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[Smurfman256]

I agree. People are moaning over nothing.

I played competitive Quake 1 back in the day via modem with 130ms pings (On a really good day if we played about 5am) so they need to suck it up.

Ha! I've played Modern Warfare on 250 pings and I've STILL found myself kicking ass...ON A WIFI CONNECTION!

 

[AzaK]

Ha! I've played Modern Warfare on 250 pings and I've STILL found myself kicking ass...ON A WIFI CONNECTION!

Hehehe. Yeah 130 was very, very hard to get. It was normally in the 200+ range. All people need to do is just "suck less"

 

[KojiKnight]

Lag as in latency from a wifi router is a myth... Lag caused by drop outs is something that does happen in reality, especially in big cities where you have a LOT of overlapping wireless signals.

I can understand people who live in those situations wanting a wired connection... and for that Nintendo sells an ethernet adapter *is flamed about having to purchase an extra accessory* Use the one you currently use on your Wii then *flamed about not having a wii or not purchasing an adapter for it* then it sounds to me like the Wii U or internet connections were never that important to you begin with and you're just looking for something to pick a fight over.

 

[LCGeek]

Why does this myth persist?

Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=2ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=4ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=2ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=2ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.1:
Packets: Sent = 24, Received = 24, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 1ms, Maximum = 4ms, Average = 2ms

This is wireless with the router I'm connected to residing in the house next door. There is a minimum of 4 walls between the adapter and the router.

Unless you have extreme wireless interference, wireless networking with up to 2ms more latency is not going to affect your gaming, especially with netcodes designed to continue operating in conditions as bad as 200ms latency.

That is one of the most blantantly dishonest ways to test out what you're doing. There are also sites who go far more in depth on the subject than doing a simple ping test to show problems related to wireless. Wireless issue don't start there they tend to start on a router after it's done dealing with your side and often drop more packets than an ethernet connection overtime. Something doesn't need to be extreme most gamers with online experiences know it's about getting that lag or packet loss at a certain time is what really matters. Also wireless has a higher overhead than wired ethernet especially if we aren't talking about dsl. Some wireless formats have a small packet size, this important for consoles cause if you go under their minimums it makes the situation worse.

Wireless setup properly is rarely an issue. When it's not and people assume it is that's when issues tend to crop up and making gaming performance a pain. KojiKnight mentioned the biggest problem about wireless what happens when it leaves your network or for that matter your isp.

 

[AzaK]

You know we can put it to rest right? When we all get Wii U's, some of you wire yours up. Some of us go wireless and we'll duke it out.

 

[LCGeek]

You know we can put it to rest right? When we all get Wii U's, some of you wire yours up. Some of us go wireless and we'll duke it out.

The wireless vs wired debate in online gaming is often defeated by isps and the problems that get caused there.

 

[KojiKnight]

Yeah pinging the router wasn't the best way to test it, but you can do a tracert instead and it'll show you that there are likely many other things your ISP does stupidly that effects much much more.


For example, but OnLive first came out I was really interested in trying it... but was majorly disappointed in the lag. So I did a tracert to figure out if it was my end, or onlive's end. I found out that while I live in Central Florida, ALL of my traffic was routed through New York, adding about 50ms+ to everything I did!

After many calls to my ISP and trudging through the first level of "dumb" tech support, eventually the message got back to some engineers who realized it too was a stupid idea to be routing all of Florida's traffic through New York. Fixed a lot of lag issues in everything else I never knew I had.

 

[FyreWulff]

That is one of the most blantantly dishonest ways to test out what you're doing. There are also sites who go far more in depth on the subject than doing a simple ping test to show problems related to wireless. Wireless issue don't start there they tend to start on a router after it's done dealing with your side and often drop more packets than an ethernet connection overtime.

And so my point is made. The connection method does not matter because most of the issues happen outside of the actual tether between the console and the router, regardless of wired or wireless.

If you have a shit router, it's going to give you shit performance wired or wireless.

It'd be pointless to run a tracert, because I was demonstrating the connection between the router and me, not the overall packet hop route. That's a separate problem and a whole other ball of wax that both connection types have to deal with.

 

[LCGeek]

And so my point is made. The connection method does not matter because most of the issues happen outside of the actual tether between the console and the router, regardless of wired or wireless.

If you have a shit router, it's going to give you shit performance wired or wireless.

Seperate issues. Wired nic routers are straightforward and offer very problems setting up or leaving as is. Wireless problem come down to the format and how it deals with packets or transmitting very rarely will someone wired have to deal with this. By nature being on wireless you should make sure your security and how it transmits is optimal for your area or applications that are using it. If it's garbage wireless little you do will mater and the router will compound the problem same for the isp. Tranmission rate and quality along Overhead Are legitimate gripes against wireless. I just doubt most making the argument have the needs of a dedicated wired connection vs something that will do the job and most likely not drop packets.

If you host games then yes go for the best possible with no issues but just an average user who doesn't stream or host this is not an issue.

Not really arguing against just reinforcing certain things we agree on.

 

[Captain Smoker]

Just wanted to update this.

The Transformers Prime 1080p rumour is confirmed by the official game page at Nintendo. http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/wC6reCMSXUZ2_IMmcm3nK8P7aiaIBGwg

Mighty Switch Force HD is also 1080p. http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/k285w84WqIRjUU1H67ww7V2xYQjLhNux

Scribblenauts Unlimited 	[url=http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=38711446&postcount=60]1080p	   60 fps	FSAA[/url]
Transformers Prime		[url=http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/wC6reCMSXUZ2_IMmcm3nK8P7aiaIBGwg]1080p[/url]
Toki Tori 2			[url=http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-08-10-toki-tori-2-flutters-onto-wii-u-in-1080p]1080p[/url] 	   				    Off-TV
Dragon Quest X			[url=http://www.4gamer.net/games/139/G013996/20120920113/]1080p[/url]					    Off-TV
Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate	[url=http://bdashnews.wordpress.com/2012/10/02/famitsu-news-102/]1080p[/url]
Skylanders Giants		[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMsCXLcMwks]1080p					    Off-TV[/url]
Puddle				[url=http://gamersxtreme.org/2012/10/08/puddle-coming-to-the-wii-u-details-and-screenshots-included/]1080p	   60 fps			    Off-TV[/url]
Mighty Switch Force		[url=http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/k285w84WqIRjUU1H67ww7V2xYQjLhNux]1080p[/url]					    Off-TV

Call of Duty: Black Ops 2*	 [url=http://www.slashgear.com/black-ops-ii-wii-u-details-unleashed-13247525/]720p	   60 fps[/url]			    Off-TV
New Super Mario Bros. U		 720p 	   60 fps	AA		    Off-TV
Nintendo Land			 720p	   60 fps
Ninja Gaiden 3 			 720p 	   60 fps 		v-sync	    [url=http://ninjagaiden3.nintendo.com/wiiu.html]Off-TV[/url]
Batman 				 720p 	   30 fps 		v-sync
Wonderful 101			 720p	   [url=http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=498371]60 fps[/url]	
Rayman Legends			 720p	   [url=http://www.gamersyde.com/news_e3_rayman_legends_gameplay-12961_en.html]60 fps[/url]
Mass Effect 3			 [url=http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/31495]720p[/url]	   30 fps			    Off-TV
Pikmin 3 			 720p 	   60 fps
Nano Assault Neo		 [url=http://www.nanoassaultgame.com/neo/video/shinen_nano_assault_neo_trailer1_720p60_8mbit.mp4]720p	   60 fps[/url]			    Off-TV
Zombi U 			 720p 	   30 fps
Lego City: Undercover		 720p	   
Trine 2: Director's Cut 	 [url=http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=38685181&postcount=114]720p[/url]			[url=http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=38702037&postcount=138]FXAA[/url]		    Off-TV
Tekken Tag Tournament 2			   [url=http://www.nintendo-gamer.net/2012/02/27/how-tekken-wii-u-will-reinvent-the-videogame-fist/2/]60 fps[/url]
Wii Fit U								    Off-TV
Rabbids Land								    Off-TV
Sonic & All-Stars Racing Team		   [url=http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=42664265&postcount=170]30 fps[/url]			    Off-TV
Darksiders II								    Off-TV
Warriors Orochi 3						    	    Off-TV

*Activision guy + some news say it's 1080p, but it's probably 720p, still waiting for confirmation.

**Off-TV info thanks to D-e-f- (click for source).

 

[Kenka]

What an awesome chart CS.

 

[Chamber]

Nice chart.

Ninja Gaiden 3 has off-tv play according to the official site.

 

[Saint Gregory]

Zombi U is 720P/30fps? I didn't know that since I haven't been following the game all that closely.

Is there an explanation for why Ubi isn't targeting a higher framerate at the very least? I don't expect every launch game to hit 1080P/60fps but an exclusive game should have one or the other.

 

[CuboidFX]

Has Rayman Legends being 720p been confirmed anywhere? I can't see any reason for them to downgrade when it was 1080p on 360/PS3.

 

[Captain Smoker]

Nice chart.

Ninja Gaiden 3 has off-tv play according to the official site.

Thanks, updated.

Has Rayman Legends being 720p been confirmed anywhere? I can't see any reason for them to downgrade when it was 1080p on 360/PS3.

Everything that has no source is listed as 720p / 30fps, could be that Rayman runs at 1080p, there are some rumours, but no source sadly.

Source for 60fps Rayman: http://www.gamersyde.com/news_e3_rayman_legends_gameplay-12961_en.html

 

[Earendil]

There have been a lot of stupid arguments in this thread, but the wired vs wireless one takes the cake.

 

[frankie_baby]

Zombi U is 720P/30fps? I didn't know that since I haven't been following the game all that closely.

Is there an explanation for why Ubi isn't targeting a higher framerate at the very least? I don't expect every launch game to hit 1080P/60fps but an exclusive game should have one or the other.

Its apparently a relatively low budget game

 

[Smurfman256]

Zombi U is 720P/30fps? I didn't know that since I haven't been following the game all that closely.

Is there an explanation for why Ubi isn't targeting a higher framerate at the very least? I don't expect every launch game to hit 1080P/60fps but an exclusive game should have one or the other.

Low budget, new console.

 

[Thraktor]

Its apparently a relatively low budget game

Low budget, new console.

Budget doesn't really have much to do with it. It's a relatively slow-paced game, so the developers have focussed on things other than framerate. Nano Assault has a much lower budget, but it's a fast-paced game, so they have focussed on framerate. It's all about priorities.

 

[Saint Gregory]

Its apparently a relatively low budget game

Low budget, new console.

Budget doesn't really have much to do with it. It's a relatively slow-paced game, so the developers have focussed on things other than framerate. Nano Assault has a much lower budget, but it's a fast-paced game, so they have focussed on framerate. It's all about priorities.

That's very dependent on the presentation. Sometimes with these games locked (I hope it's locked) at 30fps the devs can add effects and filters to bring a feature film like presentation to the game and as much as I'm a framerate whore I don't mind that.

I just hope this isn't another Ubi launch trap like Red Steel. At least they delivered a quality game with the sequel in that case though.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Off-TV is an OPTIONAL feature? I was thinking the controller could take place of your TV for single player in all cases?

 

[qq more]

Off-TV is an OPTIONAL feature? I was thinking the controller could take place of your TV for single player in all cases?

Unfortunately no. Even worse that VC games ATM won't be played on the Gamepad. I hope they update them

 

[lednerg]

Off-TV is an OPTIONAL feature? I was thinking the controller could take place of your TV for single player in all cases?

It's entirely up to the developer, as it should be. Nintendo isn't forcing it on anyone. If someone wants to make a game that requires both screens, then they can make that game.

 

[Azzurri]

SO is 32gig the most I can expand the storage to on a Basic model?

 

[wsippel]

Off-TV is an OPTIONAL feature? I was thinking the controller could take place of your TV for single player in all cases?

Of course it is. Some games need both screens at the same time. How could it be mandatory?

 

[lednerg]

SO is 32gig the most I can expand the storage to on a Basic model?

No, you can use USB hard drives. Those things are like $100 for 2 terabytes nowadays.

 

[onilink88]

Dragon Quest X hasn't been confirmed to be running at 1080p.

Dragon Quest X hasn't been confirmed for 1080p; that one fansite mistranslated the Japanese article.

I vaguely remember reading it was 60fps somewhere, though.

 

[AzaK]

SO is 32gig the most I can expand the storage to on a Basic model?

It has one SD slot that's SDHC which is 32Gig max. Therefore you can get to 40 without plugging something on the outside. From there you can throw on up to 3TB of storage via external drive.

 

[Donnie]

Has Rayman Legends being 720p been confirmed anywhere? I can't see any reason for them to downgrade when it was 1080p on 360/PS3.

Rayman Legends isn't on either 360 or PS3. Origins is, but Legends is upgraded graphically. I'd hope those upgrades wouldn't require a resolution drop, but who knows. If I had to guess though I'd guess it'll be 1080p.

 

[Brofield]

SO is 32gig the most I can expand the storage to on a Basic model?

I haven't heard anything of expandable internal storage. I know for certain though you can hook up external harddrives via USB, and that's not so bad. I mean, I've seen 3TB desktop harddrives go for $60 on Best Buy, and I'm sure there are equally good if not better deals out there.

 

[NBtoaster]

From beyond3d, Tekken Tag Tournament 2 is

dynamic 720x720 to 1280x720, max 1024x720 with 2 characters in-game, max 900x720 with 3 characters, max 800x720 with 4 characters (no AA in-game, 2xAA for character LED background or no-characters-environment-only/rankings view)

 

[tenchir]

SO is 32gig the most I can expand the storage to on a Basic model?

I thought the Wii U support SDXC? The 3DS can can support up to 128GB card, so I don't see why Nintendo would remove that from WiiU.

 

[Error Macro]

Hehehe. Yeah 130 was very, very hard to get. It was normally in the 200+ range. All people need to do is just "suck less"

Haha..."back in the day," I went to great lengths to get the lowest ping I could on my modem: I checked all the copper wiring throughout the house, cut back and stripped and reconnected all the lines on the terminal block underneath the house, had the phone company install a new junction box outside, ditched my internal modem for the best U.S. Robotics external 56k and worked out a crazy-long custom initialization string for it... After all that I managed to get around 190-210ms average on most servers. Prior to all that ~300ms was not uncommon. Quite an improvement! LOL. Man! People have it so easy these days

 

[NBtoaster]

Used to think WiFi would be bad but I don't notice any difference between ethernet and a 50% signal on PS3 and 360 now that I have it. Even when it's being used elsewhere.

 

[tkscz]

I thought the Wii U support SDXC? The 3DS can can support up to 128GB card, so I don't see why Nintendo would remove that from WiiU.

Anything can support SDXC when it's Formatted into FAT32.

 

[AzaK]

I thought the Wii U support SDXC? The 3DS can can support up to 128GB card, so I don't see why Nintendo would remove that from WiiU.

All info we have heard has suggested SDHC only. I haven't read anything about SDXC yet, but if the circuitry can address that much then I can't see why it's not possible to support more.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Of course it is. Some games need both screens at the same time. How could it be mandatory?

I didnt say mandatory, but a lot of games that use the Classic Controller on the list above have very little reason to not be able to be played on the controller. The worst result would be if, as time goes on, devs start to ignore that feature. Hope it can be patched in easily.

 

[Terrell]

From beyond3d, Tekken Tag Tournament 2 is

dynamic 720x720 to 1280x720, max 1024x720 with 2 characters in-game, max 900x720 with 3 characters, max 800x720 with 4 characters (no AA in-game, 2xAA for character LED background or no-characters-environment-only/rankings view)

And what do they source? Beyond3D says a LOT of things.

 

[klapauzius]

Everything that has no source is listed as 720p / 30fp

If you dont know resolution and FPS write "dont know" in the list but don't make up some specs.

 

[antonz]

And what do they source? Beyond3D says a LOT of things.

That information is for the PS3/360 game for sure. Though I do believe scaling is in the Wii U version as well since its basically a feature enhanced quick port

 

[Trevelyan9999]

From beyond3d, Tekken Tag Tournament 2 is

dynamic 720x720 to 1280x720, max 1024x720 with 2 characters in-game, max 900x720 with 3 characters, max 800x720 with 4 characters (no AA in-game, 2xAA for character LED background or no-characters-environment-only/rankings view)

I think the Wii U version is straight up 720p with no AA. The reason is that if you watch this trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk2XjbvuGa0 the Wii U version has multiple objects and characters on the screen at the same time with no noticeable drop in resolution. Also from looking at the "Big Mushroom mode" the game seems to have no problem rendering gigantic characters both at the same time. Glad I got this one pre-ordered....

 

[netBuff]

All info we have heard has suggested SDHC only. I haven't read anything about SDXC yet, but if the circuitry can address that much then I can't see why it's not possible to support more.

The 3DS officially only supports SDHC (maximum of 32GB SD cards) as well, but can read and write cards up to 128GB if formatted as FAT32. The presumed reason the 3DS doesn't have formal SDXC support is the fact that Nintendo probably doesn't want to license exFAT from Microsoft.

Summa summarum: It is highly probable that the Wii U can utilize SD cards bigger than 32GB if they are formatted correctly (FAT32).

 

[Smurfman256]

who else thinks that the next generation of visuals is going to be defined less by poly-count and texture resolution, and more by lighting?

 

[LCGeek]

who else thinks that the next generation of visuals is going to be defined less by poly-count and texture resolution, and more by lighting?

Lighting and shader complexity effects are going to see decent jumps.

 

[Chamber]

I didnt say mandatory, but a lot of games that use the Classic Controller on the list above have very little reason to not be able to be played on the controller. The worst result would be if, as time goes on, devs start to ignore that feature. Hope it can be patched in easily.

I agree with this. I feel like any game that isn't using the gamepad in an exceptional way, i.e. maps and move list, should offer off-tv play. It's a big feature they need to take advantage of when possible.

 

[hatchx]

I agree with this. I feel like any game that isn't using the gamepad in an exceptional way, i.e. maps and move list, should offer off-tv play. It's a big feature they need to take advantage of when possible.

And that's what is happening.
Most games allow for Off Play. The only game I can think that doesn't is NintendoLand and ZombiU, for obvious reasons.

 

[shouamabane]

The biggest offender is Monster Hunter. It's a portable game to begin with, and doesn't offer off-screen play.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

And that's what is happening.
Most games allow for Off Play. The only game I can think that doesn't is NintendoLand and ZombiU, for obvious reasons.

Tekken Tag, Lego City, Pikmin, Rayman, Arkham Asylum, and Monster hunter all are missing the feature according to that chart. Not sure if they use touch extensively or in any special way.

But if they still sell well, pubs and devs will think its not a very appealing feature, or at least one that consumers wouldn't mind if it were missing.

 

[Chamber]

Tekken Tag, Lego City, Pikmin, Rayman, Arkham Asylum, and Monster hunter all are missing the feature according to that chart. Not sure if they use touch extensively or in any special way.

But if they still sell well, pubs and devs will think its not a very appealing feature, or at least one that consumers wouldn't mind if it were missing.

That's what I'm afraid. I don't want off-tv play to be one of those things developer feel is ok to sacrifice like 60 fps has become.

 

[AlStrong]

And what do they source? Beyond3D says a LOT of things.

All of the trailers and screenshots they've released for WiiU.