(Grain of Salt) Moore's Law is Dead: PS6 SoC codenamed 'Orion', PS6 Portable SoC codenamed 'Canis'

I still say that this won't be a portable PS6 but a portable PS5, simply due to the fact that the gulf in power between them would be way too big.

most games will be cross gen anyway, so the PS5 Portable will still get most games, but the opportunity for PS6 only games is left open for developers.
 
Once again just like motion controls, Nintendo paves the way and everyone tries to copy it. Of course they are putting their own spin on it to maximize profits, sell you both versions as a package? or is the portable version going to cost less? or will the game just work on both? require a patch?

Pointless without exclusive handheld cheaper develped games.

WTF Sony you were the chosen one.
 
Three said:
Kepler is a good source but MLID is providing valuable leaks that Kepler is adding to.
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Valuable leak is one thing, but reliable information is another.

The problem with MLID is that it tends to publish leaked real information alongside pure speculation, which he presents as part of that information. The result is that it ceases to be a trustworthy source, and what it says should always be taken with a grain of salt.
This is the difference with Kepler and other sources that focus solely on pointing out concrete information they own, and speculation is either sidelined or highlighted when it isn't speculation.

This same information and its Evolution is an example.
 
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Danjin44 said:
Sure but again if it doesn't have its own exclusive then why would I buy this instead of actual PS6 console?

I bought Switch not because it portable mode but rather because it had exclusive games I want to play.
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Well, if you don't care about portability, then I suppose you could skip the portable. Just get the dedicated home console, then.

I would guess that most people (aside from hardcore gamers) would pick one or the other, not both. They'd get whatever best suits their needs. Sony probably doesn't care if you only get one of the machines (rather than both), as long as you're buying a bunch of software for it.

Software is where the real money is. Hardware is just something you get in order to use software.
 
Darsxx82 said:
Valuable information is one thing, but reliable information is another.

The problem with MLID is that it tends to publish leaked real information alongside pure speculation, which he presents as part of that information. The result is that it ceases to be a reliable and trustworthy source, and what it says should always be taken with a grain of salt.
This is the difference with K Kepler and other sources that focus solely on pointing out concrete information they own, and speculation is either sidelined or highlighted when it isn't speculation.

This same information is an example. We started with "Magnus was a PS6 and oozed Cerny's design everywhere" to "Magnus is XBOX next and PS6 "Orion," at the same time that Kepler was correcting it.
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But MLID has often said here is the leaked document in its raw form and here is what I think these are. He hasn't really made any definitive claims in these recent PS6 leaks. Kepler has kept things close to his chest and is only mentioning information after the leak. Both are valuable. MLID is allowed to speculate on his leaks as long as he continues to highlight that it is what he thinks the leaks are.
 
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Agent X said:
Well, if you don't care about portability, then I suppose you could skip the portable. Just get the dedicated home console, then.

I would guess that most people (aside from hardcore gamers) would pick one or the other, not both. They'd get whatever best suits their needs. Sony probably doesn't care if you only get one of the machines (rather than both), as long as you're buying a bunch of software for it.

Software is where the real money is. Hardware is just something you get in order to use software.
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That would create a situation worse than the Series X and Series S for the devs… I don't see Sony doing that, they are not that stupid.
 
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Danjin44 said:
The issue with that is unlike Nintendo, Sony this gen dont have much games that appeals to Japanese audience.

90% Sony first party are made by western studio.
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That's true, but Sony is taking steps to fix their Japanese game support with Astrobot and Marvel Tokōn. I expect even more support next generation.
 
I wonder if the PS6 and its portable version will have some form of gameplay integration. Imagine an Astro Bot PS6 demo where you can use the portable PS6 as a second screen to play minigames and do all sorts of cool stuff.
 
I like this.

Option to get a desktop or portable system based on your needs.

Nintendo should also do this instead of cramming everything in a single system, making it worse for everyone use case.
 
Danjin44 said:
Vita failed because Sony stopped supporting the game just became port matching.

PSP in other hand was successful.
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PSP came at a time when games were cheap to make and didn't take 5 to 6 goddamn years to make...That kind of helps...ALOT.

Good luck putting your first party studios to support your handheld device when they already need 6 years to release 1 game developing for 1 system.
 
vaibhavpisal said:
I like this.

Option to get a desktop or portable system based on your needs.

Nintendo should also do this instead of cramming everything in a single system, making it worse for everyone use case.
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Three said:
But MLID has often said here is the leaked document in its raw form and here is what I think these are. He hasn't really made any definitive claims in these recent PS6 leaks. Kepler has kept things close to his chest and is only mentioning information after the leak. Both are valuable. MLID is allowed to speculate on his leaks as long as he continues to highlight that it is what he thinks the leaks are.
Click to expand...

The MLID article that accompanied this same leaked information was accompanied by the statement that "Magnus" is cleary PS6 and oozes a Marc Cerny design everywhere."... and in between, speculation about how will be BC with PS5, chip process management and even guessing possible performance figures...

That is, the moment you can't distinguish between what's a real leak and what isn't, at least for me, the source ceases to be trustworthy, and the next step is waiting for someone to corroborate it.
In the case of Kepler, you're not in that same situation, and you know what It is and no need to corroboration.

That said, I have in no way denied that MILD may be a source of real leaks to a greater or lesser extent. I was just saying that, given the good fortune of Kepler participating in this forum, people here who want to learn more about this topic have a better much option.
 
Tiago Rodrigues said:
It's really starting to look like PS6 gen will have 2 skus: One home and one portable. Both will play the same games (obviously less resolution, etc for the portable).

Kinda like if the switch was a home console only and Switch Lite is the handheld version of it.

The home console will not be released with a disc. You will have to buy it separately (almost for sure).

This is my bet.
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I don't think they are going to make the handheld mandatory for PS6 games. It should though run all PS4/PS5 titles.

If they make it mandatory we will have another XSS situation.
 
vaibhavpisal said:
I think a proper portable is better cause that allows them to make desktop unit really powerful. Instead of being something close to Series S while costing $450 is a downside for those that wanna do pure desktop play.
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The high/low powered 2 consoles concept isn't working really well for Microsoft… Nintendo just have to develop for one system and is working amazingly well.
 
LordOcidax said:
The high/low powered 2 consoles concept isn't working really well for Microsoft… Nintendo just have to develop for one system and is working amazingly well.
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The issue with Xbox is mandatory parity for XSS. If Sony doesn't have that for PS6 games, things will naturally work out similar to Windows handhelds/Steam Deck.
 
LordOcidax said:
The high/low powered 2 consoles concept isn't working really well for Microsoft… Nintendo just have to develop for one system and is working amazingly well.
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MS have put a large gap between S and X. That can be mitigated by keeping same amount of RAM, processor etc.

As a customer, I would like to see a beefy Switch 2 home console at $499. PS5 level of GPU power. Full DLSS to bring everything to 4k 60.

And a portable version, Switch 2 lite. $399. Same system as current Switch 2, but without joycons etc. 6.5" screen for proper handheld experience.
 
vaibhavpisal said:
MS have put a large gap between S and X. That can be mitigated by keeping same amount of RAM, processor etc.

As a customer, I would like to see a beefy Switch 2 home console at $499. PS5 level of GPU power. Full DLSS to bring everything to 4k 60.

And a portable version, Switch 2 lite. $399. Same system as current Switch 2, but without joycons etc. 6.5" screen for proper handheld experience.
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That's not technically possible, the difference is going to be bigger than X and S…
 
demigod said:
So you guys want the system to go the way of the dodo like the vita again, what a brilliant idea.
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The alternative is an Xbox Series S/X situation, but even worse. You want it to be more difficult for developers to make games, and have the handheld console hamstringing the entire generation?

FeralEcho said:
PSP came at a time when games were cheap to make and didn't take 5 to 6 goddamn years to make...That kind of helps...ALOT.

Good luck putting your first party studios to support your handheld device when they already need 6 years to release 1 game developing for 1 system.
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I said this recently in another thread, but 5-7 year development times aren't necessary if you are making a game for a handheld console. You don't need AAA games. A portable console that is its own device gives developers more freedom to try new things with smaller development teams. We could see a resurgence of A, AA, and indie titles specifically designed for the portable console. If it isn't a hybrid device, there isn't as much raw power needed since you won't be outputting this to a giant 4k screen. For this to succeed is would require:
  • A clear identity (not a PlayStation 6 Remote Play device).
  • Strong indie, A, and AA development support.
  • A push for developers and publishers to support shorter development cycles and have a gamplay-focused design.
  • Amazing first-party titles that show off what this looks like when properly implemented.
  • Support from Sony for developers/publishers who want to get the most out of the console.
This isn't a Herculean obstacle. Is it a risk? Sure. But risks are what put Sony on the map in the first place.
 
IFireflyl said:
The alternative is an Xbox Series S/X situation, but even worse. You want it to be more difficult for developers to make games, and have the handheld console hamstringing the entire generation?



I said this recently in another thread, but 5-7 year development times aren't necessary if you are making a game for a handheld console. You don't need AAA games. A portable console that is its own device gives developers more freedom to try new things with smaller development teams. We could see a resurgence of A, AA, and indie titles specifically designed for the portable console. If it isn't a hybrid device, there isn't as much raw power needed since you won't be outputting this to a giant 4k screen. For this to succeed is would require:
  • A clear identity (not a PlayStation 6 Remote Play device).
  • Strong indie, A, and AA development support.
  • A push for developers and publishers to support shorter development cycles and have a gamplay-focused design.
  • Amazing first-party titles that show off what this looks like when properly implemented.
  • Support from Sony for developers/publishers who want to get the most out of the console.
This isn't a Herculean obstacle. Is it a risk? Sure. But risks are what put Sony on the map in the first place.
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I really think that a hybrid console with the PS5/PS5 Pro power could be great for Sony in every scenario.
 
LordOcidax said:
I really think that a hybrid console with the PS5/PS5 Pro power could be great for Sony in every scenario.
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It's the "Jack of all trades, master of none" situation. I get that people like it, and obviously Nintendo shows that it sells well, but it doesn't do handheld better than a standalone handheld would, and it doesn't do home console better than a standalone home console would. I would prefer to have two separate devices that are masterclasses in their respective markets versus a singular device that is decent.

Also, since Sony would have the standalone PlayStation 6, the hybrid device would make even less sense. Why release the hybrid AND the standalone?
 
KeplerL2 said:
I can confirm Canis is the codename for the handheld. As for the PS6 console I heard a different codename, but maybe it was for an earlier revision and Orion is the final name.
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You still think Xbox is launching first (with their own proprietary locked down first party Xbox Handheld variant, like a Series S option, and unlike the handheld PC's with OS debloat and an Xbox sticker slapped on for PR), a year or two, before the PS6 and the PS6 Portable?
 
IFireflyl said:
It's the "Jack of all trades, master of none" situation. I get that people like it, and obviously Nintendo shows that it sells well, but it doesn't do handheld better than a standalone handheld would, and it doesn't do home console better than a standalone home console would. I would prefer to have two separate devices that are masterclasses in their respective markets versus a singular device that is decent.

Also, since Sony would have the standalone PlayStation 6, the hybrid device would make even less sense. Why release the hybrid AND the standalone?
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I think is going to be a hybrid, just one system and the PC ports for full graphics settings. IMO
 
Nintendo drove everyone crazy. A PS6 handheld would either mean a new Series X/S situation or a new Vita. There won't be a perfect solution like with Nintendo.
 
LordOcidax said:
That's not technically possible, the difference is going to be bigger than X and S…
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Yes, PS5 level gpu would be overkill.

What I am saying is, get it more powerful than what is inside current Switch 2, get full dlss suite. It needs to be no compromise desktop system.

Develop everything for portable switch with DRS and option to unlock framerate. Simply get higher performance and resolution on desktop unit. That can then upscale via DLSS.

No VRR issues, better VFM, experience tailored for respective portable and desktop form factor. That IMO would be better as a customer.
 
Cakeboxer said:
Nintendo drove everyone crazy. A PS6 handheld would either mean a new Series X/S situation or a new Vita. There won't be a perfect solution like with Nintendo.
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Nintendo can get away with it cause expectations from them is low.

From PS, people expect latest hardware. That puts portable in tough spot. Am not even sure how a portable will match PS5 level performance with 20 watts of power.
 
vaibhavpisal said:
I like this.

Option to get a desktop or portable system based on your needs.

Nintendo should also do this instead of cramming everything in a single system, making it worse for everyone use case.
Click to expand...
That only benefit those who only play in one way; portable or stationary. Everybody who play in both ways would need to buy two devices to not lose out in some way.

Imagine if Sony would do day 1 PC ports, then I could just get the portable PS6 for portable gaming and use the PC for stationary gaming.
Would save me money. But we can't have that of course.
 
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Imagine the battery life on this thing.

A portable ps6 with an hour and a half battery? Unless there's been some crazy innovation in that space.

I think this is a bad idea but maybe its the only way sony think they can win back marketshare in Japan.
 
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I once believed the PS5 14TF leaks because even reliable leakers were 100% certain that this would be the case. Yet we ended up with a small GPU that was overclocked to the maximum just to reach 10TF. I no longer believe in leaks about consoles, because the people behind them obviously have a wild imagination and just to make fun from naive people.

However, I have reasonable expectations regarding the PS56's power. I expect it to have twice the GPU power of the PS5 Pro (around the level of the 9070XT or RTX 4080) and good PT performance (at least on a par with the Ada Lovelace). GPU power above 9070XT performance in PS6 would be big surprise to me and for now I dont believe people will get 5090 performance level in a console eve 2 years from now.
 
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Fess said:
That only benefit those who only play in one way; portable or stationary. Everybody who play in both ways would need to buy two devices to not lose out in some way.
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Yes.

Idea is not to have a compromised experience.

PS 6 will be full fledged and will be no compromise. Only handheld users will have to contend with PS5 low power version ports. Which is fine on small screen and expected.
 
Most of my gaming is done away from the TV so I'd definitely be interested in a PS6 portable.

Edit: Then again if all the games are coming to Steam as well then probably not.
 
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IFireflyl said:
The alternative is an Xbox Series S/X situation, but even worse. You want it to be more difficult for developers to make games, and have the handheld console hamstringing the entire generation?
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It doesn't have to be an xbox series s/x situation. Does the steam deck hamstring games to you?
 
vaibhavpisal said:
Yes.

Idea is not to have a compromised experience.

PS 6 will be full fledged and will be no compromise. Only handheld users will have to contend with PS5 low power version ports. Which is fine on small screen and expected.
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We've been through this, it only works in theory. It'll backfire into a Series S scenario. Games will either skip the portable PS6 or hold back what devs can do with the stationary PS6. Devs don't like it, gamers don't like it, nobody likes it. One device that does it all is the way to do it.
 
The timing of discovery of the code names makes 2027 release a high probability, keeping Sony in the 7 year cycle.

JHwqrRWIRNGUxUyp.jpeg


Interesting question is whether we could see a shift to Spring / Summer launches. Nintendo has demonstrated the viability twice - you build up inventory and installed base for the monster Q4 season.
 
Fess said:
We've been through this, it only works in theory. It'll backfire into a Series S scenario. Games will either skip the portable PS6 or hold back what devs can do with the stationary PS6. Devs don't like it, gamers don't like it, nobody likes it. One device that does it all is the way to do it.
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Personally I just want a way to play Nintendo games without compromise.

Which is not possible cause its one system. Too big for portable use, underpowered for desktop use. S/X situation is better IMO.
 
Whats the point of talking about ps6 and next gen psp if Sony PS will just become multiplatform? I rather go for switch 2 and also save allot of money for a very good PC rig.
 
Corporal.Hicks said:
I once believed the PS5 14TF leaks because even reliable leakers were 100% certain that this would be the case. Yet we ended up with a small GPU that was overclocked to the maximum just to reach 10TF. I no longer believe in leaks about consoles, because the people behind them obviously have a wild imagination and just to make fun from naive people.
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If you swallowed that then what you believed in was targeted FUD. What you believe in now seems to be the fanboy spin on what we actually got rather than the words of the designer himself. What we ended up with was a console designed around a different paradigm; less about theoretical raw 'potential' with big numbers and all about planning around a power budget first and foremost.

Corporal.Hicks said:
However, I have reasonable expectations regarding the PS56's power. I expect it to have twice the GPU power of the PS5 Pro (around the level of the 9070XT or RTX 4080) and good PT performance (at least on a par with the Ada Lovelace).
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Seems you will be disappointed yet again. It's been said many, many times before - future hardware will be less about more and more of the same, bigger and bigger numbers for higher and higher theoretical raw power as there's little mileage in that when it becomes ridiculously expensive. It will be more about using the last decade's worth of developments in ML image enhancement, scaling, ray reconstruction, frame generation, all that stuff that gives more performance for less cost and power.
 
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