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[brian!]

yeah that's probably the case
it was probably the best for standardized play even at lower levels, like there was not much to think about besides "time giants for early golems" and "is mines gud to go??" and "two laaanes? 4-1"

the closest thing to it was booty bay because the map is so ostentatious about having bot be a solo lane, but even there ppl did the 4-1 but didnt play the 4-1 correctly
like the conclusion ppl came out with is dont fight for the vision and im just like ughhhhh

 

[Alur]

It took a good while for 4-1 to catch on in Haunted Mines. Not til sometime into beta really and we play at a decent level. In Alpha it was always like 2-3 and so forth.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Lol Blaze got knocked out by a weird ass comp round 1 after nearly giving C9 a run for the money just yesterday.

 

[Milly79]

Yeah I did not agree with Ehro's assessment on Greymane. Who else is that good at finish kills? Who else has splash AAs (granted at 20, and no Hammer). He also has some insane burst with W Q at 16. He is a jack of all trades, but I can't think of anyone that can finish kills like he can on a whim.

 

[brian!]

itd be cool if all jake did was describe burritos, big fan of this

 

[Alur]

Sure he can finish kills, but he has to get in to do that and can be easily punished is their point. If he's gonna to have to stick at range (which he often does in the games I see) you're better off with a real ranged hero. The 20 talent is awesome, but it's at level 20 and kind of negates the argument that he finishes kills to me. If he's better off AAing at that point he's no longer doing what he's being picked for (if finishing is what he's picked for). You could argue it helps him do everything better but it's a level 20 talent. That's a long ass wait.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

That's under the presumption you're having a 20 minute equal teamfight. If your comp is able to enable him he will always at least trade 1 for 1, more often than not more if he won't just get a pick. He's one of the most punishing assassins.

And it's not like they'll know exactly when he'll go in since he can just as well stay at range.

THC is running him right now but in pretty much an all squishy build so idk.

 

[Ketch]

Yeah I did not agree with Ehro's assessment on Greymane. Who else is that good at finish kills? Who else has splash AAs (granted at 20, and no Hammer). He also has some insane burst with W Q at 16. He is a jack of all trades, but I can't think of anyone that can finish kills like he can on a whim.

I think he's pretty comparable to zeratul. I think zera is safer but gm gives better damage numbers. And vp is op


What are the other good podcasts to listen too? Because THH really is pretty craptastic lately.

It was good for that, but the bolded is something probably 70-80% of the player base can't be fussed with. It's just a game to log in, do dailies, get to play as Thrall and Arthas and GTFO.

This is also exactly me on most days. I do kind of like QM for that reason too.

 

[Ketch]

Double post

 

[Milly79]

Into the Nexus is pretty good, although they're kind of nooby about certain shit. Core is also okay, but I wouldn't recommend it over ITN.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Played with a rank 11 Johanna just now that insisted on staying on a shrine while the opposing team was deathballing... Almost made a comeback but we needed another favourable teamfight we didn't get. Really not a fan of triple squishy comps anymore.

Also had to report 2 people from my team...

 

[Alur]

What are the other good podcasts to listen too? Because THH really is pretty craptastic lately.

Into the Nexus is kind of a happy medium between informed and casual. Garrett is completely casual and fairly noob and Kyle is like a lot of us. Reads up a bunch, right about some things and wrong about others. He's rank 1 and somewhere above 3k MMR. They don't talk much about the pro scene, it's more about the game and the changes and things of that sort.

Core is Scott Johnson's (from The Instance (WoW)) HOTS podcast that he started not too long ago. It's a good listen to just "listen" to, but the information and views represented are definitely farther on the 70-80% of people who just play this game fun end than on the "this is actual true/useful information end". I enjoy that about it, though. It's a pretty genuine look at what the vast majority of people playing HOTS are thinking as they go through the game.

There's also Anna Prosser and Gillyweed's podcast (I forget the name) but it's not on iTunes or YouTube to my knowledge. You have to watch it live or be a sub to their channel to see the VODs.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Another game on ToD another game lost despite a more than sizeable lead. For some reason we just fell apart around lvl 20 and lost one teamfight after another.

Worst thing was people would go in after we had already sustained a loss and end up dying in vain. We even had Li Ming and Rehgar. Knew I should have locked her in myself when I had the chance.

1st 2 picks are BW and Artanis, complains about me picking Tyrande, like honestly I had zero clue what to pick our comp was fucked. Then BW goes and does not take phase shift and takes winds at 10, goes on to complain to me all game why we're losing, Artanis gets 1v1d by Illidong, and Arthas misses all his skillshots. Today reminded me why I don't play HL, dumb fucks who trihard and put the blame on a single player. Even when I lose I rarely blame a single player and I don't exempt myself from blame, mostly.

Seriously though whom do you take as 5th after your team picked BW, Artanis, Arthas, Jaina vs. the opponents Li Ming, Illidan, Rehgar, Diablo and Greymane. I guess Tassadar would probably have been better but someone explain to me how BW alone should have outhealed that comp.

 

[brian!]

Raynor is pretty good there, kill whoever dives first, see if your frontline knows how to kite back

The only thing is artanis is really wack here and ur engage is booty but i guess bw/arthas kind of works

 

[Ketch]

Tass with shrink ray / force wall maybe.

Yea I don't get the BW pick on that map....

Maybe you could have gone abathur?

But you can't dodge fights on that map


Divine hurricane uther

Maybe falstad

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I was considering Abathur but wasn't confident enough, it being on cursed hollow it would probably have been the right pick. Toxic Nest is a real pain early to mid game and annoying late game.

Anyway, the next game I got Li Ming and went to town, 12-25-0 despite neither taking dominance nor diamond skin, taking glass cannon and our healer being a bot for the first half of the game. Opponents just had too passive a comp that had no way to dive me and if they tried Greymane was there.

Dodged a Pyroblast again, feels good.

It's interesting that the lower you go down leagues the more popular teleport build becomes on Ming Lee but I've also seen it in competitive. I don't think it's as viable. I prefer taking Glass Cannon at 13 so Calamity is already hamstrung and can still go into diamond skin if I need to no matter if I skilled into it prior. Also wonder if Tal Rasha's is still skewed by pre nerf picks, Temporal Flux is way better.

 

[Milly79]

14 chulpas

 

[brian!]

Bw is pretty good on tod where the soak maxing is really important and the objective spawning is really long, plus the standoffs at those things are where her type of healing works best, ganks w/ w are good too in those long lanes

Not saying that all this is stuff your bw did in the game though lol. Raynor's ok on tod, not great, but if bw heals are a concern raynor has self-sustain and ur comp is missing sustained dmg

 

[Ketch]

dude hovers li li for the entire draft, on his pick he switch between li li and malf like 2 or 3 times, so I locked in zagara and then he goes valla at the last second and we have no support.


we won anyway, because the enemy team must have been terrible.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Bw is pretty good on tod where the soak maxing is really important and the objective spawning is really long, plus the standoffs at those things are where her type of healing works best, ganks w/ w are good too in those long lanes

Not saying that all this is stuff your bw did in the game though lol. Raynor's ok on tod, not great, but if bw heals are a concern raynor has self-sustain and ur comp is missing sustained dmg

That post was structured poorly, the game w/ BW and Artanis was on Cursed Hollow and over in 15 minutes.

 

[Ketch]

so after like 3 month break, come back and play like half dozen hero league games and finally hit rank 10 after being stuck at 11/12 for the longest time.


maybe it's the new matchmaking?

either way, only 10 more to go.

also, I have a 100% winrate with jaina in HL

 

[Seiru]

You know, Blizzard has said many times that they don't try to give winning/losing streaks to maintain 50% winrate, but my history is absolutely filled with patterns like this:

It's really tiresome when it happens. Every one of those games was a total steamroll for the other team.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Just more reminders why I don't play HL today. It's a toxic mess for me. So much for inflating my MMR by bigger gains on hotslogs. Just gonna duoqueue HL from now on.
For some reason I've never gotten a single quest that can be completed playing just Ming Lee the last couple days.

 

[Maledict]

Sure he can finish kills, but he has to get in to do that and can be easily punished is their point. If he's gonna to have to stick at range (which he often does in the games I see) you're better off with a real ranged hero. The 20 talent is awesome, but it's at level 20 and kind of negates the argument that he finishes kills to me. If he's better off AAing at that point he's no longer doing what he's being picked for (if finishing is what he's picked for). You could argue it helps him do everything better but it's a level 20 talent. That's a long ass wait.

As a ranged hero, he deals more damage than Raynor. He's one of the highest ranged damage auto attackers in the game, and the cocktail build gives him fantastic poke. Him staying in ranged form for most of the game, and using Worgen & heroic just to execute people, isn't weakening him in any way - he does freaky amounts of damage.

In terms of finishing kills, at level 16 he gets the ability to unavoidably murder most backline squishies if they hit 75% health, without any counter play beyond a shield. Cocktail + leap + swipe + auto attack + heroic will kill a squishy in under a second, from ranged. No other hero in the game can suddenly get in your face and kill people as aggresisvely as he can.

He's like a ranged illidan with more damage and worse escapes.

(I actually think all of his level 20 talents suck ass, and very rarely do they make any difference).

He's also drafted in Korea as well, so either NA scene is the only one to have worked out he isn't good, or NA is wrong. Given that in every other meta discussion, NA has been behind the rest of the world (Two tanks, Tyrael etc etc), you can guess where I think the truth lies...

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

You forget that these are inferior regions that were never ahead of the NA meta before.

 

[DaMasta113]

Just set a personal record for kills ever since they switched to the kills/death/assist stats. 17 with Zeratul. Simply went hunting.

 

[Maledict]

Well done - those type of Zeratul games are such fun!


Navi just respect first- banned Greymane against TL twice because they don't want Cris to be playing him. He's not a good hero mind you.

 

[Milly79]

All the snark in this thread!

 

[Ketch]

I thought erho was the only one claiming he's bad.

I like him, he reminds me of zeratul who happens to be one of the best heroes in the game so greymane can't be that bad.

 

[Milly79]

I don't think he said he was bad. Just that there are heroes that do it better than he does.

 

[Ketch]

well erho also thinks artanis is as good as sonya so he's clearly insane.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

All the snark in this thread!

that's how THH sounds

 

[Ketch]

no... THH is way worse.

For example, you might actually know something about this game where as Jake can only regurgitate what the pros do or say. I hate that guy now.


Milly, do you remember that one caster dude from blizzcon maybe who really needed to be punched in the face? I think it was secretly jake.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Google got signed by epsilon, whoever that is.

Gonna look into into the nexus.

 

[brian!]

this navi vs. tsam game a great example of a game where the early lead dictates the game

 

[Alur]

Thought bkb was going back to Virtus Pro? Or after this tournament concludes?

 

[brian!]

yeah they are playing it out

 

[Milly79]

Milly, do you remember that one caster dude from blizzcon maybe who really needed to be punched in the face? I think it was secretly jake.

ToD... :/

 

[Ketch]

oh yea. screw that guy.

 

[Alur]

This game though. Yikes.

EDIT: Zagara just food for Illidan. And so many entombs and maws on just Jo.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

ToD is awesome. Don't you guys mean teknolink

 

[Alur]

Nah, they mean ToD. He looks like Milan Lucic and apparently came across to some folks (based on here and reddit) as a douche. Doesn't help that Milan Lucic is one of the biggest assholes in the NHL lol.

And yeah Teknolink was awful at the MSI thing too.

 

[Ketch]

what stream are you guys watching? NA ETS? Should we start a GAF chat?

 

[Alur]

I didn't know NA was on. After EU ended I swapped to NA LCS. Any notable teams playing today?

 

[Ketch]

didn't recognize any teams, but some players here and there on random teams...

not great play, but some sick wombo combos which were fun to watch

 

[Alur]

One thing I was thinking about re: Jake, THH, etc...

Is the growing disdain for Jake and disillusionment with THH something that is happening outside this thread as well? I don't go to the HOTS reddit as much anymore so I really have no clue. I just find it interesting how the community (or at least this part of it) has turned on him so compared to the Kings of the Storm days.

Could Jake ever be edged out of his perch as the premier NA face for HOTS?

 

[Milly79]

Maybe Jake should be less of a cock

 

[Ketch]

Still no talents leaked for xul?

 

[DaMasta113]

Still no talents leaked for xul?

Just be patient.

 

[Spl1nter]

Finally got Rank 1. I am not good at the game, other players are just worse. I failed upwards.