Outdoor Miner
Member
Why??? The dude didn't even like his job and he was also really bad at it. Smfh
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PoliGAF 2016 |OT5| Archdemon Hillary Clinton vs. Lice Traffic Jam
- Thread starter Spoiled Milk
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Why??? The dude didn't even like his job and he was also really bad at it. Smfh
cartoon_soldier
Member
It will be a traditional election like 2012 with bigger margins and flipping of NC.
Republicans will consolidate around Trump, you have to remember they have spent 20 years hating on the Clintons.
Republicans will consolidate around Trump, you have to remember they have spent 20 years hating on the Clintons.
Maybe *gasp* Jon Stewart has shitty opinions on politics because he's an ideologue himself, but an ideologue given a faux-soap box in the form of a comedy "news" show with little to no accountability, but that due to the depressing state of the real "news" broadcasts comes across seeming far more credible than he really is.
Nah, it's got to be a Hillary problem right? I mean, people wouldn't grind the axe against the most qualified woman to be POTUS in recent history just because of her gender, would they? Definitely not privileged middle aged white guys on the left especially.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
No really, women are 51% of voters. This is going to be incredibly easy.
Liberals panic way too much.
Liberals panic way too much.
Black Mamba
Member
I truly believe young people don't like Hillary. I didn't realize it was so prevalent until this election season, but it's there in my anecdotal experience.
That doesn't mean she won't beat Trump. But while people voted for Obama, I think the under 35 group is going to be voting against Trump rather than for Hillary.
You're overestimating this a bit. It's not like there aren't women who will ignore his sexism.
Like men, people have selfish reasons for voting. So many rich people will ignore his bigotry to ensure tax cuts. And many more examples.
Women aren't solely driven by one thing.
That doesn't mean she won't beat Trump. But while people voted for Obama, I think the under 35 group is going to be voting against Trump rather than for Hillary.
You're overestimating this a bit. It's not like there aren't women who will ignore his sexism.
Like men, people have selfish reasons for voting. So many rich people will ignore his bigotry to ensure tax cuts. And many more examples.
Women aren't solely driven by one thing.
whyamihere
Banned
North Dakota is slightly more elastic, was closer in 2008, and Heitkamp (though South Dakota has elected is fair share of Democrats state wide. Oil will kill Hillary there, if not other things).
Agreed. This is my assessment as well.
I mean... it statistically is a Hillary problem. Her unfavorables are really fucking high.
I'm not blaming her for anything, I think she's exceptionally qualified (and really, don't buy any of the authenticity stuff, etc.). But people don't like her.
Yeah, this is exactly how I feel.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Hillary has been in the public eye too much. Every politician flips on policy to meet current public opinion, but Hillary's flips have been seen to everyone since she's been covered forever. Duckworth and Harris and CVH will be more popular in 2024 than Hillary is now.
Outdoor Miner
Member
It's funny, for all the talk about Hillary being wooden or awkward, she IMO has actually looked the most comfortable and genuine being around people away from the podium. Moreso than any other person running in the primaries on either side at least.
Black Mamba
Member
There's probably some truth to this.
But to those of us who were old enough in the mid to late 90s to pay attention to politics, Hillary has been called a bitch more times than I can ever recall.
IMO, something about her always drove people to dislike her unlike her husband. I remember in the mid 2000s coming across lots of women who called her a bitch.
I've never understood it and obviously never agreed, but this sentiment isn't new. And with the young people there's also Clinton fatigue and years of being bashed.
She has been attacked ever since she showed she wasn't going to be the background, meek First Lady. And this was the 90s, so you can imagine how the media and Republicans reacted.
She has always been well-liked when she isn't running for office. Her favorabilities as SoS were pretty high.
Heitkamp won because Rick Berg was a terrible candidate that nobody liked. She's also relatively well liked and respected as a North Dakotan. Part of her campaign was the idea that she would go against Obama if necessary. She's more on the conservative side of being a Democrat I would wager.
There is a democratic backbone that ties back to Art Link, but if you think Hillary can flip ND, that's a fairy tale. It's not that strong.
Right now, there are only two real candidates for Gov. Stenjem and Burgum. Guess what, they are both Reps. Who's the Democratic candidate? Is there one? Doesn't seem that way.
whyamihere
Banned
I also think it's quite likely that Democrats get absolutely destroyed in 2020. I'd rather win the presidency for 4 years with all of its powers and judges, but I think there are going to be so many forces of nature working against Hillary, and the fact that her favorables are already in the toilet and probably won't increase that much once she wins, that someone else could come in with a slightly-more-competent Republican party to trounce her.
Well, yes, Heitkamp ran a great campaign, but the whole point of elasticity is that events like this can happen. I'm not saying that she can win, just that I think that North Dakota would flip before South Dakota.
Well, yes, Heitkamp ran a great campaign, but the whole point of elasticity is that events like this can happen. I'm not saying that she can win, just that I think that North Dakota would flip before South Dakota.
I never understood it either and if you asked them directly to explain they largely can't. Or if they come up with some canned response and you ask them for examples of things they couldn't produce them. The idea that their dislike or hate was based on nothing factual or even anything seemed to go over the heads of some of them.
I think we might have a bigger margin than Obama in 08, but maybe 10 points. I think a lot of conservatives, women included, will vote for him anyway.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Yeah, it's not even "dog whistle" sexism, it's straight up obvious sexism. It's amazing he won the primary for that reason alone.
Yoda
Member
You're really reaching, she'd have record unfavorables entering the GE if it weren't for Donald Trump. The electorate (on both sides) despise the establishment, HRC is the establishment. Stagnant wages + increasing cost of living + income inequality + student loans + (insert endemic decade(s) long middle class problem here) have beaten the trust out the American electorate. HRC speaks in ways that are clearly poll-tested/advisor driven; if she's afraid of speaking her mind, what is it exactly that the public is too stupid to understand so they need to be read script?
Also driving the narrative of the "privileged middle class white dudes" being bigoted because they don't agree with Sec. Clinton on every single issue is toxic and quite frankly goes against the liberal orthodoxy of inclusiveness. Shutting down debate with identity politics is what the right has done for decades, we really ought hold ourselves to a higher standard.
whyamihere
Banned
I think it only happens when you try to say that Hillary has a 50/50 shot of getting indicted in the face of any evidence to such an indictment is coming, but I'm not entirely sure.
Black Mamba
Member
Among young people, I think it's mostly just fatigue. Sick of hearing about the Clintons, Bushes, etc. Also the revisionism of the Clinton Presidency as if context didn't matter.
For those around at that time, I think a lot of it is pure sexism. Even sexism from women. Strong female women in the 90s had it even tougher than today. And that sentiment carried over for those people.
It's gross, but any career driven women back then (shit, even now still it often happens) was thought of as nothing but a bitch.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Bringing this over from the Simpsons gif thread for all the Bernie stans.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Can we get Bloomberg to start Just Asking Questions(tm) about whether or not Trump won't release his tax returns because Trump maybe isn't a real billionaire?
It won't. It's not that elastic. Not for the President anyways.
More localized elections? Sure.
All three (MT, ND, SD) will probably be red for quite some time.
It's anybody's guess. There's plenty of evidence out there that the law was broken. It's just a matter of if the FBI finds that to be true, and recommends the indictment. It's not as simple as nothing happened.
Like the former NSA/CIA director said at Tech Crunch, the Original Sin was building the server in the first place.
Four_Chamber
Member
So the blatant racism of Donald Trump's butler...holy crap
I cannot fathom how somebody lives their life with so much hate. It must be real tiring to be part of a generation (and ideology) that is fading into obscurity.
I do like the fact that Mother Jones screenshoted all those hellaciously racist (and threatening) Facebook posts- many old white people are going to be visited by the Secret Service
I cannot fathom how somebody lives their life with so much hate. It must be real tiring to be part of a generation (and ideology) that is fading into obscurity.
I do like the fact that Mother Jones screenshoted all those hellaciously racist (and threatening) Facebook posts- many old white people are going to be visited by the Secret Service
whyamihere
Banned
Again, let me say it one more time: I don't think Hillary will win North Dakota, but I'm explaining why I think if a state were to flip blue, North Dakota would likely flip before South Dakota.
There is more evidence recently that the FBI is winding down their investigation and they've found nothing to indict, because that has been what they have leaked to the press.
It actually is pretty simple.
shinra-bansho
Member
Almost spat out my coffee.
Also, there's nothing particularly meaningful in Stewart's comment. She isn't as warm in a public setting as some people are and she's guarded about what she says and does. She is a nerd.
This also goes back a bit to what I have mentioned before about women and leadership, gendered trait expectations and favourability. Doing things that all politicians do. Not doing things we expect women to do.
I'd imagine if you were to classify his view on Clinton as favourable or unfavourable it would fall in the unfavourable.
"Authenticity" is the most bullshit descriptive ever. And the stupidest way of trying to judge other people.
whyamihere
Banned
I can't prove that something won't happen until it definitively doesn't happen, but if you're waiting for an indictment, it's most likely you'll be waiting for a very long time. Until they find Vince Foster's body.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Black turnout this election is going to be really down though.
https://twitter.com/GideonResnick/status/730846547668287490
We can't talk about this? Is it not topical? What's the problem?
Fair enough, it's about the same as saying I'd think Trump can win NY before he wins California. It's futile.
As far as the Clinton illegal server, the FBI isn't going to show their hand that easily on an investigation of this sort.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Yup.
People are just mad that Hillary isn't just smiles and rainbows like other female politicians. That's what we've come to expect of women in politics. Men are absolutely not held to this standard. It's ironic that this comes from Stewart who spent 2004 palling around with Kerry and supporting him heavily when he's one of the most boring personalities in politics.
metalslimer
Member
I can't tell if this is better or worse than Diablosing. Is it Diablosing if you seem to actively wish it to happen?
shinra-bansho
Member
We can run in circles all you want, but there doesn't seem to be anything that will convince you that there is no indictment coming despite all appearances that it's fucking nothing and there is no grounds for indictment.
Everything is possible, because we live in the matrix.
Everything is possible, because we live in the matrix.
Macho Madness
Member
You're doing the same thing you did when we suggested the Pats might lose to the Broncos. Everyone else is dumb and you don't consider what they have to say remotely valid
Makes it really hard to have a conversation of any value
Fenderputty
Banned
whyamihere
Banned
I'm sort of done with this conversation because it's pointless, but this points to me that they've found nothing and it will be nothing.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/05/politics/fbi-interviews-huma-abedin-clinton-aide/
Again, because nothing has happened yet, I can't concretely say one way or another. And you can say "they wouldn't show their hands!", but I don't think that's correct.
I won't be convinced that there isn't an indictment coming until the FBI doesn't proceed with a recommendation to indict.
I give equal ground to the idea that an indictment won't happen.
Just by the fact that she's being investigated by the FBI tells me that the possibility is there, and there is evidence out there that could lead to an indictment.
I don't get why you all so easily brush that aside?
Tranqueris
Banned
Soon.
I'm trying to figure out who these other people (besides Hillary and Kamala Harris) are.
shinra-bansho
Member
I'm not going down your rabbithole. I'm just pointing out why nobody else wants to either.
My wonderland is better. It's full of fabulous.
My wonderland is better. It's full of fabulous.
And hypothetically if the FBI comes out and officially says that there was no evidence of wrongdoing, what will be your response?
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It's less that its a banned topic and more that you keep professing to know more than every source at the the FBI and every single journalist and legal commentator we've seen.
Your rabbit hole seems more like head in the sand.
I would be fine with that conclusion.
I don't profess to know more than the FBI. Searching around though, it's not as simple as "It's nothing!"
Guess we'll have to wait and see.
whyamihere
Banned
And someone could say yours would be grasping at straws.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Oh okay, we should definitely treat it as 50-50 because you searched around.
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