

I am but I want to clarify what surpassing means here. Having a higher concurrent player count isn't surpassing. Apex Legend on Steam had an all-time peak of 624k players and now 4 years after release is getting around 430k daily players. And remember this is Steam only, Apex is also on EA's Store. I don't think Hell Divers 2 will come anywhere close to those numbers. I'd say in a year or two the game will be dead with less than 50k players but I could be wrong.

Epic Games Store has over 3000 games right now. How many games do you think a Sony PC storefront would have when it releases? Again offering low royalties to third parties won't make people buy their games on your storefront. You keep bringing this up yet don't seem to understand that the royalties devs have to pay for the platform's owners don't correlate to how many people will buy your game. Sony could give Larian Studios 100% of the sales of Baludrs Gate 3 on PS5 and Sony's PC storefront but that won't make gamers buy it there instead of Steam.

They already do that now with the PlayStation store. Making PC an extension of that is a meaningless cost
Sony's Web-Based Playstation Store is not the same thing as a PC Storefront just like Microsoft's web-based Xbox Store is not the same as the Microsoft Store. A PC storefront would require way more resources than a console game store. I honestly believe you guys must not be PC gamers because you don't seem to understand PC gaming. For example, security is a much bigger deal on a PC Storefront than a console one.
 
Maybe in 10 years. But right now it is probably too early.

For starters, the PSVR2 stuff is likely not what most are thinking. Most likely is going to be the ability for PS5 PSVR2 owners to stream PC VR games that don't have native versions on PS5. That would be easier to implement than native PSVR2 support on PC, which may come down the line, but would feel like a slap in the face to the console owners with the headset as they basically paid for a $550 paperweight that won't get additional support unless they also have a sufficient PC for VR games. That's a borderline mid-90's SEGA move in terms of level of stupid towards your core customer base.

Meanwhile, PlayStation consoles are still going incredibly strong globally; unless Sony have a means to monetize a PC storefront that can give them recurring revenue even without a person needing a PS+ subscription, the amount of hardcore & core enthusiasts they risk losing out from buying a console to go to the PC storefront instead would be enough, to decline overall revenue. That increases even more if casual & mainstream gamers choose the storefront over the console, because without something like a "free" ad-subsidized model, the storefront will never generate revenue on its own that console hardware can.

That is also because of the fact that with a PC storefront, there'd be no reason to not support any and all 3P controller options on PC, including KB&M, all of which can drive down desire to buy Sony-branded controller peripherals or specifically PS-licensed 3P peripherals where on the console Sony would normally get some type of license cut for them. They would ALSO need to find a way to make PS+ Essentials worthwhile for PC users while removing the online paywall requirement, not exactly easy to do.

I'm sure Sony have plans for a PC storefront in some early stages, but it'd just be incredibly premature of them to make a push for it anytime this gen or the majority of the next generation. There is significant room for growth in terms of install base, revenue, profit margins, 1P software creativity, technological creativity & standardization of new practices/features etc. that Sony can leverage through their own hardware, not to mention with the console, they still retain full control of the vertical stack. Gaming-wise PlayStation console is where they have the most vested interests so unless consoles altogether are dropping off (which isn't happening despite sensationalists reporting of late...at least it's not happening for Sony and Nintendo :/), there is no reason for Sony to cannibalize their own console market for an aggressive PC initiative which would include a launcher/storefront.

Because, another thing they'd have to do is convince 3P to put their games on that launcher/storefront as well. A PC storefront with just Sony's 1P would not be enough to make it worthwhile, but the best means of Sony convincing 3P to put their games on it would be that they only charge 5 or 10% cuts on all 3P games sold on the storefront, as long as the 3P also make PS versions of the games available at the same time. Even so, that is still going to create scenarios where some high-ARPU core enthusiasts shift to PC and therefore Sony makes less money off both 1P and 3P games sold on their PC launcher, since they get smaller cut from the 3P and they likely don't get accompanying subs on PC with the 1P if that customer doesn't need PS+ for online play.

Or, they could try something like splitting the typical 30% console cut as 20% console/10% PC storefront for 3P who support both. That would certainly get a lot of support but, again, it means that Sony's getting less from each 3P sale now on both console AND PC, and they can't use similar pricing/promotion/discount strategies on both platforms since the PC storefront has to compete directly with EGS, Steam, GOG etc. for those same 3P titles (highly doubt Sony would be able to lock in a ton of 3P PC storefront exclusives, after all that strategy hasn't been working out well for Epic's store :/).

So yeah, in general there's just far too much to risk on the console side for too much uncertainty on the PC side, by pushing a PC storefront/launcher anytime soon. If anything, Sony should be looking at what features storefronts like Steam are doing well, take them, improve them, and implement them into the PlayStation console experience. Stuff like transparent player metrics for all games, transparent game sales metrics on PS Store (price tracking, selling rate over periods of time, etc.), and integrated forum communities. There's no reason PS5 owners can't have those things on their own console, and it'd lead to a more enriching experience for a lot of them I'm sure. Again unlike certain sensationalists stories, consoles as an industry are doing perfectly fine. It's up to the platform holders to innovate with their hardware and the ecosystem on their consoles, to keep things going.

And for Sony that means not getting sidelined by this fake narrative that their only competitor is Xbox; believing that will just stifle future growth and innovation for PlayStation. PC is a competitor for PlayStation, more now than it's ever been in the past. Nintendo is also a competitor, though in different ways from Xbox or even PC. While mobile is the least contentious, it's still in a way a form of competition. Sony should be looking at what these competitors are doing right and bring that stuff to their own console platform in improved ways. That's how you actually "grow the market".

They probably will the question is will it be cross buy.

And that's another thing: if they do cross buy, does that actually help or hurt 3P? If some publishers benefit with double-dippers (T2 for example), cross buy would screw them over in some way. Or does Sony make it voluntary? Why make it voluntary and not do it with your own games? At which point, Sony are kind of screwing themselves on 1P B2P software revenue and profits.

A while ago I mentioned that Sony could do a variant of cross buy where maybe if you buy the game on one platform, you can get a version of that game on another PS storefront or platform for a cheaper price, It'd act like a discount, basically. That's probably a model that would be more appealing to both 1P and more importantly, 3P.

Did ABK's storefront have games from Namco, Capcom, Square, Sony, EA, T2? I swear, people ignore your argument to make the same argument.

As popular as those games are, they're still a small portion of the overall gaming community and games industry.

I've actually suggested that Sony should probably enter into a joint venture to take over EGS and rebrand and retool it. EGS has to moneyhat exclusives, all Sony needs to do is lower their royalties on PS5 games. Sony also has way more money for exclusives than Epic. You'll notice that all the games you mentioned were single player offline games.

Epic is bleeding money for exclusivity, Sony doesn't have to.

But why would Sony lower their royalties for games on PS5? Also while Sony has more money for exclusives, it's not infinite. And very likely multiple 1P studios will need to find ways to curb some of their excess spending on budget bloat (if present). It's also ultimately not a sensible strategy to keep putting out for tons of 3P AAA timed exclusives, when a lot of that money aside a few key IP, could be better spent on 1P AAA and AA titles & content.

But the 30% cut in royalties Sony gets from 3P PS5 games is basically free money for Sony, why would they lower it just to enter a joint venture with EGS on PC?
 
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Fabieter

Member
Controlling the third-party market could increase revenue.

Creating a new infrastructure on a new platform, managing and maintaining that infrastructure, ensuring its features are comparable to the already-established PC platform with the largest install base, and promoting a new client to people who already use the most widely accepted client and don't want another one could cost far more than controlling third-party keys would ever bring in.

Iam not sure if you know that but sony already has a infrastructure with alot of features. And people buying your games for half the price day one is definitely worth a try.
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
Iam not sure if you know that but sony already has a infrastructure with alot of features. And people buying your games for half the price day one is definitely worth a try.
Lol, be serious. You're right, they already have an infrastructure that they own completely with the PS Store (even though it's not designed for PC), and the games on it have never been half-price on day one. Third-party keys are not the reason why games are $70. Their own games launch on PSN for $70 already, and they would love for that number to be even higher. Thank God for third-party keys.
 

near

Gold Member
You're not getting the point of bringing it up.

The argument people are making is that Sony would never do this because they'd evaluate the market and realize they couldn't compete since so many others have failed.

I think this is a valid argument to bring up. Not that I agree with it entirely, but it is worth assessing. So let's try, there isn't any one particular reason why others failed to compete with Valve. There are a multitude of factors, and Sony if they want to really enter this space would have to consider them, while looking at the circumstances those companies failed in. I said this before but depending on how you measure success this could go in a number of ways. Epic Game Store is a good example because it has 270 million customers and 75 million active users, yet its software sales aren't compelling and Epic is still making a loss on its investment. Epic was able to enter the digital distribution market with a massive install base, and it still struggles. If the idea is to draw attention to your store, Epic have done a fantastic job. But this hasn't been enough, and they continue to fight this battle. Let's be honest, if Sony was able to draw that level of attention to its hypothetical storefront they'd be very fortunate. You don't achieve those numbers easily, it takes years of effort to do that organically from scratch, and would require a lot of content for anyone to even pay attention to begin with. You can argue first party titles, but it's obvious Sony's turnover of content isn't nearly as fast enough as it needs to be to sustain it on its own. Third party exclusives will not work either.

Then you have the fact that Epic Games is actually a Sony investment, it would be a conflict of interest for Sony to enter this space while also running its home console operations. What would be Sony's priorities? The most feasible and logical pathway into the PC market is to distribute via the existing platforms, and build a launcher that doesn't force customers to choose between stores. I just don't see anyone building a distribution/storefront as complete as Steam, especially with the reputation that it has built over decades.

You bring up Epic and moneyhatting, but Sony doesn't need to moneyhat.

Don't really want to take this off-topic, but you are aware that Sony moneyhats devs/publishers now for console timed exclusives, right?
 

Fabieter

Member
Lol, be serious. You're right, they already have an infrastructure that they own completely with the PS Store (even though it's not designed for PC), and the games on it have never been half-price on day one. Third-party keys are not the reason why games are $70. Their own games launch on PSN for $70 already, and they would love for that number to be even higher. Thank God for third-party keys.

Yes half the price might be a little bit of a stretch but there instances for being close to it.
 

Fabieter

Member
Name one first-party Playstation game that launched on PSN at "anything close to it."

You missunderstand me. Third party keys on pc are soo cheap that pubs basically lose money on it. Games are 25 to 50% cheaper compared to steam for the same platform basically. If they had their own launcher with third party key seller only selling psn pc keys. People would have to set for sonys platform or pay the higher price on steam. So it would mean marketshare or higher margin (win win)
 

Guilty_AI

Member
You missunderstand me. Third party keys on pc are soo cheap that pubs basically lose money on it. Games are 25 to 50% cheaper compared to steam for the same platform basically.
Publishers are also in control of keys being sold in third party websites, pricing and everything, even the existence of said keys in the first place. Unless you're speaking of places like G2A, but those are a bit like graymarket and always come with the risk of the keys being revoked due to their dubious origin.
 
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Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
You missunderstand me. Third party keys on pc are soo cheap that pubs basically lose money on it. Games are 25 to 50% cheaper compared to steam for the same platform basically. If they had their own launcher with third party key seller only selling psn pc keys. People would have to set for sonys platform or pay the higher price on steam. So it would mean marketshare or higher margin (win win)
Who is selling the keys to the third parties?
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
Well I know it's the publisher but they don't sell it for the keyseller to sell those on way cheaper prices in countries with higher income than the country's those keys are for.
This definitely isn't a recent issue, so they do know that will inevitably happen when they sell their keys. They still sell them anyway. Who are you trying to help with your solution, here?
 

Guilty_AI

Member
Well I know it's the publisher but they don't sell it for the keyseller to sell those on way cheaper prices in countries with higher income than the country's those keys are for.
Keys from places with lower regional pricing cannot be redeemed in countries with higher regional pricing tho, at least in most regions like LATAM. Could be different in the EU, idk.
 
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SmokedMeat

Gamer™
Well I know it's the publisher but they don't sell it for the keyseller to sell those on way cheaper prices in countries with higher income than the country's those keys are for.

PC has official key sellers who sell at great prices to your specific region.
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
It's a thread about psn pc with the possible reasons for it to make sense. And people are just like "no I love steam/valve too much.".
It's more like, "Many others who were in a better position to pull this off tried it already and their games are now on Steam."

Sony might do it. It would just be a stupid decision. Personally, I wouldn't buy anything from a Playstation PC client because Sony sunsets products and services that don't have the impact they want at the drop of a hat. My purchases are much safer on Steam.
 

Fabieter

Member
It's more like, "Many others who were in a better position to pull this off tried it already and their games are now on Steam."

Sony might do it. It would just be a stupid decision. Personally, I wouldn't buy anything from a Playstation PC client because Sony sunsets products and services that don't have the impact they want at the drop of a hat. My purchases are much safer on Steam.

It would be stupid because I prefer steam isn't a reasonable argument. They also have possible synergies with their console. Trophies, digital library coming over. Crossbuy, ps+ games also working on their store.
 
It's definitely coming, and for all the people who say "they have no chance against Steam". That's not the point, if they integrate it with their Playstation account, allow people to play against others on the Playstation, preserve the friendlist and the trophies, then the PlayStation owners who grow older and get into PC gaming will likely use them than use a Steam account. Over time that is going to build up a userbase, plus the people who will set up an account to play PS exclusives day one on PC rather than wait a year on steam.
They then get to keep the 30% fee that Steam charges, that probably adds up to over $100 million a year earned just on the extra revenue on those fees
 

Omnipunctual Godot

Gold Member
It would be stupid because I prefer steam isn't a reasonable argument. They also have possible synergies with their console. Trophies, digital library coming over. Crossbuy, ps+ games also working on their store.
I didn't say it was an argument, which is why I prefaced it with, "Personally..." It's an opinion, although it is based on observed patterns, which I laid out. You can go back and read them. They're literally in the following sentence.

The argument is in the five or so comments above which explain, in detail, the many reasons why it would be stupid. I'm surprised you've forgotten them, since most of them were responses to you. Would you like a recap?

1. It's costly to build a new store, especially on an entirely new platform.
2. It's costly to maintain the infrastructure for said store.
3. It's costly to manage and develop the many features of such a store, including cybersecurity, sales and marketing, UI, user features, etc.
4. They would have to build the install base from the ground up while Steam already has over 130M users.
5. They would have to convince users to download another game launcher, which is not easy to do and would be very costly as well.
6. It has been tried by companies in a better position to pull it off, and their games are now on Steam.
7. Putting their games on the most popular store with the largest install base on the platform costs them a fraction of the money and the risk of creating their own client.
 

Hari Seldon

Member
They can try, but I have serious doubts that it will work out in their favor. I think investing in a store front that can compete with steam is a lot more expensive than it appears to be. At a minimum to compete with Steam you need the infrastructure to handle returns, allow user reviews, support friend lists, create a method to allow people to join their friend's games, DM support, etc. If you care about selling 3rd party games you need mod support as well. And to really get people off of steam entirely you need forums and the rest. All of those uncompressed audio 100+GB console games are not cheap to serve up bandwidth wise.

Besides the costs, Sony simply does not have a library of games that PC players give a shit about (as evidence by the sales numbers from the leaks). This may change as they release more live service games, but are they going to completely sacrifice these games to prop up a store? Or would they rather make a shit ton of money on Steam now, like with Helldivers? Best case scenario, this process will take YEARS. Does Sony have the shareholder backing for years of crappy quarterly earnings? I dunno about this. This type of loss is a rounding error for MS or Meta but gaming for Sony is much more important. I don't think they can take a massive long term strategic risk like this in today's economic environment.
 

Fabieter

Member
I didn't say it was an argument, which is why I prefaced it with, "Personally..." It's an opinion, although it is based on observed patterns, which I laid out. You can go back and read them. They're literally in the following sentence.

The argument is in the five or so comments above which explain, in detail, the many reasons why it would be stupid. I'm surprised you've forgotten them, since most of them were responses to you. Would you like a recap?

1. It's costly to build a new store, especially on an entirely new platform.
2. It's costly to maintain the infrastructure for said store.
3. It's costly to manage and develop the many features of such a store, including cybersecurity, sales and marketing, UI, user features, etc.
4. They would have to build the install base from the ground up while Steam already has over 130M users.
5. They would have to convince users to download another game launcher, which is not easy to do and would be very costly as well.
6. It has been tried by companies in a better position to pull it off, and their games are now on Steam.
7. Putting their games on the most popular store with the largest install base on the platform costs them a fraction of the money and the risk of creating their own client.

And when consoles vanish eventually they are positioned as just another publisher instead of a platform themselves.

Why were other companies better suited to try than the company with one of the biggest ecosystems in gaming? Explain it to me.

Valve has like 300 employees and manage their store with ease. They are tiny compared to sony. Valve isn't even a public traded company so we don't know their margins, costs etc. People are so crazy about valve getting competition it's crazy.
 
It’s ironic that Sony would be allowed to have their own store on Microsoft’s platform but not the other way around

Because PCs are open platforms and general-purpose devices. Consoles aren't.

Also Id idn't know the "open platform" of PC was in fact Microsoft's platform. Guess in a way PC isn't so open after all 😉

It would be stupid because I prefer steam isn't a reasonable argument. They also have possible synergies with their console. Trophies, digital library coming over. Crossbuy, ps+ games also working on their store.

Those synergies definitely exist but my question is why does Sony have to do that right now? The console is still perfectly fine and healthy, and if anything could do with new features inspired by things on platforms like Steam, to integrate into the console experience.

Sony just doesn't have a need for a PC storefront for the next several years. There are other ways to expand revenue, profits, and install base with the console itself (plus reduce production costs sensibly) that don't involve potentially cannibalizing the console (in part) too early, while still having a (sensible) multiplatform strategy for growth on PC and mobile that also doesn't cannibalize the console.

A PC launcher/storefront would pose a direct threat to the console itself, especially if Sony had no way to monetize it without subscriptions, or make PS+ work on PC without using online play as a catalyst, etc.
 
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