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PoliGAF 2015-2016 |OT3| If someone named PhoenixDark leaves your party, call the cops

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Not open for further replies.
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
Cheebo said:
lol.

I am not just going to randomly make up stuff off the top of my head to upset Bernie-stans, I said that because I read a few months back. Bernie's campaign does enough dumb things on it's own (see: Culinary Union) that I don't need to waste my energy making up stuff about it.
Click to expand...

I can't comment on this but it wouldn't stun me. I know three women who have (quietly) resigned from Sanders' staff or campaign due to sexual harassment or inappropriate/sexist comments that weren't properly addressed. He is surrounded by some pretty distasteful men, to put it lightly, and running against Hillary Clinton has really given them the opportunity to run amok in terms of unacceptable language.

When I worked on Obama's 08 campaign this type of stuff was stamped out ASAP; they were deathly afraid of any perception of sexism, the media reaction, and Clinton running with it. Needless to say this is one of the reasons why I really don't like Sanders' campaign.
 
P

PBY

Banned
Cesare Borgia said:
I can't comment on this but it wouldn't stun me. I know three women who have (quietly) resigned from Sanders' staff or campaign due to sexual harassment or inappropriate/sexist comments properly addressed. He is surrounded by some pretty distasteful men, to put it lightly, and running against Hillary Clinton has really given them the opportunity to run amok in terms of unacceptable language.

When I worked on Obama's 08 campaign this type of stuff was stamped out ASAP; they were deathly afraid of any perception of sexism, the media reaction, and Clinton running with it. Needless to say this is one of the reasons why I really don't like Sanders' campaign.
Click to expand...

Somehow the GOP primary - which is steeped in grossness - has managed to be more fun than the Dems. Really just want it to be over.
 
H

Holmes

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
I can't comment on this but it wouldn't stun me. I know three women who have (quietly) resigned from Sanders' staff or campaign due to sexual harassment or inappropriate/sexist comments that weren't properly addressed. He is surrounded by some pretty distasteful men, to put it lightly, and running against Hillary Clinton has really given them the opportunity to run amok in terms of unacceptable language.
Click to expand...
Can you back this up with a source? Or is it just something you've heard through the grapevine?
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
Basileus777 said:
I feel like it's more people using this thread to vent about how terrible the Bernie/Hillary discussions are elsewhere.
Click to expand...

Literally every community thread I've gone into today has people shitting posters outside of the thread; BCT and LGBT GAF regularly post links to mock posters, gaming communities talk about "don't go over to Gaming-side, it's shit", this thread talking about politics threads in off-topic.

Ergo, NeoGAF is uniformly shit, we just pretend we have a few people who aren't, and they all happen to be in the same threads as us :)
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Fuchsdh said:
Literally every community thread I've gone into today has people shitting posters outside of the thread; BCT and LGBT GAF regularly post links to mock posters, gaming communities talk about "don't go over to Gaming-side, it's shit", this thread talking about politics threads in off-topic.

Ergo, NeoGAF is uniformly shit, we just pretend we have a few people who aren't, and they all happen to be in the same threads as us :)
Click to expand...

UK and AusPoli do none of that. Should give it a try.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
Holmes said:
Can you back this up with a source? Or is it just something you've heard through the grapevine?
Click to expand...

A source as in a link? No. These are women I know and worked with when I worked in DC. I have no reason to doubt their stories, and I know firsthand how certain Sanders staff act towards women.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Coriolanus said:
UK and AusPoli do none of that. Should give it a try.
Click to expand...

UKPoliGAF is surprisingly diverse, though - it doesn't have the sort of echo chamber to sustain covert bitching because there will be at least on regular who agrees with any given opinion (to a degree, at least). USPoliGAF is not representative of the GAF average political opinion.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
Y2Kev said:
I think this is seriously dangerous thinking. Bush has less of a shot than Christie or Carson? Jeb is a moron but he will have probably the most developed infrastructure. He won't have grass roots support or enthusiasm but neither will Hillary. Hillary is not Obama; she's an average retail politician. Right to rise does have money to start with the negative ads right away just like Obama did in 2012.

I think Cruz is more formidable than people think.
Click to expand...

I just don't see how Bush brings people out to vote or how people on the fence could possibly choose him over Hillary when literally the previous 2 presidents prior to Obama were a Bush and a Clinton and one is considered a massive success and the other a disaster.

I don't think money matters that much in a general presidential election and honestly, Hillary would end up with more vs Jeb! most likely.

Cruz is a snake and people see it pretty quickly. And he's too far right to be elected.
 
C

Cybit

FGC Waterboy
Fuchsdh said:
Literally every community thread I've gone into today has people shitting posters outside of the thread; BCT and LGBT GAF regularly post links to mock posters, gaming communities talk about "don't go over to Gaming-side, it's shit", this thread talking about politics threads in off-topic.

Ergo, NeoGAF is uniformly shit, we just pretend we have a few people who aren't, and they all happen to be in the same threads as us :)
Click to expand...

Alas, this is true. There are definitely some community threads that are way more hypocritical about this than others, though. I try to avoid those.

Aaron Strife said:
PoliGAF is the only community on GAF I call home
Click to expand...

Newer resident of PoliGAF here, besides that it is Asian-GAF, FGC-GAF, WressleGAF, and NFL/NBA-GAF during the season.

Crab said:
UKPoliGAF is surprisingly diverse, though - it doesn't have the sort of echo chamber to sustain covert bitching because there will be at least on regular who agrees with any given opinion (to a degree, at least). USPoliGAF is not representative of the GAF average political opinion.
Click to expand...

True - though USPoliGAF itself is extremely left in general. Most of the conservative GAF (or frankly, even moderate GAF posters) have probably abandoned OT due to the harassment they get there.

Cesare Borgia said:
A source as in a link? No. These are women I know and worked with when I worked in DC. I have no reason to doubt their stories, and I know firsthand how certain Sanders staff act towards women.
Click to expand...

:-/ Obviously a bit skeptical - but Sanders does seem to not have the best grasp over his staffers based on earlier posts.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
Cybit said:
Rubio is my legitimate worry. I think he could beat Clinton. The Dems would be hard pressed to do the "Republican is the racist white person party line of attacks" with Rubio running; and many Latinos are socially conservative. Plus, he is young, charismatic, and once he gets to the GE; doesn't really have to move past his stump speech. Watching the evangelicals going to Trump, the GOP voters seem willing to fall into line with people they don't necessarily agree with. So I think he could get a good chunk of that anti-foreigner vote even being Latino himself.

That said, I am watching an up till recently moderate democrat-leaning white man from NY manage to take over the entire Republican Party in less then a year. I am not putting anything past Trump after that. He should have no chance to beat Clinton - but we might be watching him pull off a "no chance" thing right now, sooooo he still worries me.

EDIT: Also, I'm 50/50 on the entire "Clintons put him up to this to destroy the GOP" conspiracy. You couldn't write a theoretical textbook way to destroy the GOP then Trump is pulling off, and that is a heck of a coincidence.
Click to expand...

I can't convey how relieved I am so far that Rubio doesn't look like he's taking off anytime soon. Trump and Cruz are nonstarters. Jeb! would turn the race into a very flattering Bush Years-vs-Clinton Years referendum. Kasich and Christie aren't happening.

Even if there's a terror attack, Hillary's surprisingly trusted in such circumstances. Hell, it might even drive more voters to her
(and Bill)
and away from the buffoonish, green Trump.

And as far as conspiracy goes: I want a miniseries out of this entire cycle. Put it on HBO, make it 16 episodes. This would make for some amazing television.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
NeoXChaos said:
He worked for Sanders and his staff in the past.
Click to expand...

For the record, I did not work for Sanders and his staff. I've worked with them on many occasions, especially in 2009/2010. I think Sanders is a good man but I think he's naive and inefficient. He holds everyone to the highest ideological standards while not holding himself or his staff to far more basic, universal ones.
 
N

NeoXChaos

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
For the record, I did not work for Sanders and his staff. I've worked with them on many occasions, especially in 2009/2010. I think Sanders is a good man but I think he's naive and inefficient. He holds everyone to the highest ideological standards while not holding himself or his staff to far more basic, universal ones.
Click to expand...

"with". Gotcha.
 
U

User1608

Banned
NeoXChaos said:
use that anger and apply for citizenship like those guys in Nevada.
Click to expand...
Never heard of this lol. I certainly am gonna vote with fury years from now!:p

Cesare Borgia said:
A source as in a link? No. These are women I know and worked with when I worked in DC. I have no reason to doubt their stories, and I know firsthand how certain Sanders staff act towards women.
Click to expand...
That's a damn shame. Really disappointed in Bernie. Sorry to hear that.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
HylianTom said:
Even if there's a terror attack, Hillary's surprisingly trusted in such circumstances. Hell, it might even drive more voters to her
(and Bill)
and away from the buffoonish, green Trump.
Click to expand...

Y'know.

If there's one thing that legit worries me about hills, it is how she'd most likely respond to a terror attack.

Which obv is a bonus to 'mericans
 
U

User 406

Banned
Y2Kev said:
Does anyone actually ever say that (besides Hillary?)? Bill was good so Hillary must be too?
Click to expand...

Well, Bill and Hillary did originally sell themselves as a team back in '92. The two of them have always been hardcore politicos, and she did take a very active role right up until the Republicans pulled the rug out from under her health care reform initiative. It's not unreasonable to consider this run as the other half of a tag team match.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Btw that Marquette poll has Walker at a 38% approval rating. When asked if he should try for a third term 36% say yes, 61% say no.

Hopefully he, Snyder, Scott and Kasich all get sent packing together. Too bad NC gov doesn't have a say in redistricting because that would be a great get this year.
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
Fuchsdh said:
Literally every community thread I've gone into today has people shitting posters outside of the thread; BCT and LGBT GAF regularly post links to mock posters, gaming communities talk about "don't go over to Gaming-side, it's shit", this thread talking about politics threads in off-topic.

Ergo, NeoGAF is uniformly shit, we just pretend we have a few people who aren't, and they all happen to be in the same threads as us :)
Click to expand...

Replace neogaf with humanity and community thread with any grouping of humans and you would be accurate. Everyone loves a villain.
 
C

Cheebo

Banned
Aaron Strife said:
Btw that Marquette poll has Walker at a 38% approval rating. When asked if he should try for a third term 36% say yes, 61% say no.

Hopefully he, Snyder, Scott and Kasich all get sent packing together. Too bad NC gov doesn't have a say in redistricting because that would be a great get this year.
Click to expand...
Snyder can't run for a third time, he is term limited. He is out after this term no matter what.
 
U

User 406

Banned
Aaron Strife said:
Btw that Marquette poll has Walker at a 38% approval rating. When asked if he should try for a third term 36% say yes, 61% say no.

Hopefully he, Snyder, Scott and Kasich all get sent packing together. Too bad NC gov doesn't have a say in redistricting because that would be a great get this year.
Click to expand...

Kasich can't run next term, Ohio Governors have a term limit of two consecutive terms.

And I hope to almighty fuck that he falls down some stairs in the intervening four years.
 
R

RastaMentality

Banned
CNN, MSNBC Plan Coverage of Donald Trump Event Opposite Fox News Debate
Both CNN and MSNBC intend to cover parts of an event Republican Presidential candidate Donald Trump intends to hold in Iowa during Fox News Channel’s broadcast of a Republican debate this evening.

MSNBC plans to cover portions of the Trump event live, including a speech by the candidate during the 9 p.m. hour, according to a spokeswoman for the NBCUniversal-owned cable network. Time Warner’s CNN, meanwhile, could treat it as a live news event, according to a person familiar with the situation, with coverage will largely depending on the nature of what is being presented.
Click to expand...


Also, I know GE polling is kinda irrelevant now but Luntz tested a Bloomberg candidacy:
Luntz's reasoning came from a nationwide poll of 900 likely voters conducted by his firm, Luntz Global Partners.

The survey found that 29% of Americans would support Bloomberg in a theoretical three-way race between the former mayor, GOP front-runner Donald Trump, and Democratic front-runner Hillary Clinton. Trump would receive 37% of the vote, while Clinton would emerge with 33%.

In a three-way race with Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) and Clinton, Bloomberg would receive 28% of the vote. Clinton, meanwhile, would come out on top with 37% while Cruz would take 34%.
Click to expand...
 
C

campfireweekend

Member
Black Mamba said:
Whoa, looks like a lot of conversation was spurred on by Campfire's misreading of my post.

Campfire, I am not an MMTer. I never said deficits do not matter (my personal belief is they probably do matter at some point under certain circumstances).

Here's what I said: "As a society, we should spend what we want and then use taxes to help with inequality. Taxes and government revenue are not a balance sheet."

That doesn't imply "deficits don't matter." Why? Because the result could also be a surplus. Or an actual balance. My argument is that targeting a situation where Revenues = Taxes (or G - T = 0) is stupid. We should provide what we need to provide as efficiently as possible, balance inequality with taxes. If something is still out of whack, we can always make further adjustments.

The only time I actually specifically referenced deficits is here: "Mind you, that doesn't bother me as I'm totally down with increased deficit spending right now."

- Implied I'm not always for increased deficit spending.

"Or, you know, we can just run a deficit like we've pretty much always done. - statement of fact.

The other instances related to arguments Bernie could make (or others).

So yeah, I believe we should be increasing our deficits right now (directly through spending). That's Keynesian if anything.




Now, on to everybody else:



Right, I admitted the $250k was too high and was just typing too quickly. But of course, we don't have to only raise income taxes. Uncap SS/Medicare taxes. Raise capital gains, financial transaction tax, carbon tax, etc. Just target certain areas that aren't regular folks.

The ACA mandate will be eventually what, 2.5%? So it's close, I suppose. But poor people don't have to pay that (and a lot don't get medicaid).

My issue is more optics than policy, here. bernie simply isn't going to convince people to vote for him by promising to raise everyone's taxes. So don't. Just raise it elsewhere and let it play out. You can always raise later when the fundamentals are better.



Like I said, I don't care about the revenue neutrality of a plan. And Bernie can simply lie about it with fuzzy math like the GOPers do regarding dynamic scoring.



No, he wouldn't have to at all. Just offer the plan, claim his taxes on the wealthy via X Y Z will cover it, and say the math works to be revenue neutral even when it doesn't. This is politics, not CBO training.



I didn't explain myself properly (typing quickly on phone then). It's not that I cared about that, is that in my rush I was simply using the current top tax bracket when if I stopped to think about it I'd have put the number much lower. More like it happened out of force of habit, like when you turn off a light in a room forgetting that someone elseis there because usually some isn't!
Click to expand...

Sorry for the misread man. It's just that the spend whatever, use taxes not as funding but as a redistributive scheme (the latter of which I agree with) set off some pretty loud MMT bells in my head.

And I agree with the increased deficit spending rn, that is super Keynesian and I love Keynes.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
Tbf, mmt *generally* doesn't defend that deficits don't matter.

Dick Cheney does, tho.

anyway

Kraftwerk said:
qd1kplq.jpg
Click to expand...
 
R

RustyNails

Member
johnsmith said:
Write up about that Sanders Culinary Union story. Confirmed by the union itself.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/sanders-staffers-posed-as-union-members-in-vegas-218351

Original source
https://www.ralstonreports.com/blog...ading-culinary-members-campaign-inside-hotels
Click to expand...
Drives home the point cesare borgia made: Sanders has no control over his staff. Illegally copy DNC files, break and enter a highly respected union organization, allegations of sexism and racism in campaign. Dude has no control over his people. How can we trust him to be more in control while being a President??? Surprised the amateur campaign is lasting this long.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
RustyNails said:
Drives home the point cesare borgia made: Sanders has no control over his staff. Illegally copy DNC files, break and enter a highly respected union organization, allegations of sexism and racism in campaign. Dude has no control over his people. How can we trust him to be more in control while being a President??? Surprised the amateur campaign is lasting this long.
Click to expand...

Cuz then he'd actually have, y'know, experienced dem staffers? Instead of some dudes he's pulling out of reddit?

I dunno. is why hills for VP and stuff.
 
C

Cybit

FGC Waterboy
HylianTom said:
I can't convey how relieved I am so far that Rubio doesn't look like he's taking off anytime soon. Trump and Cruz are nonstarters. Jeb! would turn the race into a very flattering Bush Years-vs-Clinton Years referendum. Kasich and Christie aren't happening.

Even if there's a terror attack, Hillary's surprisingly trusted in such circumstances. Hell, it might even drive more voters to her
(and Bill)
and away from the buffoonish, green Trump.

And as far as conspiracy goes: I want a miniseries out of this entire cycle. Put it on HBO, make it 16 episodes. This would make for some amazing television.
Click to expand...

I do think Bush would fair better against Clinton then you do, just because he can invoke his dad and not his brother (and he even comes across nothing like his brother) - and I don't think he would make a major gaffe in the general election. He's very chill and can come across as a little professorial - but assuming that the GOP fell into line behind Bush, those are traits that might work better towards moderate / liberal leaning voters. If the Sanders / Clinton race gets heated, he could also come across as the calm person in the room, which post Trump / Cruz / hypothetical heated Clinton & Sanders primary - could be a desired trait.

Rubio - if he doesn't think he can win this primary, should prepare himself for 2020. If chaos happens this year and the GOP loses to HRC due to a lack of cohesion - either the GOP splinters, or the GOP goes 100% behind a chosen candidate in 2020 - and I think it would be Rubio. A united GOP behind Rubio / solid VP pick (maybe Condi Rice?) I think could absolutely crush HRC.

ugaboga232 said:
Replace neogaf with humanity and community thread with any grouping of humans and you would be accurate. Everyone loves a villain.
Click to expand...

When I saw that post, I immediately thought of you, lol.
 
C

Cybit

FGC Waterboy
H

HylianTom

Banned
Coriolanus said:
Y'know.

If there's one thing that legit worries me about hills, it is how she'd most likely respond to a terror attack.

Which obv is a bonus to 'mericans
Click to expand...
I sadly agree.

To be honest, there are few politicians whom I'd trust in those circumstances.

Cybit said:
I do think Bush would fair better against Clinton then you do, just because he can invoke his dad and not his brother (and he even comes across nothing like his brother) - and I don't think he would make a major gaffe in the general election. He's very chill and can come across as a little professorial - but assuming that the GOP fell into line behind Bush, those are traits that might work better towards moderate / liberal leaning voters. If the Sanders / Clinton race gets heated, he could also come across as the calm person in the room, which post Trump / Cruz / hypothetical heated Clinton & Sanders primary - could be a desired trait.

Rubio - if he doesn't think he can win this primary, should prepare himself for 2020. If chaos happens this year and the GOP loses to HRC due to a lack of cohesion - either the GOP splinters, or the GOP goes 100% behind a chosen candidate in 2020 - and I think it would be Rubio. A united GOP behind Rubio / solid VP pick (maybe Condi Rice?) I think could absolutely crush HRC.
Click to expand...
I don't think Hillary-Jeb would be a blowout. Jeb is too sensible/moderate-appearing for it to not be close.

Hillary's gotten incredibly lucky with having deeply flawed Republican opposition this year. If they can come-up with someone good in 2020, she's going to have a challenge on her hands, especially if the general public thinks it's finally "time for a change" after three Democratic terms.
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
RustyNails said:
Bolded was more tongue in cheek. But his ship is filled with idiots right now and that doesn't inspire confidence.
Click to expand...

Dude
Duuuude
You gotta see it from the other side!

He's polling THAT HIGH while commanding a ship filled with brain-dead twats and going against the strongest opponent the american electoral system has seen since Reagan! Just IMAGINE what he could do with people who could remove their heads from their posteriors! If he had access to Obama's people! Surround hills with incompetent cretins like the ones he's got to work with and see what would happen to her! The revolution is nigh, my friend, the revolution is nigh!
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
RustyNails said:
Drives home the point cesare borgia made: Sanders has no control over his staff. Illegally copy DNC files, break and enter a highly respected union organization, allegations of sexism and racism in campaign. Dude has no control over his people. How can we trust him to be more in control while being a President??? Surprised the amateur campaign is lasting this long.
Click to expand...

To be fair, who recommended the person who copied over the files :p
 
R

rjinaz

Member
Coriolanus said:
Dude
Duuuude
You gotta see it from the other side!

He's polling THAT HIGH while commanding a ship filled with brain-dead twats and going against the strongest opponent the american electoral system has seen since Reagan! Just IMAGINE what he could do with people who could remove their heads from their posteriors! If he had access to Obama's people! Surround hills with incompetent cretins like the ones he's got to work with and see what would happen to her! The revolution is nigh, my friend, the revolution is nigh!
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic or not but there is some truth to this. I think Bernie is doing remarkably well considering the circumstances and the odds he has to overcome. It would be nice to have the best of the best on his team, but he has to work with the left overs.
 
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